Grateful for Antique Automobile

[rocketraider]

I am truly grateful for our Club magazine and its focus on original and correctly restored vehicles.

 

July 2024 Hemmings Classic Car came yesterday. Except for a 1960 Dodge Dart D500 convertible, EVERY vehicle featured was modified in some way, and almost every editorial comment was preaching the gospel of modifications.

 

Maybe they're going into survival mode but if this is the direction HCC is taking, come renewal there will be one less car magazine coming to HydraMatic Drive. I can see all the modified crap I want at local cruise nights and on TV.

 

 

 

 

[TexRiv_63]

I totally agree with you regarding Antique Automobile, it is the perfect magazine for the stated mission of the AACA regarding only restored-to-stock or original cars. HCC never really had that mission although it looked that way in the early days. They were headed down the road to far higher levels of modification when they shared editorial staff with Hemmings Muscle machines a while back. Luckily they changed that and I have been very happy with their balance of stock versus modified articles and also American versus foreign. 

[Paul Dobbin]

I had a letter to the editor published last year in Hemmings Classic Car, with Rocketraider's thoughts.   They responded with an story of the finding and restoration of a Cord Phaeton .   I renewed and there hasn't been much antique or classic cars since.  I will not renew again!    I even suggested the buy rights to reprint West Peterson's old articles in Antique Automobile.

West, can you sell your old stuff?

Edited May 18 by Paul Dobbin (see edit history)

[gwells]

This is exactly why I started the 'Celebration of the Authentic Car' event at the Southeastern Railway Museum in Duluth, GA, three years ago.

 

It's not that I don't appreciate the craftsmanship and design of custom and modified cars; I do. But I miss seeing the rare, historic, authentic cars I see at AACA national events, none of which have been held in Georgia since well before the Southeastern Region AACA disbanded in 2017.

Please, please, please bring your CotAC-eligible car to the show next Saturday, May 18. You can register online or on the day of the show. The cost of registration is a serious steal, in that for $25 (day of the show, $20 if you pre-register at the link given above), everyone who rides in with you gets admission to the train museum. (Regular admission is $18 adult, $15 senior/student, and $12 child.) If you have never visited SRM, you are going to be amazed at what is on display there.

The museum management has indicated that they need to see growth in attendance at the CotAC show (both in entrants and attendees) to allow the Celebraton event to use the property as a venue in the future. Please help us make sure this year's show isn't the last one!

Paul, I sure hope you will be able to make it down this year!

[Terry Bond]

2 hours ago, rocketraider said:

I am truly grateful for our Club magazine and its focus on original and correctly restored vehicles.

 

July 2024 Hemmings Classic Car came yesterday. Except for a 1960 Dodge Dart D500 convertible, EVERY vehicle featured was modified in some way, and almost every editorial comment was preaching the gospel of modifications.

 

Maybe they're going into survival mode but if this is the direction HCC is taking, come renewal there will be one less car magazine coming to HydraMatic Drive. I can see all the modified crap I want at local cruise nights and on TV.

 

 

 

 

Didn't notice. I don't get HMN anymore. I'm sure you can figure out why.

 

Terry

[gwells]

Ditto.

 

And I used to write for HCC's predecessor, "Special Interest Autos."

[Walt G]

there still is a non club magazine that has all the good features that people mention here - and has been called a soft cover book - Crankshaft magazine.

Lots of period material as well as reports of significant current car shows /events. At 144 pages for each issue you are getting quite a tome to read and enjoy .

[Robert G. Smits]

42 minutes ago, Terry Bond said:

Didn't notice. I don't get HMN anymore. I'm sure you can figure out why.

 

Terry

I decided not to renew both HMN and HCC two years ago. Haven’t missed them. I think all of us remember the days when we couldn’t wait for HMN to arrive in the mail. 

[Steve_Mack_CT]

Yep HMN renewed a year ago when the hit me with a $10 or $12 renewal offer.  HMN would come, 10 minutes sifting to find content, maybe 10 minutes of interesting cars at most.  All done now after 45 years as an HMN subscriber.

