'51 DeSoto: Tell Me What You Think

[DrumBob]

Some of you know I have been casually looking for a car. I came across this '51 DeSoto in PA, not too far away. It looks quite nice for the most part. The owner said it was running fine, but developed wiring issues. He has been rewiring the car, but hasn't finished it. He has all the parts. I asked him if he would finish the job, as I'd prefer to drive the car home instead of having it towed. 

 

What do you experts think of this ride? I think it looks pretty nice for the money, but I'd have it checked out by a pro before parting with any cash.

 

https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/1389291531615903/?ref=search&referral_code=null&referral_story_type=post&tracking=browse_serp%3A449b0cc1-0140-4a60-b22f-0d4175b86533

Edited July 27, 2023 by DrumBob (see edit history)

[m-mman]

3 minutes ago, DrumBob said:

He has been rewiring the car, but hasn't finished it. He has all the parts. I asked him if he would finish the job, as I'd prefer to drive the car home instead of having it towed. 

Not a good idea…..

when you are fixing a car for yourself you do as good a job as you possibly can. Because you are planning on keeping it and you want it to work properly.  
 

When you are selling a car, you are mentally finished with it and you are not really interested in doing more work on it. (If you wanted to continue fixing it, you wouldn’t sell it)

 

OR the job is now beyond your capabilities and you are trying to get rid of it because you are embarrassed that you are stuck. (The typical situation) 

 

Always evaluate and buy a car in the exact condition that it is being offered.
 

 If you expect a seller to do the repairs, then you should expect to be disappointed with the work. 
 

The alternative is to tell the seller to finish the job and only when they are finished, will you return and reevaluate the car and the deal.  

[The 55er]

I don't know how anyone can determine a car's condition or form any kind of an opinion when there's only one exterior picture of it in the entire ad. $4500 seems very high to me for a non-running 6 cylinder 4-door sedan. It says the price is firm and especially with all the loose ends it would be a big PASS for me. I'd definitely look for something else.

[DrumBob]

1 hour ago, m-mman said:

Not a good idea…..

when you are fixing a car for yourself you do as good a job as you possibly can. Because you are planning on keeping it and you want it to work properly.  
 

When you are selling a car, you are mentally finished with it and you are not really interested in doing more work on it. (If you wanted to continue fixing it, you wouldn’t sell it)

 

OR the job is now beyond your capabilities and you are trying to get rid of it because you are embarrassed that you are stuck. (The typical situation) 

 

Always evaluate and buy a car in the exact condition that it is being offered.
 

 If you expect a seller to do the repairs, then you should expect to be disappointed with the work. 
 

The alternative is to tell the seller to finish the job and only when they are finished, will you return and reevaluate the car and the deal.  

I asked him if he would finish the job of wiring, then I would take a look at it. I'm waiting for his reply. 

[The 55er]

Take a close look at the chrome trim on the front of the car in that single picture, it looks like someone painted it gold or something. Desotos of that vintage had a lot of pot-metal chrome trim and with the Korean War in full swing in 1951, the chrome on automobiles was thin and of poor quality. If you get the car and plan to restore it correctly be prepared to spend a lot of $$$$ at the plating shop. Just something you might want to inquire about if he responds to the wiring question. 

[c49er]

The wiring (tecently done) is a mess...don't buy it unless you can road test it on a good long drive thoroughly.

The "Tip-Toe" shift transmission with Fluid Drive  better upshift and downshift properly.

Those brake and clutch pedal pads are really worn too.

Have a very knowledgeable old car mechanic check it over carefully including using a hub puller to check the front and rear brakes.

Steering wheel is all broken and crackednunder thatbwheel cover.

Love the front carpet.🤩

 

[marcapra]

I own a 48 DeSoto which I am currently wiring.  It's a big job.  Just to show you how low prices of DeSoto four door sedans have sunk, there is a beautiful 39 DeSoto fully restored that just ended on Ebay.  It didn't sell because the bidding only went up to about $5300 for a fully restored car!  

[Crusty Trucker]

I think it needs a green wire or two to complete the effect.

[TAKerry]

Unfortunately I think we have reached the alternate universe. 

[R Walling]

The wiring that is being done looks like he is just trying to start it. If it runs well and shifts correctly, it would all have to be done over correctly.

