How do you determine if your car is "rare"?

[marcapra]

My definition of rare is if you don't see five of them in a day, it's rare.  I haven't seen a DeSoto on the road in a few years, none from 1928 to 1961.  That means all DeSotos are really rare!  I asked the man at the Cost-Co gas station, "how many DeSotos come through here each day?".  He said "What's a DeSoto?"  

[edinmass]

Tossing more fuel on to the fire……..”super car” ………what the hell does that mean? Horsepower or expensive? Wouldn’t a V-16 of 1930 be a super car also? 🤔

 

So much has been diluted today……….everything has to be special or better. In the end, I just like different. 
 

 

Recently bought a new V-12 Bentley helping out a friend. It has so many gadgets it’s asinine. Really, really ridiculous. Three options on the car cost 7k, 4k, and 5k. They were so annoying the new owner just had the dealer over ride them and shut them off. I was laughing as we had to have someone from the dealer stop by to do it…….both of us were too unsophisticated to figure it out. I was laughing when it was all over and working the way he wanted it, and he asked me what was so funny. I informed him when one of the three batteries need replacing (yes, three of them.) it will probably need to be reprogrammed again.  He was not amused.

[Johan Boltendal]

A Bentley V12 without a doubt is the ultimate rare car, the only one existing !

[TAKerry]

W12?

 

 

[8E45E]

On 11/2/2023 at 6:02 AM, edinmass said:

 

Personally I don't consider any post war cars as rare. Look at actual production numbers. Calling a 60's car rare because of an engine option, transmission option, paint job, and suspension package does NOT make the car rare. When the basic platform is getting knocked out by the hundreds of thousands..........

That can also be extended to 'badge engineered' marques.  

 

How many 1960 Edsels were made from same year Fords?  Is an Oldsmobile truly an 'orphan' as most of the GM platforms it was built on never stopped production for their other surviving marques?

 

Craig

[West Peterson]

Am I the only person on earth who has a problem with the whole term "one of"?

What in the world do the words "one of" add to the statement? Is it possible to put any other number in that place when talking about one car (99.99 percent of the cases using the phrase are talking about one car).

Ridiculous:

My 1960 Plymouth Impala is one of 300 built.

 

Correct (other than it's not a fact):

There were 300 Plymouth Impalas built.

 

Try this from now on:

For sale. 1960 Plymouth Impala. 300 built, 4 known to exist. 

 

[60FlatTop]

Having a car with special features. history, or Bespoke design is relatively common. The rare thing is taking one somewhere and not hearing some denigrating comment out of the peanut gallery.

[zepher]

5 hours ago, edinmass said:

Tossing more fuel on to the fire……..”super car” ………what the hell does that mean? Horsepower or expensive? Wouldn’t a V-16 of 1930 be a super car also? 🤔

Ed, I would say that any SJ is a supercar for that era.

Their performance was head and shoulders above just about everything else available at the time.

There are plenty examples of prewar supercars if you apply the term correctly for that era.

[Peter Gariepy]

On 11/2/2023 at 12:46 AM, 7th Son said:

We have all seen claims of 1 of 100, 1 of 25, or even 1 of 1 describing unique cars. I have found various references that give gross production numbers and some that give more precise model by model build quantities, but have not, for example, gotten numbers showing more detail than the number of six cylinder examples built vs. V-8's.

 

I've always been amused at the "rare" label when it applies to a combination of factory options on cars with high production numbers.   A few factory options combined might be "unique", but to label them "rare" seems to be a stretch.  

 

Example:  I'm sure there is an extremely "rare" early Mustang with the base 6 cylinder engine, 3 speed on the column, front bumperettes, Prairie Bronze paint, vinyl Palomino interior, gas filler door guard, locking gas cap, and wire mesh headlight covers.

 

Using that logic, of the 700,000 1964/65 Mustang's produced, 500,000 are "rare" due to their unique combination of options.  In that case the term "rare" really has lost its meaning or value.

[Jack Bennett]

Using the Model A, the Model T, and, in my case, a 1929 Fargo panel, without going into a lecture on history, or a attempt to explain government legislation, I will remind folks that there were conditions in this country which made converting a sedan into a pickup made perfectly good sense.

Accordingly, there is a abundance of Model A, Model T and Dodge pickups, but those on the market, and relatively affordable, began their lives as a sedan.

Considering this, there is a glut of pickups and light trucks available on the antique vehicle market. But, in actuality, these are not pickups, but are instead sedans, converted and titled as pickups because of government restrictions on fuel rations for sedans, but not farm vehicles, the lesser cost of registering a truck than a sedan, and the greater need of a farm “truck”, as compared to a farm “sedan” to haul farm “stuff”.

If you are looking for a Model T, a Model A or a Dodge pickup, and you are truly knowledgeable regarding the insidious differences between a truck born as a Model A, a Model T or a Dodge truck, you may have scant luck in finding one.

However, if you are looking for the same model vehicle, and are not aware of the fact you are buying a converted car, your luck just got 100% better in regards to finding one.

