Electric / Pedestrian close call

[1937hd45]

If you know me, you know that if given an electric vehicle for free I'd keep it for as long as it takes to sell it. Took Hank on his morning walk today, down the street I've lived on for 70 1/2 years now, had a electric ....box roll up on us, never heard it coming. Must have some third reich silencing engineering, NOT impressed. If he gets a kid or pet on this street he gets sued back to bare feet. 

Bob 

[TerryB]

Was he driving erratically, was he speeding, were you paying attention to traffic?  Electric vehicles are quiet.  Some will generate a sound at low speeds for the reason you seem to imply.  What about a bicycle rider, are you aware of their presence when you are walking?  If the person in the EV did nothing wrong, on what grounds would you be able to sue them? 

[1937hd45]

Co owner are you?

[dictator27]

1 hour ago, TerryB said:

Was he driving erratically, was he speeding, were you paying attention to traffic?  Electric vehicles are quiet.  Some will generate a sound at low speeds for the reason you seem to imply.  What about a bicycle rider, are you aware of their presence when you are walking?  If the person in the EV did nothing wrong, on what grounds would you be able to sue them? 

The bicycle rider issue came up recently here because of something called dooring.  A person opened his car door without looking forcing a cyclist to swerve into the path of a big rig.  The cyclist died.  There has been talk here about the Danish maneuver.  Since there is a high percentage of cyclists in Denmark, drivers are required to open their door with their right hand.  This makes them look left before opening the door.

As far as quiet electric vehicles go, this is something the CNIB (Canadian National Institute for the Blind) has brought up several times.  It is not something that can be dealt with at the municipal level so they can only advise blind people to be very cautious at intersection.

 

[JFranklin]

Maybe go back to the model T Ford concept of no driver door at all!

[Matt Harwood]

I believe electric cars are required by law to make artificial noises when they're moving. I know our E-Tron has a speaker underneath that emits a sound that changes as the vehicle accelerates. It isn't the same as the sound of an internal combustion engine's exhaust and fan noises, but it's loud enough to hear. Teslas are the same, and I can hear my neighbor's Nissan Leaf making a kind of high-pitched hum as he rolls down his driveway each morning.

[1912Staver]

I hear the noise as well , but only when they are reversing. They can be nearly silent when going forward. Perhaps U.S. regulations are different from Canada ? Lots of Tesla's and Leaf's around here.

Edited September 19, 2021 by 1912Staver (see edit history)

[Fossil]

There are all kinds of ambient noise that can drown out the sounds of a normal car approaching. People are still getting run over by vehicles sounding those annoying backup alarms. All the noise in the would will not fix stupid. It's up to you to be aware of what's going on around you. 

 

 

[Guest]

3 hours ago, 1937hd45 said:

Must have some third reich silencing engineering, 

This is the best line I've read here all weekend.  😄

[SC38dls]

Am I missing something here. Nothing happened in the OP story. So what’s the big deal?  Isn’t it the same as saying the plane didn’t crash but if it did and I was on it my survivor relatives could sue the airline. I guess I just don’t understand bitching about something bad that did not happen. Maybe I live an optimistic life instead of being a pessimist. 
dave s 

[TerryB]

Brings up images of the Hunt for Red October movie…was Sean Connery driving?  

[1937hd45]

41 minutes ago, Fossil said:

There are all kinds of ambient noise that can drown out the sounds of a normal car approaching. People are still getting run over by vehicles sounding those annoying backup alarms. All the noise in the would will not fix stupid. It's up to you to be aware of what's going on around you. 

 

 

Let get this right, who in your mind is stupid? I'll let you answer. Me, walking my licensed dog on a leash without eyeballs in the back of my head,  or your pal in the silent electric driving up behind me? 

[Peter Gariepy]

20 minutes ago, 1937hd45 said:

Let get this right, who in your mind is stupid? I'll let you answer. Me, walking my licensed dog on a leash without eyeballs in the back of my head,  or your pal in the silent electric driving up behind me? 