[Jim Bollman]

I was a subscriber of "Special Interest Autos" from issue #1 and dropped my subscription to HCC a couple of years ago. Haven't missed it.  I was like Steve_Mack_CT above, about the same reading time.

[zeke01]

it is a difficult job to crank issue after issue of any magazine, year after year. Two divergent segments of the  auto hobby are always rubbing up against each other. The progressive, younger faction wants articles pertaining to the barely twenty five year old cars that they are interested in while the older members want to read articles relating to brass and nickel era cars. It is a juggling act that I couldn't manage.

While my interests lie in the older cars, I am pulled into reading articles about the newer cars, thus expanding my knowledge and appreciation of them.

I always enjoy reading the magazine  and feel a sense of gratitude to the editors and contributors. It is a difficult job. I don't compliment the hard working staff often enough. I wish that there was a way that I could look up from the last page of the current issue and say " Thanks, what a good read". Zeke

[rocketraider]

I don't mind the newer vehicles.

 

If I want to read about restomods, "upgrades" (which often aren't really) and other assorted ways of turning an old body into a car with all the whizbang tropes of a new vehicle, I'll buy a magazine or watch a tv show focusing on that.

 

I guess I should be grateful there are still print car magazines of any stripe. When everything is focused on modifications, that promotes the false narrative that old cars have to be modified to be enjoyed.

 

Tell a lie enough times and people will take it for truth.

[Fordy]

Being far removed from the geographic location the AACA caters for, I decided to join and pay subs so that I stopped being a "passenger" using this forum.

Antique Automobile was an added bonus and I look forward to its arrival every 2 months - always an enjoyable read and a credit to all those involved in putting it together.

Steve

[TAKerry]

I agree with the content and quality of both the Antique Auto and Crankshaft. I get Old Cars which I look forward to and still enjoy. I get Smoke Signals, which often has a lot of great Pontiac specific history stuff, I get Hemmings Classic and Hemmings Muscle. The last issues I received are still sitting on the table unread. I used to get excited to see a car magazine come in the mail. Hemmings does not do that to me anymore. Its pretty much the same ole, same ole. I used to get High Performance Pontiac but was not overly surprised when that went south. After all how many articles can be written about a GTO? Thats kind of how I feel about the Hemm. stuff now. It seems that its the same stuff over and over as well as the way it is being written/edited now seems like its geared toward a non hobbyist. Very much dumbed down. I keep telling myself to let it go but the offer will come up and the renewal price is so cheap I cannot walk away. I did break the chain and got rid of their 'big book' because A. the print was too small for me to read and B. they rehashed the same articles in their other mags.

[Walt G]

I view things from several levels- I am a researcher who writes articles and stories both for club and commercial publications - have done so for decades; I have also been an Editor of local region publications as well as national publications ( Was Editor of the Society of Automotive Historians Journal for 5 years, changed it from a Newsletter to a Journal) .

There is so much material and story ideas that has never been written about. I am primarily focused on the automotive history and what happened from WWI to WWII ( both USA and European - factory sales material and periodicals published ) and that is what I have also focused my collecting of period material on in my personal library. In order for an author to get some really outstanding insight into the topic they are writing about they need to see the original material - be it at a site on line or even better  in person.

Acquiring this material is not easy- financially nor even proper storage. It all takes a considerable amount of time and lots of effort. When it comes to images it takes a high density scanner , then the skill to properly perhaps crop, resize, alter light and dark plus contrast..................

The "new" old information/ stories are out there for the "good read" we all like to see, but all I have mentioned here has to come into play in order to make the best accurate presentation possible. If an author does not have his own collection of period material they have to travel to the half dozen and more outstanding collections of material that do exist in quantity in libraries and be so thankful of who is on staff there that even knows what exists . All of us are just so fortunate that AACA Library at HQ n Hershey, Pa. has outstanding people working for our club AND are so PATIENT with all of us .

