Letter from the "aaca" museum

[MCHinson]

28 minutes ago, Terry Bond said:

 They literally gave us the finger when they eliminated the Regions and Chapters Room where clubs had their histories exhibited and were honored for their contributions.  We were simply told to come get our stuff!  

 

At least they told you to come and get your stuff. Our Chapter had a dozen or so items on display in the Regions and Chapters Room. They never even bothered to tell us to come get it. I just simply showed up during the Fall Meet and discovered that it was gone. I have no idea what happened to the items that our Chapter had on display in the Regions and Chapters room. I can only assume that the museum threw them out. 

[C Carl]

I dunno , Matt. The items might have left in the pockets of some who have proved beyond reasonable doubt how they roll.  - CC

[CarNucopia]

This situation has inspired me to rejoin the Club and show support in hoping it prevails over the museum.

 

It will be interesting to see their Form 990 for 2017 and learn how this split has impacted their finances.

[Joe in Canada]

What club are they involved with now and we should start a pool on how long it will last. Put me down for Oct. 2019 to see if they get through two touring seasons.

Edited March 28, 2018 by Joe in Canada (see edit history)

[nick8086]

I got an email today. on this..

 

It is  more of the same drama I am having..

 

It will work out.  And that will be the new norm..

 

[AJFord54]

13 hours ago, trimacar said:

Yeah, I learned my lesson in college, I was dating two girls at the same time.  They each found out about it, and there was hell to pay.  I learned you can't have your Kate and Edith too.....

 

I feel sorry for Steve and others involved in this issue at the upper levels, such idiocy sucks the fun out of old cars at times, and this is one of those times.  My sympathy. 

GROAN  

[MCHinson]

7 hours ago, Joe in Canada said:

What club are they involved with now and we should start a pool on how long it will last. Put me down for Oct. 2019 to see if they get through two touring seasons.

 

It is no longer easy to find on their website, where it was initially listed prominently, but it is the Tucker Automobile Club. After searching for several minutes without success, I was able to do a search for "Tucker Club" on their website and finally found it.

 

"Representatives from the Tucker Automobile Club of America (TACA) and the AACA Museum, Inc., Hershey, Pennsylvania, are pleased to simultaneously and jointly release news of an exciting new collaboration. Effective immediately TACA will become a vital new part of the Museum. The TACA is ending its stand-alone status to become a membership category at the Museum. Its financial resources, archival and artefactual collections will be transferred to the AACA Museum, Inc. The Club’s approximately 200 members will be welcomed into the AACA Museum’s growing family, substantively increasing the organization’s already-significant Tucker-based resources and knowledge."

 

To me, it essentially sounds like the museum absorbed the Tucker Club. The Tucker Club was a bit different from most clubs anyway. The museum now houses their lilterature and other artifacts and the club's members became members of the museum instead of members of a stand alone club. The Tucker Club does not appear to have ever operated like any other club that I am familar with. I don't think they had meets or tours or similar events.

[Joe in Canada]

3 minutes ago, MCHinson said:

Representatives from the Tucker Automobile Club of America (TACA) and the AACA Museum, Inc., Hershey, Pennsylvania, are pleased to simultaneously and jointly release news of an exciting new collaboration. Effective immediately TACA will become a vital new part of the Museum. The TACA is ending its stand-alone status to become a membership category at the Museum. Its financial resources, archival and artefactual collections will be transferred to the AACA Museum, Inc. The Club’s approximately 200 members will be welcomed into the AACA Museum’s growing family, substantively increasing the organization’s already-significant Tucker-based resources and knowledge."

So this must be where the donation to their library came from I have seen mentioned. So in essence they can start a library but AACA can not have a car display.

[R W Burgess]

45 minutes ago, MCHinson said:

 

 

 

To me, it essentially sounds like the museum absorbed the Tucker Club. The Tucker Club was a bit different from most clubs anyway. The museum now houses their lilterature and other artifacts and the club's members became members of the museum instead of members of a stand alone club. The Tucker Club does not appear to have ever operated like any other club that I am familar with. I don't think they had meets or tours or similar events.

*

*

I wonder if the Cammack Family gave up ownership to their collection yet? It was on loan originally. It would be a real slap in the face of the family if they did give the collection to the Museum. We already know from history how they sell off items to stay in the black. "To continue to add additional elements to this display, we need your help and financial support. Please consider a generous tax-deductible donation to this world-class exhibit."

*

*

 

[Steve_Mack_CT]

I promptly filed the museum's communique earlier this week, its recyclable.  ☺

[West Peterson]

The Tucker Club has a few hundred members at most. Read into that whatever you wish.

