Chrome questions

[zipdang]

FIrst question: Has anyone used Jon Wright's CustomChrome Plating in Grafton, OH? I'm considering using them for the rechroming work on my 59 Fiat.

 

Second question: Trivalent vs. Hexavalent chrome. Anything I should know about this? What I've learned via the internet (so I know it's true) is that the trivalent is much better environmentally. What about appearance and durability?

 

Thanks!

[Tim Wolfe]

I used D&G Custom Chrome in Cincinnati and was pleased with price and work. You can send them a picture and they will give you a price by email.

Brightworks in Piqua, Ohio does excellent work, but are high dollar and slow turn around. Had a quote for a rear view mirror from them for $700!!! DG Chrome did it for $50 in show chrome.  You could visit Wright's Chrome to check it out.

[13CADDY]

that's a buyer beware market--I can tell you,  you get what you pay--I'v heard pros & cons about each--i'd talk to as many people that you can & get all opinions, then make your decision--I just finished a situation where the plater told me that's the best they could do & i'd have to live with it--so good luck--Tom

[Matt Harwood]

You can't go wrong with Jon Wright, first rate work. It's expensive, but you won't have any complaints about the finished product. In chrome, you always get what you pay for.

 

As far as what type to use, I'd leave that to your plater. He has to do the work, he has to stand behind it, let him do what works best for him.

[bob staehle]

X2 on Jon Wright.

  I took some parts to him, they took pix of them, quoted me a price on the spot. He stands behind his work. Bill was as quoted.

[Bloo]

Hexavalent is the stuff used back in the day. It has that blusih color we all expect. Trivalent tends to be yellower, but the platers can control color to some extent. I have no Idea about durability. Any nice chrome job is going to be expensive today.

[mtnchev]

Zipdang:

I agree with all the above answers - get quotes from a few sources, check the platers reputation and what the other forum member say, and compare prices including shipping.  I wouldn't worry about hexavalent vs. triavalent, my understanding is that most of the platers are going to trivalent because hexavalent is more active chemically than trivalent, making it harder to remove from the waste water, thus harder to keep on the right side of the EPA and state regulations.  Trivalent plates a little slower, taking more time to reach the desired thickness.

Larry

[zipdang]

Thank you for all the repies. Glad to hear that Jon Wright's place is worth looking into. I sent them a photo and they called me back quickly and spent quite a bit of time on the phone answering my questions. I'm heading up there on Monday the 12th to take the nickel tour (no pun intended) and show them my parts. The price they quoted me was much less than an outfit out of Erie, PA, but I don't know enough about it to know if I was comparing apples to apples.

 

Here are the parts I'm currently working on. When these are done, and I'm happy, the bumpers and the grill will be next. The photo shows the left side of the car, I'm also doing the mirror image of these parts as well.

 

 

[Spinneyhill]

The price you pay is generally controlled by the amount of preparation required (polishing, copper plating, more polishing, more copper etc), as well as how fussy they are in keeping their plating vats clean and whether they do triple plating (copper, nickel then chrome). Triple plating has best durability because nickel and chrome plating are porous, while copper is not or at least is very much less so.

 

If there are any pits that can't be polished out, the usual way to fix it is to copper plate it then polish the Cu. off. This is done as often as needed to fill the pits with copper. This is very labour intensive and hence costly. An alternative is to copper plate then fill with a platable solder.  For die-cast items, this solder must be low melting point as well.

 

Before plating it must be a pretty much mirror finish. The more you can do the less you will pay.

 

 

[Durant Mike]

Going through this right now. Took detailed pictures of my 1928 Durant Radiator surround.  Sent pictures to several major platers advertised in Hemmings Classic car and AACA magazine as well as a couple local.  Prices are all over the place.  From $1,500 to $4,000, ouch!  Of course they all add the disclaimer that it's only an estimate until they have the unit to see.  So what are you supposed to do, send the unit to each place and then get it back if you don't like the estimate.  That gets costly.  I have a local shop that does chrome work, mostly for hot rods, but has done a couple of classic cars and plated my allemite fittings for me. He's in the middle.  So how do you really know who to pick that won't put the screws to you?