OK, so much for the appetizers, and on to the entree.

There is a abundant supply of pickups, which are actually cars of that model.

On the other hand, real pickups, of that same model are seldom available, and when they are, brings in a very high price.

Does this make “pickups” and light trucks of these brand names “rare”, or are they just hiding behind a sedans altered appearance?

Jack

[demco32]

On 11/2/2023 at 3:16 PM, TTR said:

For me, any car with its "Bumpers chopped off, fluids drained, slapped on my shop floor !" is rare. 🤠

 

Vast majority of owners/sellers of any old vehicles they haven't personally seen lately or ever in person seem prefer call/consider/tout theirs as "rare", usually because they believe/think it will enhance its (or their own) prestige and/or the vehicles resale value.

 

With all due respect, but there were over two thousand "250" (i.e. 3 liter V12) Ferraris manufactured in 10+ variations 10+ year time span and just one being "250 GTO" which were 36 made and have perceived market value in the range you're referring to. Some "250's" can still be bought today for few hundred thousand $$'s and many more for less than $1M.

https://cars.bonhams.com/auction/28312/lot/160P/1959-ferrari-250-gt-berlinetta-tour-de-france-chassis-no-1401gt-engine-no-1401gt/

This one sold 4 weeks ago in Belgium for $5183845,80

[28 Chrysler]

I don't like the term rare at all and super car even worse.

Many cars that are rare were not well done. Most cars well done are not rare.

If dripping with blood or just bloody, most of my cars would be rare or maybe just considered butchered.

[60FlatTop]

 

Back in the days when you could run a VIN decode online I checked out my '94 Impala SS. I was mildly impressed.

 

Found 96,919 vehicles matching your year and model in our database.

RPO    Description      Matches

"There are 4 1994 CAPRICE CLASSIC 4 DR vehicles (0.004%) matching your exact options list. There are 27 (0.028%) with at least as many options."

[Dr B]

I could not help myself from making a snarky response to this topic since we are all struggling with defining what a "rare" car is.  I was thinking in other terms, such as

 

rare 

 

medium

 

 

and well done!

 

😆

Robert

[drhach]

I think the internet has made the world smaller in some ways. When I turn ff my computer and go outside, I don't see any of these cars, ever. So, they're all pretty rare in my world. 

[Avanti Bill]

The biggest mistake most people make is confusing "rare" with valuable.  There are plenty of low production hard to find cars that aren't worth restoring.

[zepher]

29 minutes ago, Avanti Bill said:

The biggest mistake most people make is confusing "rare" with valuable.  There are plenty of low production hard to find cars that aren't worth restoring.

Now why would you go and bash Rickenbacker like that? 

[Avanti Bill]

On 11/3/2023 at 4:49 PM, zepher said:

Now why would you go and bash Rickenbacker like that? 

I don't believe that Rickenbacker would fall into that catagory!  But to some extent many cars of that era are hard to make the numbers work today eventhough profit should not be your motive in restoration.  

[8E45E]

On 11/3/2023 at 10:20 AM, Peter Gariepy said:

 

I've always been amused at the "rare" label when it applies to a combination of factory options on cars with high production numbers.   A few factory options combined might be "unique", but to label them "rare" seems to be a stretch.  

 

Example:  I'm sure there is an extremely "rare" early Mustang with the base 6 cylinder engine, 3 speed on the column, front bumperettes, Prairie Bronze paint, vinyl Palomino interior, gas filler door guard, locking gas cap, and wire mesh headlight covers.

 

Using that logic, of the 700,000 1964/65 Mustang's produced, 500,000 are "rare" due to their unique combination of options.  In that case the term "rare" really has lost its meaning or value.

I would rather see the term, "unusual" being used, rather than "rare".  

 

I have seen at least one bench-seat Mustang hardtop (a 1967).  A bench seat in a Mustang is less than 3% of production, but it still amounts to over 8,000 Mustang hardtops built that year.   

 

Craig

[1912Staver]

As at least one other member has stated, rare does not necessarily  equal valuable. To me once you get below about 25 or so known survivors then rare is justified. But rare has real drawbacks, parts are usually non existent. And likely to remain that way unless you undertake producing needed parts yourself. I have ended up with a couple of quite rare cars myself. One is one of 6 built , a little known 1973 U.K. series Formula 3 car. A nice enough car but one that is little known even in vintage racing circles . The same company built 500 or so Formula Fords { Elden } so the company is well known, but small handfulls for other classes . The 6 F3's, about 10 Formula Super V's, 3 or 4 Sports racers, 2 or 3 Formula Atlantic's. And so on over quite a few years. The 1970's were Elden's strongest years. Two brothers formed the company, one a talented designer / engineer { Peter Hampsheir }, the other brother { Brian Hampsheir }  handled the business side of things. A few other partners along the way plus sons of Brian and Peter are still involved with parts supply and car preperation.

 

https://www.eldenracing.com/

Edited November 6, 2023 by 1912Staver (see edit history)

[Joe in Canada]

When I google 1930 Cadillac Victoria a picture of my own car comes up. So is it rare ? I think not. 

