Lift suggestions

[Grizz]

im in the market. I’ve only ever used two kinds. Bend pak  and challenger. I’m thinking about a challenger le-10. Challenger is the cheaper of the two but I actually liked using the one at the shop better than the others. Any suggestions? Thoughts? Insults?

[Xander Wildeisen]

Lift with your legs, not with your back.

[Grizz]

Hahaha! Pop?!?! What are you doing on here?!

Edited January 22, 2019 by Grizz (see edit history)

[tomcarnut]

I bought two four post Direct Lifts a couple years ago and like them.  I think it was a Bend Pak I also considered but believe they required the use of an air compressor. 

[Spinneyhill]

 

 

Edited January 22, 2019 by Spinneyhill (see edit history)

[Grizz]

I want a two post. Big enough for a full size truck. I’ve never heard of atlas before but It looked higher in price. Thanks for the input

[D Yaros]

18 hours ago, Grizz said:

I want a two post. Big enough for a full size truck. I’ve never heard of atlas before but It looked higher in price. Thanks for the input

My lift will accommodate a truck, no problem.  It is an American made  Mohawk A-7.  I bought it used.  Check out the used lift market.  Good deals are available.

[Grizz]

I would do used but I need it installed. Ive put up 3 lifts in my day and don’t want to do it again. Plus I have no one to help me. Never heard of Mohawk. I’ll check it out. Thank you!!

[JACK M]

I hate a two post lift.

The reason for a lift is so that you don't have to crawl on a floor.

A drive on four poster with a sliding jack works for me.

[Grizz]

Never used a four post. Is the sliding jack to lift the wheels off the ramps?! I have limited space and like the wheels to hang free. What’s the pluses of a four poster?

[stvaughn]

I use a two post lift and have never wished I had a four post instead of the two post. However, there are times when I wish I had both. If I’m going to do any kind of tugging, pulling, banging or such I will use stabilizer jacks at each end.  Something like this. https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/TWRST100C 

 

 

[Grizz]

Oh yeah I can see how a four post would feel more stable. I’ve definitely had some heart jolting experiences with cars “settling” on the lift. Haha. Never anything serious thank god... And yes I’m also in the market for at least two of those stabilizer jacks. Especially now that I know the proper name. I was calling them screw jacks or something stupid like that.  I’m a major cheapskate so they can wait until I find a good deal. Speaking of which I emailed the folks at Mohawk. They looked nice and the Indian head logo would go good with my chieftain but they were about 2x as much as the challenger 

Edited January 23, 2019 by Grizz (see edit history)

[dep5]

USA built ROTARY

http://www.rotarylift.com/Raised-In-Madison/Legacy.aspx

 

 

 

 

 

[stvaughn]

Being a “major cheapskate” will not reduce the amount of damage to your car or the hospital bill in the event of an accident. 

[Frank DuVal]

Major plus for four post is not having to get out and kneel to place the arms of a two post! As you get older, the four post makes way more sense. Full disclosure, I only have a two post asymmetrical, and kneeling is a pain! But oh so nice when in the air.

 

Or, you want to do wheel alignments. For those you need to load the wheels as if driving down the road. OK, need turntables and slip plates too....😉

 

That Pogo stick is only for steadying a lightweight part, not a heavy part (automatic transmission, engine) or an end of a vehicle. You need these to make you feel vary safe:

 

https://www.harborfreight.com/2-ton-capacity-underhoist-safety-stand-61600.html

 

Laugh all you want at suggesting a Harbor Freight tool, but these are really nice.  Makes vehicles rock steady on a two post lift. One front, one rear, one for the heavy part you are removing a mount from, like an engine or transmission.

 

Your safety is never to be compromised. I lost a good friend (professional mechanic working in his business) when a Ranger pickup slid off a two post lift and crushed him against his Snap On tool box. Other mechanic friends have lost vehicles off lifts. If it happens to people using them everyday, what chance do you want to take as a casual user?😨

[capngrog]

When I was planning my garage, I looked into the 4-post versus 2-post lift question in some depth.  The 2-post lift allows almost total/clear access to the underneath areas of a car and can't be beat for working on wheels, tires, brakes etc.  On the other hand, the 4-post lift has restricted access to the underneath areas of a car, but is great for routine chores such as oil change and the like.  The drive-on convenience of the 4-post is also a big plus factor, not to mention that it is best for "stacking" vehicles if your collection exceeds your available floor space.    While not absolutely necessary, a 4-post lift makes working on exhaust systems easier, and all of the muffler shops I've patronized lately use 4-post lifts.