[edinmass]

Mike, listen carefully to what is being said. Good Chrome is expensive. Great Chrome is 100,000 dollars for Chrome on a 1930’s Pebble Beach car is common.  Explain to the shop what you are looking for, perfection, factory new condition, a few visiable flaws but nice, or just make it shiny. Chrome in not expensive, the LABOR to file and fit parts is, it very difficult work, cleaning, repairing, soldering, fileing, buffing, racking, it all takes time. Talk to some local collectors, they will help steer you in the right direction. It’s impossible to restore ANY car and come out ahead in the money department. Don’t even try. I understand looking for value, but remember the only thing worse than paying for the Chrome, is finding replacment parts ruined by the plater. Good luck. Ed

Edited February 10, 2018 by edinmass (see edit history)

[Matt Harwood]

Also remember that once it's done, it's done. If you get a sub-standard job, your choices are to live with it, find a new part, or send it to someone even more expensive to try to fix it and spend the money all over again. We had one car where all the trim on it was re-plated, but they just plated over all the pits and other defects and it looked HORRIBLE. It was far worse than leaving it alone because it said, loud and clear, "I was too cheap to pay for good chrome!" I won't say the car was ruined because it was a decent car, but it really hurt the look and the value and was embarrassing to drive. He probably paid several thousand dollars for that job, too, and it was just awful to see. The next owner was planning on having it re-done so it was OK, but I bet the parts lost a lot of definition and never looked quite right. We had to discount the car more than the cost of a good chrome job to get it sold, so doing it cheaply didn't even make economic sense in the end.

 

You have one chance to get it right. I know a few thousand bucks is a lot of money, but right is right and wrong is wrong and you're paying big money either way. May as well get it right the first time, no?

 

This hood ornament is technically wearing fresh chrome, but it still looks dreadful. This is what a cut-rate job looks like, and even cut-rate jobs are expensive. Would you put this on your car?

 

 

Mike, if you're in Florida, I would recommend Space Coast Plating. Again, not cheap, but you will get a good result.

Edited February 10, 2018 by Matt Harwood (see edit history)

[RiKi5156B]

I’ve had a good relationship with Warren at JBs plating in Portland Oregon. I started going to him in the middle seventies for a lot of chrome work on a t bucket show,street rod and a 64 Corvette. Many decades later we are both still alive,lots of different projects done and I still love the high quality and near half price of any of the other shops around the NW.My current 40 Buick was quoted at around 6K from the NW shops and he did it for 2800. Good guy.

 

 

[Durant Mike]

Hey Ed, I understand what your saying but I also know that you always need to get bids and that some shops charge whatever they think the customer can pay.  I stated I wanted show chrome since I was going to put my car in for AACA judging, and except for the local chromers all these other companies have had Pebble Beach cars according to them. Even the local chromer had AACA Grand National Award cars.  You talk to a dozen people and they all have there opinion on who is the best chrome shop.  No matter what it's like shooting a bullet in the dark. Don't know what your going to hit.  I guess that's the way it is.  Just like a friend of mine just got bids to remove an old Oak tree from his yard, about 35 feet tall. Bids ran from $350 to $3,000.  Some professional tree companies and others just some Joe who gets the job done.  It's not much different than the restoration companies. Some do $150,000 jobs on cars "Pebble Beach Quality" and some smaller shops will do just as good a job and win "Pebble Beach" and charge 50% less.   I think many like to pay the $100,000 chrome jobs just to be able to say they paid that, much the the Barrett Jackson auctions.  Never turned a wrench, didn't restore anything but likes to brag around the country club that he paid $200,000 for that mustang.  It's a very frustrating part of the restoration process trying to decide who to use that give you a good quality product for a fair price.

[Bloo]

In my recent experience, you can't really buy cheaper but you can buy crappier. Find some person who has had work done recently and go look at the chrome in person. Repeat until you see some that looks really nice. Use that shop.

 

It would also pay to ask the person who had the chrome done if the shop delivered the goods in close to the time promised. Chrome work is mostly prep work and is labor intensive. Like other labor intensive jobs (bodywork, etc.) things can drag. There is a line at every shop, and they wont start on your parts tomorrow afternoon. As the shop will have your parts for a fairly long period, it is good to know what to expect.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 11, 2018 by Bloo (see edit history)

[Matt Harwood]

Cheap, well-done, or fast. Pick two. 

 

Mike, in your tree analogy, would you assume that the $350 guy would do as good a job as the $3000 guy? Or might you have to worry about a tree on your house? My neighbor had a giant oak in his back yard that was dead and leaning precariously towards my carriage house. We have a good relationship and I just asked him to take it down. After he got a few quotes, he and his father-in-law decided to take it down with a rented cherry picker and chain saws. They obviously didn't know what they were doing--I don't know what happened or how it happened, but the cherry picker was on its side and the father-in-law had a broken wrist. The tree remained mostly standing until they paid a real company to come in and finish the job. Cheap FTL.

 

You see where I'm going with this. Expensive chrome isn't a rip-off and cheap chrome isn't necessarily a bargain. Shopping price is probably a mistake. There's good advice above suggesting that you find a car with nice chrome and talk to the owner and see who did the work. Referrals will improve your chances of getting good work. But you should plan on it being eye-wateringly expensive no matter who you choose...

