Car trailer versus falling tree

[Gary_Ash]

We had a wild nor'easter storm this week with inches of rain and winds 60-90 mph in southeastern Massachusetts.  The leaves were still on most of the trees, which gave them a lot of surface against the winds, so there were lots of downed trees and power outages.  I lost three trees, including a big one that partly landed on my aluminum car hauler trailer which was parked in the old barn foundation..  

 

I trimmed off some of the branches that were on top of the trailer, found only a small dent in the roof, no punctures.  After cutting the trunk in half and trimming off as much weight as I could, I looped a chain around the trunk near the top of the trailer, hooked it to the bucket of my John Deere compact tractor, and was able to lift and rotate the trunk away from the trailer.  There doesn't seem to be any other damage, so I guess I got lucky.  We'll be weeks cleaning up the mess of smaller branches all over the yard.

 

We had discussed cutting down the big, old tree with a tree trimming company only a few days ago.  He was going to come in a couple of weeks, but the storm beat him to part of the job.  I'll leave the rest of the tree for him to cut.  At least we'll have more firewood.

 

The tree trunk as it landed.

 

The main trunk of the tree and the broken part.  A matching trunk still stands, must come down soon.

 

The mess on top of the trailer.

 

 

 

 

[TerryB]

Glad to hear it wasn’t a total loss and a bonus of extra firewood!

[Bhigdog]

I had a tree come down on the stable a few years back. Not too much damage nothing structural just a few holes poked through. The insurance adjuster was more interested in looking at the tree than the stable. Seems, at least with Erie, if the offending tree was sound before it came down I was covered. On the other hand if the tree had visual defects or was dead they were not on the hook for any damages. Just sayin....Bob

[mike6024]

Arborists are charging stupidly high prices. The real concern is if you have a big tree that could fall on a neighbor's house. But can you even afford an arborist to come out every other year to inspect and trim it? Not me!

 

 

This looks like a very small tree and I wouldn't hesitate to drop it myself. I'd expect to be charged a few thousand to have it removed where I live.

 

[Jim Bollman]

Probably one of the stronger place to hit the top of your trailer with the extra framing for the door. Hopefully it didn't bend it enough to jam the door.

[Marty Roth]

Gary,

 

Sorry you have to go through this, and I can sympathize.

Having a winter's supply of firewood paints a positive note.

 

Our neighbors on our north and western sides both have very big trees overhanging our yard. Jointly, we engaged an arborist to take down potentially offending branches prior to this year's hurricane season. Thankfully, these trees were unaffected by Hurricane Ida. Our neighbor to the south had a crepe myrtle which did take down our cedar fence on that side, but didn't do any more substantial damage. We did have moderate wind and wind-driven rain storm damage, as well as some other damage, but at least the house is standing and has been made liveable, pending roof, window, ceilings, and other repairs. We're better off than so many in this area who've lost everything - homes, businesses, livelihoods, etc.

Edited October 30, 2021 by Marty Roth (see edit history)

[George Smolinski]

11 hours ago, Bhigdog said:

I had a tree come down on the stable a few years back. Not too much damage nothing structural just a few holes poked through. The insurance adjuster was more interested in looking at the tree than the stable. Seems, at least with Erie, if the offending tree was sound before it came down I was covered. On the other hand if the tree had visual defects or was dead they were not on the hook for any damages. Just sayin....Bob

If that’s how your insurance policy works, then I’d say it’s a pretty poor policy. Execute some due diligence and start comparing policies and premiums through an insurance broker.

[George Smolinski]

10 hours ago, mike6024 said:

Arborists are charging stupidly high prices. The real concern is if you have a big tree that could fall on a neighbor's house. But can you even afford an arborist to come out every other year to inspect and trim it? Not me!

 

 

This looks like a very small tree and I wouldn't hesitate to drop it myself. I'd expect to be charged a few thousand to have it removed where I live.

 

From the looks of it, the tree should have been downed about 20 years ago.

