Does driving an old car make you a better driver?

[Andy J]

I went to a car show this morning,driving my newly acquired '40 Chevrolet Master 85.The show was about 25 miles from my house and required that I travel on the Interstate,state highways,and city streets.Not having driven an old car like this in 40 years,I observed several things I'd always been aware of,but now seemed even more important.People whiz by weaving in and out of traffic,phone in one hand,a cigarette in the other with two fingers on the wheel.I'm trying to maintain a safe distance from the car ahead and people dart right in front of you to turn or to keep from being slowed up by an old car in front of them,greatly reducing my stopping distance.

 

My point here is that you really have to pay attention to things once taken for granted when you're driving a modern car with PB,PS and other modern driving aids.My old Chevy doesn't have all this,as you know,not even a radio or heater.So,all there is to do is drive and try to be as careful as you can because most other people aren't.You have to allow for other people's impatience and anticipate farther ahead of driving conditions.

 

I think this has improved my driving skills by just this short drive today.I think modern conveniences have made people poorer drivers than they were 30-40 years ago.

[edinmass]

 

Drive a 5000 pound car at 50 mph with only rear brakes.......that WILL get your attention. 

[Bleach]

7 minutes ago, Andy J said:

I think modern conveniences have made people poorer drivers than they were 30-40 years ago.

From what I remember, people did not drive any differently back then than they do now, at least in the L.A. area.

[TerryB]

Forty years ago=2022-40=1982.  Maybe better since no cellphone yet people might have been paying a little more attention to driving.  Speeding, running stop signs and traffic lights was probably the same.  Today I see more kids with their own cars as soon as they reach driving age which just increases the number of cars on the road.

[John348]

Andy,

I really don't enjoy driving my cars that much anymore for the reasons you mention. My cars are in suburban NYC and it is just way to congested and drivers are just way to preoccupied, mostly by their cell phones. At my home in central Florida it is worse. Your car is not on the same playing field as the other cars, and the other drivers have no idea that is not, nor do other drivers care. The entire cellphone/texting dynamic just adds another dimension of distraction on the road. It is puzzling to me why there are no laws yet similar too DWI laws for offenders, with steep financial fines, points on the license, and insurance increases. They are risking someone's life every second they are not looking at the road

We went from defensive driving to protective driving, but there is only so much you can do when nobody will let you leave that safe distance in front of you to stop safely. I have been slowly downsizing my collection because of several contributing factors, and what you pointed out is one of the reasons     

Edited May 7, 2022 by John348 (see edit history)

[edinmass]

 

For a real scare, drive a box of wood and metal that's say....100 years old plus. You know the car.......where the passengers ARE the crumple zone. Fact is, driving ANY pre war car today is equal to driving a motorcycle. You are 100 percent exposed. And it feels like you have a target on your back. I drove the 851SC Speedster today........and it's as fast as any modern traffic......but the people behind me were trying to get around because they thought they were going to get stuck behind me. Use caution and drive defensively. 

[PFindlay]

22 minutes ago, edinmass said:

driving ANY pre war car today is equal to driving a motorcycle

This is exactly the attitude you need especially when driving pre-WW1 cars.  I don't have signals and lights on some of my cars/motorcycles, but even for those who do, you can't count on the other driver seeing your signal or that neat little brake light you fitted inside your tail lamp.  You have to assume that other car will turn in front of you, or stop suddenly, or veer into your lane as they try to snap a picture of you or ..., or ..., or ... and drive accordingly.  (Not to mention the fact that you have to assume there's always the possibility of a mechanical failure - brakes, steering, tires, stalling in an intersection, etc.  This puts the onus on you to make sure your car is properly prepared for each outing and avoid driving to the extremes, just in case.) 

 

So you do whatever you can to be noticed and keep safe.  But it's all up to you.  This is life saving advice for all motorcyclists as well as pre-war car drivers.

[John_S_in_Penna]

Just to balance out the discouraging accounts:

There are plenty of country roads and small highways

where driving an old car is safe, enjoyable, and serene.

Such roads have lower speeds and little traffic--and 

many parts of the country are full of such roads.

 

So buy that Ford Model A, that 1918 Buick, that 1929 Reo.

Learn its operation and its features.  Appreciate its history,

and give it the exercise it deserves.  Just drive it where

it's appropriate!

 

Edited May 8, 2022 by John_S_in_Penna (see edit history)

[wayne sheldon]

While certain aspects of this are frightening. And a feeling of hopelessness creeps in alongside worry and the realization of your vulnerability? In the long run, you will benefit from the antique automobile experience in many many ways. And, believe it or not, this is one of the things that you will benefit from.

