Automotive Legislation: Too Important to ignore!

[f.f.jones]

This article is already posted in the legislation forum, but it needs to be read by everyone who owns and drives ANY car. There are REAL plans out there to prohibit private vehicles. Some say it can't happen here, but it's in discussion stages in California, England and other places. If we ignore it, it won't go away.
It will happen sooner than later.

(Moderators may have a problem with this article being posted here, but the automotive community needs to stay informed.)

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/uk-inches-closer-to-eliminating-private-car-ownership/ar-AASbota?ocid=mailsignout&li=BBnb7Kz

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[oldcarfudd]

I think it would be easier to ban guns in this country than to ban cars.

[John348]

1 hour ago, oldcarfudd said:

I think it would be easier to ban guns in this country than to ban cars.

 

Talk about a knee jerk reaction!

They are not banning the ownership of private vehicles, they are banning the use of private vehicles in huge cities which might not be a bad thing considering all of the traffic caused. if this were to be implemented it would be only in the inner cities. It would force people to use mass transit  Traffic only got worse since the advent of Lyft and Uber so now we have all of these extra cars riding around.

So nobody is coming to take your car away, you can relax

[Guest]

...

Edited December 28, 2021 by GregLaR (see edit history)

[f.f.jones]

4 hours ago, GregLaR said:

I think it's safe to say our cars are will not be legislated off our roads in the foreseeable future.   

I agree with your quoted observation, however urban centers are experiencing the rapid development of systems to greatly reduce private car usage. Many universities, public and private, think centers, and governmental sectors, both state and federal, national and international, are actively funding and planning for change. Even in your own backyard, plans are being made. (I know from first hand knowledge - my son is a professor at a prestigious University and has been consulting about this subject in both hemispheres for a number of years with a number of public and private institutions).

 

Quote from the article:

 

"If you think this plan is limited to just the UK, you haven’t been paying attention. There have been other efforts to make private vehicle ownership a thing of the past, including a new measure in Southern California. The 2021 Regional Transportation Plan passed recently by the San Diego Association of Government’s board of directors is a $160 billion initiative just for the metropolitan area to boost public transportation."

 

This certainly won't affect rural areas this century or probably even the next, but changes are coming and we all should be aware - not from a position of fear or irrational reaction - but with  an educated, open-minded view. 

 

 

Edited December 28, 2021 by f.f.jones (see edit history)

[nick8086]

😊

 

More horse power... lol..

 

This  is what the new deal has become.. Cutting up a Henry J to get around..

Edited January 3, 2022 by nick8086 (see edit history)

[hidden_hunter]

3 hours ago, GregLaR said:

The same British who, a century ago, controlled most of the known world and watched their empire dwindle away in the last 75 years to the point where they're barely able to hold onto an island the size of Michigan without the financial assistance of America and other allies?  The British, who gave up their industry, their basic freedoms, their rights, their borders, their influence, their respect and even their very identity?  The British, whose redundant and bloated government has nationalized every formerly private business and industry that generated revenue?  The very same British who, at the end of World War II were completely bankrupt as a nation and had to negotiate a loan from the United States in the amount of $3.75 billion dollars (60 billion in 2021 dollars) to stay afloat.

 

One of the biggest mistakes the UK made post ww2 was turning their back on the commonwealth in favour of old enemies in Europe who somehow managed to convince them to trash their own country while miraculously growing their own. Brexit isnt' going to save them years of poor short term political decisions 

 

That said, people do hold transport for london in fairly high regard so there is a potential for other cities to adopt it - personally I've never found anything all that special with transport in london. Perhaps they wouldn't need all of these measures if they you know did something about the countless foreigners flaunting parking restrictions that grind traffic to a halt 

 

  

[1935Packard]

This is a government official in England making a comment at a conference that they should consider changing the idea of individual car ownership.  At least to me, seems pretty far from plans to ban vehicle ownership in the United States.