[Dosmo]

2 hours ago, smithjohnson22 said:

The 1951 DeSoto is often appreciated for its distinctive styling and classic design elements of that time. It featured sleek lines, a prominent grille, and unique tail fins, which were common characteristics of cars from the 1950s.

A 1951 DeSoto has tail fins?  That is news to me.

[28 Chrysler]

Have him finish only the wiring to get it to drive and charge.What he is putting in there I would pull out.

[Steve_Mack_CT]

Bob it seems like your target is late 40s, early 50s, right?  Seems you can buy a much better car for not a huge spend increase.  

Nothing came of Chevys that you were looking at a while back? 

[Fleetwood Meadow]

I’m going to argue that if you like the car then look at it and go for it if you feel comfortable. With reasonable electrical wiring skills you can rewire that entire car yourself. There is pretty much nothing on those vehicles that you can’t do yourself. I have a 1951 Dodge that looks identical and it wasn’t running when I bought it. I had no knowledge of how to get it running; I took the head off and replaced a valve and it ran after 40 years. I am rewiring the car now, one wire at a time and enjoying the experience. These are good cars if you are limited on funds. I love the people on this site and I value their input but I have asked on a couple of occasions on whether or not to move on a vehicle and the answers are always the same, “find one that is in better condition.” Keep in mind, none of us are experts. There is no such thing in this hobby, we are merely people who enjoy cars with an experience with them. I find these cars to be strong tanks and with a little fine tuning you can go through Hell itself with it. Check under the driver’s floor for rot on the edges of the cab near the frame. When the floor pan rots the side wall under the pan also rots. With that being said, I agree that I don’t love the wiring job he is doing and having him finish it just for you to remove it and rewire it seems excessive to me. Even though it says firm perhaps since you have had the conversation with him about wiring you can make a compromise to lower the price a couple hundred dollars and take it as is. 

Edited July 27, 2023 by Fleetwood Meadow
Added the last 2 lines (see edit history)

[DrumBob]

Thank you for all the good responses. The seller has already agreed to come down $150 without even asking. I agree, the wiring looks like a mess, and if I would have to tear it all out and start from scratch, well, that puts a damper on things. He told me he's only selling the car because his wife's muscle car needs work.

 

Steve, nothing came of the Chevys. Either the sellers didn't answer my inquiries, or they needed too much work. 

 

My nephew in PA is a car guy who can help me find a vehicle and look it over if something nice comes along. 

[Steve_Mack_CT]

@Fleetwood MeadowAgree on your observation on simplicity.  In fact I would argue my '41 Plymouth (first car in 1977) was an easier car to work on than even the Model As that came along much later.  That said 90% of the reason a newer hobbyist gets out after one experience is the car needs more than their skillset and or budget allows.  So I see both points.  Still, all things considered I suggest buying best you can in a given price point, and area of interest.  Especially for your first rodeo...

Edited July 27, 2023 by Steve_Mack_CT (see edit history)

[pkhammer]

  Fresh undercoating in the trunk or anywhere else is a red flag to me. Be sure it's not hiding rust or poorly done repairs. I knew a guy once that "fixed" rusty floors by pop-riveting in cheap flashing metal and then heavily undercoating it to hide it. 

  I'm not a big fan of cars from the 1942 thru 1953/54 era but I say if you like the car, it runs well and the body checks out good and solid then go for it.

[60FlatTop]

Arethere any deferred maintenance items or upgrades on the Studebaker or Merc that $4,000 could be well spent on?

[Bryan G]

This DeSoto is my kind of car. I wouldn't do a lot with it, just tidy it up, get the wiring squared away, and get the car as reliable as it can be. And then I'd drive it. $4500 will get you a dented Elantra at the local buy-here/pay-here, or you can have this. Were I in the market for another car from this era, I'd have to at least give it a solid look. 

[DrumBob]

4 hours ago, 60FlatTop said:

Arethere any deferred maintenance items or upgrades on the Studebaker or Merc that $4,000 could be well spent on?

My favorite cars of all time are the '49-'50 bullet nose Studebakers, but finding one on my very limited budget has been hard, so I've decided I like DeSotos as well. I actually have fondness for many cars from '49-'54, so when the right one comes along, it could be almost anything that suits my fancy. Not a big Dodge/Plymouth fan, but you never know. 