WEG

Edited May 13 by Walt G (see edit history)

[TerryKott]

Resto-mods are big business right now. I don't have a problem with them except those terrible low-profile wheels on old Muscle Cars.

[69merc]

I'm here as well, because it is the one club that values originality in old cars. The thing that makes me wonder is that all of the mass media focuses on restomods, upgrades, transformations, lowering, raising, bags, etc, that it probably trains young people to see the world of old cars in this light. I'm not anal about originality.  I have replaced all my lights with LEDs inside and out.  I have a Pertronix upgrade in the distributor.  I have halogen headlights. But I think I'm gonna put the brakes on any more upgrades.  🙂  To be honest, even at cruise ins and shows, the originality of cars is appreciated by a lot of people. 

[28 Chrysler]

The Hemmings Motors News web site has had many restomods articles for at least couple of years now.

[Jim Skelly]

I have to tip my hat to Hemmings Classic Car for totally ruining what had been a good car magazine.  The July issue arrived today, and my subscription expires with the next issue.  It started out with 120 pages, tests of pre-war and post-war cars, good columns, and usually a one-page history of a long-forgotten car.  Then the page count got reduced to 96 and has been at 72 for quite a while now.  They got lazy by providing too much coverage on auctions, featuring barn finds when there are plenty of original or accurately restored cars and trucks to tell us about, and now they seem to think we all want to read about restomods.  This issue even has a Hemmings auction featuring a '41 Cadillac coupe with a Cadillac crate engine!  The same situation occurred with Hemmings Muscle Machines.  I quit Hemmings Motor News when I needed to use a magnifying glass.  They will not be missed and will be scratching their heads wondering what went wrong.   

[Bhigdog]

Hemmings is simply following the money. As a business that,s what they must do to survive. 

We are a declining market. Modifieds, rods, tuners, etc are the ascending demographic......bob

 

[Oz Dodge 4]

I think one of the factors "changing" magazine content is the amount of you tube and other media that is put together by car modification businesses trying to promote their industry, and their target audience is the affluent younger set who are the ones the younger majority are trying to emulate, while the car "magazines" are relying on the "older" enthusiasts such as us who have very little interest in profit generating total custom makeovers and ground up hot rod builds, but to keep in the game the already established magazines have to appeal to a wider audience to get the circulation they need to survive.  Every time the established magazines lose a reader its another nail in the coffin for the magazine and it drives them further away from our interest and to more modification oriented stories to appeal to those who are left.

 

Edited May 14 by Oz Dodge 4 (see edit history)

[CarNucopia]

I don’t think wanting to customize your car is a new thing. The big difference now, vs. “back in the day..”, is that you were able to get a modified car directly from the dealer. Are the new modifieds really all that different from a Shelby Mustang, Yanko Camaro, Hurst/Olds or AAR ‘Cuda? Even a the buyer of a 1973 Catilina could custom order to their taste. 
 

[rocketraider]

1 hour ago, CarNucopia said:

I don’t think wanting to customize your car is a new thing. The big difference now, vs. “back in the day..”, is that you were able to get a modified car directly from the dealer. Are the new modifieds really all that different from a Shelby Mustang, Yanko Camaro, Hurst/Olds or AAR ‘Cuda?

Yes.

 

Those cars were based on factory available engines and components and carried a factory warranty and the manufacturers' blessing. No Coyote/LS/Hellcat engines, no outsized disc brake conversions with requisite bigger wheels, no computer-controlled transmissions and fuel delivery systems stuffed into 50+ year old body and chassis.

 

The issue I have with all this is that it sends a message that older cars HAVE to be modified in some way to be enjoyed. The aftermarket manufacturers peddle this idea. Then the "old car" magazines buy into it and their readers become convinced they have to do all these "upgrades" to enjoy their car, falling right into the trap.

 

I'm one who firmly believes that if somebody can't master setting an automatic choke to start a carbureted engine, that individual has no business owning an old car.

 

Likewise if an individual wants all the "conveniences" of a modern vehicle, he/she/whatever should go buy a modern vehicle that provides them and be ready to pay the outrageous repair costs when they break.

