GM Oshawa Plant in Canada to Close

[Mark Gregory]

There is rumour on the news that the GM Plant in Oshawa is to close . About 3,000 people will lose their jobs .

The plant location has been there for 100 years .

The McLaughlin Buick was made here .

 

https://www.cp24.com/news/oshawa-gm-plant-to-close-affecting-thousands-of-jobs-1.4191957

Edited November 26, 2018 by Mark Gregory (see edit history)

[TerryB]

Not good news.  Do you know what cars are assembled there?  

[Mark Gregory]

According JD Power the quality coming out the plant was number one . I heard a lot of the Buick's went to China . Ford in Oakville also had good quality control and then they took the Truck production to the USA .

 

Current products include the Buick Regal, 10th gen Chevrolet Impala, Cadillac XTS sedans, (including the Cadillac PRO model, which are later converted for use as hearses, stretch limo's and armored limo's), 9th Gen Chevrolet Impala, and Chevrolet Equinox until July 2017, after which one of the plants wa retooled for production of the Chevrolet Silverado and GMC Sierra which began in early 2018. The next generation Buick Regal will be assembled in Germany for the North American market.^{[citation needed]}

[Joe in Canada]

Not a rumour as the announcement is tomorrow. Of the 23,000 workers there in the 80s there is only 2,500 there today and only one shift. Mark quality is not an issue as much as profit is.  The truck plant working 3 shifts was the highest in awards then was sent to Mexico in 2008. So much for the 100 years of GM building Buicks in Oshawa. They are also going to close some plants in the US I was told. The bulk of the work will go to Mexico and a dribble to the US but you will not hear that. 

Edited November 26, 2018 by Joe in Canada (see edit history)

[plymouthcranbrook]

Regardless what anyone says the only thing really American about big companies anymore is their loyalty to the American dollar.

[Laughing Coyote]

16 minutes ago, plymouthcranbrook said:

Regardless what anyone says the only thing really American about big companies anymore is their loyalty to the American dollar.

 

Yep. Charge you more, and get less (less product, less quality, less everything) Just sad.

[Spinneyhill]

4 hours ago, Laughing Coyote said:

 

Yep. Charge you more, and get less (less product, less quality, less everything) Just sad.

Really? Less quality? They must be about to fail then. These days they have to compete with the Asian car makers, not to mention the Europeans; are they not doing well?

 

Maybe. My cousin almost ordered a new Mustang last year. He has lusted after one for years. His wife was seriously ill and for some reason he didn't. But this year he bought a Kia Stinger GT. His son has a 1 year old Mustang and took him from somewhere in Sydney to Bathurst (Australia) for motor racing earlier in the year. Brian now emphatically does NOT want a Mustang; the Stinger will do very nicely thank you. Much better car.

[cxgvd]

Oshawa, I feel your pain.  I live in a city where Navistar/ International trucks were made for 100 years, now closed.  After many incentives and guarantees from all governments Navistar decided to built a new  factory in Mexico leaving the old factory to the city taxpayers to clean up.  Presently it is a vacant lot covered in cement which no one will touch over environmental concerns, I suppose.  We are getting a new casino but it is located across the street from the old plant.

 

More than a few eye brows were raised recently when two new snowploughs hit the road in our municpality and they were Mexican Navistar trucks.

 

Life goes on.  Gary

 

BTW, my 1915 McLaughlin was built in Oshawa three years before the factory was acquired for GM of Canada.

 

Edited November 26, 2018 by cxgvd
updated with photo (see edit history)

[Frantz]

13 hours ago, Laughing Coyote said:

 

Yep. Charge you more, and get less (less product, less quality, less everything) Just sad.

I'd disagree here. You get significantly more today in just about everything but style, and style is subjective. The cost really isn't out of line either when you factor inflation and becomes a bargain when you consider the features added (including those forced by regulations.. but those are consumer demand too via the political system). There are still low frills options out there that people simply opt not to purchase. Base model cars and trucks exist and generally sit for a long time until someone purchases them. Base models simply don't sell well. Folks who only buy used cars and complain about what is or is not offered in new cars surrender their voice by not putting their voting dollars into the product.

The avg new car in the US is $33k I believe... buy a tractor that cost $33k and look at simple and small it is and you'll realize. Cars are cheap for what they offer because we have excellent competition to pick from and huge economies of scale.

[John_S_in_Penna]

The Canadian plant's closure is just one part of a broader move.

Seven plants worldwide will be closed (four in the U. S. A.).

Here are some quotes from a Bloomberg story:

 

"General Motors Co. will cut more than 14,000 salaried staff and factory workers

and close seven factories worldwide by the end of next year, part of a sweeping

realignment to prepare for a future of electric and self-driving vehicles.