[West Peterson]

1 hour ago, George Smolinski said:

If that’s how your insurance policy works, then I’d say it’s a pretty poor policy. Execute some due diligence and start comparing policies and premiums through an insurance broker.

 

13 hours ago, Bhigdog said:

I had a tree come down on the stable a few years back. Not too much damage nothing structural just a few holes poked through. The insurance adjuster was more interested in looking at the tree than the stable. Seems, at least with Erie, if the offending tree was sound before it came down I was covered. On the other hand if the tree had visual defects or was dead they were not on the hook for any damages. Just sayin....Bob

 

George. Home owner's insurance usually won't cover loss or damage caused by negligence or a maintenance-related issue. So, if the tree was rotting and ready to fall down before the storm, damage caused by the falling tree is not likely covered. That is pretty standard. Of course, there are exceptions, and there are probably rider options you can purchase separately.

[West Peterson]

I probably spend an average of at least $1,000/year cutting down trees or trimming. Some years none, other years double. I DO NOT use an arborist. Unless you're trying to save a sick tree, there's no reason to. But you do want to make sure the company is insured properly to protect yourself against liability if the tree cutter gets seriously injured. Also, of course, if there's property around it that could be damaged.

 

Also, if a tree falls on your vehicle, it's your vehicle's comprehensive insurance that would pay, not your homeowner's insurance. However, if you have a bunch of dead trees on your property, I'd check with your insurance advisor as to whether or not you're covered if a known dead tree comes down and causes damage.

[J.H.Boland]

This big spruce tree fell on my garage last year. The large number of branches spread the weight around and a dented eavestrough was the only casualty. My local arborist cleaned it up and took down a second one for about $200.

[72caddy]

That is a great deal. I had to get some 80-90’ pines removed. Clear land underneath, a crew that came and went at random, and had to pay a whole lo more! Yard still has not recovered. One pine literally left a trough in the ground when it hit.

[Gary_Ash]

As George said, the tree should have come down years ago, but before I got the car hauler, there wasn't anything that it could fall on.  I just measured the trunk about 4 ft off the ground: it was 9 ft around.  The remaining part of this twin-trunked tree is 45-50 ft tall, not something for me to play with.  We do have Ted the tree guy come fairly often.  He has a bucket truck with a 60 ft boom that can reach high in the trees, but not to the tops of many of the ones here.  And, when the truck can't get to the trees, Ted will put on his climbing hooks and belt and go up the tree with a chain saw hanging from a rope below him.  He scaled a 80-100 ft pine in back of the house, trimming off limbs as he went up, cut the top 15-20 ft off above him, then sliced 2-ft pieces as he went back down.  Too bad pine isn't good firewood.

 

Ted in the bucket taking down a dead tree.

 

Ted on the tree with climbing hooks and belt.

 

Enlargement of Ted on the tree from photo above.  This is not the kind of activity I want to do!

[60FlatTop]

A friend of mine ran a tree trimming business years ago. He said he would drive through very well manicured neighborhoods and spot a branch or two that needed minor trimming. When he brought it to the owner's attention they would ask for it to be trimmed right away. Once he set up for that small job and the other neighbors saw, he would work the neighborhood for a week.

 

He told me he wouldn't even slow down driving past my place.

[George Smolinski]

4 hours ago, West Peterson said:

George. Home owner's insurance usually won't cover loss or damage caused by negligence or a maintenance-related issue. So, if the tree was rotting and ready to fall down before the storm, damage caused by the falling tree is not likely covered. That is pretty standard. Of course, there are exceptions, and there are probably rider options you can purchase separately.

West, I beg to differ. We had a tree come down on our home in 2019. Hit the main roof & bounced off onto the porch roof. Our insurance covered the tree removal, painting on one side of the house where the branches scratched the paint, damage to a little of the fascia, and a whole new roof even though the roof was only 6 years old. They paid out about $30,000 & we paid our $2000 deductible. 

And yes, even though the tree was alive, it was rotten on a large area of the trunk which was plainly visible from one side.

 

I think the difference here is what type of homeowner's coverage. We have one of the best policies for coverage, and as you can see, it certainly paid off.