Antique automobiles connect their caretakers to history and understanding in many ways that no modern car can. History becomes more personal, you become connected to your own past and family in ways you never imagined!

You also become connected to realities of life, past, present, and future, you will understand so many things so much more than you did before. 

One of the realities you will understand better is your responsibility to yourself! Your responsibility to your own safety, as well as the safety of others.

 

Most people are born sheep. They will be as good or bad, as smart or stupid, as they are taught to be. When they are taught that the responsibility is always someone else's? When they are raised to believe that some corporation and their car is going to save them from themselves and every other idiot on the road? They believe that and they drive accordingly. But those things are not reality. The idea that someone else is going to always care for you or protect you from harm is a fantasy!

 

Anything that adds significant enjoyment or quality to one's life involves some amount of risk. And antique automobiles are no exception. People have been killed driving their antique automobiles (including a few people I have known). However the understanding that one usually gains from the antique automobile hobby is also likely to help you live better, and may help you to save yourself from other people's foolishness and recklessness. You will be a better driver of anything you drive because of what the antiques teach you. Probably a better worker, a better family man, and better friend to yourself and others, because of what the antique cars teach you. You will likely also make better friendships with better people.

 

Enjoy the journey.

[joelj]

I don't know if it makes you a better driver but it does take more cognitive effort than a modern car. My 49 Buick Super kind of likes to operate within certain parameters. If you try and force it to do what it doesn't want to do it protests through mechanical feedback. You have to drive it smooth and proactively. Just let the other traffic do whatever they are doing and avoid an accident. Don't worry about it if some idiot passes you on a double yellow line when you are going 40 in a 35mph zone. It was just another idiot.

[MikeC5]

I think driving any pre-WWII with rear-only brakes will force you to be a better driver (or you won't be doing it for very long).  I look at what's going on much further down the road than before I began driving my '25 DB.  I had a few close calls at first...  Of course, that won't protect you from the moron looking at his phone that rear ends you....

[tcslr]

Mr Sheldon has a good point. 
background: my wife and I visited youngest daughter in a large metropolis. We live in area where three cars are a major congestion. The conversation was three points: 1) why so few cars with obvious  damage from crashes, 2) obvious operators using personal devices and not watching the conditions and 3) can you imagine driving our 1931  ( and older) in these conditions?.( and the speed! )

 

maybe drivers are ‘better’ than given credit.  Maybe reaction is faster then we think. Generally, it is easier ( and incorrectly) to catastrophize than Dara suggests. This doesn’t make it ‘easier’ to drive our vintage and antique vehicles in modern traffic. 
my point: just like current blood work, statistics show we worry unnecessarily. 
what I DO need from my friends -you- I’d hoe I convince my emotions what my head believes.

tom

[58L-Y8]

26 minutes ago, John_S_in_Penna said:

Just to balance out the the discouraging accounts:

There are plenty of country roads and small highways

where driving an old car is safe, enjoyable, and serene.

Such roads have lower speeds and little traffic--and 

many parts of the country are full of such roads.

 

So buy that Ford Model A, that 1918 Buick, that 1929 Reo.

Learn its operation and its features.  Appreciate its history,

and give it the exercise it deserves.  Just drive it where

it's appropriate!

 

John makes salient points: there still are places in this country where the safe, enjoyable operation of old cars is possible.  Seek out the state and paved county roads beforehand to establish suitable routes and time periods of light use.  It just might be no longer possible in urban/suburban areas on some routes and during certain hours of the day.  I've recommended to a friend who lives in Denver, Colorado to investigate the early weekend morning hours to drive his car.   Old cars need regular exercise to keep their systems function, plus provide the enjoyment we seek as a benefit.

 

Old cars, unlike our new ones, were much more involving to operate, demanded we provide the attention and coordinated physical effort to make them perform.  As such, they may contribute to improving our defensive driving skills in general.

[Mark Shaw]

2 hours ago, John348 said:

We went from defensive driving to protective driving

I completely agree....

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

There have always been those not paying attention.  In 1952 Mom was letting me drive . Teaching me if you will. I stopped at a stop sign at the intersection  of the road I was on with another. The driver behind me did not.  THE only two cars around.

  But I am still here. Unafraid.