 

"Four factories in the U.S. and one in Canada could be shuttered by the end of 2019

if the automaker and its unions don’t come up with an agreement to allocate more work

to those facilities, GM said in a statement Monday. Another two will close outside North America...

 

"GM Chief Executive Officer Mary Barra is trying to make the company leaner as

U.S. auto demand slides from a record in 2016 and sales in China -- GM’s other profit center --

are also in a slump. Barra is also shifting resources toward building electric cars and,

eventually, vehicles that drive themselves. “We’re taking these actions while the economy is strong,”

Barra told reporters in Detroit. “This industry is changing very rapidly. We want to make sure we’re

well-positioned. We think it’s appropriate to do it while company is strong and the economy is strong.”...

 

"GM also said that the company will jettison the Buick LaCrosse, Chevrolet Impala and

Cadillac CT6 sedans next year. The Chevy Volt plug-in hybrid will also be dropped

along with the Chevy Cruze compact, which will be made in Mexico for other markets.

Too many of GM’s factories are operating on a single shift to build models that have

fallen out of favor, leading its plants to run about 1 million vehicles short of their full capacity,

said Kristin Dziczek, vice president of industry, labor and economics for the Center for

Automotive Research in Ann Arbor, Michigan...."

 

[kingrudy]

I lived in Michigan for a long time. I saw Buick City in Flint close, terrible loss to the city. Unable to understand why this could not have been down sized instead of shut down. Hamtramack is also supposed to shut down and that will be a hard hit for Pole Town. Detroit is a mess, some people are hanging on trying to revitalize the city, but the amount of abandoned building would shock most people.

[Buffalowed Bill]

Sadly it seems to reflect the changing tastes of the buying public. Ask yourself if you, or anyone that you know, is driving one of the cars that is currently being produced in one of the plants scheduled for closure.Trucks, trucks and more trucks, SUV's and crossovers. Is GM just following the lead of Ford, by the deletion of many of their signature models? Automakers seem to be concentrating on their more expensive, and more profitable large trucks.  I really don't know the answer, but it certainly seems reasonable to me.

[Spinneyhill]

15 hours ago, Laughing Coyote said:

less product, less quality

Please define your terms. What is "quality"? This is an extremely difficult thing to define. Books have been written about it. "Zen and the art of motorcycle maintenance" for example. And "less product"? Your car does much more today than ever before, is far safer, is often more economical to run, is far more comfortable, needs less maintenance, lasts a lot longer, doesn't rust as fast and so on.

 

The thing that worries me about these closures and outsourcing of production to low cost labour locations is that we lose production capacity and ability, which has to be a national security challenge. In this country we are all servicing each other and not really productive in terms of making stuff.

[wmsue]

Our local plant in Lordstown, Ohio will also be closing. They went to one shift a year or so ago, but now they will be closing. This will devastate our local economy even more than the restructuring of Delphi Packard  hurt us.

Even with all the new tax laws it always comes down to $$$ (theirs not ours).

Edited November 26, 2018 by wmsue (see edit history)

[Laughing Coyote]

I should have been more clear on my response. I meant it as a general statement to what's out there today compared to years past. Example: The quality of tools today compared to ones manufactured years ago. Some cost more now and are cheaply made. You buy clothes now a days and after 3 washes the hems are coming apart and the material is thinner and is not the same as it was. Food is costing more and you get poorer produce and fruits. Packaging is smaller to reduce cost and you get even less product so the companies make more profits. It's every where you look.  And as we all know car parts are not like they use to be either. Pay more get less. Cars are priced higher due to all the gadgets inside that everyone likes. Yes, they run better, drive better, and are more efficient which is a plus, but a lot of people don't have the funds to keep up with all the higher costs. I'm just a hard working person that likes to get his moneys worth when I purchase something, especially higher cost products. It's just really sad to see people losing jobs. Okay, I'm done. 

[plymouthcranbrook]

16 hours ago, Laughing Coyote said:

 

Yep. Charge you more, and get less (less product, less quality, less everything) Just sad.

As an example non automotive related i have an older toilet paper holder in my bathroom. When I put a  roll of paper on it the the new roll is about an inch narrower that the ones the holder was made for. The new `1=4 rolls they sell now are about the size we got for regular 30 years ago

[plymouthcranbrook]

7 hours ago, cxgvd said:

Oshawa, I feel your pain.  I live in a city where Navistar/ International trucks were made for 100 years, now closed.  After many incentives and guarantees from all governments Navistar decided to built a new  factory in Mexico leaving the old factory to the city taxpayers to clean up.  Presently it is a vacant lot covered in cement which no one will touch over environmental concerns, I suppose.  We are getting a new casino but it is located across the street from the old plant.