 

Just don't tell me my old car has to have modern underpinnings before I can possibly drive and enjoy it. That is the message magazines like HCC are sending by focusing more on modifications than accurate restorations.

[Steve_Mack_CT]

Agreed and honestly a bit of the hand that feeds you complex foe me.   I started HMN at age 14 or 15, I think they have said FY to thousands of long time subscribers reallizing many here have 15 years or so on me.  I get numbers and the reality of surviving in print but the mission is not even an afterthought now.  

[edinmass]

I see resto mods that cost 600k-1.2m here in Florida. Not my cup of tea.  They sure are interesting and have great build quality. Some of the stuff is really off the wall. Ever see a VW 23? Window van with 800 horsepower? 

[rocketraider]

I don't think I want to...

[76 Caddy]

I have been a HCC  subscriber for a very long time and am thinking about not renewing.  Like with what happened to Cars and Parts, I kept them for 1 year after the "change" then cancelled them.

I want an old car to drive like an old car, not a new one (that's why I have a '19 XT5).  I'm slowly trying to restore the '69 Chevy pickup that my grandfather bought new, and I have been asked many times if I was going to put disc brakes on the front to which I reply, it didn't come that way, so no.  I want to feel the way it drove when I was a teenager and he let me drive it, four-wheel drums and all.  When I read HCC now, the impression I get is that they want you to think an old vehicle is unsafe unless you "upgrade it" with modern parts like disc brakes, electronic ignition, aluminum radiators, etc, etc.

 

Therefore, I too am Grateful for the AACA and the Antique Automobile magazine.

Tim 

[Steve_Mack_CT]

3 hours ago, edinmass said:

I see resto mods that cost 600k-1.2m here in Florida. Not my cup of tea.  They sure are interesting and have great build quality. Some of the stuff is really off the wall. Ever see a VW 23? Window van with 800 horsepower? 

Well for modifieds I would walk by that in favor of the 57 Chevy with a mediocre paint job, nice Cragar SS rims, and a homebuilt sbc backed by a 4 speed and a 9no frills interior.

 

Or a clean VW van that is still a VW.

 

But yeah an 800 hp rendition of a VW van might sell some magazines...

[alsancle]

31 minutes ago, Steve_Mack_CT said:

Well for modifieds I would walk by that in favor of the 57 Chevy with a mediocre paint job, nice Cragar SS rims, and a homebuilt sbc backed by a 4 speed and a 9no frills interior.

 

Or a clean VW van that is still a VW.

 

But yeah an 800 hp rendition of a VW van might sell some magazines...

 

I could have posted this.

[West Peterson]

7 hours ago, edinmass said:

I see resto mods that cost 600k-1.2m here in Florida. Not my cup of tea. They sure are interesting and have great build quality. Some of the stuff is really off the wall. Ever see a VW 23? window van with 800 horsepower? 

 

4 hours ago, Steve_Mack_CT said:

Well, for modifieds I would walk by that in favor of the '57 Chevy with a mediocre paint job, nice Cragar SS rims, and a homebuilt SBC backed by a four-speed and a no-frills interior.

 

Or a clean VW van that is still a VW.

 

But, yeah, an 800 hp rendition of a VW van might sell some magazines...

 

3 hours ago, alsancle said:

I could have posted this.

Yes. Me, too.

 

Thank you to all who praised Antique Automobile. Our staff and columnists spend a LOT of time trying to make it the best it can be. I am grateful for the freedom that Steve Moskowitz and the AACA Board gives us in producing something that we feel represents all of AACA. I was editor of Car Collector for 15 years, and Managing Editor (then Editor) of Cars & Parts after that. I saw the writing on the wall, and bailed on both of them. I'm now finishing my 20th year with Antique Automobile. Time flies when you're having fun.

[Buffalowed Bill]

Several years ago I stopped subscribing to most of the magazines I was taking, some of which I had been taking for decades. I had been looking at my bookshelves that that were full of 50+ years of books and periodicals. Why had I been saving all this stuff. I was never going to reread it!

