Pebble Beach - Monterey Car Week 2021

[alsancle]

[Cadillac Fan]

9 minutes ago, alsancle said:

Wow!

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Former Best Of Show winning Cunningham.

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Best of show 1958.

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[SC38dls]

AJ, Ed and all the others that have taken us on this adventure we owe you a very big thank you. If we are ever in the same location again I will be very honored to ply you with a cool libation of your choice or two. Walt is also invited so we can have the opportunity to record it as a historic event. 
dave s 

[8E45E]

1 hour ago, Walt G said:

I am very impressed and in shock  almost,  to see 90% of the vehicles have "period" appropriate colors on them. It lets one see the styling of the car not just a brash "lookee at me" presentation. Bravo to all the owners and restorers who choose to make their cars look like they did 80+ years ago when they were new.  All of this coming from someone who has studied and taught art for half a century as well as being involved in historical research and writing about same for even longer. Once again - Yes, I am a dinosaur.

W

We can all be thankful Piet Mondrian look paint jobs never used on cars in the early 1940's!!

 

Although VW came close in 1996:  Tracking down the wild, and wildly colorful, Volkswagen Golf Harlequin – Newsroom (vw.com)

 

Craig

Edited August 15, 2021 by 8E45E (see edit history)

[alsancle]

My understanding is the gentleman showing this 37 Packard did restoration himself. Well done!  

[58L-Y8]

1 hour ago, alsancle said:

An all-time favorite sport sedan design but would someone please, tactfully and diplomatically, inform the owner this magnificent masterpiece does not benefit from the two-tone paint scheme.   And the white walls should go too!

[Steve9]

1 hour ago, alsancle said:

That’s my brother Mike and his ‘23 Lincoln. Attempting to bribe the judge?

[edinmass]

 

Edited August 16, 2021 by edinmass (see edit history)

[ramair]

To all that are here at Pebble, please stop by and say hi,  I would love to see  some of the best and most generous friends on the greatest forum.  I am based out between the green 1914 Packard and the blue 1914 Pierce . I will gladly pour some wine from our vineyard ( for the one person that would rather have another type of adult libation I will happily stand in line at the bar for you) ,  Michael

[mike6024]

Live video of the event should start in 15 minutes. Click on this link below.

WATCH THE 2021 PEBBLE BEACH CONCOURS

 

[alsancle]

This Lancia is the nads.

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[edinmass]

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[wayne sheldon]

49 minutes ago, ramair said:

 I am based out between the green 1914 Packard and the blue 1914 Pierce .

 

A beautiful red car with an unusual top? Rear entrance tonneau. Nice! Should I take a wild guess? Thomas (circa 1903)?

[SC38dls]

28 minutes ago, edinmass said:

Just saw you go across the presentation area. 

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[mike6024]

[ramair]

I had a great time at Pebble, especially so because I was able to meet a few forum members in person.  My only regret was not being able to fully resolve my misconceptions about whitewalls verses blackwalls

[edinmass]

All loaded it up and heading home. My flight was canceled. Now I get to play musical airplanes and get home a day late. We met nine people from the forms at pebble. Just a big shout out to all those who stopped by and said hello. Thanks. Ed

Edited August 16, 2021 by edinmass (see edit history)

[29 Chandler]

4 hours ago, wayne sheldon said:

 

A beautiful red car with an unusual top? Rear entrance tonneau. Nice! Should I take a wild guess? Thomas (circa 1903)?

1904 Pope-Hartford Model B, possibly the oldest Pope too. Now lives a few miles from me 🙂

[wayne sheldon]

21 minutes ago, ramair said:

I had a great time at Pebble, especially so because I was able to meet a few forum members in person.  My only regret was not being able to fully resolve my misconceptions about whitewalls verses blackwalls

 

Michael, White walls versus black walls is a tough one to resolve. The entire history of tires is embroiled in that continuous change in construction and opinion. I tend to favor black walls myself, and always have. However, I have been talked into white walls on one car I had years ago, and have a car I still hope to restore before I die that I have white walls for because my wife really wanted them. I had another car that had white walls when I got it, and another (1925 Pierce Arrow series 80) years ago I put them on because I felt the car needed them.

The history of tires, had all whites, off whites and grays in the early days (your lovely little red rear entrance tonneau is appropriate for all whites!). In the mid 1910s, with increasing demands for tires as more cars were being built every year, plus the beginnings of the 'Great War' (WW1) causing raw rubber shortages, other means and materials were sought to get more tires out of less raw rubber. Such things as 'carbon black were found to not only extend the raw rubber, but also made the tires stronger and last longer. A lot , and I mean a whole big LOT of mid to late 1910s tires were in fact white walls. Not because of style, but because the crude manufacturing made it easier to make the casing out of white rubber, and then cap the treaded area in black. The result was a two sided white wall. 

