Okay I know I'm not a mechanic - '41 Buick Had been running great until last week.

[414TATA]

My '41 Buick with original 248 CI  straight eight engine 38,500 miles. Had been running great until last week. While out for a nice drive she started sputtering and missing big time.. then run   okay. died a few times on me before I could get home. I've been waiting for a few days of no  rain as my mechanic has no covered storage where he works on it.  Just asking to get a few ideas.  I thought maybe bad gas.  She started with out much grinding today after sitting over a month .   Ran it a while warming up,   ran smooth for a few minutes then started the missing again .. then smooth then missing and almost died.  then smooth etc.  I pulled it back in the garage until Thursday when the mechanic can take it.  SO.. bad gas?  bad points? distributer?  the plugs aren't that old and neither are the plug wires.  seems like a fuel problem.?  would the mech fuel pump (now a few years old)  act up like that?  or maybe a carb problem?  As my header states I'm not mechanical so just asking you guys who are some of the things it might be.  appreciate any feed back. Thanks.

Wayne 

Fresno, Ca.

[MCHinson]

The most likely problems that I would search for first are a failing condenser, a failing coil, or ignition points failing. It could be a fuel related problem, but it is much more likely to be an electrical problem. They tend to start failing when warm as the components develop higher resistance when the components warm up.  

[61polara]

The first thing I would look at is the coil if it is running well sometimes, but not at other times.  Also look at the primary and secondary wiring to the coil.  Your car has a coil mounted int he firewall and one wire is in a shelided cable to the ignition switch.

[Akstraw]

Unless the fuel tank has been cleaned or replaced, the first thing I would check would be fuel filter(s).  (1). If the OEM filter is present, clean and/or replace.  (2). Many of our cars have had an inline filter of some type added over years.  Look for, and check/replace that.   (3). Some carburetors have a fine screen at the fuel inlet.  Remove and clean that.  Good luck!

[DFeeney]

I would go , Slow and Easy on your fix.  You will get a lot of first hand knowledge from the members of this form.  Find a friend who has basic mechanical skills who can help you.   Your car has several different systems and it won't hurt to make sure each is in spec.  The last thing you want to do is start throwing money at it.

[414TATA]

Thanks to all of you. Appreciate the knowledge here.

 

 

[edinmass]

DFeeny is 100 percent correct. Diagnose it, don’t guess. It takes years of experience to get a good “feel” if a problem is fuel or ignition. 99 percent of all fuel problems are ignition. 😎

 

It’s a simple car, and a competent mechanic shouldn’t need more than hour in a properly set up shop to figure it out. And it’s likely a talented guy will figure it out in 15 minutes. I expect it will be a simple fix.

[Bryan G]

Sounds a lot like the bad condenser I had recently. Idled fine but very rough at 2-lane blacktop speeds, soon becoming undrivable beyond city streets.

[Pfeil]

1 hour ago, edinmass said:

DFeeny is 100 percent correct. Diagnose it, don’t guess. It takes years of experience to get a good “feel” if a problem is fuel or ignition. 99 percent of all fuel problems are ignition. 😎

 

It’s a simple car, and a competent mechanic shouldn’t need more than hour in a properly set up shop to figure it out. And it’s likely a talented guy will figure it out in 15 minutes. I expect it will be a simple fix.

I'm in with all of this, but I had to say what a beautiful car! Good luck with your problem and let us know what the problem was. TKS.

Edited March 27, 2023 by Pfeil (see edit history)

[Marty Roth]

Several good suggestions by very knowledgeable folks here-

Let me just add one thought:

Attack only one item at a time
Fuel delivery (maybe vapor lock?)

Fuel filter/screen

Coil

Condenser

Points

 

If you try everything at once, you may never really know what the real problem was

[John Byrd]

414tata, I had a 38 Packard that did exactly as you've said, and it was the wire to the coil right where it came out of the metal shielding ( like 61Polara mentioned ). It had a "rub mark" and when I jiggled it, the engine missed badly and would even die. Check there and on the other end also. Good luck.

[kgreen]

9 hours ago, Akstraw said:

Unless the fuel tank has been cleaned or replaced, the first thing I would check would be fuel filter(s).  (1). If the OEM filter is present, clean and/or replace.  (2). Many of our cars have had an inline filter of some type added over years.  Look for, and check/replace that.   (3). Some carburetors have a fine screen at the fuel inlet.  Remove and clean that.  Good luck!

The fuel pump on these cars have a fine screen filter built into the fuel pump.  If your problem does turn out to be fuel related, that should be checked/cleaned.