 

I began to compare the content of what I was currently getting to the vintage copy. In most cases the newer stuff was just not as good. As my subscriptions ran out I just didn't renew. To be honest there were feeling of withdrawal for a while-what was I missing and how was I going to be able to keep current with the hobby that had been so much a part of me, for so long? Not to worry, social media had already filled that gap. It took about six months to overcome the feelings of withdrawal. Today I'm enjoying reading what I want and when I want to read it. If I lived to be a hundred I will still have stuff on the shelves that I have not reread.

 

As an aside I find that it's been interesting comparing the predictions and opinions of yore with the real world dynamic. Perspective is not just a case of where we are going, but also how we got here as well.  

 

[gwells]

2 hours ago, West Peterson said:

I was editor of Car Collector for 15 years...

And I think I know the nutcase who quit Car Collector (after his first son was born) to make room for you. LOL.

Working for your dad was always fun but sometimes not easy. Suspect it was even less easy for you... Great memories.

West, please stay healthy, as it would be extremely difficult to find someone to fill your big shoes at the magazine. The job you've done with the Antique Automobile is extraordinary.
 

[edinmass]

Having published a bunch of articles back in the '80s and '90s, it’s incredibly difficult to have a dozen different stories in progress, while trying to put together a magazine that has deadlines. Photos are never what you need, background information usually has holes in it that needs research, people respond slowly and cause articles to get pushed back. Running a professional publication is ten times the work that most people realize.

 

The club is indeed fortunate to have West as the editor. Fact is, many editors of magazines have no interest in the subject matter they are publishing. In this case, West grew up in a true car family… and as an additional benefit... he likes all cars… truly a one in a million person who could successfully pull it off for twenty years.

 

Three thumbs up for West... 👍👍👍

[West Peterson]

21 hours ago, gwells said:

Working for your dad was always fun but sometimes not easy. Suspect it was even less easy for you... Great memories.

Having to overcome the nepotism aspect was just one hurdle, but I was given no benefits (especially in salary). I worked for practically nothing (like you probably did). I decided right away that I would learn as much as I possibly could about the business, and hopefully it would lead to something good. I introduced computer design to Car Collector ON MY OWN DIME, as the publisher (God rest his soul) refused to bring it in-house. With his permission, I bought my own computer and took over the publishing of the magazine on my own (except for the business end of it).

 

Working with my father was an eye-opening experience, but he was a living, walking, breathing old-car encyclopedia. When he MC'd at car shows, such as the Greenwich Concours, he did so WITHOUT (!!!) any notes whatsoever, and all his facts were correct. We didn't always see eye to eye, but he gave me respect. 

[Paul Dobbin]

On 5/14/2024 at 3:52 PM, Steve_Mack_CT said:

Well for modifieds I would walk by that in favor of the '57 Chevy with a mediocre paint job, nice Cragar SS rims, and a homebuilt SBC backed by a four-speed and a no-frills interior.

 

Or a clean VW van that is still a VW.

 

But yeah an 800 hp rendition of a VW van might sell some magazines...

I like modifieds too, but most of my cars are bone-stock. When we lived in Florida, our antique car club would occasionally go to a race track, like Sunshine Speedway or the Desoto Dragway, and  participate in the show and the fan races. I raced my stock 1934 Fords and my stock 1959 El Camino along with all the Model As in the club that came along.

 

My observations was that the cruise-In hot shots who came only did the show to tal about how fast their cars were. My '34 Ford was eliminated by a '56 Ford six-cylinder which was all souped-up, but I didn't assign the classes. It was all for fun! My 59 El Camino could never win either, with a high-mileage 283 and a Powerslide transmission. (I even dragged with my tailgate open for more speed).   

 

The real racers are a different bunch having fun, too. It's all part of the old car hobby. They enjoyed my old cars, too.

[gwells]

4 hours ago, West Peterson said:

I worked for practically nothing (like you probably did).

Yep. When we had our first kid, I realized I had to try to make a decent living. LOL.