Tires were usually so dirty in those early days, that searching original era photographs it is often very difficult to tell whether the sidewalls are black or white (even reds, greens, blues, and grays were made and sold in the mid to late 1910s!). Forty to fifty years ago, I began to believe that 1910s era cars were usually black walls, Then further research made me question that. Careful study of era photographs finally convinced me that many tires look uniformly colored, and assumed to be black, simply because the tires were the dirtiest part of the car. Enough (HUNDREDS!) early photographs do show white sidewalls that I became convinced that a large percentage of 1910s era tires were in fact white wall. Again, it was more a matter of cost and construction than style.

In the early 1920s, tires began being black walled more often than not. The fancy colors were a short-lived fad in the mid to late 1910s (I have seen several original tires in those colors!), and all but gone by 1921. However, there were a LOT of exceptions. Buick in the mid and late 1920s I know provided two sided white walls on a lot of their cars. NOT all of them. I have seen a lot of era new car advertising showing white wall tires. I have also seen a lot of the same era new car advertising showing black wall tires. By that time, it was a styling choice. Buick, in the mid and late 1920s was one of the most stylish mid-priced cars in the market!

It is also interesting to note, that some Ford factory photographs taken in the mid 1920s show two sided white walls still being used on at least some model T Fords!

The stock market crash and resulting economic depression made big changes quickly in the early 1930s. Those that could still afford a new car, whether a very expensive one or a common Ford or Plymouth (or Buick) usually did NOT want something as ostentatious as white wall tires. They were available, and SOME people did want them. So whether a Dodge or a Duesenberg, research into the individual car would be necessary to make the 'correct' choice today.

After WWII, white walls came and went, wide whites, REALLY wide whites, narrow whites, and really narrow whites all came and went and came back again. Throughout most of those years, black wall tires were often more common. Even silly 'porta-walls' hung around for a couple decades!

Personally, I am much too interested in the pre-depression eras to follow the postwar trends.

 

Safe trip home!

 

I see that while I was typing, 29 Chandler says your red car is a Pope Hartford! Another fantastic automobile! A good friend many years ago had a 1903 Thomas, looked very similar.

[mike6024]

That Mercedes is at Keller Winery? That's in my back yard, drove by it many times, never knew there was a car collection there.

Edited August 16, 2021 by mike6024 (see edit history)

[Ozstatman]

Is that a paint chip on the Alfa? 

 

[ramair]

Wayne, I wish the Pope was mine, but I did not have a car at the show, many of my friends had early cars there, the 1914 Pierce, the 1914 Packard Six and the 1925 Pierce.  Actually I have personally solved the whitewall / black wall problem, I own 8 cars, the 1915 Buick big 6, the 1916 Buick big 6 , the 1936 GMC and the 1993 Allante are black wall.  The 1928 Buick country club coupe, the 1938 Packard super 8, the 1939 Packard twelve and the 1968 Toronado have whitewalls. So as long as I do not buy another car, I am at 50/50.  In my comments about whitewall verse blackwall I was just kidding in light of the fact I met some of the forum members that spar back in forth on the forum all the time on this subject.  I have included a picture of my Buick with whitewalls, I bought the car with the tires that are on it. I think the 128” wheelbase and dual rear spares give it that “Packard” look that led to the Packard lawsuit that Buick lost

[wayne sheldon]

Ah, more pieces to the people puzzle! Thank you. I keep trying to figure out some of the who's who of forum members. Beautiful Buick! Those always look good with white wall tires. Years ago, a friend of a friend that was somewhat of a Buick expert was showing some factory photos from between 1926 and 1928, that clearly showed the two sided white wall tires on them. He and several other Buick owners were trying to get the major tire suppliers at the time to produce two sided white walls for the Buick owners. Early "maybes" soon turned into "forget it", and the idea was basically dropped. Sadly, that Buick guy died a few years later of bone cancer. Another longtime good friend wound up with one of his Buicks, and toured with it for almost thirty years.

You have a few really interesting Buick automobiles! Two longtime friends have 1915 Buick Big sixes! I have ridden in both of those, and what wonderful cars they are! One of them, I did drive for a couple miles. I usually don't care to drive other people's cars. But they were trying to resolve a problem with the car's clutch, and wanted another opinion. 

To have both a 1915 and a 1916 must make an interesting pair.

Another longtime friend had a 1926 Master sedan (120 inch wheelbase if I recall correctly?) over forty years ago. Powerful car with fantastic road manners. (It also had an Owl-Lite spot-lamp mounted on the radiator with correct control rods and handle!)

[Billy Kingsley]

I'd love to see a greenwall tire...green has been my favorite color my whole life.