They do have annual meets ... or at least, they used to. Rarely does (did) anyone ever bring a car, usually they go to a location where a Tucker exists.  The issue the club letter brought up was their announcement in print of a pallet of literature delivered to them.  Again, the club did not have any issue with it.

 

[Matt Harwood]

15 hours ago, trimacar said:

Yeah, I learned my lesson in college, I was dating two girls at the same time.  They each found out about it, and there was hell to pay.  I learned you can't have your Kate and Edith too.....

 

 

/throws tomato

[Paul Dobbin]

I toured the "collection" with Bill Smith prior to the building the Museum structure.  I came away with the idea that it was a Region's museum in alliance with the AACA National Club.  At that time  there were only 200 cars in the storage building.  I see his signature on this latest "AACA Museum" letter that I find offensive.  I question whether the entire BOD over there are in really agreement with all this nastiness 

[AC Fuhrman]

I'm desperately  trying to stay OUT of it this time .....However, I will look very carefully before I was ever directly involved with a '501 C3' arrangement again. Going around Uncle Sam when fund-raising can be very tricky - was OUR Museum "stolen" or "given away" or "lost?" Was it ever 'OURS' to begin with? Lots of hurt feelings, lots of mud, makes the whole 'family' look bad. I'm not offended by anyone's letters - shows that at least we all care about something.

 

I have said several times - this is really personal for me  - like a bad divorce - because I truly love both the awesome Club and awesome Museum!

 

Best wishes to all involved.

 

 

[charlier]

3 hours ago, R W Burgess said:

*

*

I wonder if the Cammack Family gave up ownership to their collection yet? It was on loan originally. It would be a real slap in the face of the family if they did give the collection to the Museum. We already know from history how they sell off items to stay in the black. "To continue to add additional elements to this display, we need your help and financial support. Please consider a generous tax-deductible donation to this world-class exhibit."

*

*

 

 

The following article I've linked to may provide some insight into the ownership of the Tuckers.

 

Cammack Family Tucker Collection

 

If I understood the article correctly, the way the "Supporting Organization" (SO) was set up for the Tuckers, the SO retains control over the Tuckers.

 

 

[jeff_a]

Please excuse my lack of knowledge about the Tucker Club, but how could they get 200 members for a club based around a company that put out 52 cars? Do they count all family members of owners....or are they just good at getting people who appreciate, but do not own,Tuckers?

[Bob Hill]

4 minutes ago, jeff_a said:

Please excuse my lack of knowledge about the Tucker Club, but how could they get 200 members for a club based around a company that put out 52 cars? Do they count all family members of owners....or are they just good at getting people who appreciate, but do not own,Tuckers?

 

Good at getting people who appreciate, but do not own, a Tucker

 

Bob

Edited March 28, 2018 by Bob Hill (see edit history)

[R W Burgess]

23 hours ago, charlier said:

 

The following article I've linked to may provide some insight into the ownership of the Tuckers.

 

Cammack Family Tucker Collection

 

If I understood the article correctly, the way the "Supporting Organization" (SO) was set up for the Tuckers, the SO retains control over the Tuckers.

 

The article will not allow me to read it without logging in, Charlie??

[old car fan]

It will be long legal fight on this. Every year in October we went to the Museum, no more. And I pity the families that donated cars thinking they were safe; well, they are not. Very sad greed and payroll overtakes the love and history. I will not post on this subject again, we have great people on this side, who I believe, and most go way out of their way just to make a meet happen. The balls are going to roll on the court, lets wait, find out where they stay,

[RAH]

To AACA board and Museum board and other Club members, I have been reading ad nausea these missives and yes I am still for the time being a member of the AACA. This contentious 'Pissing Match' between these Boards is at least unprofessional and counterproductive to both! Previous missives allude to the AACA creating the Museum including financial support and the use of the term AACA and access to the club website, etc. Subsequent to the National AACA achieving 'non-profit' status and the seeming acknowledgement that the 'Library and Research Center' was somehow different from the 'Museum' which also achieved the 501(c)3 status. Almost immediately the 'Library' was absorbed into the AACA as part and parcel so to speak and not a separate entity. It is obvious this current power stretch to force the 'Museum' to either acknowledge being a separate entity NOT a part of the AACA OR submit to and relinquish individual operational function. Hence the observation of 'Power Grab' in the relation between Boards and a matter of Power and Control or at least the perception thereof. Unfortunately this is not just these Boards attitude as is obvious in other organizations I am still for the time being a member! These boards seem to acquire a dictatorial attitude and sometimes concentrate on things that affect small groups and not on things that affect the entire membership as an entity!  Respectively submitted Rodger "Dodger" 

