1953mack Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) 06.13.12Something's got to be done to increase the attendance at the BCA Nationals, especially on the East and West Coast areas.I’ve always wondered why the BCA doesn’t send out a survey/questionnaire/comment poop sheet with the BUICK BUGLE a couple of months prior to the Nationals, or with your membership renewal paperwork, to get some input from the dwindling +/- 8,000 members as to why they decided to attend or NOT attend this year’s Nationals. Plus, it could ask for some feedback on what it would take to have you attend a Buick Nationals (Decision makers: listen up!). Many other topics could be included but I'll save that for another post. Results would be published in the BUICK BUGLE.I’m sure a lot of other people are wondering why this year’s expected participation numbers are lower (by 40%?) than anticipated/advertised. My take on this, and the reason that I am one of the many that are NOT going to Concord, N.C. this year, is that the mileage (not to me), the City, the economy (not to me), dislike for anything NASCAR, or other personal reasons (not to me) are the top five reasons for the low numbers. Sorry, you can't fault the price of gas this year compared to the +/- $4.25/gallon prices in 2008 (Flint). Don’t get me wrong. I love to drive to the Nationals . . . . . getting there is half the fun. I’ve driven to and made 14 of the last 20 Nationals in 17 different cities (once only to Plano, Texas; once only to Danvers, Mass.; and twice to Flint), missing Phoenix, Atlanta, Kokomo, and Batavia.I realize that this forum has very limited visitors and even non-BCA members, but I would like to hear comments from everyone. Maybe include what year of Buick you would have driven or trailered to the show (I like 1965 and older, stock or modified) and the number of BUICK NATIONALS that you have attended. Thanks for your interest and to those going to Concord, have a safe trip and ENJOY. See you in South Bend, Indiana in 2013. Al MackBCA #8965"500 Miles West of Flint""If you gave me a penny for my thoughts and I gave you my $.02 worth, somebody would me making money off me" :mad: Edited June 13, 2012 by 1953mack added BCA #8965 (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
progoofoff Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Where did your statistics come from?Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhigdog Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 There are several reasons I don't go. First is I an no longer a member. I declined to renew with the last dues increase. The cost just plain exceeded the benefits. I would still go to the Nats, as I did enjoy the ones I did attend, if the entry fee was reasonable. I would have no problem with a non member $15/20 entry fee with the understanding that my car would be judged but I would receive no trophy, thus saving the club that expense. That might lure some newbies to the meet who might like the experiance and later join. If I did go I'd bring either my 55 or 57. They both already have their Gold so it'd be a social event for me................Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jscheib Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Al,OK, I will take the bait. But I am going to Concord. Trying somewhat to read betwnn in lines, you did not indicate "(not to me)' for two of the five. So your two reasons are basically the location, as not being excited about ConcordCharlotte and NASCAR. I am not really a fan of NASCAR either, as I tend more toward "open wheel" and sports car racing; however, I found Concord/Charlotte to be quite the place including the devotion to the "sport" (some people do not use that term for racing) is very interesting to see and sense. The SE of the US is continuing to grow and mature, as well as preserving the past, so I consider the area one of my primary reasons for attending , as well as sharing the time with fellow Buick owners. The rotation of meets gives one an opportunity to learn more about a particular area.I am not concerned about numbers, but I am sure the 500 was a target, not a expectation, and I am not so sure the numbers attending are not that far off past meets, except for Flint in 2003 and 2008 as these were unique events. I Have attended 10 of the last 15 National meets.John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caballero2 Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 (edited) I have attended six nationals, and driven a car and entered in point judging in five. Three Silvers and two golds. Disqualified for Senior for driving on radial tires. The car, however twenty years after restoration, invited to the Concours D'Elegance of America 2011. I am sure the new owner has to replace front wheel bearings after trailering from Colorado to Michigan. Point is, the disadvantages outweigh the incentives for a meet over three hundred miles from home on a point judged car.Dan Edited June 14, 2012 by Caballero2 (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackofalltrades70 Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 I would have been there, but work schedule is preventing it, as it does every year since I've been a member and will forever unless the dates are changed. Our facility goes into shutdown the first week of July and I am in charge of the shutdown. Have to be here the week before to prepare.......I was really trying to go for a day or so this year, but to no avail......Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD1956 Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 I cannot afford to go to the far off Nationals. My income just does not allow me to enjoy the hobby in that regard. But I have been to several Nationals over the past 30 years. The furthest from me being Flint. On the 2003 trip to Flint my 56 broke down on the way home. I had to leave it with a very reliable dealership and rent a car to make it the rest of the 200 miles home. Then two weeks later I had to return to get the car and finish driving it home. I certainly cannot afford that experience again. But I make reservations for just about every National, no matter where they are. I keep working and hoping that I can change this picture around and begin to enjoy some of the meets further away. I am especially setting my sights on 2014. One big advantage to the Nationals in different areas is the chance to see and review all the excellent Buicks I've never seen. That and the Forum Breakfast really make the events worthwhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john hanson Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 I will be thier with a load of parts. anybody need anything let me know i'll see what i can do. i have a lot of 40s - 50s & 60s partsJohn Hanson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stealthbob Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Why do people not go?It can be a costly commitment which demands time, energy and effort to go. The costs however of attending the actual meet are NEGLIGIBLE compared to the costs of actually making the trip so the BCA can not be at fault for the meet costs. I think it comes down to the travel costs and if they are worth the experience of attending.This will be my first Nationals this year, I will be traveling down from Canada with my Dad....I hope to make this our annual thing. I also hope to meet all my online Buick friends....time, energy and effort well spent methinks. Could not imagine a reason for not going would be over a simple and CHEAP club membership fee, let alone a CHEAP registration fee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Stoneberg Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Just saw the news, gas at under 3 bucks a gallon. No reeason not to go. I plan on driving a car that require Premium... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stealthbob Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 Yea but cheap oil means a worse CDN dollar exchange....at least its not at $0.70 anymore though. Got $0.97 today.....last April it was close to $1.02 USD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buicknutty Posted June 13, 2012 Share Posted June 13, 2012 I have been a BCA member for over 30 years, and have been to 6-8 Nationals during that time, and I am not going to this years show.My reasons for not going this year are partly cost, and partly getting the time off of work. Though over the years, it is more to do with the cost of attending, rather than getting the time off of work, though sometimes the latter has been an issue. Also, coming from Canada, the exchange has at times been really painful, and I went for a long time between Nationals for this reason.By cost, I mean the total cost of going to the show, the actual cost of registration, etc., isn't the main issue, its' the cost of hotels, meals, fuel, and other incidental expenses, for me, my wife, and kids. To all this I must also add that I have ALWAYS had a GREAT time at the BCA Nationals and really wish that I could attend more often. Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Bruce aka First Born Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 I will have to agree that for me, as others, total cost comes into play. I made Ames, my first [ became a member in 2008, when I bought my '50]. Did not even try last year. Will be there this year and in 2015. Driving, meals and lodging become expensive. Membership and registration are not a problem. Ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stealthbob Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 I an no longer a member.I noticed your signature line still mentions the BCA? AACA, BCA, WPC, USHGA" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60FlatTop Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 I am in week 13 after a double bypass. That is the ONLY reason I am not coming.My wife and I had planned to drive down from New York a week ahead to leave the car. We were going to fly back and then I was flying down the week of the show alone. That gave her a nice trip without 2 or 3 days of being totally bored and roasted to the pavement.Then I would drive back.Buicks and old guy problems seem to go hand in hand. And if you get to be "Buick Club age" you should do everything possible to minimize the kid's inheritance. Next year I will be good to go.On the inheritance thing, I plan to double the footprint of my garage, buy a 1920's or '30's large model Buick, and probably a RR Silver Spur over the next few years. See you next year, 50 pounds lighter and spending the money the kids thought they'd get.Bernie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60FlatTop Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 I will swear I was joking if my wife gets wind of this post.Bernie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhigdog Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) I noticed your signature line still mentions the BCA?True enough. Also the WPC club. I've tried to delete them both from my profile repeatedly to no avail and so just gave up. I'm not trying to be a poseur as I've mentioned several times I declined to renew my membership..............Bob Edited June 14, 2012 by Bhigdog (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38Buick 80C Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 Interesting thread; thank you for starting it Al. I am watching it closely so we can learn and improve. PS. Did I forget to say it was 500 metric cars...that's like 310 US (standard/english) cars so, we're good!