[hidden_hunter]

1 hour ago, 1935Packard said:

This is a government official in England making a comment at a conference that they should consider changing the idea of individual car ownership.  At least to me, seems pretty far from plans to ban vehicle ownership in the United States.

The "hot topic" in transport for the last few years has been mobility as a service and multi modal journeys (as in you interchange between car, transit and uber/taxi) - not sure how popular that one is going to be in a post covid world

[Steve_Mack_CT]

Before brushing this off I think the point here is to be educated and watchful here.  2A folks understand people who want to impose their will on others do so incrementally and tirelessly.  A constant battle.  We should take that as a lesson on how this will eventually unfold.

My point being this idea will be pushed here eventually - it is a question of when, not if.  Complacency and an attitude of "Oh, well it can't happen here anytime soon" only helps proponents of that policy.

Edited December 28, 2021 by Steve_Mack_CT (see edit history)

[alsancle]

I'm willing to bet a generic poll of the US would find 15-20% of the people would be in favor of banning private ownership of cars,  but if you look at the under 30 age bracket that number would be much bigger.

 

Every time I think it is impossible for something stupid to happen it happens.   Of course,  I live in Massachusetts...

[John_S_in_Penna]

As car fans, we should take special note of this.

Thank you, Mr. Jones, for bringing this to attention.

 

I searched a quotation in the article, and read articles on

this topic in several publications on-line, even British

publications of good reputation.  The idea is NOT just to

ban transportation in major cities;  it is indeed to eliminate

ownership of private cars, even in rural areas.

 

Here is one link:

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/cars/news/car-sharing-should-become-the-norm-in-drive-to-cut-carbon-emissions-says-minister/ar-AARGQ70

In it, Trudy Harrison, who is close to Prime Minister

Boris Johnson, said, "For all its devastation, the pandemic

has created an opportunity for lasting behaviour change

in how we go about our travel.”  They are calling this "The

Great Reset"--and people should look this up.

 

And there are plenty of world forums where ideas are

shared among the elites, gaining more traction.  Claus

Schwab, Chairman of the World Economic Forum, has said,

"You will own nothing and be happy."

 

Miss or Mrs. Harrison also affirmed, "Many things seem far fetched

until they aren’ t and I believe the same is true for shared mobility."

 

 

Edited December 28, 2021 by John_S_in_Penna (see edit history)

[car crazy]

Never say never about the possibility of something happening..

[Steve_Mack_CT]

1 hour ago, car crazy said:

Never say never about the possibility of something happening..

Exactly my point, it is not majorities, btw that drive this, it's who fights hardest.

[Gunsmoke]

The inner city of the future and what Climate Change, Demographics, and Technology might lead it to look like, is a field for futurists, experts and people who understand the bigger picture, they will to research and develop sensible, practical and acceptable solutions. This forum is not the place for wild speculation, conspiracy theories and narrow minded pragmatism on this subject. Moderators I suggest end this post or move it to legislation section. I don't see it as a helpful discussion, just an opportunity to rant. 

[46 woodie]

It's already been proposed in New York City, it's a new program called "Congestion Pricing". There will be sections of the city that car's will not be able to enter without being taxed. They are still trying to work out the details, but the NYC government is really pushing for it to become a law. What they are doing is trying to encourage people to use mass transit.

[60FlatTop]

I have seen this writer before: https://www.motorious.com/author/steven/

 

2430 articles written, the guy will do anything for a buck. The topic link went to an MSN page.  That page was so cluttered with advertising there was very little room for dramatized or sensationalized "journalism" as loosely as be term is described.

 

News outlets have lost all credibility and value. Give me two old Gunsmokes and a rerun of Green Acres. It is a much better use of my time than MSN, CNN, or FOX. Even The Guardian makes me mince sometimes.

 

BTW. Read "Dissertation on roast pig" by Charles Lamb and imagine CNN with little girls in a well.