 

More than a few eye brows were raised recently when two new snowploughs hit the road in our municpality and they were Mexican Navistar trucks.

 

Life goes on.  Gary

 

BTW, my 1915 McLaughlin was built in Oshawa three years before the factory was acquired for GM of Canada.

 

Casinos, one of our big growth industries.

[John_S_in_Penna]

It used to be that cars were made in Flint,

and you couldn't drink the water in Mexico.

 

Now cars are made in Mexico, and you

can't drink the water in Flint!

 

So goes a joke that's been making the rounds---

[Joe in Canada]

Did anyone hear if they closed any car plants in Mexico??? GM only has an engine plant and a car plant left around 5,000 employees in Canada.

Edited November 26, 2018 by Joe in Canada (see edit history)

[Modeleh]

My great grandfather worked at the McLaughlin plant in 1914.  May have even had a hand in your car, who knows.

The thing that bothers me most is that when push came to shove during WW2, it was the manufacturing plants in North America that retooled to build what was required at the time to defend our freedom.  Without manufacturing plants, what are we going to do the next time the chips are down?

[TerryB]

The times, they are a chaingin.  I like cars not SUVs or SUV wanna be styling.  It’s a sad day to hear of so much loss in the auto industry especially in GM with all its heritage.  Stockholders want returns not excuses and that drives businesses to be as profitable as they can be in a very competitive worldwide market.  Sometimes I think Henry Ford had the right idea when he wanted less influence on his business by people demanding profits above all else.  I hope those affected by the GM news find a way to go on without too much loss to their well being.  I went through this in the consumer electronics business.  My job was transferring manufacturing technology to Mexico and China.  Kind of like building your own gallows knowing the end of your job was coming.

[mercer09]

ask yourself this- has GM learned from its past mistakes?

 

A resounding no.

 

We bailed them out awhile back and got stuck with a tab in the end. They are not profitable as they should be, so they continue to close down.

 

whose fault is that?

 

The Japanese issued us a warning in the early 70's and we never got it................

[Frantz]

Just think how many factories the Model T put out of business. Labor cost per car has been going down since the car was first produced for sale.

[Jim Skelly]

People eventually stopped buying cars when the trunk openings shrunk by a foot in depth, and the car widths narrowed from 80 to 73 inches, so you could no longer adequately (note I didn't say comfortably) seat three people in the back seat of full-sized cars.  Add sloping roofs that reduce rear headroom and rear visibility, and you no longer have a suitable vehicle for families.  Why GM didn't go to hatchbacks to provide an adequate trunk opening indicates how clueless they are.  The foreign car companies have been making wagons and hatchbacks for decades, and have done quite well with them.  GM, Ford and Chrysler have been too stubborn to continue making them.  Yes, they are importing the Opel-made Regal hatchback and wagon, but I haven't seen any on the road.  I have seen a couple of Cruze hatchbacks, but plenty from other manufacturers.  

 

SUVs provide decent seating for 5, and adequate room for 7-8.  Trucks can comfortably seat 2 in the front and 2-3 adequately in back.  GM complains that the cars aren't selling, but if they made competitive cars, they wouldn't have trouble selling everything they made.  Since SUVs and trucks are more profitable, GM has been investing their money in those vehicles.  I wouldn't be surprised if GM becomes totally irrelevant within a few years if it hasn't already achieved that.       

Edited November 27, 2018 by Jim Skelly
omitted a couple of words (see edit history)

[Mark Gregory]

So I guess this statement does not apply anymore ? ?

 

What's good for the country is good for General Motors, and vice versa. A statement made by Charles E. Wilson while president of the General MotorsCorporation, a leading United States automobile manufacturer. Wilson later became secretary of the federal Department of Defense.

[hidden_hunter]

Pretty much exactly the same we went through here with Mitsubishi, Ford, Holden and Toyota all stopping local manufacturing here in the last 20 years. Shame because the last generation of cars was actually good

[nick8086]

Michigan . I think  I have three car from here.

 

They need to do what ford did.  The redo of the ford gt 40.

 

Chrysler prowler - is another car..

 

 

 

 

 

[cheezestaak2000]

it's deja vu all over again for me. here in delaware we lost both GM and Chrysler plants. that was 15 years ago. there are less than 600,000 people in the state of delaware, so yeah, we felt it a little bit. as of today, both plants are still empty. another good point raised was that the chrysler was a main producer of tanks during world war 2. i guess if another conflict breaks out, we can buy them from china or mexico. why is it a nation that loves cars so much is so stupid about where we get them from?