 

I just want something I can drive without a lot of work. Not looking for a showstopper. Just something original, unrestored and mechanically solid. 

[Rusty_OToole]

I'm with Bryan G. It looks like a decent car that needs some TLC. I will not comment on the price as I don't know what cars are going for in your area. But, I would try an offer and if I got turned down, keep tabs on it and check back with the owner every week or 2. You never know your luck. I have bought cars before where the seller was initially holding out for more money. If the car does not run, or does not run right, or needs work, that will turn off 90% of potential buyers especially if the car is not a real desirable model. In other words if it was a Mustang convertible it would sell if it had no engine, a 51 DeSoto sedan, not so much.

[JamesR]

It's a cool car, but as others have said, it's not really possible to know what's what based on a pic. I had a 1950 Mopar and it was a good car, but it was presented as being in far better mechanical condition than it actually was.  I think there are a lot of youtube videos out there of the "I JUST BOUGHT A CAR THAT HASN'T RUN IN 30 YEARS AND I'M GOING TO DRIVE IT 500 MILES HOME!" variety and they create the myth that most old non-running cars can be put into drivable condition in a couple of afternoons. Even if an old non-running car could be jerry rigged well enough to make it home 100 miles or more, who knows what damage is being done to the engine or bearings by not getting the sludge out of the crankcase properly. One oil change won't do it. Good luck.

[Rusty_OToole]

19 hours ago, JamesR said:

"I JUST BOUGHT A CAR THAT HASN'T RUN IN 30 YEARS AND I'M GOING TO DRIVE IT 500 MILES HOME!"

I watched one of those on Youtube. It was a 1968 Suzuki 500 motorcycle that had been put away in a garage in the eighties with very low miles on it. The buyer lashed it together and got it running but it blew sky high before he got 50 miles. If he had taken it home in a trailer or pickup truck and serviced it properly it would have been like a new bike.

[DavidinCA]

I like those Chrysler products in general, and the price seems in the right range but the question in my mind is do you like it as is, or do you intend to restore it.  If you make it mechanically sound it should be a fun car, bearing in mind that Fluid drive and a six means you can’t be in a hurry.  

 

The wiring work that’s been done is an unknown and seems like it might need to be redone to a large extent.  A correct harness is not cheap, and while it’s straightforward to install, it’s a lot of time to do right. It’s also much easer to replace an original, intact harness than one that’s been spliced and replaced in various places.  

 

The cosmetics are a can of worms, since it seems like you’d end up touching everything once you start.  If you are fine leaving it largely as is and can sort the wiring yourself, it seems like a good choice.  If you want to fully restore it, then it wouldn’t be my first choice.  

[c49er]

The main thing to make this car a wise purchase is if the buyer has enough skill/tools and $$ to get it back on the road.

If not then he will have to pay the big bucks....this will kill the deal.

[Fleetwood Meadow]

Looking at the seller’s page he has several listings, including this car at least 3 times. In one of them that is listed at $5,500 it shows it running. Is that a recent video? To me it sounds like it needs some tuning up. 

[Rusty_OToole]

Jack you are right, such cars were meant to last about 10 years, they never dreamed they would still be in use this long. But, the quality in 1951 was pretty good compared to what came after.

[DrumBob]

11 hours ago, Jack Bennett said:

Keep in mind that this is a “shoebox” car, manufactured during a time when MOPAR used some pretty poor quality materials to build their cars. Nearly every 1950-1951 vintage car I have looked at has the floor boards, rocker panels, trunk, roof line and door bottoms rusted out. The wiring is poor quality copper, and this problem is exacerbated by the cloth insulation rotting away and subjecting the car to electrical problems. The material used in the upholstery and headliners must have been bad quality on the day it was installed because it surely didn’t stand the test of time. I like the engine in my 1951 Plymouth Cambridge, but the brakes, steering, transmission and all rubber parts are junk. Still, the photo looks good, and if you like the car, that alone makes it a good deal. But, I can’t understand why you would buy a old car, which surely will require a lot of upkeep, and still expect someone else to do the wiring so that you can drive the car home. 

I don't have the knowledge of these cars the way you do, I appreciate your response. I came here to learn more, and I certainly have and continue to do so. 