[MCHinson]

RAH,

 

I would encourge you to read the 24 page history of the break down of the effort to merge the club and the museum. From all of the documents that I have read, there was never any type of "power grab' attempted by the club's board of directors. The museum was formed by the club. The museum board, over the years, drifted away from the active AACA club members who first comprised it. Although plans were made when the museum was formed to eventually merge the two organizations, similar to the way the library was eventually merged with the club, the museum board and the club board were unable to bring about a merger. The museum board apparently still wants to retain the name "AACA" so that it can continue to receive the benefits of the donations that it has received from AACA members by being seen as part of the "AACA family". Despite that, the actions of the museum board have been pretty clear that they have no interest in doing anything to benefit the club. I support the club's actions in this matter. It is a shame that the merger could  not be accomplished but the blame for that does not rest with the club. The silver lining in this cloud is that the club actually found an even better location for the new headquaters and library building than it would have had if the merger at the museum site had happened.   

[charlier]

21 hours ago, R W Burgess said:

The article will not allow me to read it without logging in, Charlie??

 

Sorry everyone, the link did not work. I originally did a Google search and found the article and was able to read the whole thing. Then I included that link in my post. Apparently that link that I posted only shows a small part of the beginning of the article and the request to login or signup for the Wall Street Journal.

 

If you use Google to search for the article" How to Succeed in Philanthropy Without Really Giving Anything" then click on it in the Google search then entire article is vie-able if you are logged in with a Google account. Then you can read the entire article without having to log-in or subscribe.

 

Charlie

[Peter J.Heizmann]

10 hours ago, Paul Dobbin said:

I toured the "collection" with Bill Smith prior to the building the Museum structure.  I came away with the idea that it was a Region's museum in alliance with the AACA National Club.  At that time  there were only 200 cars in the storage building.  I see his signature on this latest "AACA Museum" letter that I find offensive.  I question whether the entire BOD over there are in really agreement with all this nastiness 

 

Totally agree, Paul.  I had the same feelings when I saw his signature plus two others who signed the letter from the museum.  When I was on the AACA board one of my assignments was to represent AACA on the museum board (basically a liaison function).  This was back in the 2008-09 time frame when I was appointed for 2 years.  All I can say is I am extremely disappointed to see these names on the letter, however, if they really feel they did the right thing then so be it and I wish them the best.

 

Like others all my support remains for the AACA.  We will prevail and survive.

 

Regards,

 

Peter J.

[Steve Moskowitz]

RAH,

 

Yes, AACA wanted to see a merger of some sort, any sort.  AACA has stated over and over again that the club did not want to run a museum nor did it have the time or human resources.  Since we were giving them money to them we certainly were not looking for money from them!  There are ways to merge allowing a subsidiary to still maintain control.  Be that as it may, the museum board did not wish that to happen.  Their right.  They are independent and do not answer to you our membership.

 

What is not right, as a public trust, that any entity misleads people.  If there is NO relationship then it needs to be made clear and not have people think that the museum is a part of AACA. 

 

The national board has stated for the record it does not want litigation.  THEY realize it is not in the best interest of our membership or the hobby but the name we have owned since 1935 must not be misappropriated.  Hopefully, common sense will prevail and a simple compromise will be made and both sides can feel they got a fair deal.

 

 

[edinmass]

It was interesting reading the last museum letter. They talk about protecting their 18 million dollar asset. Gee........why even mention a value??? And, just for the record 18 million won’t even buy a decent Ferrari these days. With such a very small total equity that the museum is claiming, they may have already caused some people to shy away from their museum. Operations currently run 1.5 mil a year, about ten percent of the total value of the entire place..........seems like numbers that won’t work over time. The museum was ultimately set up for the public to enjoy, and have a place for AACA members to place a car or memorabilia if they wished. Board of directors come and go, as do museum curators. Short term strategic decisions that run a museum like a private boys club will ultimately cause the downfall of the organization. I have seen it countless times......country clubs, car clubs, other museums........... they will turn off people from getting involved, keep volunteers away, and events and fundraising will suffer. It will take time for the slide to the bottom.......maybe they will get lucky and some new board members will stop it and turn things around, but trust me, if it’s run as a personal toy of a few to buff their egos the place is doomed.  

[SC38dls]

Steve. I am in total agreement with the board and you. One thing I believe needs to be addressed is the apparently illegal use of the AACA mailing list. I believe it was stated they could only use the list with approval. Surely that was not given for the purpose of sending out their ridiculous letter. Being in the circulation fulfillment business for the last forty plus years I am familiar with list management. When we produce a list for a client that has one time or multiple time use we will ‘salt’ the list. When that mail arrives it is checked for contract agreement. If the mailer has mailed it outside the contract limits the contract has penalties in it that any court will uphold. 

