1971 Cadillac coupe deville motor

[Pace]

I have a 71 Cadillac coupe deville and would like to use the motor in another body. Can I receive some information about what old school body can I fit it inside of? It’s a 7.7 litre 472 CID 16-valve OHV V8 engine

[padgett]

Be interesting in a Studillac or a Cad-Allard.

[Pace]

What’s your thoughts on a chevelle or camaro 

[joe_padavano]

https://www.cad500parts.com/

[Pace]

Nice. Thanks

[C Carl]

First year of the low compression Cadillac Engines. Run far better than the earlier 10:1s on modern gasoline. This is the only year Cadillac put a long duration camshaft in the low compression big block engines. Would have let that CDV loaf along on down the line all day at around 115 or so. Put the very best high pressure radials on it,  gas shocks, urethane sway bar bushings, urethane air bags at 6 - 8 psi in the rear coils, and then drive it like you do a VW bus. Just keep that right foot on the firewall. But with those cheap easy mods, you will enjoy it at any speed.    CC 

[Pace]

Can you recommend a body to drop it in 

Edited June 9, 2020 by Pace
Misspelled words (see edit history)

[C Carl]

Yes, from where I stand, Padgett has suggested a couple really great "old school" possibilities. Allard is fantastic, BUT,  in Today's world, you might have to pack an impractical lunch in order to pull that one off. Sonny Wisner's 514 Cad powered beauty, is a great take on the "old school" Studillac theme. (That is Sonny standing behind his creation - in black to the left - says if he wasn't happily married he'd take the "E" off his license plate). My pick would be an "old school" snakey lead sled. '47 Cad fastback, chopped about as low as "Cadzilla", flat black, fairly complex Crimson pinstripes, NO FLAMES, you get the idea. All Cadillac, soul intact. Oh : and purple, kind of "Black Light" - UV looking interior lighting. I have never seen one done like this,  though I hope to live long enough to see one. YOURS maybe ? But please don't cut up a restoration candidate. I would get in trouble for suggesting this. AACA is about presservation, and I agree.

 

Welcome, Pace ! Please stay with us, and give us a few sneak peeks if you figure out what to do with that 472.   -   CC 

 

 

[Pace]

Great suggestion, I sure will keep you all posted on what happens and thank you! This forum has been a party 

[CarlLaFong]

12 hours ago, Pace said:

Can you recommend a body to drop it in 

)h God!!!!! Not this crap again??? What exactly are your intentions? An engine swap or a body swap onto the Cad chassis? FWIW, I swapped a Cad 500 into a 56 Ford F100. It was a very nice truck. Also I included a Volare suspension swap which was very popular 25 or 30 year ago

[Pace]

Yea one of those lol. The caddy body is just to far gone due to weatherization would preserve it but hey you have to know when to let go. I want to do an body swap. The engine is just so big afraid of being unable to find the proper fit. But hey a pickup may be the call

[Matt Harwood]

There's no "body swap" you can do. There's nothing that will just drop onto that frame other than another Cadillac body, and even then it's a HUGE job.

 

The engine will fit in anything if you're clever enough and skilled enough, but there's nothing that will be a direct bolt-in. I like the idea of these big Cadillac motors being used instead of the ubiquitous Chevy crate engines, although there's a reason why the Chevys are popular. With enough time and effort and money, anything can be done, so pick something you like and get to work fabricating.

 

If your desire is borne of the need to do something different, then go for it. The options are limited only by your skills and budget. It's a BIG engine physically, so you'll need a rather large car to put it in (or a truck, as mentioned) and it will still weigh more and make less power than a comparable generic Bowtie, but being different is, to me, far more interesting than a number on a dyno sheet. A TH400 will bolt right up to that engine, as will many of its derivatives, so that's a useful option that works in almost any application and the front of the motor is pretty spacious so you should be able to adapt accessories to almost any engine bay without too much work.

 

Still, the question remains: how skillful and dedicated are you to such a build? Or is this just trying to recycle something that sort of seems useful simply because you already have it?

[Pace]

Amazing advisement!! That was super helpful thank you. So my father has the 71 caddy but because he allowed it to sit outside in NY state weather and has completely ruined it to a point of no return. But happily exists a motor with less than 80 k. So the game plan is to place it in another body just was unsure as to which would hold that size

[SC38dls]

I put a Ford 289 in an Austin Healy, it is a tight fit but works. It just took time to make it work and get everything welded and setup. That engine went in and out of the car 10 or 12 times before final installation. It’s not just look at it do a little work and off you go. As others have said time, money, some help, the correct tools and some level of skill with a lot of determination you can make that engine fit anything. 
That being said it would look silly on a go cart. 😳

dave s 

Edited June 9, 2020 by SC38DLS (see edit history)

[bryankazmer]

I know using truck chassis comes up in this context because of body on frame, but there's a reason for the phrase "handles like a truck."

[Guest]

A Diamond T pickup.

[Pace]

See the thing is it’s super difficult to find

[JACK M]

I say get on Craig's List and find some abandoned hooptie.

The market may dictate what you hot rod will be.

Oh yea, needs suspension, brakes, wiring, paint, tires, interior. Or not.

[Pfeil]

Why do we have to go through this again??? 

 

What is the AACA Discussion Forum?