 

Ben 

Edited May 7, 2022 by Ben Bruce aka First Born (see edit history)

[32buick67]

Andy,

Thank you very much for highlighting this post...a topic which has become 'old-hat' in my personal life, almost undistinguished based on a saga of my life experiences driving around the world, but now the idea is rejuvenated again as you remind me of what others might be thinking and considering as they drive older cars.

I asked my wife and kids about their thoughts on driving our prewar Buick, and after quite a few drives on the country roads and in traffic, they say that they now realize the value and importance of doing non-modern things like listening to the engine rpm/rhythm, feeling the clutch pedal on their foot, and the smoothness of the car as it moves, and other technical characteristics such as oil pressure and water temperature so they can make the car perform as best as possible.  I don't have to tell them what is good/not good, they just kind of sense when things aren't 'right'.

 

Just the way we like it, our car has no radio, no heater, no wifi, just an engine and drivetrain and a good looking prewar body, in my humble opinion.

Stopping a 4200lb car with mechanical asbestos brakes sometimes takes planning and pre-thought, especially for random deer crossings, and maybe that is helpful for teaching the next generation in relation to modern driving....thinking ahead, planning, expecting the unexpected, defensive/protective/avoidance driving, leaving space between cars, focus on operating a vehicle as a privilege and not a right, etc...

 

This might help a little with improving slow moving vehicle visibility, ours works very well - 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00OBTK4LQ/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o05_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

Going forward in this life, it seems big brakes are better than big engines....

 

Mario

[J.H.Boland]

Sometimes collisions are just plain unavoidable. A week ago Thursday I drove my near mint '99 Jeep TJ (I know, it's not antique, but it's one of my toys) to my chiropractor. I was on my way home in the inside lane of a four lane street, passing a parked city bus on my right. A 2016 Mazda drove in front of the bus, right into my path. I had no time to react and t-boned her at 35 MPH. All air bags deployed and there were only minor injuries. The insurance will want to write off the Jeep but we will see.

I occasionally take the Packard or one of the other older cars on this trip. I shudder to think about it.

[JV Puleo]

Years ago a friend of mine wired his 31 Chrysler so that he could flash the brake lights he'd added without applying the brakes. When someone got too close behind him, he's flash the lights.

 

I've decided, with my 1910 car, to use electric lights simply because I have been caught out with dusk coming on with only gas lights...and those weren't connected. I also have an extra set of cowel lights that I'll set up as rear directionals and another that I'll wire as a center red brake light. At this point I've stopped counting the times I've had a near accident because some nitwit was talking on the phone or texting so the idea of driving defensively is now ingrained.

[Lahti35]

I do think an old car makes you a better driver, certainly no worse than todays general driver!

 

I think my motorcycle makes me an even better driver though. Nothing like feeling like a hunted animal on the road to keep you frosty!

[BobinVirginia]

Yes 

[1935Packard]

I don't know if driving old cars makes you a better driver in a newer car, as the experience is so different that I don't know if the habits cross over.  But all of us who drive pre-war cars on the occasional highway know how exhausting an experience it can be given how hyper-attentive you have to be the road, other drivers, and your car.    May you all live near pleasant back roads!

[Studemax]

If we went back to 3 on the tree shifting, no power steering, and no power brakes - no one would have time to play with their damn smartphone while driving and eating a taco.

[plymouthcranbrook]

What I am seeing on the roads is in addition to what the others have mentioned is a significant amount of anger and rage. Some seem to be angry when they get into the car and angry when they get out of it.  Screaming, making gestures, brake checking, trying to cause collisions, etc.  Hell, how often do you hear about some clown becoming angry and shooting at another car for any number of reasons. Cutting someone  off, not driving fast enough, making a turn. Even not leaving a stop sign fast enough. Making an honest mistake. That is what concerns me on the road. Not the simple idiot that I have dealt with for the past 55 years.  

[JFranklin]

1 hour ago, plymouthcranbrook said:

What I am seeing on the roads is in addition to what the others have mentioned is a significant amount of anger and rage. Some seem to be angry when they get into the car and angry when they get out of it.  Screaming, making gestures, brake checking, trying to cause collisions, etc.  Hell, how often do you hear about some clown becoming angry and shooting at another car for any number of reasons. Cutting someone  off, not driving fast enough, making a turn. Even not leaving a stop sign fast enough. Making an honest mistake. That is what concerns me on the road. Not the simple idiot that I have dealt with for the past 55 years.  