 

[1912Staver]

I can understand GM and others increasing EV production. All the various gov's involved are pushing the concept. But justifying the shutdown so GM can concentrate on autonomous vehicles seems a bit of a stretch. The technology is still in its early stages and it will most likely be a number of years until it is a practical reality.

Also the excuse that masses of people are forgoing car ownership in favor of Uber etc. seems to be only a half truth. Are Uber cars produced in an Uber only production plant hidden in the depths of the Black forest ? All those newly minted Uber drivers need to get a car somewhere. Is there a rule against using a GM car if you are an Uber driver ?

 

Greg in Canada

Edited November 27, 2018 by 1912Staver (see edit history)

[J.H.Boland]

On 11/26/2018 at 4:30 PM, plymouthcranbrook said:

As an example non automotive related i have an older toilet paper holder in my bathroom. When I put a  roll of paper on it the the new roll is about an inch narrower that the ones the holder was made for. The new `1=4 rolls they sell now are about the size we got for regular 30 years ago

 

Yep,and our butts are getting bigger too !

Edited November 28, 2018 by J.H.Boland (see edit history)

[Mark Gregory]

I agree with everyones comments about importing cars and saving jobs . Here is part of an article about Electric cars . If I understand this GM wants a regulation enforcing Electric cars .

 

And even if GM no longer plans to build gas-guzzling automobiles in Oshawa, there's a decent chance that the company's shift towards electric vehicles will eventually receive government support. General Motors is calling for a U.S. rule that would mandate 25 per cent of all new vehicles be green by 2030.

[1912Staver]

The glaring contradiction in all of this is that GM themselves says the public wants light trucks and SUV's . Regardless of how fuel efficient, gas guzzlers in anyone's books. EV light trucks are probably even further away from being a practical reality. At least ones that are intended for real work, trailer  towing etc. and not just really  tall , heavy replacements for family sedans. Battery's are definitely improving however I don't think we are quite there yet.

  Greg in Canada

[Pfeil]

1 hour ago, Mark Gregory said:

I agree with everyones comments about importing cars and saving jobs . Here is part of an article about Electric cars . If I understand this GM wants a regulation enforcing Electric cars .

 

And even if GM no longer plans to build gas-guzzling automobiles in Oshawa, there's a decent chance that the company's shift towards electric vehicles will eventually receive government support. General Motors is calling for a U.S. rule that would mandate 25 per cent of all new vehicles be green by 2030.

Well, that leaves electric cars out. Electric cars are not Green.

[Bhigdog]

Yup, the herd is thundering towards EV and autonomous. Big money being spent lobbying for same. GM says they are interested in folks who can code not those who can design or engineer. Wonder what the Hershey show or flea market field will look like in 25 years. Will anyone care?.........Bob

[mercer09]

in 25 years ............

 

not to worry, most of us wont be around.

[mike6024]

 

This is the shape of things to come. I've seen a couple of them around town recently. They do not need a long hood because they don't have a V-12 under it. It's a Chevy bolt EV.

 

[cxgvd]

It's all about fuel efficiency, the EPA cancelled the CAFE standards which had been in place for decades,  Before this decision manufacturers had to produce fuel sipping sedans so they could sell SUVs and trucks and still maintain a Federally mandated fuel efficiency average.  No CAFE, no regulations, here you go, how do you like it now?

 

Honda, Toyota and Volkswagen are open for business and will merrily sell the consumer any hot hatchback, wagon or sedan any citizen could possibly desire.  BMW, Alfa Romeo or Mercedes if you want more punch from your wheels and do not care about the gas.  

 

Regards, Gary

 

 

[billorn]

I cant believe nobody at the American auto makers ever stopped to think about what happens when gas is $5 a gallon again......

 

Oh thats right its America. Dont worry gas will always be nice and cheap. Keep selling the big trucks. Who needs to sell to a global marketplace when your in a global marketplace right?

[1912Staver]

Road and Track magazine had it all figured out in the late 1950's...….. the Cyclops

 

 

Greg

Edited November 28, 2018 by 1912Staver (see edit history)

[AJFord54]

On 11/26/2018 at 4:30 PM, plymouthcranbrook said:

As an example non automotive related i have an older toilet paper holder in my bathroom. When I put a  roll of paper on it the the new roll is about an inch narrower that the ones the holder was made for. The new `1=4 rolls they sell now are about the size we got for regular 30 years ago

There's a joke in there somewhere, but I'm not about to touch it.