 

So the owner of the electric car is a problem for simply driving his car on a public road?
Would you have been equally upset if someone had ridden a bike up from behind you?

How about someone walking faster than you?

How about a jogger?

 

I fail to understand your complaint.  (or maybe just whining?)
 

Or, maybe you simply fault the owner for making a personal choice to own an electric vehicle and that offends you because you choose not too?

 

[1912Staver]

Reminds me of something that happened years ago. I was riding my bike on a designated cycle path , at a pretty good clip, I was into cycling for fitness at that stage of my life.  A man was standing a bit off the path enjoying the view. Just as I came close he turned and stepped right into my path, never looked my way at all. Needless to say I clobbered him....hard . Luckily, once we got each other picked up, sorted out and let the shock settle down a bit we realized neither of us were seriously injured. But very lucky. I was bruised, stiff and sore for days after, I am sure he was as well. A racing bike at speed is very quiet. I didn't have time even to yell at him to look out, things happen that fast.

Edited September 19, 2021 by 1912Staver (see edit history)

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

DAMN, must be a slow day. 

 

 Ben

[ply33]

Regarding the pedestrian warning noise that electric cars are now required to have: That is a fairly new requirement in the US. There are quite a few EVs and PHEVs on the road that were built prior to the requirement and those can be very quiet as all you hear is tire noise. Unlike a bunch of pickup truck drivers who like noisy aggressive off road style tread patterns, it seems most EV drivers stick with the low rolling resistance tires which are pretty quiet.

 

The newer EVs and PHEVs have small speakers and emit pedestrian warning sounds at low speeds. I have read that some manufacturers are trying for unique sounds, I guess as part of vehicle branding. I have read that Teslas, maybe just the newer ones, allow the owner to select the sound.

[plymouthcranbrook]

I still think going back to a man with a flag in the daylight and a red lantern at night will solve the problem.

Edited September 20, 2021 by plymouthcranbrook (see edit history)

[rocketraider]

Just one of many things to be solved as we segue to EVs.

 

Used to hate the electric golf carts we had at work for same reason. The plant machinery was loud enough to require ear plugs, then when a golf cart zoomed up on you, if you were lucky its driver would toot the horn to let you know it was there.

[1937hd45]

19 minutes ago, ply33 said:

Regarding the pedestrian warning noise that electric cars are now required to have: That is a fairly new requirement in the US. There are quite a few EVs and PHEVs on the road that were built prior to the requirement and those can be very quiet as all you hear is tire noise. Unlike a bunch of pickup truck drivers who like noisy aggressive off road style tread patterns, it seems most EV drivers stick with the low rolling resistance tires which are pretty quiet.

 

The newer EVs and PHEVs have small speakers and emit pedestrian warning sounds at low speeds. I have read that some manufacturers are trying for unique sounds, I guess as part of vehicle branding. I have read that Teslas, maybe just the newer ones, allow the owner to select the sound.

 

Do EV owners understand that NON EV people have small children and grand children? 

[rocketraider]

Probably. But not a priority for them.

 

If you "people watch" (and I do) you'll notice that early adopters of new technology tend to be a little narcissistic and "look at me!" types.

 

A lot simply do not care about other people. Their world is centered around themselves and their, and only their, gratification. Whoever gets run over in the process is simply collateral damage.

 

Life on third rock would be great if people weren't, well, people. Tex Avery's screwball masterpiece "The Cat Who Hated People" comes to mind, but I cannot find a full-length version of it.

 

 

[1937hd45]

Just now, rocketraider said:

Probably. But not a priority for them.

 

If you "people watch" (and I do) you'll notice that early adopters of new technology tend to be a little narcissistic and "look at me!" types.

 

A lot simply do not care about other people. Their world is centered around themselves and their, and only their, gratification. Whoever gets run over in the process is simply collateral damage.

