Ford CEO says electric vehicles may shift to completely online sales.

[Twisted Shifter]

 CEO Farley described a future where Ford dealerships would no longer stock inventory but serve as customer service centers for picking up online orders or repairing existing vehicles. “We've also got to go to non-negotiated price," said Farley. 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news/ford-ceo-suggests-new-ev-sales-model-that-s-100-online/ar-AAY1zNt?ocid=mailsignout

 

[avgwarhawk]

Dealerships don't want to hear that. Furthermore, I'm hard pressed to drop 50k plus on a vehicle sight unseen.

[1935Packard]

That's the Tesla approach, from what I understand.

[hidden_hunter]

36 minutes ago, 1935Packard said:

That's the Tesla approach, from what I understand.

And Mercedes here, Honda also moved to it and their sales totally tanked 

[Bhigdog]

Maybe Amazon will sell them. Delivered to your door 2 days later........Bob

[rocketraider]

I hope I'm in the ground before that happens. What's next, going back to 90 day warrantees?

 

I don't understand peoples' fear of negotiating a car purchase. Educate yourself before you go and negotiate a deal fair to yourself and the dealer. What's so difficult about that?

 

I guess this will appeal to folks who have never developed any social or negotiation skills, and certainly to carmakers, who will be able to price their products with impunity.

[31plymouth]

5 minutes ago, rocketraider said:

I don't understand peoples' fear of negotiating a car purchase.

With the shortage of new cars, dealers are in the drivers seat.  Asking thousands over the the MSRP.  Car companies and dealerships are loving it.

I don't think there is much negotiating going on theses days.

[Guest]

This would mean an end to the time honored profession of the car salesman.  Not to mention the negative trickle down effect this would have on other businesses, like the garment industry, among others.

 

[Pfeil]

16 minutes ago, GregLaR said:

This would mean an end to the time honored profession of the car salesman.  Not to mention the negative trickle down effect this would have on other businesses, like the garment industry, among others.

 

Edited June 3, 2022 by Pfeil (see edit history)

[Guest]

I miss Cal.

[60FlatTop]

24 minutes ago, rocketraider said:

Educate yourself before you go and negotiate a deal fair to yourself and the dealer. What's so difficult about that?

There are many people in jobs that require group meetings and decision making. It is their job and livelihood. They show up at multiple meetings everyday totally unprepared. It is how they live. An educated consumer or coworker is a rare pleasure.

 

My line of work is not cars but I have turned down work from clients who were not knowledgeable, looked like trouble.

 

[John_S_in_Penna]

2 hours ago, Bhigdog said:

Maybe Amazon will sell them. Delivered to your door 2 days later........Bob

I suppose if there are few options, and they all come

in bland shades of gray, they could do that.  But they

won't find me as a customer!

[28 Chrysler]

Costco will sell them in a 2pack.

[1937hd45]

Can some math wiz tell us what percentage of the population buys NEW CARS? 

[DAVES89]

39 minutes ago, 60FlatTop said:

There are many people in jobs that require group meetings and decision making. It is their job and livelihood. They show up at multiple meetings everyday totally unprepared. It is how they live. An educated consumer or coworker is a rare pleasure.

 

My line of work is not cars but I have turned down work from clients who were not knowledgeable, looked like trouble.

 

I've had sales jobs where they wanted to call meetings and then wonder while I was in the office and not out making calls. I am now a one man band selling health insurance and Medicare products and also avoid the unkowledgeable but arrogant client that usually turns out to be trouble... 

[Marty Roth]

56 minutes ago, 28 Chrysler said:

Costco will sell them in a 2pack.

--- and Sam's Club will offer the option of a discounted 3-week mailer,

or the "Scan and Go" from the rearmost rack

[f.f.jones]

I purchased my last "Factory New" vehicle in 1972. I have been able to live comfortably (wife, house, kids, dogs and cats - the whole catastrophe) without having to purchase another "New" vehicle and not because I couldn't afford one. 