 

I determined that I would only have the space and budget for one type of lift and eventually decided on a 2-post lift.  One factor that helped in my decision was observing maintenance areas of large car dealerships/repair garages:  for example, out of 20 lift/work stations, one would be a 4-post, and all of the rest would be 2-post.  I asked around amongst my gear-head friends, and those who do extensive work on cars overwhelmingly thought that if one had to make a choice between 4-post and 2-post, the 2-post lift was the best all around tool.

 

I'm 74 years old, and getting down onto the cold concrete floor of my garage to adjust the lift arms of my 2-post can be a pain (literally and figuratively), but once adjusted, as Frank stated above, using the lift is "oh so nice".  Actually, with the assist of gravity, I find that getting down on the floor is easier than getting back up, but that's a whole 'nother story.  Oh, one other thing: the 2-post lift ties up much less floor space than does the 4-post.

 

So far, the most ambitious project I've tackled in my garage has been the conversion of my 1968 Chevelle from automatic to 4-speed, and my 2-post lift performed admirably.  I've read about folks who remove entire bodies from their frames using a 2-post lift, but I have no plans to do anything like that.

 

In my opinion, the best of all worlds would be to have one of each, but if I can only have one, I'll go with the 2-post lift.

 

Cheers,

Grog

[poci1957]

5 hours ago, JACK M said:

I hate a two post lift.

The reason for a lift is so that you don't have to crawl on a floor.

A drive on four poster with a sliding jack works for me.

 

Four post lifts get little respect from pros but I agree with Jack M that for a home garage there are real advantages.  The common refrain is that a 2 post is preferable since it will allow the wheels to hang for suspension work and that is true, BUT if you buy the sliding jack you eliminate that problem.

 

The sliding jack slides back and forth between the ramps.  When the car is on the lift and up in the air you place the jack at the lifting point and manually jack it up, no air or electricity needed.  If you are only servicing that end of the car you can securely work on it while on the jack OR you can put it on jack stands and move the jack to the other end to elevate that axle too.  A heavy cross tray is included to hold the jack stands under an axle.

 

ADVANTAGES:

No need to bolt down the lift or have specific concrete thickness; since the load is distributed on four posts pretty much any solid and level concrete will support it.      

 

No need to get on the ground to place the lifting arms under a car, just drive on and no worry about stability or balance

 

The lift includes casters that can easily be installed to roll it to a different space anytime.  I used mine as a movable scaffold for hanging my ceiling panels and lights.  I also partially disassembled it and took it along when I moved.

 

No need to avoid the posts when opening the car doors, you can freely get in and out

 

Can be raised and allow a second car to safely park underneath—plastic drip trays are included. 

 

No need for air supply and plugs into any 110V outlet.

 

When working on the car you can use the ramps as your workbench for tools and parts

 

I have had mine for over ten years and one move and have had no problem with the hydraulics, pump, cables or any other part. 

 

DISADVANTAGES: Raises slowly compared to a professional lift and requires purchasing the sliding jack to be most effective.

Edited January 23, 2019 by poci1957 (see edit history)

[Grizz]

^^^very helpful. Now I understand why jack said “the reason for a lift is so you don’t have to crawl around on the floor”. Got it. I do hate having to set the lift. I would always be overly careful and set the arms. Raise a little. Stop. Double check. So a four post lift is easily movable?!  I mean just push it around? That might be a huge plus.

[Frank DuVal]

There are some 4 post lifts sold with wheels to move them around the garage. 

[poci1957]

Mine has big urethane casters that attach easily and allow me to push the unit around by myself.  I would say if I needed to move it to another space I could do it and be ready for use in 15-20 minutes start to finish.  They can be seen in this photo, Todd C 

[c49er]

I have two 4 posters ... total both 40" long.

Dual sliding jacks... a Rotary 12,000 lb and a BP 14,000 lb.

I have done engines, transmissions, exhaust and suspension on them...... 20" wide ramps /runways... widely spaced runways .... quick and safe on and off... very safe and stable

I have seen cars fall off two post lifts like I show below as I was driving to work one day....I do use two post lifts ... 4 post for my personal use with rolling jacks.

 

Edited January 25, 2019 by c49er
Messy post! (see edit history)

[JACK M]

In regards to the casters.

I have them but rarely if ever have I used them.

The way they work is that they hook into place (one on each post) and thru a cantilever idea the weight if the treads lift the posts.

The posts don't need to be very far from the floor to be able to roll the thing around.

I am glad to see so many here that like the four posters, to me they make much more sense than a two poster.

One thing that I do is to remove the approach ramps as soon as I get the car up a few feet.