 

Life on third rock would be great if people weren't, well, people. Tex Avery's screwball masterpiece "The Cat Who Hated People" comes to mind, but I cannot find a full-length version of it.

 

 

 

 

Thank you. The EV Clan sure is a close knit group as witnessed here. Pray the jerk doesn't take out a little kid. 

 

Bob 

[keithb7]

This story reminds me of the great race from NY to Paris back in 1908. 
 

One of the driving teams was arrested. Their car drove into a small USA town. The car’s exhaust noise was claimed to have scared horses. The team were in jail overnight if I recall. Was it the Italians?

 

People don’t like change. Never did. Still don’t. Yet eventually society adapts. 

[Bryan G]

In the meantime-I only drive my old cars to one or two shows per year; as I'm driving along I can't get pedestrians out of my way because I refuse to use my horn, and they can't hear a straight eight idling with stock exhaust.

[Frank DuVal]

Stanley Steamers are quiet also.... 

 

I'm still trying to figure out the complaint. If you were on the sidewalk, then the car is at fault. If you were in the street, then you should be walking facing traffic. I learned that 60 years ago as a child. 

[mike6024]

I suppose Bob was buzzed by a speeding, silent EV. Too fast and too close. Go slow and give space when passing pedestrians on residential streets. I live on what is supposed to be a quiet, 25 mph residential street, without sidewalks, so if you go for a walk you are sharing the road with vehicles, even if you try to stay over to the shoulder. Some people drive responsibly but most speed and it can be 35 mph, or 45, or sometimes even 50+
 

[ply33]

2 hours ago, 1937hd45 said:

Do EV owners understand that NON EV people have small children and grand children? 

I don’t know as I don’t have an EV. I am interested in automotive technologies as they come along so I do a lot of reading about the tech. I do not read or think as much about the people buying it.

 

With respect to car owners understanding that people have small children and grandchildren, at my previous house we lived on a short street with an elementary school at the end. Nearly all the children were dropped off by parents. Near as I can tell from the way the parents drove none of them realized or cared that other people had children or grandchildren.

 

My general impression is that many drivers only care about themselves. We are all subject to confirmation bias so I can’t say that my observations are accurate but it seems to me that the bigger and/or more expensive the late model vehicle is, the more self-centered the driver is likely to be. Again, probably confirmation bias, but drivers of less expensive cars (usually less expensive because they are older vehicles) don’t seem to be as aggressive or self-centered in their driving.

 

Disclaimer: I have a PHEV which is pretty quiet most of the time. I got it because I am frugal with my “daily driver” and it was, when I bought it, just about the cheapest vehicle I could get that used very little gas and was a make/brand with a good reputation for reliability. I live in an area with lots of pedestrians and spotty coverage with respect to sidewalks so those pedestrians are often in the traveled way. So I drive pretty mellow and watch carefully for pedestrians, etc.

[plymouthcranbrook]

3 hours ago, rocketraider said:

Just one of many things to be solved as we segue to EVs.

 

Used to hate the electric golf carts we had at work for same reason. The plant machinery was loud enough to require ear plugs, then when a golf cart zoomed up on you, if you were lucky its driver would toot the horn to let you know it was there.

Reminds me of when I was a young lad driving an electric fork lift in a drug company factory. You would be creeping along with a big load on the front of the machine as there wasn't room to turn around in many places. People would just step off in front of you. We used to joke that their thoughts were" He'll see me and stop"

[TerryB]

10 hours ago, 1937hd45 said:

 

 

Thank you. The EV Clan sure is a close knit group as witnessed here. Pray the jerk doesn't take out a little kid. 

 

Bob 

You have yet to say what happened in the encounter.  Did you step out in front of the car because you did not hear it? What you are saying is quiet cars are inherently bad.  If a gas vehicle is driven unsafely is that ok because it’s powered by fossil fuel?  Trying to make an argument that EV owners and EV cars are inherently poor drivers has zero merit based on the details, or lack of details, you have presented so far.  

