The addition of auxiliary tail lamps - yes or no?

[Dosmo]

I have seen a number of antique cars from the (mostly) six-volt era with auxiliary tail lights added below or near the original ones.  I guess the reason behind the extra lights is safety-related when the original lights don't burn brightly enough, if at all.

 

I just wonder what a prospective buyer thinks when he/she/they/them see these lights?  Is the addition of the lights seen as a negative?  It may not be that big a deal for some, but that might not be the case for others.  How much of a big deal can it be to correct the issue with the original lights in order to get them back to where they burn brightly enough to be safely visible to whomever is behind them?  How much of a big deal is it to then remove the auxiliary lights and then do the repairs necessary to remove all evidence of their ever having been added?

 

I guess the big question relates to how does the installation of auxiliary tail lights affect the value of the car?  Is it a valid reason to make a lowball offer?

Edited June 18, 2023 by Dosmo (see edit history)

[CChinn]

Not a big issue for me. I use my old cars to drive them, so extra safety features such as auxiliary lights, turn signals, seat belts, etc )although not original) are not a negative for me. From a valuation perspective, I am also neutral on the issue.  I am sure others here who strive for originality or show their cars in the competitive classes may have a different viewpoint. If I do show the car, it would be in the DPC category so the add ons are allowed as long as it is not excessive

Edited June 18, 2023 by CChinn (see edit history)

[DFeeney]

I think if you shopped around you could find  higher watt bulbs which would fit your sockets and be brighter.  I would also look into 6 volt LED lights.  By today's standards the early cars were not well lit . 

[bryankazmer]

This is also sometimes done to facilitate installing directionals.  I generally prefer that additional lights be done without cutting into the body - e.g. bolted to bumper braces

[Dosmo]

18 minutes ago, bryankazmer said:

This is also sometimes done to facilitate installing directionals.  I generally prefer that additional lights be done without cutting into the body - e.g. bolted to bumper braces

Old car forums exhibit lots of stories where accidents have been caused by dim or non-existent lighting, especially from the rear.  I remember that one guy had an early 50s Pontiac wagon that got totaled.  The tail lights were the pod-type that were mounted on the tailgate, and the lights would pivot in such a way as to be visible from underneath the lowered tailgate.  But, they were still low enough that someone traveling behind the Pontiac didn't see them, resulting in a nasty accident that rendered the wagon unsaveable - I can't recall if there were any injuries.

 

But, I like the idea of additional lights if they can be added in such a way as to be non-detectable when removed.  I would hate to add lights mounted in such a way as on the 40 Ford coupe and the 47 Hudson in my original post.  I think they detract from the appeal of the cars' looks.  A third brake light mounted in the rear window seems like a method that wouldn't leave any lasting damage to be cleaned up.

 

But, to each his own...

[Mark Shaw]

Earlier on this forum, there was an explanation of how red LED bulbs effectively increase the brightness through red lenses. 

Therefore, there should be no need to add more lights for safety.

[31nash880]

I was concerned with this issue on a 1931 Nash. Decided to add a 12 volt inverter to 6 volt circuit an add magent held trailer lights. Also added turn signals. No cutting and easy to remove with no evidence. 

[Walt G]

Before the LED bulbs etc. I added directional lights to my 733 Packard of 1930. the front fog lights became the place to do this in a rewire and at the back I made small brackets that looked period and used a pair of cowl lights from the 1920s to mount on them and then connected/wired in . SO everything can be removed if necessary yet not jump out and ruin the flow of the lines of the car. the 40 Ford shown here has lamps that are just to large for my view.

[3macboys]

More than a little off topic but I really like that picture with the 40 Ford - took 80 years but the police finally caught up with the bootlegger.  Just over the hood of the JD tractor you can see the Crown Vic sitting on the other side of barn.  Maybe those extra tail lights were to change the look of the car from behind to make the Revenuer think that they had lost the car they were chasing....

[chistech]

There are ways to increase the lighting all around to help with visibility of our old cars. LEDs were already mentioned with both taillight and headlight bulbs available. Recoating the reflectors or aluminizing them makes a huge difference.  There is a small company that does a great job offering a third brake light which can easily be installed in a rear window on any hard top car. It is also a LED along with it working as a brake light, it will flash half its length to each respective side when wired in with a directional switch. Bumper mounted directional lights are another big help and even modifying single filament bulbs in cowl lights to dual filaments allowing the cowl lights to now be directional lights also is another modification that doesn’t effect the integrity of the car.

[Bryan G]

On my 49 Chrysler the separate inboard brake lights seem do show up quite well, but the turn signals don't lend themselves to visibility. I'm currently working on getting LED bulbs to work. These cars have a reflector below the taillight; I've thought of trying to turn that into an extra turn signal, or to changing the brake lights to a dual element. I've definitely seen some folks miss the fact I was turning.

