The Car Which Shall Not Be Named III (1935 Lincoln K)

[edinmass]

2 hours ago, tom_in_nh said:

Not all stainless steels are non rusting. Request 316 stainless steel (medical grade) if it is feasible. 

Best of luck to you Matt.

Tom

 

Tom is correct. Most non rusting stainless is very soft, so it’s often alloyed with other materials. How did I find out? I bought a Chinese stainless steel grill, and it turned orange in three weeks outside.

[old-tank]

...mineral deposits from hard water?

[Matt Harwood]

Well, in my usual awesome way, I fixed the car until it was broken. I figured I'd change the coolant to something that wouldn't cause rust, so I drained the system. Then I decided I'd clean up that rust on the water pump shaft, so I used a Scotch-Brite pad to tidy things up a bit. It didn't get all the rust off, but it cleaned it up. 

Then, of course, in my infinite wisdom, I decided to add some more packing to the water pump since the packing nut was almost all the way tightened. More packing would be a good idea and not too difficult, right?

 

So after an hour of turning that goddamned nut 1/16 of a turn at a time using three different wrenches, I cleared the threads. And now it's stuck. I can't slide it out enough to get any packing in there and I can't push it back into place so the threads will grab and tighten. So it's just in limbo, stuck on the shaft loose enough to turn but too tight to slide back into place. I'm guessing it's hung up on whatever crud was on the shaft and I didn't clean it up well enough. 

 

What the heck do I do now?

 

[AB-Buff]

I guess I would try putting a few drops of oil on that shaft and the threads rotated around enough to where it’s free enough to catch the thread again and screw it back in. A little oil won’t hurt anything.

[edinmass]

Don't screw around……pull the pump and service it on the bench. 

[Matt Harwood]

I managed to get it back together with a lot of penetrating oil and a 3/4" wrench against the nut, tapping it with a hammer. Eventually the packing nut moved enough for me to screw it back into place. I did not get more packing in there, however, so this is a job I'm going to have to revisit in the not-too-distant future. I'm not taking the water pump off now because we're going to the Lincoln Homecoming on Thursday up at the Gilmore. I've missed it for the past 4 years, I'm not missing this year because of a sticky packing nut. I'm not sure having it on the bench would make any of this any easier--the housing still gets in the way as much as anything.

 

Stuck packing nut. I eventually got it back onto

the threads by using a wrench and a small

hammer to tap it back a half-millimeter.

 

Once the water pump was sealed up, I filled the cooling system with 2.5 gallons of Zerex Original Green anti-freeze, 30 ounces of No-Rosion, and 4.5 gallons of purified water. That's about a 30/70 mix of anti-freeze and water. I expected it to run a little warmer because of it, so I drove another standard test loop to see.

Results? Pretty much as it ever was. No surprises, not running notably hotter, cooling off just as easily as before. That's good news. No more worries about getting hot. The cooling system is healthy (well, aside from the water pump packing, I guess).

 

When I returned to the shop there was still a drip from the water pump packing nut so I tightened it up a bit more. I got the shaft pretty clean but there's still some corrosion on it that I'll have to remove if I want to get the packing nut to move. I only used a Scotch-Brite pad on it, so maybe I'll use some 220 sand paper or something a bit more aggressive to knock it off of there and try to get the nut to slide freely. Then add more packing.

 

But not in the next few days. It should be fine for the rest of the season as it is.

[AB-Buff]

Matt, I would run at least 50% antifreez. I run 55 to 60% antifreeze and the rest distilled water. I found it with the American Austins and Bantams that have aluminum piece parts. If you go less than 50% the aluminum will disappear and rott away in time. I run 60% in the Lincoln when I add water every once in a while I have a bottle of mixed up of 50%. I pour into it.

[Matt Harwood]

1 hour ago, AB-Buff said:

Matt, I would run at least 50% antifreez. I run 55 to 60% antifreeze and the rest distilled water. I found it with the American Austins and Bantams that have aluminum piece parts. If you go less than 50% the aluminum will disappear and rott away in time. I run 60% in the Lincoln when I add water every once in a while I have a bottle of mixed up of 50%. I pour into it.

The No-Rosion should guard against that. That's exactly what it's designed to do.

[Grimy]

Add a magnesium anode (sacrificial material).  Your local boat shop will have an assortment.  On my 1918 Pierce the anode is a short cylinder drilled lengthwise, with stainless wire hooked into the overflow tube.

[EmTee]

19 hours ago, Matt Harwood said:

...I used a Scotch-Brite pad to tidy things up a bit. It didn't get all the rust off, but it cleaned it up. 