 

In the case of the tree in question on this thread, it appears quite obvious that it should have been taken down a long time ago.

[George Smolinski]

35 minutes ago, 60FlatTop said:

A friend of mine ran a tree trimming business years ago. He said he would drive through very well manicured neighborhoods and spot a branch or two that needed minor trimming. When he brought it to the owner's attention they would ask for it to be trimmed right away. Once he set up for that small job and the other neighbors saw, he would work the neighborhood for a week.

I did the opposite in our neighborhood when we first bought our house. We needed a bunch of trees trimmed so I called and found a company that gave me a discount if I could get 3-4 other neighbors to have theirs trimmed. It worked out. I always got a discount over about 13 years we had the home and the tree company picked up about 8 long time customers.

[West Peterson]

5 minutes ago, George Smolinski said:

West, I beg to differ. We had a tree come down on our home in 2019. Hit the main roof & bounced off onto the porch roof. Our insurance covered the tree removal, painting on one side of the house where the branches scratched the paint, damage to a little of the fascia, and a whole new roof even though the roof was only 6 years old. They paid out about $30,000 & we paid our $2000 deductible. 

And yes, even though the tree was alive, it was rotten on a large area of the trunk which was plainly visible from one side.

 

I think the difference here is what type of homeowner's coverage. We have one of the best policies for coverage, and as you can see, it certainly paid off.

 

In the case of the tree in question on this thread, it appears quite obvious that it should have been taken down a long time ago.

 

I'm just stating facts, George. It is not normal for insurance companies to insure damage caused by dead trees. Your tree was still alive, no matter how much rot there was, it was alive, and I highly suspect is why they covered you. You may have a different policy than most, but the standard insurance policy will not cover negligence.

[1912Staver]

My lot has a creek running along the property line. Environmental rules say I can't touch anything for a buffer of 30 feet from the center of the creek. Property next door changed hands last year and the new owner { a freshly minted Canadian with lots of $ and no respect for the environment or Canadian protection laws } illegally removed all the trees on his side , left several of mine quite exposed to wind damage. Claims someone at city hall said it was fine to " clean up " along the creek . Fat chance total removal of about a dozen trees or more ,is what the city engineering clerk had in mind . So far no problems, but who knows in the future. 

 Our property's are way too small to meet current subdivision rules , but were subdivided back in about 1962. Long before current rules were in place. Houses are way too close together , and too close to the creek. My house is one of the origonal structures on the property and was built in the 1930's.  This is all minimum 5 acres lot size zoning by todays rules and the houses would have to be built much further from the creek { 100 feet } by todays rules. Who is liable ?

Edited October 30, 2021 by 1912Staver (see edit history)

[Billy Kingsley]

It's funny how trees fall. Not ha ha funny but weird funny. We had a neighbors tree come down into our yard during hurricane isiahs last year. It landed on the shepherd's hook that our bird feeder hangs on. The hook was totally fine, it supported the weight with ease. The suet feeder that was hanging there was bent in half and halfway down the yard. I was standing where it fell just five minutes before so I'm lucky I wasn't squished. 

[mike6024]

Arborist charged me $2,880.00 to prune this oak tree. Reason I had it done is I have a new neighbor, Using their place like a commercial property, parking their Freightliner and other equipment under the oak which extends way over the property line. I don't think they should be parking equipment out in the feild and using a 200 year old oak on my property just for shade. So the point is the arborist crew piddled around for a few hours, trimmed a lot of only small branches and i don't think I got much for my money. After they were done I asked him, the arborist who wasn't actually on site while his crew was here. he said you do not cut any big branches on an oak because it can introduce disease. You trim off small stuff to lighten it.

 

Well they didn't cut much except small stuff, mostly up to the 2 to 3 inch diameter range. And fed that through their $30,000 chipper.

 

 

[mike6024]

This is my other heritage oak, not near the property line. This is what can happen to them. This happened in the middle of summer, no wind, just collapsed. One of three main branches coming off the trunk broke.

