AJ in the Great Race

[edinmass]

4 minutes ago, pkhammer said:

  The odds of Ed's participation may depend on how much Crown Royal is promised.

Maybe they should put the distillery as a stop on the race……I’ll be there with certainty. And I will probably suffer a big deduction for arriving early on that leg……..😏

[SC38dls]

Let’s start guessing on how many bottles of CR it will take to be his navigator in the PA. I’ll bid three bottles to start. 
dave s 

[edinmass]

4 minutes ago, SC38dls said:

Let’s start guessing on how many bottles of CR it will take to be his navigator in the PA. I’ll bid three bottles to start. 
dave s 

Hell, three wouldn’t get me to cross the street! 
 

I would consider doing the race after talking to AJ…………so an old dog can learn new tricks. Any challenge in a pre war car is of intrest to me. Lord knows I need to expand my horizons………..I’m turning into one of those old curmudgeons I would meet as a fifteen year old kid at the shows back in the early 80’s. Talk about coming full circle. 

Edited June 28, 2022 by edinmass (see edit history)

[SC38dls]

1 minute ago, edinmass said:

Hell, three wouldn’t get me to cross the street! 
 

I would consider doing the race after talking to AJ…………so an old dog can learn new tricks. Any challenge in a pre war car is of intrest to me. Lord knows I need to expand my horizons………..I’m turning into one of those old curmudgeons I would meet as a fifteen year old kid at the shows back in the early 80’s. Talk about coming full circle. 

Did I say BOTTLES I meant cases! 
dave s 

[pkhammer]

55 minutes ago, edinmass said:

Hell, three wouldn’t get me to cross the street! 
 

I would consider doing the race after talking to AJ…………so an old dog can learn new tricks. Any challenge in a pre war car is of intrest to me. Lord knows I need to expand my horizons………..I’m turning into one of those old curmudgeons I would meet as a fifteen year old kid at the shows back in the early 80’s. Talk about coming full circle. 

I'm still betting no amount of CR will get Ed to be the Navigator though. Driver/mechanic yes but navigator.......probably not.

[edinmass]

 

Hammer.........you hit the nail on the head!

[pkhammer]

1 minute ago, edinmass said:

 

Hammer.........you hit the nail on the head!

No pun intended, right?

[SC38dls]

My three cases would be for Ed to drive and I’ll be the guy that gets us lost as the navigator. I’m sure three cases would ensure Ed would have no idea we were lost at all. He would just be enjoying the drive and would have no idea about our score. 
dave s 

 

edit - I’m sure Ed would only consume this type of refreshment at the end of each day’s stage. He would never drive and drink as he is a responsible driver. 

Edited June 28, 2022 by SC38dls (see edit history)

[edinmass]

For the record, I only drink to make post war cars more interesting! 😎

[Paul Dobbin]

Glad to hear your side, Tom.   I was a driver the first 2 years and always wanted to fire my navigator.

Then as a Navigator, I wondered what my driver was doing.

The super low scores are crewed by two (2) Navigators and one does the driving too.

Your's was a really good showing for Rookies, especially the final stage.However we went back for an encore in 2001.   Then the car did the Peking to Paris Rally.  I'm cooked.

[alsancle]

I like driving in Tom’s 39 120 so much I thought I would take my dad out today and is 40 180. Just for comparisons sake.  I’m just impressed with how well sorted Tom’s car is. He can hear every little noise, and then roots it out till there are none. I need to leave my dad‘s car with him for a month or two.

 

The 180 is definitely more powerful, and the hood is probably a foot longer, but otherwise they are fairly similar.  I actually think Tom’s car is more comfortable inside, as it feels more spacious, and you’re sitting up a little bit higher. My dad‘s car has buckets (at least 1940 version of it) and you’re sitting closer to the floor. I’m sure the roofline must be a bit lower. Because it does feel more cramped, even though it’s a bigger car in theory.

Edited June 28, 2022 by alsancle (see edit history)

[George K]

6 hours ago, edinmass said:

Hell, three wouldn’t get me to cross the street! 
 

I would consider doing the race after talking to AJ…………so an old dog can learn new tricks. Any challenge in a pre war car is of intrest to me. Lord knows I need to expand my horizons………..I’m turning into one of those old curmudgeons I would meet as a fifteen year old kid at the shows back in the early 80’s. Talk about coming full circle. 

Nothing wrong with being a curmudgeon. Curmudgeons saved a lot of great cars when nobody else cared. Just be a good one.

[alsancle]

Costs.     It is not a cheap thing to participate in.   Probably less than bringing a car to Pebble, but a lot more than going on a tour.