Edited August 3, 2023 by DrumBob (see edit history)

[Rusty_OToole]

DeSoto was as good a car as was made in America at the time, better than some other popular cars I could name. Engine, chassis, steering, suspension, brakes and bodywork were tops for their time. All cars had similar upholstery, of natural fabric, as nylon and other synthetics had not come in yet. Same with cloth covered rubber insulation wiring, vinyl insulation was a few years off.

 

New cars last longer and require less maintenance but in many ways are sleazier and harder to repair.

 

You are not apt to find a 70 year old car in perfect shape. Even if you somehow pulled one out of a time machine it would still require more regular service, repair and maintenance than a 2023 model.

[MGRAB]

Years ago I had a '51 DeSoto Sedan project car.  The best attribute this car has is the grille and its the most expensive to find or plate.  The chrome on these pit so bad and you really need to find NOS to do it right.  In the 90's I found a complete set in the box and slowly acquired other pieces. Doubt you can do that now.. all the Merc guys ate these up.  I never had anything plated on the car, but had a guy once tell me the ridge on the teeth was usually rounded down to get to something worth plating. 

 

Long and short I bailed on the project, got my money back and it got parted for a more worthy coupe project. I never found a place to recast the steering wheel either. 

 

Very hard to find all the parts you need cosmetically.. not like Dodge or Plymouth.  If you really want one of these I'd wait for a low miles example.  These are neat cars that don't get the love they deserve.  

 

If you are really serious, forget the mechanical concerns.  These are insanely easy to work on.  Focus on the chrome.  If it is all pitted up, bail.  If it looks good with little pitting, ok price.  You can get these for $10-15k with low miles and you won't be beating others off to buy it.

 

I love project cars and hate steering someone away but this is one of those cars I would only do if the top went down.

 

Mike

[Lahti35]

This Plymouth would be a much better choice... Looks cleaner.

 

[DrumBob]

That does look better. I have found another Plymouth on FB Marketplace in PA that look promising for $5K asking price. I also found a '51 DeSoto in PA. The girl selling it started at $6000, and is now down to $3500. She's having some necessary work done to it, and I'll probably go look at it this week if it's done. It's a bit rough, but a little TLC, tires and some paint will clean it up. 

[Ed Luddy]

For $4500 it's worth the gamble. That's clunker money in 2023!

[Frank DuVal]

On 7/27/2023 at 11:00 PM, DrumBob said:

My favorite cars of all time are the '49-'50 bullet nose Studebakers,

"My favorite cars of all times are the '50-'51 bullet nose Studebakers."

 

There, IFIFY. (I fixed it for you). Only the 1950 and 51 had the bullet nose. Now back to my comment on your comment:

 

Me TOO! We have a '50 Commander 4 door. Back in college I had a '50 Champion 4 door, a $25 car.

[DrumBob]

23 minutes ago, Frank DuVal said:

"My favorite cars of all times are the '50-'51 bullet nose Studebakers."

 

There, IFIFY. (I fixed it for you). Only the 1950 and 51 had the bullet nose. Now back to my comment on your comment:

 

Me TOO! We have a '50 Commander 4 door. Back in college I had a '50 Champion 4 door, a $25 car.

I thought the bullet nose Studebakers started in '49. Thanks for the correction. 

 

I could have bought a '51 Starlight coupe in 1970 for $300. Of course, I passed on it. 

[marcapra]

To show how low prices have gone for 40s and early 50s sedans, look at this restored 39 DeSoto that barely cracked 5K on Ebay!

 

<https://www.ebay.com/itm/145191191766>

Edited August 8, 2023 by marcapra (see edit history)

[The 55er]

In all fairness there have been higher bids on this blue 1939 Desoto on Ebay......$7910, $8101. and a high of $9150 back on July 10. It has a great appearance with nice paint & chrome but I wouldn't call it fully restored, the crusty engine compartment needs some serious detailing and the trunk is completely bare with no mat, jack or spare tire. Also the interior might present well but it's incorrect for the car. It's been relisted yet again and it's currently active. I'm sure the dealer that's selling it is looking for top dollar as there are over 120 very detailed pictures of it in the listing and there's even a Youtube video of it available. Whether that special buyer shows up or not remains to be seen.