It has been that way ever since there were cars. This was from the 50's

 

[John348]

7 hours ago, JFranklin said:

It has been that way ever since there were cars. This was from the 50's

 

Yes, very true, but the number these type drivers has grown exponentially. Leaving the house or the job angry is only compounded by a distracted angry phone call while listening to a hate radio station, then compounded by far more vehicles on the road with all kinds of driver assists on these newer vehicles that prevent them from hurting themselves. There is a far more noticeable lack of respect for other vehicles, and pedestrians. Most drivers appear to be in their own self absorbed world. A majority of them do not even realize they just drove past a piece of history that is 75 years old or older (or even newer)

I understand the thoughts to go find a country, that is just not that easy to any more for some people. When I owned my 31 Chevy, that was the task get up at 6AM and drive on the same 25 mile stretch, after a few years it began to get boring, and that even became dangerous as well

 

Walt G lives about 12-15 miles from me and it could be a pretty tough drive at any time of day from Monday to Saturday. 

 

While I do understand that I have gotten older, besides my changing, the environment around me has changed even more. I understand accidents do happen, but there is no excuse for being reckless behind the wheel.

 

I will admit I paid about $800 for the lane departure option on my 2018 Sierra 2500 truck when I ordered it, but only in the case if I became sleepy on a long trip when I travel by myself, not to remind me to look back on the road from my cell phone.

The playing field is just fair anymore, with all of the technology, I do question why the texting feature is not automatically disabled on new cars once the vehicle is started? I honestly think that would save a lot of lives, and insurance companies should be the ones behind it rather then spending money on commercials that insult our intelligence.   

  

[SC38dls]

Telephones, whether using for texting or calls should be disabled when the car is in motion. They do it on GPS systems ( or use to anyhow) why not on phones?  They should also equip radios with a device that turns the volume down and admits a tone when an emergency vehicle is approaching with its lights and siren going. Maybe then people would pull over to give them access. I say this because I had a good friend bleed out in an ambulance that got stuck in traffic, the driver said he could not get people to let him thru and they were moving at about 25 mph. Technology may seem big brother like in many cases but there are ways it would help society be safer, especially from idiots. 
dave s 

[Walt G]

16 hours ago, 58L-Y8 said:

Old cars, unlike our new ones, were much more involving to operate, demanded we provide the attention and coordinated physical effort to make them perform.  As such, they may contribute to improving our defensive driving skills in general.

I totally agree with this, Driving an old car ( especially pre WWII manufacture) makes you pay attention, more aware of what your car is doing or needs to do ( possibly can't do without some skill ) . It also makes you aware that everyone else does not know what you have to cope with so you thus look at them in a different view as "something to contend with" besides, ruts in the roads, etc. Being more involved in the operation of your old car should make you more aware of how to drive .

[Brass is Best]

When driving an old car you do have to pay more attention. It is amazing the things people will do trying to get a look at our car. I once had a person pull into the middle of the road in front of me and stop. They just stopped and pulled out their phone. Then they took a picture of the 1911 Cadillac I was getting stopped about 10 feet from their door and drove off. As stated before driving an old car is like driving a motorcycle. You have to pay attention to what everybody else is doing as well as driving. The older or more exciting your car is to look at the more attention you have to pay. 

[keithb7]

I keep my 38 Plymouth pretty dial'd-in. Brakes set up to work as best as I can. The brake system is original. They are pretty good actually. Just yesterday a little old lady sunk in her seat, looking up through the steering wheel made an appearance. She was driving towards me, on-coming lane. All of a sudden she turned to her left right in front of me. I had to hammer on the brakes. I gave her a good long shot of the aaoogah horn.   It was too close. I was minding my own business, going about 30 mph. Would have made a fine mess of my 38 Plymouth if we made contact.

 

My Plym has no turn signals. The brake lights are pretty small . I drive accordingly. I tried to order one of those 6V LED light bar 3'rd brake lights for my back window. They won't ship to Canada. I am in a town of about 100,000 here in Canada. Drivers are pretty civilized most of the time. I do not feel threatened. With the price of gas, I feel like I'm seeing far less cars on the roads when I cruise around town. 

 

Over the easter weekend we drove to San Francisco. I was appalled at some of the driving we witnessed. Terrible and deadly risks were being taken to get somewhere in a hurry. Shocking. I can't imagine living in a city that big and driving a pre-war car. I am happy here in my area. I feel no real constant danger cruising about town. I do watch my rear view mirror a lot. I gotta try again and get one of those LED 3rd brake lights.

 

Yes I do believe we are better drivers in old cars.

[John348]

Older cars you have to be more aware of the machine you control and it's capabilities, you become part of it. Listen to how it is operating and aware of unusual odors, monitor gauges, among many variable's.     