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stealthbob Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 Interesting thread; thank you for starting it Al. I am watching it closely so we can learn and improve. PS. Did I forget to say it was 500 metric cars...that's like 310 US (standard/english) cars so, we're good!! Yup....We said 54 1954 Buick's right.....well we left out the fine print. It was in Gallon to liters format. Yes that gives us a 53 54 Buick's but I think on the day of the event we will get out 54 (liter) 1954 Buick's!<iframe width="640" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/gQoBiICacYQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick5563 Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 The confusing "no-shows" to me, are the people who live four hours or less away and decide not to come. I remember last year that there were guys who lived two hours away who opted out. Why even belong to the BCA if you can't even show up in your back yard?I was actually hoping you were gonna show up last year, Bhigdog. I would have loved to meet you and buy you a beverage after all of the advice you have given me (directly or indirectly) over the years. If that means you could have shown up and paid a nominal "display only" fee I'd be for that. I know there are insurance issues that would have to be worked out.With all of that said, I agree with the others who bring up the fact that the true expense lies in getting there (sub $3 gas and all). It's gonna be probably 50 gallons of gas, two hotels and meals for two days BEFORE I get there. Then the same on the way home. The Charlotte host hotel is a bit more than recent hosts, but the other close hotels are cheaper than past hosts. As for NASCAR, I don't watch it, but that isn't going to keep me from going (that's just silly). Now if only they could shorten the dinner to an hour and a half, I'd start attending that again. Seriously, mail the awards and cut way down on extraneous singing of God Bless America, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhigdog Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 Thanks Mike............Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Old Guy Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 I went to every BCA National meet from 1971 in Flint until 2009 in Colorado. I stopped going because the emphasis now is on trailer Queens and 400 point judging over fun. You have heard this from me too many times, so I will shut up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jscheib Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 For Joe,I understand your concern; however, when you look at the numbers, of the 341 registered at Concord, I think Brian indicated there are 135 being there for 400 point judging. By my calculations that is under 40% of the cars registered. Then we might add those the people that will fly in without a car, so I think there we can safely say that perhaps 65%, possibly more, of the attendees will be having "fun", without a concern for the judging aspect of the event. So, I respect your opinion, but as I look at these numbers, I am not sure I would state the "emphasis" is on 400 point judging. That is my take on National Meets.John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhigdog Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 True enough. Also the WPC club. I've tried to delete them both from my profile repeatedly to no avail and so just gave up. I'm not trying to be a poseur as I've mentioned several times I declined to renew my membership..............BobSuccess................Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stealthbob Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 Success................BobToo bad, I would have liked to meet you and your 2 Buick convertibles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Old Guy Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 John You are right !! I think Brian has done a GREAT job trying to bring the BCA back ,and ,I guess my problem is the members that have the mega-buck cars want the glory that goes with a gold-senior award. It used to be that members drove in and hung out on the showfield, and talked about driving their Buicks. Now it seems that the field is not filled until Saturday when the cars come out of their boxes. I know that some of the cars are done by the guys that own them, but most are done by pros, and the owner has to rely on the builder to do them right. Most are over restored ,and if a Buick had been purchased new, put into sealed storage, and brought to the meet, it would be luck to get a silver award. I am sorry that I have caused problems with the BCA and wish everyone good luck and good health. Enjoy your Buicks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhigdog Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 Too bad, I would have liked to meet you and your 2 Buick convertibles.I enjoyed the BCA Nats I attended and would do so again if I were permitted a "display only" basis for a reasonable fee and they were within a few hundred miles. I have nothing against the BCA and still hang out here and offer help when I'm able. I only left the club because the dues, when added to the other clubs/magazines I supported, got to be more than they were worth to me. Personal decision. I also dropped other memberships and magazine subscriptions for the same reason. Maybe someday we will meet................Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JZRIV Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 (edited) I would have expected pre-registrations to be higher for Concord. Thats a nice area for a meet.I personally do not attend the BCA meet because I attend the ROA national whether I take a car or not because the Riviera, as well as the "family" of friends I have made attending the meets is nearest and dearest to me. If I was retired I'd do both the BCA and ROA but between getting time off work and the cost, I can only justify one national car show. Some feedback I've got over the years in talking to folks who never attend an ROA national, here is what I've heard in no particular order.Car is not reliable enough for a longer trip and dread the thought of breaking down far from home.Have no interest or attraction in attending a national show. (this one is more common)Only take one vacation away from home a year and a car show isn't high on the priority list for the family.Can't get time off workDon't have the money.I always thought the last two could be interpreted as not having interest in attending in a decent percentage of cases. In other words they could get the money and time off work if they really wanted to but its not a priority to use it for a car show. Edited June 14, 2012 by JZRIV (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38Buick 80C Posted June 14, 2012 Share Posted June 14, 2012 John You are right !! I think Brian has done a GREAT job trying to bring the BCA back ,and ,I guess my problem is the members that have the mega-buck cars want the glory that goes with a gold-senior award. It used to be that members drove in and hung out on the showfield, and talked about driving their Buicks. Now it seems that the field is not filled until Saturday when the cars come out of their boxes. I know that some of the cars are done by the guys that own them, but most are done by pros, and the owner has to rely on the builder to do them right. Most are over restored ,and if a Buick had been purchased new, put into sealed storage, and brought to the meet, it would be luck to get a silver award. I am sorry that I have caused problems with the BCA and wish everyone good luck and good health. Enjoy your BuicksJoe, You bring up an excellent point about sealing a new car and then having points deducted. Not to get too far off the initial topic but there will be some brand new unsold Buicks sitting around at the meet. I hope some judges take a close look at them. I bet they find some things they would deduct for, which to your point would be an incorrect deduction as it came that way from the factory so there should be no deduction and you of course are right! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCReatta Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 I'll be there. Main reasons are that my finances (for a student) allow this year, and it's in my back yard. Gas is cheap round here (even with crazy taxes). I filled up the other day for $3.20/gal. SC is prolly way under $3.00 now. I'm entering two cars. Both are display only (both are daily drivers). But I'm bringing a car full of Reatta parts, judging, cruising to Salisbury, among other things. Most of the events on tap for the weekend I've already done multiple times before. But I'm still pretty excited about doing them with the club. My grandfather (old Studebaker nut) will be with me (driving the second Reatta down), and he's really looking forward to it. We're also planning to get out to the 2013 meet in South Bend (studebaker turf).With the whole new cars getting points deducted thing, I feel rather uneasy about it also. A customer of mine is trailering his '88 Reatta coupe (with 700 miles on it) in. I personally have gone over this car from top to bottom and have found no reason that any point should be deducted. There's not a thing unoriginal to it. Even down to the "ok to ship" sticker installed by the factory after inspection. It's there. But I feel that somebody will find something on it that's not like the other car they just judged with 13,000 miles and it will have points deducted. I dunno, just seems a little wonky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kingoftheroad Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 I'd go but its to far with travel & fuel costs the way they are.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bhclark Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 We'll be there this year with our '59 Invicta! Same car we drove from Ohio to Colorado and to Ames. It's my most reliable antique, other than the '65, but the wife and kids can't stand 8 hour days with the top down. IT would have made the trip to MASS as well, but I damaged the radiator on the test cruise and it couldn't be recored in time)Cost is a factor, but we usually add a few days to the beginning of the trip and do a combo vacation. The plan is to spend a few days in Ashville on our way to Concord. (A few days in Cleveland, TN to spend with family was scrapped)As far as cost of gas, with a family of 4, it's cheaper to drive than fly for sure! Also, where are you guys getting sub $3 gas? It got down to $3.50 here, then spiked back up to $3.90.See you on the (driven class) showfield! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stealthbob Posted June 15, 2012 Share Posted June 15, 2012 I enjoyed the BCA Nats I attended and would do so again if I were permitted a "display only" basis for a reasonable fee and they were within a few hundred miles. I have nothing against the BCA and still hang out here and offer help when I'm able. I only left the club because the dues, when added to the other clubs/magazines I supported, got to be more than they were worth to me. Personal decision. I also dropped other memberships and magazine subscriptions for the same reason. Maybe someday we will meet................BobI can respect that...I was dismayed with your reasons for terminating your membership, but with some thought it has occurred to me that you still are here helping others.It is what its is...and it is not the same for everybody.I am about to embark on a special trip, my first Nats and 10 days with my Dad. As a young lad I used to spend countless hours in the winter driving on back snow covered roads with him, on the way to some hockey practice or game. I am who I am today because of him and those one on one talks. Its more than just a car hobby.....its about the connection to your past and present. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 4 bufords Posted June 16, 2012 Share Posted June 16, 2012 this will be my fifth national show,98,99 2010 and 2011,had a blast meeting new members and seeing cars from different areas.looking forward to seeing everyone in charlotte,4 bufords from ct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Shaw Posted June 16, 2012 Share Posted June 16, 2012 I am not going this year, because I flew to the last National on the East Coast and combined the trip to visit family. Going to two consecutive meets on the East Coast just makes no sense to me when I live on the West Coast. I am pleased to see that the BOD intends to move around the country to provide more opportunities for everyone to attend a BCA National. I also agree with Mike about the length of the awards dinner as I have attended two and never want to attend another as long as they go on for so long. Get it said and get on with it! Many of our members cannot last that long!I was very disappointed with the lack of participation for the PWD AfterTour this year too. It is hard to believe we don't have enough prewar cars back east to make up a good group for the PWD AfterTour. After all, even post war cars are welcome and we still had to cancel due to lack of participation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dandy Dave Posted June 16, 2012 Share Posted June 16, 2012 I'm not attending either. Mostly the cost, and also now I need to replace a radiator that has been stolen from my old Cat Model 12 Road Grader. The total cost of the trip may just cover the cost of the loss. Really sucks some SOB had to ruin my fun, but that is life. Dandy Dave! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jscheib Posted June 16, 2012 Share Posted June 16, 2012 Dave,Sorry to hear. That radiator has some long kasting results. I guess there was no way the police could check the salvage yards, bu I wonder just how far away the theives may have carried it before dumpibg it. We will miss your presence.John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Morton Posted June 16, 2012 Share Posted June 16, 2012 I am about to embark on a special trip, my first Nats and 10 days with my Dad. As a young lad I used to spend countless hours in the winter driving on back snow covered roads with him, on the way to some hockey practice or game. I am who I am today because of him and those one on one talks. Stealthbob,I'm excited for you and your trip to Charlotte with your Dad.I took a similar trip with my Dad and my son in 1999 to the Outer Banks of North Carolina where we rented a cottage and toured all the Lighthouses and one restored Lifesaving Station.We had a GREAT Time and it is appreciated even more now by my son and I as we approach the 10 year anniversary of his passing.I can only hope that you both have as much fun as we did and make lasting memories that will stay with you forever.I look forward to meeting you and your Dad in Charlotte.BTW,enjoy Father's day tomorrow.See you all in Dixie! Rich:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUKE Posted June 16, 2012 Share Posted June 16, 2012 I will be there by the grace of God and Buick. I've attended at least six or seven national meets and enjoyed every one of them. If you compare them to cruising nights it's definitely wrong. These are all Buick shows all Buick people some of them live and die for the 400 point judgeing some live and die for custom Buick's some do trailer and some like me love to drive their cars. My point is we all must love a buick because we saved them from the trash yard and that what it's all about. I myself enjoy the ride yet some years it's expensive and some years it's not too bad. Even when I break down and I do if it's not a major motor transmission job I can fix it and get on the road that's part of drive an antique car. I know I'm a little bit fortunate in being retired and having the extra time a wife that understands(but don't like old cars) but I too have the same money problems as everybody I just start saving the day I get home from the last national so I go again next year every dime counts in my jar. So yes I'll be there as I said before my handshake and a smile on my face is for real. PS. Asking Brian does he need any help is like asking a priest does he need any money. So ask them and I am sure he will appreciate it. Have a great Buick day Frank Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted June 16, 2012 Share Posted June 16, 2012 Now that I know who is staying home I guess it is safe for me to go. (I owe some of them money or beers).Willie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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