 

[Bhigdog]

Trees are both a joy and a curse. Around here the going rate to take an average size tree down in pieces, chip the branches and leave the fire wood is around $500. There are thousands of standing but dead Ash trees and the tree guys have more work than they can handle. I had one dead ash along the road I was afraid to take down because it was too close to a primary electric line for my taste. Guy dropped it and left it in the woods for $100 cash money. Well worth it.

I had one oak go down and ding the neighbors garage. He never said anything but I checked and, at least in PA, the general rule is if my tree falls and damages your property it's YOUR insurance that covers.

That said, I'm sure that's what they made lawyers and law suits for............Bob

[39BuickEight]

11 hours ago, George Smolinski said:

If that’s how your insurance policy works, then I’d say it’s a pretty poor policy. Execute some due diligence and start comparing policies and premiums through an insurance broker.

Just like auto insurance, property policies vary greatly from structure to structure and from state to state.  Don’t assume anything .

Edited October 30, 2021 by 39BuickEight (see edit history)

[West Peterson]

6 minutes ago, Bhigdog said:

 the general rule is if my tree falls and damages your property it's YOUR insurance that covers.

 

 

Unless the tree is/was dead, then you're liable.

[mike6024]

I cut 4 of these eucalyptus that I myself had planted along the fence line long ago. The idea was wind break, but they can fall in a heavy winter storm with high winds, Besides they are non-native and really have no business being on this property. it is valley oak territory.

These eucalyptus were about 24 to 28 inch diameter at the base. i think 40 feet tall plus, but i didn't measure that. This one was leaning hard over to my neighbor's side of the fence but I pulled it. Put a rope around it, throw the rope up as high as you can get it for leverage. Run the rope around so it is doubled. Put a tow chain around the base of the Oak tree. Then pull on the rope with 2 come alongs. Cut a wedge on the pull side, then back cut. You tighten down with the hand winches. It cracks. You essentially pull it down, not cut it down. You cut it so it's weak, then pull it over. "Arborists" would probably quote me $3,000 each to remove these trees.

 

[Bhigdog]

2 hours ago, West Peterson said:

 

Unless the tree is/was dead, then you're liable.

 

"That said, I'm sure that's what they made lawyers and law suits for."

 

Like I said. ...............Bob

[Bhigdog]

1 hour ago, mike6024 said:

"Arborists" would probably quote me $3,000 each to remove these trees.

 

In the more populous parts of the country they're "arborists". Around these here parts they're called "tree guys"...........Bob

[John Bloom]

this giant oak (alive and we thought thriving) came down came down at our cottage and affected 3 properties. The property it originated from (huge root ball), the property to the east (crashed through their stairs) and the top of the tree ended up in our backyard.  Because of the hill and close proximity of the cottages, they couldn’t get heavier equipment down there and so a crew to cut it up and use human labor to carry it all up the hill to the the street and then do the cleanup left a $10,000 bill. Because the tree was thriving, there was no negligence from the homeowner whose tree it was, they consider it an active God and each property owner was responsible for what was on their property.  My insurance did give me $1000 to cover cleanup of debris so that took me from 3,333 to 2,333.

 

With no negligence, the declaration of an act of God, each owner was responsible to make their property right.

[SC38dls]

I would say it wasn’t an act of god - the devil made him do it so pay up insurance company. 
dave s 

[kingrudy]

On 10/29/2021 at 7:16 PM, mike6024 said:

Arborists are charging stupidly high prices. The real concern is if you have a big tree that could fall on a neighbor's house. But can you even afford an arborist to come out every other year to inspect and trim it? Not me!

 

 

This looks like a very small tree and I wouldn't hesitate to drop it myself. I'd expect to be charged a few thousand to have it removed where I live.

 

I was in this situation a few months ago. My neighbor stated that three tall pines were a hazard to his house as they could fall and cause structural damage. I'm no aborist, but the trees looked good to me. I called an aborist and he came out to look at the trees and stated that they all looked healthy and didn't charge me for the assessment. Spoke to the neighbor and he agreed.