bc65riv Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 looks like 3 1965 gran sport rivs are coming up for auction at BJ on thursday havent even checked other days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bdad Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 BJ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pyntre Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 Barrett Jackson / Scottsdale Arizona Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr914 Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 Does any one think that the prices are beginning to wane? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Curran Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 Check out the white one with 13,500 original miles and look at the Gran Sport emblem on the rear panel. Looks like the emblem from the Skylark series. Either someone swapped it out or is it possible that it was installed at the factory this way by mistake? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelman Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 (edited) Here is a link to the page sorted by Riviera. You can click on the lot number and get a complete description of each car. Sorry, that didn't work like it was supposed to. Here is a link to each car. Their website sometimes does not work as intended. http://www.barrett-jackson.com/Events/Event/Details/1963-BUICK-RIVIERA-224753 http://www.barrett-jackson.com/Events/Event/Details/1965-BUICK-RIVIERA-GS-225989 http://www.barrett-jackson.com/Events/Event/Details/1964-BUICK-RIVIERA-224511 http://www.barrett-jackson.com/Events/Event/Details/1965-BUICK-RIVIERA-GS--226222 http://www.barrett-jackson.com/Events/Event/Details/1965-BUICK-RIVIERA-GRAN-SPORT-226171 http://www.barrett-jackson.com/Events/Event/Details/1979-BUICK-RIVIERA-S-TYPE-225027 Edited January 15, 2019 by steelman New links (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1965rivgs Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 Steve, thanks for posting these links. The turquoise/white `65 GS once belonged to a fellow named John Wright. The first time I saw this car was at the ROA annual meet in Indianapolis in `86 or `87. I probably still have "Polaroids" of this car from then. The car appears now, with all its idiosyncrasies, just as it did then except I dont remember the staining in the trunk. I usually attend one or two auction house events in Scottsdale every year but not this year. Wish I could be there to inspect this car now, with 30 years of additional knowledge and experience. The maroon GS is the same car which sold for well over $100K, maybe $115K, a few years ago in Scottsdale at a different auction house. That auction house usually presents high end exotics so it will be interesting to see how a much different audience embraces this car. Tom Mooney 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RivNut Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 2 hours ago, Pat Curran said: Check out the white one with 13,500 original miles and look at the Gran Sport emblem on the rear panel. Looks like the emblem from the Skylark series. Either someone swapped it out or is it possible that it was installed at the factory this way by mistake? Swapping emblems at the factory would be kind of hard since the Riviera was built in Flint, MI and the Skylarks were built at a different assembly plant. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Curran Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 8 minutes ago, RivNut said: Swapping emblems at the factory would be kind of hard since the Riviera was built in Flint, MI and the Skylarks were built at a different assembly plant. Good point Ed. I wonder if the mounting studs are in the same location for both emblems? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chasander Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 (edited) My 66 Skylark Gran Sport was built in Flint. In Fact Itook factory delivery. Edited January 15, 2019 by Chasander (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1965rivgs Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 (edited) 40 minutes ago, RivNut said: Swapping emblems at the factory would be kind of hard since the Riviera was built in Flint, MI and the Skylarks were built at a different assembly plant. Skylarks were also built at Flint assembly but on a different "line" than the big cars. Since the emblems on the Riviera and Skylark Gran Sports are the same in `65, the factory would have had to be "all out" on both lines to use an emblem slated to be used on the following year`s model as has been speculated in this case. Although I find that barely, remotely possible, I was told first hand by a fellow whose name was Ed Lutnik, that on several occasions he went to R and D to obtain parts being finalized for the next model year, to complete a build when the appropriate part was not available on the assembly line. This scenario would certainly apply with interchangeable parts such as emblems, wheels, etc.. Ed Lutnik was one of the most interesting Buick people I have ever met. He apprenticed in his uncle`s dealership in the Chicago area and went on to become the lead instructor in GM`s Hillside IL training center. Ed was called up to Flint on a supposedly temporary basis to sort out problems they were having with non-functional `63 Riviera models. I believe he stayed there devoted to the Riviera/big car assembly line through the `70 model year. Ed told me many stories about the problems and their