[rocketraider]

What works in densely populated urban areas doesn't work from diddly for those of us who live 20 miles (or farther) from anywhere. For some inexplicable reason that never sinks in on these high-minded people- who are invariably clustered in densely populated urban areas and either willfully or ignorantly assume everyone else does.

 

Jerry Clower often mentioned people who were educated beyond their intelligence. I've known a lot of "educated" people who define that phrase.

 

Complete fools with advanced degrees and an agenda are a bigger danger to civilization than private vehicle ownership.

 

Be aware and watch out for your interests.

[rocketraider]

19 minutes ago, Gunsmoke said:

The inner city of the future and what Climate Change, Demographics, and Technology might lead it to look like, is a field for futurists, experts and people who understand the bigger picture, they will to research and develop sensible, practical and acceptable solutions.

Plenty of us DO NOT LIVE in inner cities or other densely packed urban areas.

 

There is no ride sharing or public transportation out here where I live. That's where these overeducated fools get it totally and irresponsibly  wrong- they assume everyone lives in cities where such services are available and make sense.

 

"You will own nothing and be happy". 1917 Russia and 1949 China come to mind.

[John_S_in_Penna]

20 minutes ago, 60FlatTop said:

I have seen this writer before...the guy will do anything for a buck....

 

Bernie, it's good to read with a skeptical eye.

But I searched and read several articles, from

different sources, all based on the same talk.

 

And--as AACA has instructed their newsletter

editors--it's fine for us to discuss legislative topics

when they relate to our automotive focus.  This

subject isn't mere idle talk by one minor Englishwoman;

it's being discussed at the highest level by others too. 

[rocketraider]

 

[alsancle]

1 hour ago, Steve_Mack_CT said:

Exactly my point, it is not majorities, btw that drive this, it's who fights hardest.

 

My new saying is that we have a tyranny of the weak going on.    The internet has given power to every closet case that was formerly ignored or scared to leave their house.

[60FlatTop]

2 hours ago, rocketraider said:

Complete fools with advanced degrees

And my thoughts go to those bestowing the advanced degree. Seated in the highest positions they sit back in awe, inspired by the working class pictured in Richard Scarry books.

[Peter Gariepy]

1. Politics are off limits on the AACA Forums.  This post is teetering on the edge of partisan politics...

 

2. Join SEMA if you want to actually do something productive related to legislation related to our hobby.
 

 

[John_S_in_Penna]

Peter, with respect to you and our other AACA

national folks, legislative topics that affect cars

are important to discuss.  We even have a

"Legislative" category.  And our regional newsletters

may include automotive items in the governmental realm.

 

Through watchfulness,  harmful ideas that haven't yet

made it into legislation  can be rooted out before bills

are on the table or unlegislated regulations surprise us.

 

Also, the error is on BOTH sides of the aisle, so

there's nothing partisan.  Our members on this thread

have been courteous as they ponder this issue.

[SteveMaz]

The only thing that is certain is that the world will be a very different place in 50 years, just as it was 50 years ago, and 50 years before that, and 50 years before that. With young adult children I'm more concerned with how they will eat, breathe, and live than with what they will own.

[Gunsmoke]

Thanks Peter G, hopefully your guidance will lower the largely uninformed/biased rhetoric. I much prefer to talk/read old car stuff on AACA! I find it interesting when some one suggests this is a "harmful idea". And then says "the error is on BOTH sides of the aisle, so

there's nothing partisan." It's as if one party's members take an "it's harmful" position on an issue like this, and members of another party take the opposite view. Classic Divisionism disguised as casual conversation. 

[Peter Gariepy]

1 hour ago, John_S_in_Penna said:

Peter, with respect to you and our other AACA

national folks, legislative topics that affect cars

are important to discuss.  We even have a

"Legislative" category.  And our regional newsletters

may include automotive items in the governmental realm.

 

Through watchfulness,  harmful ideas that haven't yet

made it into legislation  can be rooted out before bills

are on the table or unlegislated regulations surprise us.

 

Also, the error is on BOTH sides of the aisle, so

there's nothing partisan.  Our members on this thread

have been courteous as they ponder this issue.