[Fleetwood Meadow]

There was an Edsel that I was looking into buying. It had a third high light added to the rear window. My immediate thought was great someone has been playing around with the wires. The second thought was it will immediately be removed. Brighter lights do not correct distracted drivers. If people aren’t paying attention to the car in front of them an additional lights won’t change that. My 1951 Dodge Meadowbrook had, what I considered to be, dim taillights and brake lights. I found 6 volt red LED bulbs and they are just as bright as any car today. 

[Stude Light]

On my 1939 LaSalle, I added 6v LEDs to my tiny tail lights. That helped but the BrakeLighter Bar (as mentioned by @chistech above, is what really aides in safety. I have no interest in the company but am only sharing to help others with their safety. https://www.brakelighter.com/

 

This is a video of the setup in my LaSalle.

 

Since this car came with no turn signals, I added a column mounted switch and repurposed the front fog lamps into directional signals.

 

[Fordy]

I run A Model Ford on one of my Series R Hupps. I made a bracket that clamps around a tube between the rails that also mounts the spare wheel bracket. Turn signals tail and brakes. They look the part and there are no additional holes in any part of the car.

[Mark Gregush]

The idea of the 3rd brake light in the rear window came out in the late 20's or early 30's. The sample I saw in a Model A book from the era, used a Neon bulb. While I don't have all the details, pretty sure that there are some upgrades allowed even in Ford Model A fine points judging that points are not deducted, such as cast-Iron brake drums and adding 2ed taillight. 

[West Peterson]

23 hours ago, Walt G said:

The 40 Ford shown here has lamps that are just to large for my view.

 

They're actually pretty small. I think you're confusing the drawn white circle around them (to show where they are) as part of the taillight.

[Walt G]

Thank you West, you are correct! to many hours looking at a computer screen typing text for a new story about old cars.

[1932 plymouth pb sedan]

My Plymouth had directionals installed in the 50s and cut through the body, I got them functional rather than trying to fill the holes. Never had a passengers side taillight and that confuses the hell out of people in todays world, good thing everyone understands the one finger wave and profanity.

[keiser31]

Apparently the Chinese thought the 1926 Chevrolet coupes came with turn signals as my model of one suggests. Take a close look under the bumper of the real car and the model....

[TAKerry]

Adding lights, in particular to the rear of the car can never be a bad thing. There are options available now that I would think anything could be accomplished in a tasteful way. Not as much an issue on 'newer' cars as on the earlier models. I agree that it would not make much diff. to a distracted driver but any thing can help. 

[PWN]

Anybody try the bicycle flashers? Rechargeable, battery can last a day or more, but the best thing is you can see the lights over a mile away and also have erratic flash patterns to catch the eye.

 

1. Bontrager Flare RT

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[Akstraw]

I agree that in today’s environment where, for many drivers, driving is just another app on the cell phone, any additional brake/signal lights are beneficial.  If you can do so without cutting metal, that’s the best way.  I adapted a trailering kit to add magnetically mounted brake lights to my ‘48 Chrysler.  This car, curiously enough, came from the factory with only one brake light, that being in the center of the trunk lid.  I had to re-wire the trailer kit for 6V, and added some of those strong neodymium magnets underneath to keep them secure.  The entire assembly can be unplugged and removed in about 2 minutes.  The biggest abomination I have had to deal with was a hack job of added signal lights, front and rear, on a ‘32 Detroit Electric.

[ply33]

On 6/20/2023 at 1:28 PM, PWN said:

Anybody try the bicycle flashers? Rechargeable, battery can last a day or more, but the best thing is you can see the lights over a mile away and also have erratic flash patterns to catch the eye.

I made up some brackets that can clamp on to the rear bumper supports that hold bicycle LED flashers. I normally stow them in the glove box but if I am driving a long way at night or end up sitting by the side of the road at night I can clamp them on and then set them to either solid on or flashing as desired.

 

That doesn't help with having a more visible brake light though.

[PWN]

On 6/20/2023 at 10:42 PM, Akstraw said:

I agree that in today’s environment where, for many drivers, driving is just another app on the cell phone, any additional brake/signal lights are beneficial.  If you can do so without cutting metal, that’s the best way.  I adapted a trailering kit to add magnetically mounted brake lights to my ‘48 Chrysler.  This car, curiously enough, came from the factory with only one brake light, that being in the center of the trunk lid.  I had to re-wire the trailer kit for 6V, and added some of those strong neodymium magnets underneath to keep them secure.  The entire assembly can be unplugged and removed in about 2 minutes.  The biggest abomination I have had to deal with was a hack job of added signal lights, front and rear, on a ‘32 Detroit Electric.

Love the Volvo!

[JACK M]

When I was wiring up the Jeepster I found that whoever had done it the first time must not have understood just how to make turn signals work.

The original bulbs only had one filament.