I'd try soaking a paper towel in CLR or white vinegar and wrapping it around the shaft to sit for awhile.  I'd think that would remove the calcium and rust stains without using any abrasive.

[Stude Light]

Matt,

Glad you are getting time to enjoy your car and it is cooperating with all your hard work!

 

Below is a photo of the steel (non-stainless) water pump shaft in my Studebaker (taken today). Since restoring it over 7 years and about 3000 miles ago, I've only run RO Water and No-Rosion changing it once after 5 years (and it still looked like the day I put it in). I try to keep the packing tightened to the point of just being wet at the nut interface when the engine is running.

 

This engine is like a galvanic nightmare with a cast iron block, aluminum head, brass thermostat housing, copper radiator, brass impeller and aluminum & cast iron water pump housing. No issues so far. About once every two years I spritz the water pump shaft, spark plug base and the uncoated engine fasteners with some Boeshield T-9 as a rust preventative. It's a process that seems to work for me.

 

I run about 25% EG, 75%water with No-Rosion in my LaSalle as I drive it a lot later in the year - right up to when the snow flies. 

Scott

Edited August 6, 2023 by Stude Light (see edit history)

[Matt Harwood]

Had a nice day tour with a number of other great cars. About 50 miles of driving, a few stops including a farm with baby goats, so Melanie went crazy with them. Our friends Scott and Jen joined us and our original plan was to take two cars: me in the Buick with Riley his girlfriend, and Melanie in the Lincoln with Scott and Jen. Unfortunately, Riley's girlfriend canceled and Riley didn't feel like going, so four of us piled into the Lincoln and hit the road. Oh, and Melanie did all the driving.

 

A pretty good array of cars, from a 1917 Winton

to a quartet of 1941 Cadillacs.

 

Melanie enjoying the baby goats. She really wanted

to bring home the little spotted guy, whose name

is Philip.

 

Melanie was thrilled to drive her first tour.

Car didn't hassle her at all.

 

Chasing Dave Heinrichs' 1917 Winton

in the rain.

 

Comparing V12s with the Pierce-Arrow.

 

No issues to report, even though it was 86 degrees. A little rain along the way, but no big deal. Car inched up to 190 degrees sitting in traffic going into a farmer's market, but it didn't get fussy. However, the idle kept creeping up so I need to resolve that this week. Even Scott, a NASA engineer, was perplexed by the self-tightening screw. He speculated that it was some harmonic in the engine that hit the screw at just the right frequency. Maybe...

 

Thursday we leave for Michigan and the annual Lincoln Homecoming at Hickory Corners and the Gilmore Museum. We'll be trailering the Lincoln for that one.

 

 

[MCHinson]

Just a thought... The harmonic theory is probably as likely an explanation as anything else that I can think of. Can you swap out the screw with a longer screw with the same threads? I would assume that a different length screw would not resonate at the same frequency, and hopefully stop the self-tightening issue.

[Stude Light]

4 hours ago, Matt Harwood said:

However, the idle kept creeping up so I need to resolve that this week.

I use Loctite bearing retaining compound for issues like this. Unlike thread locker which sometimes is too much locking for small screws that you occasionally want to adjust, it provides more of a stiff, almost gummy, feel....kind of like a nylok nut would feel like. Just a thought. 

[EmTee]

Is there a jam nut on the throttle screw?  If not, is there room to add one?

[Matt Harwood]

1 hour ago, EmTee said:

Is there a jam nut on the throttle screw?  If not, is there room to add one?

That's my current plan.

[Terry Harper]

Matt,

I can't even begin to tell you how great it is to see you and Melanie and your son finally enjoying this wonderful car. I think many of us have felt the same ups and downs you have during your journey, some of us would have walked away long ago. But you stuck to the path. Thank you for sticking with it and providing the story with a happy ending. 

 

Our mortal existence is indeed full of trials and tribulations. How we overcome them and how we teach our children to overcome them is all part of it. What a wonderful example of perseverance and determination for your son. I know at some point down the road (as we all do) he will be faced with his own trials and I am sure, he will look back at the saga of "The Car Which Shall Not Be Named" and know that since his Dad overcame that trial, he can overcome his as well.

[West Peterson]

18 hours ago, Matt Harwood said:

 

Melanie was thrilled to drive her first tour.

Car didn't hassle her at all.

 

I suspect tennis elbow. I've had a problem with that for three years now!!! 

[Matt Harwood]

I took @EmTee's advice and wrapped a paper towel around the water pump shaft, then soaked it in CLR. I'll let it sit overnight and see what happens.