They will be in your way walking around the car, and if you aren't careful you will knock your head into them when the car is high up.

It only takes a couple of times of bonks on the head to learn this.

As far as parking another car under the lift, I see the point but to me it makes for to much work to get that top car out. I think every car should have its own door.

I have used my four poster and some straps to lift off bodies, lift boats off of trailers, pull engines etc. (albeit this is not the best thing to use for engines)  

Another bonus is that when you are working under the car you have a handy place to put your tools and parts on the treads.

[STEVE POLLARD]

I went with the Atlas 4 - Post Lift model 8000 a few years ago. It came with the casters and drip pans - I ended up purchasing additional drip pans to cover the entire length of the ramp. So far , it's been great ! Also when I purchased  the lift, the manufacturer gave me a name of a installer that would pick up the unit at the distribution center, deliver and install the unit - best decision I made !   

 

 

[poci1957]

9 minutes ago, STEVE POLLARD said:

I went with the Atlas 4 - Post Lift model 8000 a few years ago. It came with the casters and drip pans..............when I purchased  the lift, the manufacturer gave me a name of a installer that would pick up the unit at the distribution center, deliver and install the unit - best decision I made !   

 

Mine was purchased from Greg Smith in Indianapolis and I also ordered delivery and setup (their service was either in house or closely associated).  It was what I needed at the time but when I moved and needed to move the lift I was able (with helpers) to take it partially apart and reassemble it myself.   

[Hans1]

GRIZZ

Just reflect on the wonderful amount of information that is provided with the help of so many AACA helpers.

That is what is so good about our AACA people.

 

I wrestled with the same thoughts, and decided to obtain a 2 Post, 10,000 lb,  Challenger.  Had it installed by local Rep distributor of the company. 

At 79 crawling to adjust arms under car is not bad, the best part is having most any part at the height I want.
Let us know what you decided to do

[Grizz]

Thank you all! Truly great information. I learned a little. Probably going to stick with the original plan and go with the 2 post challenger. I thought about rotary but at the old shop we had two rotarys and a challenger in the back. I eventually claimed that back bay and moved all my tools over there I liked it so much. The four post sound nice but I like the open access space of the two post. Also my space isn’t real big. 24x40 long. I’m thinking the lift will be in the back of my garage in the middle and have to back the cars in. Another factor was $$. I got enough to get me exactly what I need and not always what I want. Here’s a shot of the garage. I just got the lights on!!! I had to rewire the 240 outlet because the electricians wired it up wrong and it kept tripping the breaker. Next I will epoxy the floor and have lift installed!!! Then I never have to go back inside my house to my loving family again!!!

Edited January 24, 2019 by Grizz (see edit history)

[poci1957]

Your setup is like mine, I have 24x48 but with the cars two deep and the door on one end just like yours,  I put my lift in the space where your Grand Marquis is with the idea that I would have my workbench and toolbox on the side wall and a heater in the corner.  That way my primary workspace would have everything I needed close at hand and I could sort of contain the heat in that area.  You will have an even better setup for a lift with almost unlimited height, enjoy, Todd C

[Grizz]

I wanted to have it back and to one side like you said but the lift guy came and looked at the garage and felt like the middle would be best. Guess I’ll put shelves and tools on either side? I’m gonna call him tomorrow and put in an order probably 

[poci1957]

That means you lose a parking space, bad idea unless there is a very good reason IMO

[capngrog]

47 minutes ago, Grizz said:

I wanted to have it back and to one side like you said but the lift guy came and looked at the garage and felt like the middle would be best.

 

I'm not so sure that the middle would be best per poci 1957's comment above.  I'm sure that the middle would be the easiest from the standpoint of the "lift guy" making the installation.   If you agree, let the "lift guy" know your concerns about losing a parking space.  He may note your concern and make an extra effort to accommodate installation of your lift off to the side, or if he doesn't think it's such a good idea, he'll probably explain his reasoning.  On my lift, I've found it nice to have space to one side for  a work bench and on another side, to have space for specialized tools such as welders, compressors etc.  Of course, on the other hand, you don't want to "crowd the lift by placing it too close to a wall.  I'm sorry if I sound "wishy-washy" here, but there are many things to consider in the placement of a lift.

 

Cheers,

Grog

[Frank DuVal]

Ask yourself several questions. First being, what is the post spacing of the Challeneger lift you are looking at? My Danmar D-10/ACX two post is 12 feet from edge of base plate to edge of base plate. I like to be able to open doors without denting them on the posts! And be able to squeeze between the slightly open door and the car to get in and out of the car. Some lifts are so narrow, you need to exit the car then roll it into position to set the arms.