There have always been a wide selection of cars, well maintained and able to serve my purposes available at very reasonable prices as compared the current year's offerings. With judicious preparation, I feel that this trend should continue. 

I have nothing against all the latest gizmos, options, lack of variety in exterior or interior colors, etc, etc. I just feel I don't need to be the first on my block or at the grocery store or stop light or church parking lot with a new car. Nor do I need to dump thousands of dollars on the pavement (in depreciation) as I leave the dealership with a new vehicle. 

...Just the way I've done it, and it worked for me.

[f.f.jones]

1 hour ago, 1937hd45 said:

Can some math wiz tell us what percentage of the population buys NEW CARS? 

When someone figures this out, please subtract all the fleet purchases - rental cars, government agencies, and any other volume purchasers who are not individuals. Might not leave too many private purchases compared to the adult population in general.

[TerryB]

You can’t have used cars until……they are used!  Used cars were new cars at some point in their history so someone has to start the process of regulating them to the status of used cars.  I often hear the used car market is a more profitable endeavor than selling new.  Certainly true in this limited availability market.

[SC38dls]

I’ll bet Ford is going to be successful in this endeavor. Not so much to the types of people that are part of this forum or association but the current 20-40 year olds that have never negotiated the purchase of anything. They think the internet is the absolute end all and do everything on it, entertainment, social events, buying food to underwear. They think if it’s on the net it must be true and the best you can get, why not cars. The world is changing at a faster pace than old guys like me can keep up with, cars on line is just one more change. Just think in 10 years (I’ll probably be gone) and you go to a car dealer you can say “remember the good old days when we could talk to a real person” ! Wait a minute, aren’t we saying that now about a lot of the things we use to talk to a person? The more it changes the more it stays the same. 
dave s 

Edited June 3, 2022 by SC38dls (see edit history)

[TAKerry]

Agree completely with Dave. I was a realtor a few years ago and had a young girl as a client that bought a house. When I asked her to write a check for the down payment she was dumbfounded! Had no idea what a check was nor where to get one. I told her that her bank could help. She didnt have a 'brick and mortar' bank, everything she did was online!! I had to walk her through the steps to get a cashiers check.

 

Whole different world than what a lot of us grew up in/remember.

[rocketraider]

2 hours ago, GregLaR said:

 

Now picture that in a 70s leisure suit.🕺

 

I've had plenty of co-workers who epitomized "if ya can't dazzle 'em with brilliance...". They were rarely prepared and couldn't negotiate their way out of a paper sack. They were the demographic "no-haggle car buying" was designed for.

 

I always enjoyed the sport of it meself. But as Dave points out above, some are terrified of personal interaction and are willing to take whatever beating comes their way as long as they don't have to face-to-face with anyone. Facetime doesn't count 🙄.

[60FlatTop]

Leasing electric cars is something I would like to get into. Long life with minimal engine maintenance, no check engine lights, and relatively high purchase cost. I would surely consider leasing the lease turn ins. I could squeeze the juice from the principle for 15 years.

 

Look at the current crop of ICE cars from 5,000 to 150,000. They are so reliable companies are begging for you to insure them against the non-event every 3 minutes on TV.

[plymouthcranbrook]

Another three reasons not to buy a Ford electric. 1. It’s a Ford.  2. Buying it online.  3 It’s an EV. 

[John348]

It is pretty obvious that Ford is not marketing it to a majority of those who posted on this thread, for that matter it is also pretty obvious a majority of those posters are not in the market for that type of vehicle. And it is very obvious not many of us like any change. The days of beating up a dealer and haggling over a price have become pretty much a thing of the past. My last three GMC trucks I built on line, printed out the build sheet, called the dealership, he gave me the price and I ordered the truck on the phone. Last one was on the way to the AACA Meet in Mobile 2018. I am not buying it used or off the lot inventory so there is no need to touch and feel it. I really don't see much of a difference of on the phone or on line.