I ended up making a couple of tin plates and actually splitting the taillight into two chambers. Upper for taillights and lower for stop/turn.

Wired up a couple of brighter single filament sockets and stuffed them into the lower half of the bucket. Worked pretty well.

[R.Dan Herrera]

Back in sept.2022 I purchased a pair of amber colored fog lights that are made for use as turn signals and have brackets that mount to my 36 dodge front or rear bumper holding Brackets .these came from Rodtiques LLC out of Hanover Maine and can be installed permanently or removable.of course the rears are not fog type but are vintage looking also.

[J.H.Boland]

I had a pair of old style trailer tail lights that are a close match to the original single tail lamp on the '25 Buick. With LED bulbs they are more than adequate . I restored an extra pair of original cowl lamps and mounted them on specially made brackets on the front bumper. The period accessory stop light lights up green with "STOP" in the lens.

[Paul Dobbin]

Yes, all our pre WWII vehicles have small taillights, down low and usually dim.   Sometimes centrally mounted and really hard to see.   If the car was a Standard, that meant one tail light on the left side only.   I always add the right side tail light.   Our 1915 Model T had one kerosene tail light and we never lit it or drove it at night.   Our headlights were not designed for us to see the road, they were made so that cars coming the other way would see us coming.    The Model T was the first year for electric headlights.   Powered by the magnito, the faster I drove the brighter the light got, until the bulb exploded.   Another reason to drive it in daylight only.

YES, I want a high mounted third brake light, turn signals and bright STOP Lights.   That idiot in a pickup truck doing 65 MPH on a curved

road will rear-end me before he knows I'm there, doing 35 MPG because that ls a fast as I can take the curves.  The white speed limit sign says 40, but I can't do that fast safely.   Driving lights are a help but sometimes more than my 6 Volt generator can supply for long rides.

Best option, avoid a drive after dark if possible

[Scott Bonesteel]

As Paul Dobbin has succinctly put it, if you don't drive them, you might as well collect clocks.  I understand that some of us have a 1919 Raremobile or a 30s, one-off high dollar model wherein originality is the only consideration and driving them in real traffic an infrequent if not rare event.  I drive my cars, in particular my 1934 Plymouth PE sedan.  No one is ever going to mistake it for a concourse restoration but at least to me I think it looks pretty good.  The original look is in no way destroyed or diminished by the way I have protected myself on the road:  1937 vintage Super 7 fog lights on the front that have been wired for running lights and turn signals.  The original, two-filament tail lights, both of them (extra tail light was an available option), I have wired for brake and turn signals.  Only 'non period' addition is a slim, third brake light, mounted on the lower edge of the rear window, which I have powered with an additional hydraulic switch mounted on the rear end junction block for the rear hydraulic brake lines--which gives a very bright brake light and provides a backup brake light if the original hydraulic switch (powering the regular tail/brake lights) were to fail.  Stayed away from the 'billet' types that do look anachronistic an went for one that, while modern, is the least obtrusive.  On my 34 convertible, still in the works, I am using a period 'STOP' light for a third brake light, which looks more appropriate.  Bottom line, take a little time, use period lights if available, and you can get turn signals and brake lights that give us drivers at least a little more of an edge against some of the blockhead drivers that are out there, particularly here in Southern California. 

[dodge28]

If  it is a trailer queen keep it original. If you drive it on public roads install additional lights for safety. Turn signal and stop lights, bright as could ever be. Old cars on the street is always a distraction to most drivers.

[Guest]

I have found turn signals, added brake lights etc do little to nothing safety wise.  They do make the owner feel better often, unless you are driving at night and the only visible part of the car are the lights.  In reality most on the road are simply too busy looking at the car to notice lights, right turns frequent return waves.  The good bit is they are at least looking at the car.  For night driving I advocate bulbs as bright as possible, wire them like you would trailer lights simply using dual filament bulbs, provided of course you have 2.  Regarding the front during daytime you would probably better off making eye contact and pointing which direction you are going.

[Matt Harwood]

I'm convinced a third brake light is the single biggest safety boost you can add to your old car.

 

[dodge28]

swab you are right. Old cars on the road itself is a distraction. I myself, while driving, and I see an old car driving along I try to get closer to have a better look. But I keep it safe. A third brake light is good but all lights must be at a reasonable height to be visible Matt, and bright.

[Mark Gregush]

9 minutes ago, dodge28 said:

swab you are right. Old cars on the road itself is a distraction. I myself, while driving, and I see an old car driving along I try to get closer to have a better look. But I keep it safe. A third brake light is good but all lights must be at a reasonable height to be visible Matt, and bright.

There are a lot of people on the road that don't see them or misjudge their speed. The shape of them or color just does not register as a car. 

I added a 3rd brake light to my 1920 Dodge touring. It is mounted at the top bolt that would hold the spare tire bracket, along with two taillights. Turn signals to come later.