Of course legislation is important. Why the legislation forum exists and why I promote SEMA.  
 

Partisan politics have no place in this forum. Period. I make no apology for the policy. 

[alsancle]

And yet the electric car and alternative fuel threads are allowed.

[dictator27]

4 hours ago, rocketraider said:

Plenty of us DO NOT LIVE in inner cities or other densely packed urban areas.

 

There is no ride sharing or public transportation out here where I live. That's where these overeducated fools get it totally and irresponsibly  wrong- they assume everyone lives in cities where such services are available and make sense.

 

"You will own nothing and be happy". 1917 Russia and 1949 China come to mind.

For many years an interurban rail service ran from downtown Vancouver out to the town of Chilliwack in the eastern Fraser Valley, a distance of 65 miles,most of it rural.  The love affair with the automobile killed it in the early 1950's.

Guess what?  Seventy years later it's coming back.  When current construction ends, it will be about half way back to Chilliwack. Much of it is still rural. What goes around comes around.

[1912Staver]

Unfortunately the fabric of society has changed considerably since the 1950's and before. Quite a few Fraser Valley resident's are not completely happy about Skytrain's expansion. The transportation service is a mixed blessing. Skytrain has brought quite a bit of city crime along with the use by regular law abiding people. Downtown and rural Langley has a serious enough drug and homelesness  problem as it is. I don't know if you have used Skytrain lately , but depending on the time of day and station you are using the experence can be anything but pleasent.

[TTR]

1 hour ago, Peter Gariepy said:

 

Partisan politics have no place in this forum. Period.  

Just quit pu**yfooting around and ban any/all who engage in it, like you’ve promised/threatened (too) many times before. Period.

Sometimes examples (sacrifices ?) has to be made, especially with slow learners.

 

[Peter Gariepy]

1 minute ago, TTR said:

Just quit pu**yfooting around and ban any/all who engage in it, like you’ve promised/threatened (too) many times before. Period.

Sometimes examples (sacrifices ?) has to be made, especially with slow learners.

 

I have.  

[Peter Gariepy]

1 hour ago, alsancle said:

And yet the electric car and alternative fuel threads are allowed.

Show me where they are partisan and they’ll be moderated. 

[Laughing Coyote]

2 hours ago, John_S_in_Penna said:

We even have a "Legislative" category.  

Exactly. 

 

[John348]

https://forums.aaca.org/forum/28-automotive-legislation/

[60FlatTop]

We are bipartisan. We come for your good. And all your goods." Heard that somewhere.

[alsancle]

54 minutes ago, Peter Gariepy said:

Show me where they are partisan and they’ll be moderated. 

By their nature they have a political bent, you just can’t see it. If we’re gonna be strict to the rules then we should be sticking with 25-year-old cars.

[Steve_Mack_CT]

3 hours ago, Peter Gariepy said:

 

 

3 hours ago, Peter Gariepy said:

2. Join SEMA if you want to actually do something productive related to legislation related to our hobby.
 

Peter, with all due respect is this the official position of the AACA?  I ask because as a long time member I  would be surprised and more than somewhat dissapointed if that is the case.  I hope the club doesn't walk away from legislative issues even if they become contentious. 

Not saying I disagree with a no politics policy but I do think the forum and club should not only be open to, but encourage legislative updates of any kind that could directly impact our hobby. 

You put out a warning & moved it.  Fair enough, but it seems Ironic that the only comments here that could be construed as an "attack" (on one's understanding of the issue) seem to come from folks who either would dismiss it (as they certainly can) or seem irritated about the post.  

 

[car crazy]

This is indeed an extremely import topic that should not be rationalized away from open civil, non-political discussion. To reiterate my "never say never" comment, who among us would have imagined 30 years ago electric cars would be in our futures, and that the elimination of the internal combustion engine for automobiles could be a possibility?

Edited December 28, 2021 by car crazy (see edit history)