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

Wayne, I am going with the fuel problem crowd, as I have been there. If there is a flat  Moraine filter in the line just ahead of the carburetor, that may well be the problem.   AKstraw's #3 is just where the fuel line goes into the carburetor inlet. 

 

  Good luck

 

  Ben

[Joe Cocuzza]

Sticky float/needle valve in carb - maybe ?????

[alsancle]

11 hours ago, edinmass said:

DFeeny is 100 percent correct. Diagnose it, don’t guess. It takes years of experience to get a good “feel” if a problem is fuel or ignition. 99 percent of all fuel problems are ignition. 😎

 

It’s a simple car, and a competent mechanic shouldn’t need more than hour in a properly set up shop to figure it out. And it’s likely a talented guy will figure it out in 15 minutes. I expect it will be a simple fix.

 

I was about to post something like "A really smart guy told me once that 90% of all fuel problems are ignition".  Then I remembered it was you.

 

Since you have explained that to me,  it has been running around 75-80% ignition.

[DavidAU]

I would replace the condenser first.  They are very cheap and the symptoms you describe fits a failing condenser.  If that doesn't work move on to the rest of the of the possibility's.

[JACK M]

Put a couple of those neon spark testers on a couple of plug wires (or on the coil wire itself, might be better) and start it at night, in the dark.

When it starts acting up you should be able to determine spark or fuel.

I had one doing exactly what you describe, and it was the old coil wire breaking down.

[sagefinds]

We had a '63 Chevy chassismount motorhome many years ago,neat old truck,lots of fun. We were out Discovering Wyoming and it started missing and sputtering. Stopped in a city park about 300 miles from home and started checking things out. It had a pretty fresh tuneup and all that looked good,no obvious problems. The fuel pump was the old type that had screws holding it together,I took the bottom part off and there was a piece of rubber from somewhere in the seat keeping the fuel from building up. I took it out,put it back together and it ran fine again from then on.

 

I might also mention the diaphragm in some of those old pumps can get hard and start cracking which always leads to a problem.

The condenser is there to mainly keep the points from arcing as they open. If the condenser is bad and they do arc generally one side of the points will build up which changes the spark. I If that is the case you may have to file and reset or replace them. Good luck.

 

[Nailbitten]

ALL great replies! 

If all else fails,you might take a look at the Coil Wire where it makes connection in the Coil.

That coil wire connection can get very corroded after a while and between the rubber boot being cold then warming up,it can make contact and then nothing.

Took me quite a while one time to find that one out.

[dodge28]

The most common problem is plugged gas filter or water in the gas filter/ carb bowl. One other place to look for problem is the electrical starting switch at the carb. Check for electrical leaks. 

[zdillinger]

It sounds electrical to me and I would start troubleshooting there.

[Pete O]

Another thing to look at is the primary wire leading to the points.  Broken insulation can cause intermittent grounding which can cause loss of power and backfiring.

[SC38dls]

I had a similar problem on my 38 Studebaker after rebuilding the carb, fuel pump, new electric pump, plugs, plug wires, points, rotor and cap. The master wizard ( of course I mean Ed better know as edinmass) took pity on me and had me send him my distributor. Fifteen minutes later he had it fixed. It was a bad wire in the distributor. I didn’t even know there was a wire in the distributor!  He sent it back it runs great, cooler by 10 degrees and 3 more miles per gallon. Follow Ed’s and Pete O’s advice and I’ll bet you will solve the problem. Good luck. 
dave s 

 

ps edit correction miles per gallon not gallons per mile !  Thanks Grony for catching it. 

Edited March 30, 2023 by SC38dls (see edit history)

[Grimy]

14 minutes ago, SC38dls said:

3 more gallons per mile

?????

[edinmass]

I guess I’m just old fashioned. I would diagnose it instead of guess. 

[drhach]

Does it run better again when it's cold? In other words, if you got back in it the next day, would it behave the same way? Or is it now permanently in the state of running bad? 

[Morgan Wright]

One thing you see with fuel problems in old cars, with rust getting in the gas, is you can see lots of rust in the carb bowl or fuel filter. If there's enough rust to make it sputter and run irregularly, there is a lot more rust that's easy to see. Look in the filter.

 

99% of ignition problems are the fuel.

 

 

 

.

Edited April 4, 2023 by Morgan Wright
typos (see edit history)

[EmTee]

21 hours ago, Pete O said:

Another thing to look at is the primary wire leading to the points.  Broken insulation can cause intermittent grounding which can cause loss of power and backfiring.