[Bloo]

As Durant Mike pointed out, you don't get the real estimate until they see it. That would involve shipping 2 ways. It is not only expensive, but risks losing or damaging irreplaceable parts, and just for an estimate.

 

Last year I hauled a couple of bundles of chrome to shops for another restorer. The first bunch came back horrible looking, with scratches visible under the plating. A few pieces were already peeling.

 

I hauled another similar pile to a different shop, and though he did not request pebble beach quality, what he got back did look that good. The difference between the two is astounding.

 

Looking a the two piles unwrapped on the table, it looks like about the same square footage. The price was about the same, slightly more for the second shop, but really not enough to mention. Was it really about the same cost? I think so but I don't know, and there is no way to really compare, since they weren't the same parts, and also much of the labor is restoration of the parts. If you were restoring multiple copies of the same model car, you would have a better idea, but you still wouldn't really know, because the  condition of the parts plays such a role. The condition wont be the same even if you send identical parts.

 

Part of that first pile has already been redone. Likely more of it will need to be redone.

 

Another thing to consider is that sometimes detail is lost during polishing. The plater has to get the pits out, Will he add a bunch of copper and sand that back down? Or, will he just sand to the bottom of the pits? Maybe he will do some combination of the two? If you lose detail on a casting you wont get it back in a redo.

 

Find another restorer with parts you can hold in your hand that look terrific, and I don't mean the samples laying on the desk at the chrome shop. I mean something another restorer paid for. When you see something you like, use that shop. IMHO any potential savings from price shopping will get eaten up in shipping and the re-do at the shop you should have gone to in the first place.

 

Good luck!

 

 

[cricket-ny]

I have used the outfit in Erie Pa. I can attest to their excellent quality and workmanship, but as you already know, not cheap.

[zipdang]

Again, thanks for all the replies. I'm off to Grafton, OH tomorrow and I'll be curious to see how the quote may change with the parts in hand. They have told me that they're scheduling into May right now which is OK with me since I don't fuss in the garage when it's cold. If I had a blank check, I'd probably take the trip to Erie to check them out, but I simply don't have the budget for them.

[John348]

Remember, you never want to touch these vent window frames ever again once they are done and installed. It is not a simple chrome part that unbolts and you can just rechrome it again if you are not happy or the quality does not last. Those windows frames were never meant to come apart  that is why they were riveted. Check the guarantee of the work, any the timeline of that work. I had a set of bumpers done by Librandi's in Harrisburg PA the quality was excellent and they are guaranteed for as long as I own the car, they also do a lot of new chrome work for Harley Davidson. Like the others pointed out you get what you pay for just make sure of it!  

[29 franklin]

I have also used the shop in Erie. Beautiful work but you will pay for it. To me it is worth it . One and done  

[ex98thdrill]

It's funny that I'm reading this and just the other night I was talking to Matt Hinson about the same thing in Philly.

 

I will reiterate the same thing the others have said....

 

You get what you pay for.

 

I will tell you the same thing I've told Matt and everyone else. 

 

1.  If you're going to keep the car, do it once, do it right, and get it done.

2.  If you're not planning to keep the car, do it cheap and get rid of it.

 

My father and I have done several restorations and we've dealt with several platers.  We finally found one plater that we like, so now that's all we use.

 

The plater that we use is Cambridge Chrome up the other side of Toronto, Canada.

 

The Candians can process chrome with chemicals that the EPA has banned and I feel that you get a better job.  You can drop your chrome off in Buffalo, New York, or you can catch him in the Red Field over by the stadium on Hershey week, or you can ship the chrome directly to Canada.

 

The next time you're at an AACA meet and you see a car with Canadian license plates, ask them who did their chrome.  We've been using Cambridge for the last 15 years, we've never had a problem and we swear by them.  Those guys can also do stainless and nickel as well.

 

I'm not going to knock anyone else's product, but I will tell you this, if you don't use Cambridge, you most likely won't get better chrome anyplace else.

[poci1957]

15 hours ago, John348 said:

I had a set of bumpers done by Librandi's in Harrisburg PA the quality was excellent and they are guaranteed for as long as I own the car, they also do a lot of new chrome work for Harley Davidson.

 

I used them too and was very satisfied--still looks fantastic after 15 years, everything fit right, all the holes were in the right place, etc.  These are experienced old car people (active AACA members) and will not give you something like Matt Harwood's Packard hood ornament above and then play dumb about the quality.  They were not fast but that was OK with me, Todd C

[zipdang]

I had a nice day-trip up to Grafton, Ohio to check out Jon Wright's place. Remember, I really have no firsthand experience with this but I was impressed with the place. First thing I noticed was a well-organized, VERY clean shop with quite a few people at work. Zach showed me around, explaining all of the steps, and showing me numerous parts of all types in various stages of the process. He gave the parts I brought with me a good look and explained what would be done with each. Some of these Fiat parts have the maker and part number visible once installed and he assured me that these markings would not be lost in the rechroming. As you might have guessed, I left my batch of parts with them and was told they should have them done by mid May. As to the cost, they certainly weren't the cheapest place but more realistic for my wallet than others. Come May, I'll let you know how it all turns out.