 

Now, do you plan on doing repair work like removing a rear axle shaft? To do that you need three feet past the rear axle backing plate. So, 3 + 3 + width of car = minimum width of repair stall, or so.

 

Want a workbench beside the lift? Need at least 18" walking space between the post and the workbench.  More is better....😉   Going this route, 2 (workbench) + 1.5 (walk space) + 12 (lift post to post) = minimum 15.5 feet for lift stall. And if you want to walk on the other side of the lift, now 17 feet width of stall!

 

Take a tape measure and masking tape out to the garage and start taping off lift and work areas before you decide where to place stuff. 

 

And you didn't say, but also know how much length you need to access vehicles on the lift. You need to stand in front and back of the vehicle being repaired, usually. like standing in front of a hood, opening a tailgate on a long pick up, etc. 26 feet is a typical length of stall.

 

 

[Grizz]

The lift fella and I took measurements and anything besides the middle is too tight against the wall. I really wanted it to one side to park a car next to it but 24 feet just isn’t enough. Overall width of a challenger LE10  is 131.75 roughly 11ft? Plus as frank said, another 3 ft at least from the wall. 

Edited January 25, 2019 by Grizz (see edit history)

[poci1957]

i guess this wasted space must be a two post problem because my four post fits in one space just fine.  This is 24ft, with a car on one side and a workbench on the other 

Edited January 25, 2019 by poci1957 (see edit history)

[Frank DuVal]

Four post Posts are smaller than two post Posts, as only two carry the load and they need to account for the leverage (vectors) of vehicle weight. So, four post lifts can fit in smaller spaces! Another reason they are sold for extra parking spaces, under 10K capacity, they fit in 10 foot wide stalls.😉

 

24 feet, ID or OD? 24 feet inside between the inside of walls or beams is much more room than 24 feet from outside of wall to outside of wall, the typical garage measurement on plans.

[poci1957]

9 hours ago, Frank DuVal said:

Four post Posts are smaller than two post Posts,.............,. So, four post lifts can fit in smaller spaces! Another reason they are sold for extra parking spaces, under 10K capacity, they fit in 10 foot wide stalls.

 

 

I had not thought about that, yet another plus for the four post in a home garage.  Indeed my 24ft space is actually more like 23.5 inside as frank questioned, Todd C

[Paul Dobbin]

Another thing to pay attention to is the under lift clearance.  Early cars are tall, my early 30's cars a 5' 7", some even 5' 8".

I had to buy a longer lift to get enough clearance to park one underneath the lift.   I have nearly 6 feet when all the way up.  Lots of lifts don't have 68 inches underneath.  Measure more than once and buy the right one the first time.

The biggest determining factor for me in getting a 4 post was not having to get up off the floor 8 times, everytime I put a car on the lift.

Edited January 26, 2019 by Paul Dobbin
added my main reason (see edit history)

[Bloo]

This^^

 

Actually tall vehicles exist in all eras. You just have to be careful about how far you put them up! To avoid walking around all scrunched up under the car, because you couldn't put it up all the way, get a tall enough hoist to do the work you intend to do. Ceiling clearance for taller hoists is another issue.

 

I can certainly relate to not wanting to get down on my knees a lot to set the hoist. I might even pick a 4 poster today.

 

On the other hand, If you intend to do general repair on anything even remotely modern, you want an offset 2-poster. It cannot be overstated how useless a 4 post hoist can be in that situation. You will find yourself working on the ground outside with jackstands because the hoist is in the way. When I was in the trade if someone had shuffled me into a bay with a 4-poster in it, I would have been looking for another job the same day.

[JACK M]

1 hour ago, Bloo said:

On the other hand, If you intend to do general repair on anything even remotely modern, you want an offset 2-poster. It cannot be overstated how useless a 4 post hoist can be in that situation.

 

This doesn't compute for me. General repair, Do you mean body work, or tune ups? What is general repair to you?

I kind of go the other way when it comes to use/useless.

 

Paul is right about the eight trips to the floor. I have trouble getting my fat ass off of the floor anymore. (the reason I got the lift in the first place).

[Janousek]

My main service hoist is a 4 post bendpak and I really like it.   Just drive up, lift up, and start working.  If I have to do a brake job or wheels then it takes a few more minutes.  It's nice to have the runners to set the brake drums and spindles or tools on as I work.  Everything is right there.    

 

They aren't as handy working under the hood though.  Everything is raised 5" so I have to drag a step stool around as I work under the hood.  

 

 

[Spinneyhill]

Ref. side space. You can pull an axle out above the work bench if you don't have cupboards on the wall. So that space does not need to be exclusive?