causes and he acted as a liason between the assembly line, the repair area and upper level management. If you google his name I`m sure you will find a reference to the switch pitch feature in the Super Turbine 400. Ed held the patent for the switching mechanisms. Fascinating individual and the couple of days I spent with him will always be remembered. Tom Mooney Edited January 15, 2019 by 1965rivgs (see edit history) 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KongaMan Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 5 hours ago, dr914 said: Does any one think that the prices are beginning to wane? Makes sense. The traditional market (i.e. old white guys) is becoming actuarially ominous, and they are either getting their affairs in order or their heirs/estates are disposing of unwanted goods. IOW, a potential buyer has a greater selection from which to choose, which means more downward pressure on the price. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Curran Posted January 15, 2019 Share Posted January 15, 2019 3 hours ago, 1965rivgs said: Skylarks were also built at Flint assembly but on a different "line" than the big cars. Since the emblems on the Riviera and Skylark Gran Sports are the same in `65, the factory would have had to be "all out" on both lines to use an emblem slated to be used on the following year`s model as has been speculated in this case. Although I find that barely, remotely possible, I was told first hand by a fellow whose name was Ed Lutnik, that on several occasions he went to R and D to obtain parts being finalized for the next model year, to complete a build when the appropriate part was not available on the assembly line. This scenario would certainly apply with interchangeable parts such as emblems, wheels, etc.. Ed Lutnik was one of the most interesting Buick people I have ever met. He apprenticed in his uncle`s dealership in the Chicago area and went on to become the lead instructor in GM`s Hillside IL training center. Ed was called up to Flint on a supposedly temporary basis to sort out problems they were having with non-functional `63 Riviera models. I believe he stayed there devoted to the Riviera/big car assembly line through the `70 model year. Ed told me many stories about the problems and their causes and he acted as a liason between the assembly line, the repair area and upper level management. If you google his name I`m sure you will find a reference to the switch pitch feature in the Super Turbine 400. Ed held the patent for the switching mechanisms. Fascinating individual and the couple of days I spent with him will always be remembered. Tom Mooney Hi Tom, what is your professional opinion of the different emblem? A factory anamoly perhaps or an owner’s personal preference? I’m not knocking the car but my curiosity got the best of me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1965rivgs Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 11 minutes ago, Pat Curran said: Hi Tom, what is your professional opinion of the different emblem? A factory anamoly perhaps or an owner’s personal preference? I’m not knocking the car but my curiosity got the best of me. Hi Pat, I dont know that there is such a thing as a profesional opinion regarding something like this. If you asked me if I thought it was possible I would answer yes, but the more evidence that could be gathered (for instance if this car was at the end of the production run) the better or worse the chances. If you asked me if I thought it was likely, I would answer no. Having stated the above and regarding the use of emblems at Buick in the mid sixties...we all know there were two versions of the Riviera Gran Sport scripts in `65. Most folks dont know that there were also 2 versions of the Skylark Gran Sport grille emblems in `65. In `66 the Wildcat started the model year with a cursive style "Wildcat" script and changed over during the model run to block letters. I have documented a handful of `66 Wildcats which have cursive scripts on the 1/4 panels and block letters on the trunk lid! Is it possible someone changed the trunk lid? Yes, but I started watching for this anomoly when an original owner swore to me that is the way his car was delivered as new. So, there was quite a bit of swapping around of branding going on in the mid sixties.... Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lrlforfun Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 3 hours ago, KongaMan said: Makes sense. The traditional market (i.e. old white guys) is becoming actually ominous, and they are either getting their affairs in order or their heirs/estates are disposing of unwanted goods. IOW, a potential buyer has a greater selection from which to choose, which means more downward pressure on the price. OK Riviera People: Chip's about got it. And painful it is. I'm 67 and I'm seein' old white guys, the people I've known, droppin' like flies. And these folks? The car people who loved the cars we love. The market has become very limited for many many cars. I think there are a few things temporary holding up prices.... but eventually they will tumble due to supply increasing and demand decreasing due to the following......... The cost of restoration is through the roof and the number of people who work on these cars has been dramatically dwindling for quite some time They are still popular for now but Father Time is feverishly working on it's admirers and his shadow gets it all The fed has a 10 year T-Bill at 2 3/4% for a while and