 

1.  Car Prep - the car really needs to be dialed in.   No corners cut or they will bite you in the middle of nowhere.    5k?  10k?  20k?  Depends on the car.

 

2.  Registration,  - off the top of my head I think it is 7500 per car,  and then another 2500 if you want a corporate sponsor logo on the car.

 

3. Transport - some of the cars were driven to both RI and home from Fargo.  It is an advantage if you live near one of the end points.    Otherwise, you are trailering or paying the transporter.  Figure 2500 to get the car home  or 5K both ways.

 

4.  Hotels,  rates were 135-145 for most of the stays.  There might have been one expensive one mixed in.   You need a room from Wed night through the following week to Monday.  That is 12 nights.   If you are sharing a room between Navigator and driver then you can keep that to around 1500.

 

5.  Food.  You are getting fed 3 meals typically every day.  So food costs are minimal.

 

6.  Rally Clock & Speedo,  2k.

 

7.  Support team - if you have one you don't care about anything else I've said for costs.

 

So,  lets see...

 

10K  + 7500K  + 5K + 1500 + 2k = 26K for one race?

 

[edinmass]

Don’t forget the social costs of the trip…………both Tom & AJ are type A personality's……….a far throw from normal people like myself and the other forum members here. Ten days in a car under pressure to keep competitive……….NOT an easy task. I would certainly need to have a sit down with anyone before I could do ten days straight under pressure. Half of me wants to take my Pierce 12 on the race next year…….and the other half thinks I’m insane. The entire thing looks exhausting………I guess if I had a few months to screw my head on straight I could do it. At this point in my life I’m probably never going to take up the challenge of the great race……..if I had a 1915-1919 Pierce 48 I would jump at it……….anything newer just doesn’t seem entertaining enough. George T, can I borrow your car? And your gas card? 😎

Edited June 29, 2022 by edinmass (see edit history)

[wayne sheldon]

I bet George would be a great navigator! I think he has that solid type of mindset. I was thinking of joking that you and I could do a GAR type Run, but we would have to fight over who drove and who got us lost? Besides, SOMEONE has pay for the danged thing!

[Oldsmobile 83]

2 hours ago, edinmass said:

Don’t forget the social costs of the trip…………both Tom & AJ are type A personality's……….a far throw from normal people like myself and the other forum members here. Ten days in a car under pressure to keep competitive……….NOT an easy task. I would certainly need to have a sit down with anyone before I could do ten days straight under pressure. Half of me wants to take my Pierce 12 on the race next year…….and the other half thinks I’m insane. The entire thing looks exhausting………I guess if I had a few months to screw my head on straight I could do it. At this point in my life I’m probably never going to take up the challenge of the great race……..if I had a 1915-1919 Pierce 48 I would jump at it……….anything newer just doesn’t seem entertaining enough. George T, can I borrow your car? And your gas card? 😎

Ed,

Maybe you should consider entering the White in the Great Race?

Tim

[1937hd45]

Glad you guys had a good time! Now that we know the cost I wonder what a "Rookie Year" would cost at Pebble Beach for a restored ready to show mid range vehicle? 

 

Bob

[Dan Cluley]

3 hours ago, alsancle said:

So,  lets see...

 

10K  + 7500K  + 5K + 1500 + 2k = 26K for one race?

 

Just think how much cheaper it would be to do it again next year. You already have the special equipment, and I assume the car wouldn't need nearly as much to be ready.

[edinmass]

9 hours ago, Oldsmobile 83 said:

Ed,

Maybe you should consider entering the White in the Great Race?

Tim

I’m dumb, not crazy. 🥸

[Gunsmoke]

Events like these are like many extravagances in life, "if you have to ask what it costs, you cannot afford it". I suspect for most teams I see (based on what they are driving), cost was not a big concern, a couple of people spending 10K-15K each for a week vacation is not uncommon. For some others, the "bucket list" factor makes it worthwhile, especially for a serious old car guy. Then their are the "professionals", who have likely many named and unnamed sponsors, making them just hired guns and likely able to seriously compete for a share of the prize money. Personally, I would love to be a navigator or driver on such a run (I don't have a suitable car), and being retired of course time is not a factor. To sum up, I suspect 99% of members of AACA would love to do this once in their favorite ride, with their bestie, if cost was not a factor.  

[alsancle]

9 hours ago, Dan Cluley said:

Just think how much cheaper it would be to do it again next year. You already have the special equipment, and I assume the car wouldn't need nearly as much to be ready.