 

Quote

My father was a living, walking, breathing old-car encyclopedia. When he MC'd at car shows, such as the Greenwich Concours, he did so WITHOUT (!!!) any notes whatsoever, and all his facts were correct.

He was exactly that.

 

Quote

We didn't always see eye to eye, but he gave me respect. 

He loved and respected all you boys. I miss him every day and often reach for the phone thinking I can still call him for advice and knowledge.

 

The African proverb that "When an old man dies, a library burns to the ground" absolutely applies to my best man (in 1977) Donald R. Peterson, whom I consider one of my two or three surrogate fathers.

 

As I often said, in your presence and his, "I'm the illegitimate sixth Peterson son." The fact that he smiled and didn't disagree with my silly claim is still a source of great joy to me.

[Paul Dobbin]

On 5/12/2024 at 2:56 PM, Paul Dobbin said:

I had a letter to the editor published last year in Hemmings Classic Car, with Rocketraider's thoughts.   They responded with

an story of the finding and restoration of a Cord Phaeton .   I renewed and there hasn't been much antique or classic cars

since.  I will not renew again!    I even suggested the buy rights to reprint West Peterson's old articles in Antique Automobile.

West, can you sell you old stuff?

   Sorry, I may have spoken to soon.   Wednesday I got both, Classic Car and Antique Automobile magazines.   Classic car had

   long articles and photos on a 1857 Porsche, a barn find 1929 LaSalle, a 196o Dodge Dart D-500 Conv., a slightly modified 1931

   Model A and a 1966 Pontiac Tempest.   Several cars which I have own at some time in the past.  Plus their usually good columns.

   My subscription is good until Feb.2025, which will be the next judgement time.

   Antique Automobile was the standard great antique car stuff I'm interested in along with Club News and events.  Good Stuff!.

 

[rocketraider]

The front-page Porsche is heavily modified from as-built, though with mostly Porsche parts. 

 

The A was a period hot rod which is cool in its own way but in Jeff Koch's own words "was an impediment, if not a danger to myself and traffic around me"- the implication is that the A had to be modified to be used and enjoyed.

 

The LaSalle I think deserves better than to roll around in its "patina", but "barn find" and "patina" are fast becoming trigger words to me.

 

The last paragraph of Matthew Litwin's July 24 opening column sums up the direction HCC has taken under his editorial leadership. To wit, "upgrades" are not only acceptable but have to be done to use and enjoy an old car.

 

If supposedly old-car oriented magazines start beating that drum, eventually there will be no correctly or accurately restored examples left. It's bad enough when people think of our old cars as clown cars (see the '36 Chevrolet in "what is it"). Add in a perception that they're unsafe and unreliable unless they're upgraded/transformed into a modern vehicle underneath the sheetmetal... well, that's tough to swallow. Or is for me anyway.

 

[Pfeil]

On 5/14/2024 at 12:52 PM, Steve_Mack_CT said:

Well for modifieds I would walk by that in favor of the 57 Chevy with a mediocre paint job, nice Cragar SS rims, and a homebuilt sbc backed by a 4 speed and a 9no frills interior.

 

Or a clean VW van that is still a VW.

 

But yeah an 800 hp rendition of a VW van might sell some magazines...

Funeral homes like it too. 

[1912Staver]

On 5/14/2024 at 12:52 PM, Steve_Mack_CT said:

Well for modifieds I would walk by that in favor of the 57 Chevy with a mediocre paint job, nice Cragar SS rims, and a homebuilt sbc backed by a 4 speed and a 9no frills interior.

 

Or a clean VW van that is still a VW.

 

But yeah an 800 hp rendition of a VW van might sell some magazines...

Crager SS wheels !! One of my least favorite. Just not a fan of chromed die cast centers attached to a steel rim. Give me a one piece alloy wheel any day. Cragar SS's are heavy and the chrome is poor quality. Around here they often looked like crap after a year or two from the corrosion heaving up the chrome on the center portion. 

 But I know, different strokes.