[Buffalowed Bill]

I completely agree with whats been said. Two things that I would like to add.

1) Plating is only as good as the polisher. The reputation of the company is dependent on his work. I have seen a good company go down hill, when they lost their polisher. If need be, get to know him personally. Make sure that you are familiar with his work, and make sure he knows how much you respect him for his work. A tip can't hurt, either.

 

2) Make sure that your shop is willing to guarantee their work. If they decline to guarantee, walk away, you are in the wrong place! 

  

[Restorer32]

When customers complain about the cost of plating I tell them "Just be happy that you can get it done at any price". I know enough about plating to know that it is a business I would never want to be in.

[ex98thdrill]

I wonder how much longer these platers will be around before someone closes them down. 

 

Today you can get things powder coated where they have a chrome finish.  I've never seen it and if I did I didn't know it was powder coat. 

 

Several years ago NASCAR banned chrome rims on the race cars because they had issues with the wheel weights not sticking to the rims.  A couple of years ago (it might've been 10 years) the chrome rims came back, but this time they were a chrome powder coat.  I never saw what they look like up close so it's too hard for me to say if it's good or bad.

 

Aside from the NASCAR boys, I've never known anyone to go that route.  If you check with most vendors that do powder coat, they have several colors to choose from, even a chrome type finish.

[zipdang]

Some of the alternatives mentioned here reminded me of Dad and I trying to dress up that big-toothed grill of a 1951 DeSoto Custom with a GENUINE chrome kit from JC Whitney. We did enjoy just how worthless it was, though! If nothing else, it did give those teeth a uniform color -  a flat, brushed aluminum look...

[Bleach]

On 2/11/2018 at 10:45 AM, RiKi5156B said:

I’ve had a good relationship with Warren at JBs plating in Portland Oregon. I started going to him in the middle seventies for a lot of chrome work on a t bucket show,street rod and a 64 Corvette. Many decades later we are both still alive,lots of different projects done and I still love the high quality and near half price of any of the other shops around the NW.My current 40 Buick was quoted at around 6K from the NW shops and he did it for 2800. Good guy.

 

 

 

I live in the area and have not heard any good things about this guy. In fact as far as I know he doesn't even do his own work and that he sends it out elsewhere and has a horrific turn around time.

[bob staehle]

Zipdang,

I have been to GCP several times. Always take my wife with me, we stop at Nancy's Main St. Diner for lunch.  Good food, 50's 60's decor.

                                                      Bob

[RiKi5156B]

 He had his own shop years ago,but now he gathers a big shipment together, then calls around to the major shops in So Cal and gets a good price on the whole lot. The chrome work is excellent in my opinion. I’ve had a lot done over the years and only one minor issue which he took care of. No big deal. But every one has their own opinion. Zipdang asked and I shared my experience.

[zipdang]

I thank all for their opinions realizing all shops have their supporters and detractors. I'll follow up when I get my parts back. Thanks again!

[zipdang]

I went to pick up this first round of chroming and I am quite pleased! There were a couple smaller pieces that I didn’t accept (they wholeheartedly agreed on my opinion and said they should not have gone beyond their own inspector), but they’re redoing them tomorrow and said they will overnight them to me - no charge of course. May even have them by Friday!

 

Hopefully by this fall I'll have the remainder ready to go - bumpers, grille, miscellaneous other bits. So far I believe it has been money well spent.

 

Jon Wright's Custom Chrome Plating in Grafton, OH. I believe it's OK to post their name if its a compliment!

[zipdang]

Tomorrow it's off with my next (and hopefully last) batch of parts to be chromed. This time around it will be more expensive ? since it includes both bumpers and the pot-metal grille along with various other parts. I've been reading with interest the ongoing thread elsewhere about chrome alternatives, hoping to find a less expensive but acceptable alternative. Some interesting ideas but I'm afraid I just wouldn't be satisfied – especially since the chrome is so visible and takes such abuse (bumpers, etc.). Ah well, this will drain the budget and put the interior further down the road, but it will be worth it.

 

 

[zipdang]

I picked up my chrome a while back and just forgot to post the photos. Jon Wright's Custom Chrome Plating in Grafton, OH did a great job. I was particularly please with the job they did on my pitted pot-metal grille halves. These required a great bit of work including some "reattaching" of one of the mounts.