No matter what, it’s gonna cost me a lot more than it did this time. Tom paid for almost everything, and would not take any money from me, although admittedly I wasn’t exactly hitting him over the head with it.

 

This is the kind of friends I like to associate with, and then I keep Ed around to balance things out.

[58L-Y8]

AJ:

So, this was an all-expense paid trip to Fargo...?

Steve

[Paul Dobbin]

10 hours ago, Dan Cluley said:

Just think how much cheaper it would be to do it again next year. You already have the special equipment, and I assume the car wouldn't need nearly as much to be ready.

   Plus, you now know how it works.  You don't have to waste another week learning the basics.   My once in a lifetime adventure turned into a

11 race career and a lifetime identity.

Roy George  (Of Tonight Show fame)

 

 

[alsancle]

1 hour ago, 58L-Y8 said:

AJ:

So, this was an all-expense paid trip to Fargo...?

Steve

Not exactly Steve, I’m not gonna go add it up but I definitely had cost. There were flights and hotel rooms. But Tom covered the lions share, especially getting the car ready and entrance fees.

 

But, we now have a fully sorted Packard, with a few minor mechanical issues that need to be addressed. So in that sense it would be much cheaper next year.

 

I believe we need to submit a $2500 down payment by the end of the month, to guarantee our spot.   I do not understand or know the details, but there is  supposed to be a waiting list, and a line of people trying to get in.

[58L-Y8]

4 minutes ago, alsancle said:

Not exactly Steve, I’m not gonna go add it up but I definitely had cost. There were flights and hotel rooms. But Tom covered the lions share, especially getting the car ready and entrance fees.

Just me being a wiseacre... 

Think of it as the gameshow winner hears the show host ask:

"Johnny, Tell our winner the Grand Prize he's won! 

Yes, Monte:

"An all-expense-paid trip to beautiful, exciting Fargo, North Dakota!!!"

[alsancle]

Just now, 58L-Y8 said:

Just me being a wiseacre... 

Think of it as the gameshow winner hears the show host ask:

"Johnny, Tell our winner the Grand Prize he's won! 

Yes, Monte:

"An all-expense-paid trip to beautiful, exciting Fargo, North Dakota!!!"

I could live there. It’s actually a very nice small city. Everybody’s much nicer than what you get on the coasts. I’ve said for years Id moved to Ohio where my moms from , just to be around the people.

 

The coasts are basically populated by elitist pricks,

[58L-Y8]

Just now, alsancle said:

I could live there. It’s actually a very nice small city. Everybody’s much nicer than what you get on the coasts. I’ve said for years Id moved to Ohio where my moms from , just to be around the people.

 

The coasts are basically populated by elitist pricks,

Quite true!  The further you get inland, the nicer we get...!

[alsancle]

1 hour ago, 58L-Y8 said:

Quite true!  The further you get inland, the nicer we get...!

Steve, there are those that might say I’m an elitist prick too. But don’t believe them!

[alsancle]

The downside to Fargo is obvious. I asked my local friend there when winter came, he said generally in October, but the snow melted fast.

 

The upside is it almost everyone has a Morton building that is four times as big as their house.

[John Bloom]

17 hours ago, alsancle said:

Costs.     It is not a cheap thing to participate in.   Probably less than bringing a car to Pebble, but a lot more than going on a tour.

 

1.  Car Prep - the car really needs to be dialed in.   No corners cut or they will bite you in the middle of nowhere.    5k?  10k?  20k?  Depends on the car.

 

2.  Registration,  - off the top of my head I think it is 7500 per car,  and then another 2500 if you want a corporate sponsor logo on the car.

 

3. Transport - some of the cars were driven to both RI and home from Fargo.  It is an advantage if you live near one of the end points.    Otherwise, you are trailering or paying the transporter.  Figure 2500 to get the car home  or 5K both ways.

 

4.  Hotels,  rates were 135-145 for most of the stays.  There might have been one expensive one mixed in.   You need a room from Wed night through the following week to Monday.  That is 12 nights.   If you are sharing a room between Navigator and driver then you can keep that to around 1500.

 

5.  Food.  You are getting fed 3 meals typically every day.  So food costs are minimal.

 

6.  Rally Clock & Speedo,  2k.

 

7.  Support team - if you have one you don't care about anything else I've said for costs.

 

So,  lets see...

 

10K  + 7500K  + 5K + 1500 + 2k = 26K for one race?

 

My fear is that my two daughters will Someday be discussing what is the budget for their wedding, and my wife would share details like this and say “well your father spent this much money just to do a race in an old car so factor that in when you think what he should pay for the wedding”.