 

 

Then I removed the idle screw, found a nut that would fit, and screwed it back into place. I fired the engine and adjusted the idle, then locked it into place with the lock nut. A small ignition wrench worked perfectly, so I stashed it in the glove box with my screwdriver for adjustments in the future. It's not quite as easy as just turning the screw, but it's certainly not difficult. As a bonus, the spring is putting quite a bit more pressure on the screw head with the nut in place. It isn't going to move anymore. I'll have to put a final adjustment on it with the engine warm, but it's pretty good for now.

 

 

 

 

[West Peterson]

Perhaps I'm feeble, but how does the nut "lock" the screw in place? It seems to me that the extra nut only acts as a spacer to make the spring create more tension (which in itself may be the solution). What prevents you from turning the screw without the wrench?

[Roger Zimmermann]

41 minutes ago, West Peterson said:

Perhaps I'm feeble, but how does the nut "lock" the screw in place? It seems to me that the extra nut only acts as a spacer to make the spring create more tension (which in itself may be the solution). What prevents you from turning the screw without the wrench?

As the screw it treaded into the lever, the locked nut can prevent any movement from the screw, either from the spring side or the other one. As first I thought that you are right and two nuts are needed, but the lever is acting like a nut...

[Matt Harwood]

53 minutes ago, West Peterson said:

Perhaps I'm feeble, but how does the nut "lock" the screw in place? It seems to me that the extra nut only acts as a spacer to make the spring create more tension (which in itself may be the solution). What prevents you from turning the screw without the wrench?

 

You tighten the jam nut against the mounting flange once the screw is where you want it. That pressure of the tightened nut against the screw threads is sufficient to keep the screw itself from turning. It actually holds much better than you'd expect--it'll never move.

[West Peterson]

Okay. I get it. The nut is squeezing -- putting pressure on the threads.

[JV Puleo]

I'd be inclined to remove the spring altogether and just use the jam-nut. With the extra nut in place it isn't doing anything and may be in the way for setting the idle.

Edited August 9, 2023 by JV Puleo (see edit history)

[Matt Harwood]

13 hours ago, JV Puleo said:

I'd be inclined to remove the spring altogether and just use the jam-nut. With the extra nut in place it isn't doing anything and may be in the way for setting the idle.

I thought about that, but it's a unique spring and I figured on the screw was the safest possible place I could store it.

[pfloro]

Matt,

 

Considering engine vibration, do you think there is value in adding an internal tooth star washer between the lock nut and the casting...?

This may be overkill but the nut (and the screw) would certainly stay tight.

 

Paul

[Matt Harwood]

On our way to Hickory Corners and the Lincoln National Homecoming. Hope the weather holds!

 

[keiser31]

39 minutes ago, Matt Harwood said:

On our way to Hickory Corners and the Lincoln National Homecoming. Hope the weather holds!

 

Be safe and have a blast!

[Smartin]

Do you need another opinion on your jam nut, or do you have enough? 🤣🤣  Sorry, I had to.

 

Jam nut for the win!!

[KVP]

Looking forward to attending the Gilmore show and laying eyes on the Lincoln.  

[edinmass]

Matt……Imsuremhooe you have a weight distributing hitch on that rig………in the photo it looks like you do not. For the mass of that Lincoln………..you’re on the edge of safety with the hitch…………..Ed

[Matt Harwood]

7 hours ago, edinmass said:

Matt……Imsuremhooe you have a weight distributing hitch on that rig………in the photo it looks like you do not. For the mass of that Lincoln………..you’re on the edge of safety with the hitch…………..Ed

That's a brand new Dodge 1-ton Cummins diesel. If that thing doesn't have the right hitch, I don't know what would. I even had to buy a special sleeve to reduce the size of the receiver to fit a standard hitch. It pulls effortlessly, really impressive.

[Matt Harwood]

Just a little drive around the Gilmore grounds.

 

 

 

[keiser31]

NICE shots!

[Matt Harwood]

 

[AB-Buff]

Looks like you’re having a great time! If you ever run into Ray Theriault, say Lynn James says hi!

[95Cardinal]

Thanks for the sweet ride-along video.

Congratulations, Matt; you made it!

Joe

[Matt Harwood]

More shots from the Lincoln Homecoming. It rained pretty hard for about 45 minutes and then it was just perfect weather. About 50 cars, a good selection of L and K pre-war models, and a whole lot of Mark VIIIs. My personal favorite was Bill Wybenga's 1932 KB Judkins coupe (the gray one), a car I've known for many years. A great weekend at the Gilmore!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 12, 2023 by Matt Harwood (see edit history)

[Laughing Coyote]

I bet you're glad you sealed the roof.

[Matt Harwood]

4 minutes ago, Laughing Coyote said:

I bet you're glad you sealed the roof.

No leaks!