[TTR]

Does driving an old car make you a better driver?

No ! 
You either are a good driver or not, regardless what you drive.

Based on my daily observations during past 40+ years, most road users aren’t very good, but they just don’t know it and somehow manage.

Why do you think insurance premiums are what they are ?

Edited May 8, 2022 by TTR (see edit history)

[Grimy]

This is an excellent thread, but almost every post brings up a vision of Dustin Hoffman repeatedly saying "I'm an excellent driver" in Rainman.....

[TTR]

1 hour ago, TTR said:

Does driving an old car make you a better driver?

No ! 
You either are a good driver or not, regardless what you drive.

Based on my daily observations during past 40+ years, most road users aren’t very good, but they just don’t know it and somehow manage.

Why do you think insurance premiums are what they are ?

P.S. A drivers skill level can often be easily assessed without their car moving or even him/her in it. Just look at how they park.

 

[keithb7]

Some valid different opinions. Perhaps the thought of being a better driver requires further explanation. 
 

I am very much aware of the lack of safely features in my ‘38 car. I’m very vulnerable without seat belts. No Crumple zones. Air bags? A collision would likely have grave consequences.  Add to that my ‘38 is endeared to me. I could care less about my 2006 car. So I indeed feel extra cautious, driving it. Protecting my life and my car from damages. 

Edited May 8, 2022 by keithb7 (see edit history)

[keiser31]

I have to be a better driver in my old car. A LOT of people are oblivious to the lack of speed and stopping distance of the old cars. I think what makes me a much better driver is when I check out the stupid crashes on YouTube. It has made me so much more aware of my surroundings. ANYTHING can happen from ANY direction so it's best to be alert.

[avgwarhawk]

One thing my mother drilled into my head concerning driving a car is never ever, ever, ever, never, don't even think about it, don't do it, hard no.... tailgating.  Probably the best advice my mother gave me among other advice for life.  She also said let the other driver commit to their movement before I start mine. Situational awareness is a must.  In my old Buicks I drive one mile below the posted speed limit.  Other drivers usually just go around and carry on.   Others might tailgate me. I will pull over and let them pass.  By and large driving my old Buicks is the same as driving my daily. 

[studeboy]

I live in a very rural area that should be safe for driving my 1940 studebaker. Unfortunately it is not. I can cruise in the interstate all day at 65 with the car and keep up. However when I am out on the road people in modern cars take incredible risks to get by me. They pass over double lines on blind curves up hill to get by me when i am going at the legal speed. This especially happens on back roads. I have a lot of sympathy for my amish neighbors when I drive my prewar car. Some of them get killed every year around here.

[ply33]

12 minutes ago, keiser31 said:

I have to be a better driver in my old car. A LOT of people are oblivious to the lack of speed and stopping distance of the old cars. I think what makes me a much better driver is when I check out the stupid crashes on YouTube. It has made me so much more aware of my surroundings. ANYTHING can happen from ANY direction so it's best to be alert.

Agree on all points.

 

With respect to crash videos on YouTube: After a collision with a person who ran a red light I installed a dash camera in my daily driver as I wanted to have a witness with me at all times. I now have a dash cam in all vehicles including the '33. For a while after installing my first dash cam I watched a number of dash cam videos on YouTube. That can sure raise your awareness of the number of idiots on the road and how so many "unexpected" things can happen. I put unexpected in quotes because in retrospect so many things that people think were unexpected turn out to be something that should have been expected. So I now expect more things that I never expected before and am a more cautious driver because of that.

 

Among other things, I now allow at least a 3 second following distance and usually more like 5 seconds. On the freeway that means lots of people cut in front of me. So be it, I will still get to where I am going in about the same amount of time. And I will have a bit more time to react for unexpected events. The most recent unexpected event was a tire exploding on the vehicle ahead of me. No damage done: I had time to react and the driver of that vehicle, after swinging widely from lane to (fortunately empty) lane, got their vehicle under control and pulled over the shoulder.

[oldcarfudd]

avgwarhawk, I don't have the option of driving 1 mph below the speed limit in my 1907 single-cylinder Cadillac!  Other than that, I agree with your approach.

[avgwarhawk]

6 minutes ago, oldcarfudd said:

avgwarhawk, I don't have the option of driving 1 mph below the speed limit in my 1907 single-cylinder Cadillac!  Other than that, I agree with your approach.

Yeah, that's a tough one to keep up with traffic.