A cease and desist letter should be drafted by the legal team to the museum board immediately if they are in violation of the limited approval agreement. 

I for one don’t want their crap (I refuse to use my industry standard term of ‘junk’) mail in my mail box again. I have never responded to their mail nor have I been to the museum or will I go. Therefore I do not have a business relationship with them. That means by postal rules if they are using your list illegally then they are committing mail fraud. It got Capone thrown in jail. It may work on these turkeys  or st least make them worry. 

Have fun 

Dave S 

Edited March 29, 2018 by SC38DLS (see edit history)

[A. Ballard 35R]

Do you know that a contract exists? Perhaps there was an informal arrangement made years ago based on common interests existing then and the "understanding" that there would be a merger in the future. I have tried to follow this involved subject but obviously don't know the complete details.

[SC38dls]

A.Ballard 35R, I do not know if there is a formal contract. I have asked in previous post and the only reply as I stated in my last post was they had " limited use with approval"".  I would love to see the contract. I would like to see if it has the normal industry provisions for one time or limited use in it. The magazine industry has been doing list rental or list trades for as long as I have owned my circulation service bureau. I have always made sure we 'salt' every list that has gone out of our bureau for the over 200 magazines we have worked with in those 40+ years.  It is a pain and a big job keeping those records and checking the returns so the list do not get misused. But understand the member/subscription list of a culb or magazine is the most valuable asset they have. Everyone is aware of what is happening with electronic hacking and list misuse in the news today.  An organazation that is member/subscription based better not be loose on who uses or has access to their list. I am sure with the business experience the AACA board has someone has though of this detail.  Maybe we will get the answer to your question maybe not. All I hope for is they are aware there are ways to stop the illegal use of this valuable asset.  

Have fun

Dave S 

`

Edited March 29, 2018 by SC38DLS (see edit history)

[Bob Hill]

I only have two things I hope come out of all of this.  First, our club is able to retain AACA for their use, i.e. isn't lost to the museum.  I know of a club here locally (not a car club) that had a split and the new group applied for a copyright of the old club's name and got it so the old club lost the name they had used since the mid 50s. I sure hopethat doesn't happen to our club. Secondly, I hope it is resolved soon and never raises it's ugly head again - this is not a positive thing for our club or the hobby 

 

Bob

[46 woodie]

I wonder how much of the general public, other than A.A.C.A. members, know of our situation. Perhaps some sort of disclaimer in the programs of each A.A.C.A. meet and particularly the Hershey Directory. Something  like, "The A.A.C.A. is not affiliated with the AACA Museum". I know several of my non member friends had no idea what was happening and agreed not to visit the museum in the future. 

[AC Fuhrman]

But your friends will miss out on a really nice museum... and over politics?

I'm happy we won the Revolution - but I'd still like to visit London one day.

 

[Bob Hill]

If they aren't a AACA member then that is $12 a head the museum will not get.

[AC Fuhrman]

Still missing out on a great museum. And if they aren't club members it's not their fight anyway is it?

 

Can't just go to the next museum over and see three Tuckers or the Bus Transportation area.

 

Politics - not going to take my experiences away.

[AC Fuhrman]

On 3/27/2018 at 7:18 PM, C Carl said:

I dunno , Matt. The items might have left in the pockets of some who have proved beyond reasonable doubt how they roll. 

 

You are actually accusing real people of stealing individual artifacts? Is there proof of this? I think this is going too far.  

[R W Burgess]

I know a couple regions/chapters that never got their club articles back??? They closed the room off and never said a word.

 

If they were so interested in AACA, you would think a notice might be helpful? 

[C Carl]

1 hour ago, AC Fuhrman said:

You are actually accusing real people of stealing individual artifacts? Is there proof of this? I think this is going too far.  

 

Hi  AC ! The question marks in the above quotation indicate that you have constructed an INTERROGATIVE. My response is that the "might have" I included in the verbiage means that I have constructed CONJECTURE regarding an unexplained disappearance. The retired law enforcement officer to whom I responded (please note : I began my conjecture clearly stating "I dunno , .......") , had made an "assumption " , itself conjecture. RW has just got me thinking my conjecture may be closer to the mark than Matthew's. MY DOUBTS about larcenous, bad intent on the part of a "rat" , or "rats" among the cynical , backstabbing , officious cabal who have recently defamed our club through a transparently ad hominem attack on our hard working , able and dedicated officers and board ; My DOUBTS  regarding the presence of a "rat" , or "rats" ; MY doubts are coming close to evaporating , in favor of an acusation of a "rat" , or "rats" , the identity of whom is yet unknown. Your interrogative , the coda of which is a declarative , verges on an accusative itself ! 