it's going up not down. There are many other things that are in competition for investment So there you have it. So in the meantime....enjoy the ride. Mitch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bodayguy Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 I think prices have been pretty good recently! But I can’t remember a Barrett Jackson with that many first gen Rivs before so yeah we could have more cars for sale now. That might not be a bad thing ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jframe Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 The white 63 just went for 41k, not bad money for a 63, and a nicely done one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pyntre Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pyntre Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pyntre Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pyntre Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Saw one 64 too for sale , but didn’t get a picture of it 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjp69 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 22 hours ago, Pat Curran said: Check out the white one with 13,500 original miles and look at the Gran Sport emblem on the rear panel. Looks like the emblem from the Skylark series. Either someone swapped it out or is it possible that it was installed at the factory this way by mistake? Here are some "before" pics of the white one, when it sold in June 2014 for $23,100. http://www.2040-cars.com/Buick/Riviera/1965-buick-riviera-gs-425-dual-quad-13-009-original-miles--954986/ 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seafoam65 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 My car was starting to look like the pics of the white one 43 years ago which resulted in the repaint in lacquer that the car has now. Flint put about one coat of paint on these cars when they were built. My Dad's 65 he bought new was rusting through the paint in spots when it was five years old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1965rivgs Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 21 minutes ago, cjp69 said: Here are some "before" pics of the white one, when it sold in June 2014 for $23,100. http://www.2040-cars.com/Buick/Riviera/1965-buick-riviera-gs-425-dual-quad-13-009-original-miles--954986/ Wish I could read the characters on the POP...that would reveal much Tom Mooney 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Curran Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 I like the before pics of this car. Another interesting change is the spare washer fluid bottle is mounted on the drivers side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JZRIV Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 This will be quite interesting to see what the 3 65 GS cars sell for. Have to wonder if having 3 cars all pretty nice in same auction will water down the bidding some. It will also be interesting to see if there is any evidence of color drastically affecting value. Agree with jframe that white 63 going for $41k sold well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeJS Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Good day. Sorry, I don't know all the slight variations by year, but I always thought that the rear speaker grille in the 63s had the Riviera script and that the stylized R came in '64... (??) Nonetheless, nice to see a few of these first gens on the block for a change... Later, Mike Swick Edmonton, AB ---- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RivNut Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 (edited) You are correct on the emblem on the rear speaker grills. Should be the same for the door panels and the steering wheel. Did you see a picture on this thread that shows something different or are you just asking a question? Just curious as I couldn't find a picture of the interior of the '63, Edited January 16, 2019 by RivNut (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeJS Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Ah, crap , sorry, the white one was a 65, I think jframe called it a '63 and I just looked at the pics without thinking... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelman Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 The white 63 is the only one sold so far. The three 65s all will sell on Thursday, 1/17. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kreed Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 This will be interesting tomorrow ! The burgundy mist GS is the same car that sold at Gooding in 2015 for $110 K + $11 buyers premium = $121 K and was discussed thoroughly on this Forum at the time . I bought a $200 paddle to bid on it and never got my paddle off my lap as two guys in front of me raised their paddles and never put them down until it hit $110 K . Check out the pics from then (which I saved ) and now. First two are from 2019 BJ and second three are Gooding 2015 . Different battery but rest looks identical to me .This will test the market . KReed ROA 14549 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arnulfo de l.a. Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 I agree this will be interesting. My 65 gs has the same factory color combo. Only mine was painted over by previous owner with a cheap earl shieb red paint job which it still has today. I will be very surprised if the owner does not lose money Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bodayguy Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 So if you bought a 65 GS, could you choose whether you wanted a black console or the wood veneer? I thought they were supposed to be all black. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1965rivgs Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 7 hours ago, kreed said: This will be interesting tomorrow ! The burgundy mist GS is the same car that sold at Gooding in 2015 for $110 K + $11 buyers premium = $121 K and was discussed thoroughly on this Forum at the time . I bought a $200 paddle to bid on it and never got my paddle off my lap as two guys in front of me raised their paddles and never put them down until it hit $110 K . Check out the pics from then (which I saved ) and now. First two are from 2019 BJ and second three are Gooding 2015 . Different battery but rest looks identical to me .This will test the market . KReed ROA 14549 Hi Ken, I was in Scottsdale when this car went thru Gooding but we attended a different auction house. Correct me if I am wrong but as I recall almost every car, if not EVERY car, was a high end exotic at that auction except for this Riv. This was probably the cheapest car on property, right? BJ is a much different venue and audience, still alot of money being thrown around but for different reasoning, will be interesting.... But considering the radical difference in audience I`m not so sure this will be a test of the market, not really apples for apples in terms of the audience. Should be fun! Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat Curran Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 5 hours ago, bodayguy said: So if you bought a 65 GS, could you choose whether you wanted a black console or the wood veneer? I thought they were supposed to be all black. All consoles in 65 had the wood veneer, GS or not as well as standard or deluxe interior. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seafoam65 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Wow, the maroon car has a Stant Lever-cap which is known for hitting and denting the sheet metal on the hood! Hello McFly! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kreed Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 3 hours ago, 1965rivgs said: Hi Ken, I was in Scottsdale when this car went thru Gooding but we attended a different auction house. Correct me if I am wrong but as I recall almost every car, if not EVERY car, was a high end exotic at that auction except for this Riv. This was probably the cheapest car on property, right? BJ is a much different venue and audience, still alot of money being thrown around but for different reasoning, will be interesting.... But considering the radical difference in audience I`m not so sure this will be a test of the market, not really apples for apples in terms of the audience. Should be fun! Tom Hi Tom - you are right about the 65 GS being the "cheapest " car on the auction block at Gooding that day - that's the reason I went but.... The big dollars were in the room and the guy that bought it was NOT going to be outbid as he never took his paddle down! It went up in $5,000 increments and literally was sold in less than a minute . I took my $200 bidding paddle home as a souvenir 😎. Today's auction will , I believe, give us a little better idea of the market ( although clearly there will be plenty of big bucks in the room today too) . We'll see . KReed ROA 14549 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelman Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 Interesting that he absolutely had to have it, and it is back on the block two years later. And at a different auction, not back with Gooding. Great car. Love the colors. But he will not match the money from two years ago at Barrett-Jackson this year. I might be surprised, but not really the right crowd for this car there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr914 Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 and the white one looks like someone painted the finned valve covers! Would love to buy that white one though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1965rivgs Posted January 17, 2019 Share Posted January 17, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, kreed said: Hi Tom - you are right about the 65 GS being the "cheapest " car on the auction block at Gooding that day - that's the reason I went but.... The big dollars were in the room and the guy that bought it was NOT going to be outbid as he never took his paddle down! It went up in $5,000 increments and literally was sold in less than a minute . I took my $200 bidding paddle home as a souvenir 😎. Today's auction will , I believe, give us a little better idea of the market ( although clearly there will be plenty of big bucks in the room today too) . We'll see . KReed ROA 14549 Hi Ken, I think I misunderstood your original comment as being a comparison of the 2015 market versus today`s. If you were referring to just the present market then I agree. I think the pool of buyers at BJ, considerate of The Big Three`s offering AND muscle cars, is better suited than Gooding to present an accurate big stage auction house value on the cars. If I had my preference regarding real world values, I`d prefer to see these cars go through Russo and Steele, where there are more bargain hunters which would be more typical of the buying pool in general. Tom Edited January 17, 2019 by 1965rivgs (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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