While you're in there, check the condition of the ground wire on the breaker plate.  This is needed to electrically connect the breaker plate to the distributor body.

[414TATA]

Sure appreciate knowing the possible problem areas to check.  Waiting for the flat bed truck transport right now.  On her way to the shop soon .

 

Thanks very much. Passing all above info to mechanic.

 

[Skidplate]

Ok, so I'm sure I'm being a little judgy here but there really is no such thing as Mechanically Inclined. It's really more of a Desire To Learn and being OK with doing it wrong a couple of times before we get it right.  It's amazing how many people I've known who will never do things on their own because there was that ONE TIME that they tried and failed to fix something and then never tried again. Ask anyone here and they'll tell you, the only thing that makes someone Mechanically Inclined is accepting that we all do things wrong to some extent the first or second time we attempt it. we're just too stubborn to give up and are willing to keep doing it again until we get it right. Now to be fair, there's also this other thing. Most of us here figure that if someone is going to do something wrong on our toys, it might as well be us. And also, if you want something done right (and I mean Really Right) as in "while you have it apart you clean and fix everything you can find to your best ability" YOU are going to have to do it. Your mechanic doesn't get paid to do all the extra stuff that you would do on your own toy. He can't. He would go broke spending his time to make your old POS Really Right the way it should be. He isn't going to replace those nasty ass old bolts that should have been changed out years ago. He isn't going to clean all that crap that's been lodged in some corner that will eventually start rusting out. All the things a supposedly Mechanically Inclined person would learn to do over the many years of Doing Stuff on Their Old Car instead of handing it off to "Their Mechanic". We all started somewhere and as difficult as it may seem right now... You can too. Cheers

[neil morse]

9 hours ago, Skidplate said:

Ok, so I'm sure I'm being a little judgy here ..

Yes, you are.  And I think you are way off base.  This wonderful hobby is open and available to all who want to participate.  Some are more "mechanically involved" than others.  But don't judge those who delegate maintenance of their cars to others, to whatever degree.  "To each his own" should be our mantra.  

[Bloo]

Well, I didn't get that out of it at all. Are you sure we read the same post? I don't see any hate for those who choose to hire things out, just maybe a little side eye for those who failed at something and never got back on the horse. That's not the same thing at all. I agree there's room for all of us in here. 👍

 

In my own experience, in any given year, there will be a short list of people or shops to whom I can hire out specific jobs, and trust things to go well and the job to be done correctly to a high standard. Probably all of us have a list like that whether we wrote it down or not. If something I need does not fall on that list, and I just have to pick someone... well.... things don't turn out acceptably more than half the time. I do a lot of stuff myself, and often take on things I haven't done before so I don't have to be in that situation.  I don't judge or look down on people for hiring things out. I cringe in silence because I want it to go well for them and I think the odds are against a good result. If it turns out OK I breathe a sigh of relief.

 

I also agree with skidplate anyone can learn this stuff and improve over time if they want to, and there is no requirement to be "mechanically inclined". I think that is a myth like "musically inclined" when the reality is hours and hours of practice.

 

Edited April 5, 2023 by Bloo (see edit history)

[neil morse]

8 hours ago, Bloo said:

Well, I didn't get that out of it at all. Are you sure we read the same post?

Well, upon further review as they say in the NFL, I think it was me who was being a bit "judgy" toward @Skidplate, and I apologize for misreading the intent of his post.  My only defense is that I had been to the eye doctor yesterday and had my pupils dilated so I wasn't reading too well.

 

I have no problem with anything in either Skidplate's post or yours.  Having read his post more carefully, I see that he was actually just encouraging people to try things themselves.  As you know, I am a good example of a newbie who has become much more "mechanically-involved" with my car due in large part to the encouragement and help I have gotten from forum members like you!  This has been a great benefit to both my car and myself.

 

 

 

Edited April 5, 2023 by neil morse (see edit history)

[Morgan Wright]

I have a 1917 Buick. I have never taken it to a mechanic. The tire place would have no clue what to do, to change one of these tires. They don't even have the tools. I took the starter-generator to a starter/alternator repair shop. He said "starter generator? That's too many words." So I said "starter generator distributor coil" and he said "Let me see it!" He had never seen such a thing and had no clue how to service it. I took the valve cages to the shop to get lapped and the guy was great, but had to google it because he never saw valve cages before. Did a great job though. 

 

The whole point of working on these cars is, the mechanics who knew about these cars are all dead, so nobody knows better than you.