[pkhammer]

3 hours ago, alsancle said:

The coasts are basically populated by elitist pricks,

Hey! I resent that! I am not Elitist! 😂😆

[avantey]

Ed, if you want to try out the race you can sign up for one of the various regionals they do in the spring.  They are set up like the big race but only run two days so newbies can get a feel for it and practice to see how they and their car perform.  Had one in Rochester NY a few years ago where I was registrar. We had a man from Maine who was going to run the Race but his car was not ready for Rochester in May.  I ended up driving in my Avanti and he navigated. With neither of us having ever done any of it, it was entertaining to say the least! He got his Packard ready by July and raced but I do not remember how well he did. 

 

I would have to drive after watching Doug Sharp navigate, he is a walking computer and literally always adjusting his father's speed and time at speed for 14 days, very intense.   The regionals would let you try on the boots without buying them!  And it is a lot of fun with a great bunch of car crazies! 

Just my two cents,

[alsancle]

18 hours ago, John Bloom said:

My fear is that my two daughters will Someday be discussing what is the budget for their wedding, and my wife would share details like this and say “well your father spent this much money just to do a race in an old car so factor that in when you think what he should pay for the wedding”.

 

John,  I've got three kids,  when the time comes I'm going to write them each check and hand it to them.   If want to blow it on the wedding, fine, or if they want to buy a dilapidated old car with it even better!

 

My empirical observation over the years is that the bigger the wedding, the shorter the marriage.   And nobody get mad at me - there are exceptions to every rule - even the ones I make up out of thin air.

Edited June 30, 2022 by alsancle (see edit history)

[alsancle]

The car almost beat us home from the race. Typically shipping a car across most of the country involves a car traveling four times the distance of a straight line, as other cars are dropped off and picked up. This came straight home.

[John Bloom]

1 hour ago, alsancle said:

 

John,  I've got three kids,  when the time comes I'm going to write them each check and hand it to them.   If want to blow it on the wedding, fine, or if they want to buy a dilapidated old car with it even better!

 

My empirical observation over the years is that the bigger the wedding, the shorter the marriage.   And nobody get mad at me - there are exceptions to every rule - even the ones I make up out of thin air.

AJ, i think we see eye to eye on this.  I also plan on writing a check, they can choose how to use those funds........traditional wedding, small wedding with cash help get their marriage started, or justice of the peace and use the wedding money for a down payment on a house.  I will try to not show my "cards/preferences" and let them make the decisions.   I doubt my wife and my wedding cost 1,000 dollars.  In our little part of the world, lots has changed since 1986........  If our parents had given us that "cash gift and you choose", I wish I would have had the foresight to tell my wife, "lets get married at the justice of peace and buy a used Ferrari Dino in 1986.....

[JACK M]

I have four daughters.

The standing offer is an agreed upon check. Even if they elope. (And in my opinion that would be the best)

One down and the rest I think will be old maids. Like bachelor dad.

[trimacar]

1 hour ago, JACK M said:

I have four daughters.

The standing offer is an agreed upon check. Even if they elope. (And in my opinion that would be the best)

One down and the rest I think will be old maids. Like bachelor dad.

I have four daughters too…..twenty years ago, when they were in their twenties, my standing offer was $5000 check if they eloped, a wedding would be paid for if a reasonable sum, and once they hit 35 they were on their own.

 

Two daughters had very simple weddings which were not much more than the promised check. The other two are unmarried…..so I got off pretty easy…

 

Amazing the car got back so quickly!  Reminds me of the time I bought a car in Jackson Ms., flew down to help load it on a popular transporter’s truck.  Flew back home and helped him unload it!

[edinmass]

On 6/29/2022 at 8:54 AM, alsancle said:

This is the kind of friends I like to associate with, and then I keep Ed around to balance things out.

 

It's the alligator arms syndrome I'm suffering from........it's genetic. All of us French Canadians are cheap bastards. Besides, with my lack of education; I can hardly be expected to pay attention. 

[alsancle]

26 minutes ago, edinmass said:

 

It's the alligator arms syndrome I'm suffering from........it's genetic. All of us French Canadians are cheap bastards. Besides, with my lack of education; I can hardly be expected to pay attention. 

And I tell everyone you’re Portuguese.

[Grimy]

On 6/28/2022 at 8:40 AM, edinmass said:

And I will probably suffer a big deduction for arriving early on that leg……

And another big deduction for leaving late....

 

Somehow we did not find time to attack the surviving jug of Maker's that I brought to the Pierce meet.  The other one went to Greg....