EV's are not for everyone but they will make up for 1/3 market share. that is the buyers personal decision, no different the number of doors, seat material, or transmission type.  As Terry pointed out every used car was a new car and I see plenty of late model used cars on the road, so someone did buy or lease them when new. 

Edited June 4, 2022 by John348 (see edit history)

[kar3516]

I’m guessing that owners of EVs will sell them right before the battery requires replacement.  And prospective buyers of the used EV will deduct the price of a new replacement battery from the asking price.  They are not cheap.  A friend of mine said he found what he thought was a good deal on a Smart car for his wife to drive in their small town; car was $5000 but the replacement battery it needed was $8000....  the used EV business will be all about cost of batteries

Edited June 3, 2022 by kar3516 (see edit history)

[TerryB]

That idea of selling it right before battery replacement can be 300,000 miles or more ahead for your most modern EVs. As EVs gain market share battery pack replacement will be like crate motor jobs are today, do you do it and is it worth the cost?  It’s also important to remember EV batteries are not like a gallon of milk, they don’t just spoil overnight.  The batteries can slowly degrade until they are no longer practical to use.  My first iPad is that way, after eight years of use the battery discharges more quickly than my two year old iPad yet I can still use the old iPad for many tasks in spite of its battery degradation.  Someday it will quit altogether but that day hasn’t happened yet.

[kar3516]

15 minutes ago, TerryB said:

That idea of selling it right before battery replacement can be 300,000 miles or more ahead for your most modern EVs. As EVs gain market share battery pack replacement will be like crate motor jobs are today, do you do it and is it worth the cost?  It’s also important to remember EV batteries are not like a gallon of milk, they don’t just spoil overnight.  The batteries can slowly degrade until they are no longer practical to use.  My first iPad is that way, after eight years of use the battery discharges more quickly than my two year old iPad yet I can still use the old iPad for many tasks in spite of its battery degradation.  Someday it will quit altogether but that day hasn’t happened yet.

I hope you are right...

[John348]

This is from Ford's website, from my experience from the two new Fords I had owned the only question I have is "the great pride in every vehicle they build" Maybe they should be using "have you driven one lately" now? I always viewed that slogan as admitting they built crappy cars prior 

"What is my Electric Vehicle's Battery Warranty?

We take great pride in every vehicle we build. So, should a problem arise, we’re here to make it right. Your electric vehicle’s battery warranty protects your components if repairs, replacements or adjustments are needed while you are covered. Your battery is covered for 8 years or 100,000 miles, whichever comes first, retaining a minimum of 70% of its original capacity over that period."

 

this is the link

 

https://www.ford.com/support/how-tos/warranty/warranties-and-coverage/what-is-my-electric-vehicles-battery-warranty/

[1937hd45]

8 hours ago, f.f.jones said:

When someone figures this out, please subtract all the fleet purchases - rental cars, government agencies, and any other volume purchasers who are not individuals. Might not leave too many private purchases compared to the adult population in general.

Thank you! After I posted my request I though about everything you just mentioned. 

[Frank DuVal]

11 hours ago, rocketraider said:

I don't understand peoples' fear of negotiating a car purchase. Educate yourself before you go and negotiate a deal fair to yourself and the dealer. What's so difficult about that?

What is fair?  Since I only buy a new car every 17 years, I have nothing to base a fair price on. Fair compared to the value of the car to me, or fair value compared to another dealer, or fair to the manufacturer, or ????

 

When you walk out with your new car, how do you know you got a good deal? Could be you were just offering a too high a price to start, and the salesman played along and got your price even higher!😆

 

Do you always go in and offer 50% of MSRP?😉  If it is always a set % off MSRP, then why the dance?