[TAKerry]

Not much experience with electrics, or even new cars. Mom has a brand new equinox ( I think thats what it is, something Chevy). When she comes over I can stand beside the running car and barely hear it. My hearing isnt great so I doubt I could tell the diff between that and electric.

[31plymouth]

Is this why the golf carts at Hershey drag the tin cans?

 

Read a story many years ago about early Rolls Royce car.  
Something like.      " The only thing you hear when a Rolls Royce is coming down the road is the tires.   We don't make the tires"

 

[Brass is Best]

This whole thread should be removed. It is not about old cars and has the potential to get political very quickly... 

[Matt Harwood]

I should admit that one of my very favorite things to do was to put my 1929 Cadillac in 3rd gear and let it idle along at 5 MPH. It was completely silent. Surprised A LOT of people at car shows walking in front of it.

 

The whole point of the Full Classics was silent operation. Hell, you can stand next to the Marmon Sixteen while it's idling and not know it's running and I have to check the oil pressure gauge at lights to be sure it hasn't stalled.

 

This isn't a new phenomenon. Just because the form of propulsion has changed, the circumstances haven't. If anything, this was a good lesson in situational awareness.

[1937hd45]

New day today, took the liberty to tell the young mom pushing her twins in the duel carriage about the silent danger. She thanked me. Sunny clear day, I could hear the rooster crowing two streets over.

 

Bob 

[60FlatTop]

Ever hear about the husband who misunderstood his wife when she told him there was a old cycle path in the neighborhood?

[TerryB]

36 minutes ago, 1937hd45 said:

New day today, took the liberty to tell the young mom pushing her twins in the duel carriage about the silent danger. She thanked me. Sunny clear day, I could hear the rooster crowing two streets over.

 

Bob 

Good!  Enjoy the nice day yourself, they don’t happen often enough for my liking.  Also, enjoy your trip to Hershey this year, I hope it’s as much fun for you as always.  I guess Hank is your dog, if yes, give him an extra pat on the head and an extra dog brisket today, I’m sure he deserves it.  

[1937hd45]

Hank is my dog, smarter than many think, he pissed on the EV owners lawn first thing this morning.

 

Bob 

[mrspeedyt]

The problem with silent electric cars existed over 100 years ago. they are delightfully quiet in my opinion. 

 

(at least they have better batteries now.)

Edited September 20, 2021 by mrspeedyt (see edit history)

[Walt G]

Added issue in today's world is that most people - either behind the wheel of the new mode of transportation, or walking on the street do not pay attention. How many people walk with their head phones on listening to music, looking at their cell ? How many don't tell their kids they have to wear a helmet when riding their bikes? The kids see their parents and other adults set examples that are not quite safe or even courteous .

It is a self focused world because all is available at the tap of a button.............................

[60FlatTop]

3 hours ago, Walt G said:

It is a self focused world

"People" have not joined together for a common cause for 80 years, about four generations. And 80 years before that, 1860's. And 80 years before that, 1770's.

 

Appears to be a four generation thing going on. They will become less self focused soon.

Edited September 20, 2021 by 60FlatTop (see edit history)

[1937hd45]

5 minutes ago, Walt G said:

Added issue in today's world is that most people - either behind the wheel of the new mode of transportation, or walking on the street do not pay attention. How many people walk with their head phones on listening to music, looking at their cell ? How many don't tell their kids they have to wear a helmet when riding their bikes? The kids see their parents and other adults set examples that are not quite safe or even courteous .

It is a self focused world because all is available at the tap of a button.............................

 

 

There was a time not so long ago that I'd look a walker or runner in the eye and say good morning / good afternoon. They are now so self absorbed I just ignore them, ear plugs and a cellphone suppository is the center of their world.