Like Ed says above if it is rare then nobody wanted it when it was new. 

[31 LaSalle]

I have a 1928 Chrysler 72 convertible coupe

I dont know how many were produced i would not describe the car as rare

but i would definitely use the term RARE when it comes to obtaining parts

 

[Terry Y]

On 11/2/2023 at 8:02 AM, edinmass said:

 

 

 

In the end.......cars are just cars. Common or not.....if you like it.....that is all that matters. 

Ed, this is so true and so simply and clearly said, like when Lennon and McCartney wrote: "and in the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make."

[arcticbuicks]

if every other one is smashed ,crushed,burned.......and made into rebar........and you cant find any parts at all.......its likely rare

[Rusty Heaps]

Asked when I went to register another project car, “ Packard? Who made it?” Apparently 1954 Pontiacs are rare, I thought I would never find a buyer for a fender I have! 🤪 All joking aside, It would be nice to have a ballpark figure as to what percentage of ‘40s and ‘50s cars are still in existence. I’m sure certain models faired better than others. 1957 Chevrolet coupe for example as opposed to a 1951 Plymouth 4dr sedan. 

[JACK M]

It may be rare if it's not well done. 

 

🤪

[PWN]

My 1922 Chandler Royal Dispatch is rare. Only maybe 4 or 5 exist today.

[arcticbuicks]

sounds rare ,what if tomorrow ......some barn find pops up on the internet with 7 of them that nobody in the clubs knew existed ?..........how do we really know how many are in existence ?

[PWN]

1 hour ago, arcticbuicks said:

sounds rare ,what if tomorrow ......some barn find pops up on the internet with 7 of them that nobody in the clubs knew existed ?..........how do we really know how many are in existence ?

Ok so with the "what if" 11 exist. Still rare.

[zepher]

3 minutes ago, PWN said:

Ok so with the "what if" 11 exist. Still rare.

There are about 8 1926 Rickenbacker E6 Broughams known to exist.

Find 3 in a barn and you still have less than a dozen.

[1935Packard]

When I was in second grade, our teacher taught us that the way to respond to relative terms was to ask, compared to what?  The teacher would stand in front of the class, "I see a tree that is tall," and we would respond as a class, "tall compared to what?"    The point was that these relative terms have no meaning except with respect to a reference point.  I feel like it's the same thing with a car being "rare."  Rare compared to what?  For some people, all old cars are rare.  To others, it's not rare if other examples exist somewhere.  All depends on the standaad.

 

Don't think I remember anything else from 2nd grade, but for some reason I remember that.  

 

 

 

 

[JACK M]

20 hours ago, 1935Packard said:

 

Don't think I remember anything else from 2nd grade, but for some reason I remember that.  

How about that teacher's name?

[8E45E]

2 hours ago, JACK M said:

How about that teacher's name?

Mrs. Paradis.  (Long since deceased.)

 

Craig

[arcticbuicks]

"rare" .......is what your car WILL be....... by the time you get the major restoration completed 

[nick8086]

Here is a rare car..

 

 

Edited November 11, 2023 by nick8086 (see edit history)

[Fordy]

How many of you have heard of a Lightburn? Washing machine and cement mixer factory in Adelaide South Australia that dabbled into the car market with a horrid attempt that barely sold, and few exist even here. In the US or Europe probably not one example. 

Only rare because it was an abysmal failure.

Steve

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

On 11/8/2023 at 2:24 PM, 1935Packard said:

When I was in second grade, our teacher taught us that the way to respond to relative terms was to ask, compared to what?  The teacher would stand in front of the class, "I see a tree that is tall," and we would respond as a class, "tall compared to what?"    The point was that these relative terms have no meaning except with respect to a reference point.  I feel like it's the same thing with a car being "rare."  Rare compared to what?  For some people, all old cars are rare.  To others, it's not rare if other examples exist somewhere.  All depends on the standaad.

 

Don't think I remember anything else from 2nd grade, but for some reason I remember that.  

 

 

 

 

 

  I like THAT.   "compared to what"  works in many things. 

 

  Ben

[playswithbrass]

There has to be another one of these somewhere,but I can not find it . Is it rare,I don’t know. Too busy driving the wheels off it. People ask how much is it worth? I need to find two people who want it more then me to find out.

[Walt G]

On 11/3/2023 at 5:04 AM, edinmass said:

So much has been diluted today……….everything has to be special or better. In the end, I just like different. 

I completely agree with this statement. It seems so many people need to have something "rare" be it a vehicle, or anything else , just to get them noticed so they can brag about it and be a level above others. Who cares, does that really matter ?  Be happy with what you have, don't flaunt it in anyones face, share the object, knowledge and then take satisfaction that you made someone else happy or have a good day when they weren't .  Life is short , no guarantee you will be here tomorrow .

[JACK M]

1 hour ago, Walt G said:

It seems so many people need to have something "rare" be it a vehicle, or anything else ,

That is so they can be like everyone else.