 

And why, WHY, does it take hours to get out of the dealer playing these games? What a colossal waste of my time. The last car I bought from a dealer was a USED car and it took 4 hours! I will never grace that dealer doorstep again.🤬

 

I see a lot of Carvana trucks loaded with vehicles running on I-95. Must be working for someone!😄  But not me.

Edited June 4, 2022 by Frank DuVal (see edit history)

[John348]

10 hours ago, f.f.jones said:

When someone figures this out, please subtract all the fleet purchases - rental cars, government agencies, and any other volume purchasers who are not individuals. Might not leave too many private purchases compared to the adult population in general.

 

My friend owns a Cadillac Buick GMC dealership on Long Island, almost all of his transactions are private customers and 80% of those transactions are leases. Since the internet the prices are out there and there is very little wiggle room. There are less and less dealers so he said dealer convenience has added value for service, I know it does for me. 

The only people that I come into contact that don't purchase new vehicles on a regular basis seem to be on this site. That's OK, but people have to understand that just because they don't do it, it is still be done by people on a regular basis, and more then every 10 to 12 years.

[1937hd45]

Wonder if you can notice any outside  difference between a 10-12 year old car and a new on the dealer lot version? 

[prewarnut]

 I imagine Ford is doing this to maximize sales and marketshare, probably believing that foistering EVs onto an established dealer network may not work out too well.

[Steve Moskowitz]

Have another perspective based on several decades as a new car dealer.  First, not every dealer has sales practices that cause customers to never come back.  They hardly could survive doing that!  Definitely there are the bad guys but many run straightforward businesses.  At Oldsmobile in our final years we tried one price selling.  Personally we loved it but some neighbor dealers took advantage of our concept and that made it tough.

 

The issue I have with Ford is that they pushed, demanded, forced their dealers (like other manufacturers) to invest heavily in facilities and "buy" a corporate look.  These same dealers are going to have to figure out what to do with their real estate as their taxes are not going to change!  Just one more example of the disdain that SOME manufacturers have for their dealers.  The new crop of executives would love to see dealerships go away.  Sad, it affects a lot of people from employees, families and yes local communities as many car dealers are the biggest supporters of little leagues and charities.

[bryankazmer]

The advantage of the approach is that dealers will not carry much if any inventory.  The factory needs  to run "made to order" instead of "made to stock."  Ford's experiment with this is currently underway.  I can see dealers having a smaller store (no big parking lot) and a few demo cars.  Pricing being fixed or negotiable is a separate issue, but I don't see it as a big deal either way.

[1937hd45]

Still would like to know what the percentage of the population can NEVER afford to buy a NEW vehicle. 

[1912Staver]

At todays sort of list prices I would say quite a large percentage.

The problem is that many / most makers have  cut down on affordable , basic cars. No frills, point A - B commuters. Small efficent engine. Light weight, manual trans, great fuel mileage. 2 door , hatch back. Mainly a 2 seat car . but a kid or small adult size back seat. 10 - 12 G target price. What's so hard ? The Auto industry built them for years, where did they all go ?

Endless choice of 40 - 60 K ,SUV type things or 60 - 100 K trucks. but almost no simple , basic cars these days.

Edited June 4, 2022 by 1912Staver (see edit history)

[SC38dls]

I would say the percentage is getting bigger every day! I know I can’t afford one not that I want one. Our main car has 150,000 and is 11 years old, just broken in and my daily driver is 84 years old with 81,000 miles I’m sure it’s going to out last my old body so I don’t have any issue with what manufacturers do. I do feel bad for the employees that will be out of a job. 
dave s 
dave s 

[bryankazmer]

55 minutes ago, 1937hd45 said:

Still would like to know what the percentage of the population can NEVER afford to buy a NEW vehicle. 

that's a different question from how many can't or choose not to.  Anyway, last years' NA light vehicle sales (includes leases as the cars are technically sold to the leasing company) was 14.9 million vehicles.  That includes fleet sales.  Start from there.

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