 

I sincerely hope the unambiguous and irrefutable logic of my above declarative serves to smooth any feathers I may have unintentionally ruffled.  - Carl 

 

And a P.S. : I have read all 24 pages. I have read all postings here above , and hopefully will still be able to read all as yet forthcoming. My ire is particularly aggravated by the obvious anguish of the long time members who generously put years of labor and love on behalf of our great club and its membership , by the perfidy against a number of members who generously gave the of the fruits of their labor , and the forceful slap in the trusting face of all members who had taken such pride in such a jewel in the AACA Crown , that which was to be OURS. OUR very own museum. NOT to have been the turf of a loose cannon BOD who seem to constantly exacerbate fears of potential bad intent. Reasonable doubts require vigilance. The late members who remembered THEIR Club and its members in their wills must be turning in their graves.

[Steve Moskowitz]

Folks, I have not had the time to read the latest posts but have been alerted to an issue that needs to be addressed.  AACA is fair,  AACA only wants the truth to be spoke and in regards to the Regions and Chapters room I think the wrong message has come out.  The then executive director of the museum and a staff member did their best to reach out to regions.  What MAY have happened is that the museum used a list that was not up-to-date or maybe the officer from the region thought it junk mail or it was lost in the mail. Any number of things could have happened! 

 

This is all interesting to me personally as at meeting a museum board member told the group I instructed regions to take their materials out of the museum!  Fortunately she named a region and I called them up and of course they refuted it as it did not happen. 

 

What happened to the artifacts later is not known to me but I feel confident that the executive director at the time, Mark Lizewskie handled the issue respectfully while he was there.  That I am positive of but have little other knowledge of what happened there after he departed. 

 

On a good note just got back from a test fitting of the bookmobile in the trailer and it fits!!!  We will be there in Charlotte!  I will try and review the forum more later tonight.   

 

 

[Dynaflash8]

7 hours ago, AC Fuhrman said:

But your friends will miss out on a really nice museum... and over politics?

I'm happy we won the Revolution - but I'd still like to visit London one day.

 

Is it worth it to support a bunch of people who took over the Museum and the property, after we AACA members paid for it.  It absolutely cannot be good enough to warrant its success under the circumstances under which it now exists.  I look forward to the day it closes in shame.

[Dynaflash8]

5 hours ago, R W Burgess said:

I know a couple regions/chapters that never got their club articles back??? They closed the room off and never said a word.

 

If they were so interested in AACA, you would think a notice might be helpful? 

My wife crocheted a very large blue and yellow afghan with the letters "AACA" largely printed in the middle.  It even had her special tag in one corner.  It hung in the "Regions Room" for many years and was suddenly gone when all of this started.  I wrote a personal letter to the "curator" of this museum asking that it be returned.  I did not even receive the courtesy of a reply.   To me, it felt like I was dealing with some kind of an ungrateful bum.

Edited March 29, 2018 by Dynaflash8 (see edit history)

[Dynaflash8]

3 hours ago, Steve Moskowitz said:

Folks, I have not had the time to read the latest posts but have been alerted to an issue that needs to be addressed.  AACA is fair,  AACA only wants the truth to be spoke and in regards to the Regions and Chapters room I think the wrong message has come out.  The then executive director of the museum and a staff member did their best to reach out to regions.  What MAY have happened is that the museum used a list that was not up-to-date or maybe the officer from the region thought it junk mail or it was lost in the mail. Any number of things could have happened! 

 

This is all interesting to me personally as at meeting a museum board member told the group I instructed regions to take their materials out of the museum!  Fortunately she named a region and I called them up and of course they refuted it as it did not happen. 

 

What happened to the artifacts later is not known to me but I feel confident that the executive director at the time, Mark Lizewskie handled the issue respectfully while he was there.  That I am positive of but have little other knowledge of what happened there after he departed. 

 

On a good note just got back from a test fitting of the bookmobile in the trailer and it fits!!!  We will be there in Charlotte!  I will try and review the forum more later tonight.   

 

 

Steve:  (as in Steve Moskowitz) Make sure the book that Ralph Towner and I wrote is on the bookmobile, okay?    Because of my wife's medical problems I can't be there to see it myself.  That said, I do look forward to seeing the restored bookmobile one day.  I'm sure it is beautiful.

Edited March 29, 2018 by Dynaflash8 (see edit history)