The Antique Automobile Club of America (AACA) discussion forum is a place to talk about our favorite subject – original, un-restored and restored antique automobiles, trucks, motorcycles and related memorability and history - and the people who love and drive them!

[Pace]

Buddy scram, always a Debbie downer with too much time on their hands. I reached out to some intellectuals about a subject I’m not familiar with and there are some great suggestions to bat. If you don’t have any helpful information to add just scroll on. Almost as worthless as the time I spent even typing this. 

[CarlLaFong]

3 hours ago, Pace said:

Buddy scram, always a Debbie downer with too much time on their hands. I reached out to some intellectuals about a subject I’m not familiar with and there are some great suggestions to bat. If you don’t have any helpful information to add just scroll on. Almost as worthless as the time I spent even typing this. 

By your own admission, you are unfamiliar with this subject. My question is, do you have the skill set the tools, the time and the money needed to do something like this. Some think that you can just "stick" an engine in whatever  you have and drive merrily off. Well, good luck with that. The only thing that engine will slip into is another 71 Cad

Edited June 9, 2020 by CarlLaFong (see edit history)

[Pfeil]

58 minutes ago, Pace said:

Buddy scram, always a Debbie downer with too much time on their hands. I reached out to some intellectuals about a subject I’m not familiar with and there are some great suggestions to bat. If you don’t have any helpful information to add just scroll on. Almost as worthless as the time I spent even typing this. 

 

Buddy scram,  always someone comes on the site and doesn't read the rules.

 

This note below was put up by the one who is a moderator and the one who maintains this site!

What is the AACA Discussion Forum?

The Antique Automobile Club of America (AACA) discussion forum is a place to talk about our favorite subject – original, un-restored and restored antique automobiles, trucks, motorcycles and related memorability and history - and the people who love and drive them!

 

 

[C Carl]

2 hours ago, Pace said:

 I reached out to some intellectuals about a subject I’m not familiar with ........................

 

Well, that being the case, taking on a project of this magnitude that you are not familiar with, would be time poorly spent. This would be a complicated, highly specialized project which would require a significant fraction of a lifetimes experience. That Studillac was built by a very experienced hotrodder, and professional mechanic. By posting here, hopefully you have got a peep through the keyhole into the futility of your proposition. Sell the 472 if you can. There is some market for them, although the market is very soft these days. 472/500 Cadillacs are lighter than a Chev 454, and there is as much speed equipment available for them as most guys would ever want. To sell it, keep it in the car, and hopefully you can demonstrate it running. 

 

As I said above, you are most welcome to AACA forums, where I hope our centuries of collective experience has lead you to the water. Please take a drink, and hang out with us. You obviously have a curious degree of automotive interest. Perhaps you will become fascinated with what we do. I will be 76 in a month. How old are you ?      -    Cadillac Carl 

[SC38dls]

I don’t understand some of the negative comments about someone trying to figure out what to do. He says he doesn’t know much about doing this type of work. He’s asking for information to make a decision about what to do. So many times someone complains about no new blood coming into the hobby and when someone does these type of comments come up. Thank goodness there are good people that are willing to help with good advice. If you don’t like this type of request don’t respond just ignore the thread and move on. 
 

I hope you get what you need and have fun doing what ever you decide. You may even think of selling the caddy, taking the money and get into this hobby with a little less daunting project. 
Good luck, most important is to have fun, it’s what makes this hobby worth getting iinto. 
dave s 

Edited June 10, 2020 by SC38DLS (see edit history)

[54Coupe]

I have a friend with a 472 Cad in his 49 Hudson. That is a fun ride. That engine will physically fit in the confines of a Chevelle engine compartment. You will, however, need to fabricate engine mounts, etc.

[Pace]

Nice, so a chevelle naturally was the first option but after speaking with a few people the tailor job would be a bit to costly for me at the moment so I’m currently bidding on a 75 le Sabre that will be a smooth swap

[Buffalowed Bill]

Twenty five years ago my nephew put one in a 1956 Chev truck. It was an absolute joke-no traction whatsoever. 

 

Why don't you look for a correct period Cadillac? Have some fun with the car and keep the engine for a spare.

 

Carl I saw that Studebaker at Greenwood, I can't remember if I talked to the owner. Picture reminds me how I'm going to miss Greenwood this year!

 

Bill

[Pfeil]

20 hours ago, SC38DLS said:

I don’t understand some of the negative comments about someone trying to figure out what to do. He says he doesn’t know much about doing this type of work. He’s asking for information to make a decision about what to do. So many times someone complains about no new blood coming into the hobby and when someone does these type of comments come up. Thank goodness there are good people that are willing to help with good advice. If you don’t like this type of request don’t respond just ignore the thread and move on. 
 

 

 

It's simple to understand and all you need to do is read the rules of the General Forum and you will realize this is no place for modified hopped up cars rod rods etc. There are plenty of web sites that cover that sort of thing.

 So I will again quote what one of our moderators and also the same guy that maintains this site says.

" 

What is the AACA Discussion Forum?

The Antique Automobile Club of America (AACA) discussion forum is a place to talk about our favorite subject – original, un-restored and restored antique automobiles, trucks, motorcycles and related memorability and history - and the people who love and drive them! "

 

 Hopefully you now understand the mission of AACA discussion Forum.

And don't get mad at me. If you wish to change the rules have at it.

 

Edited June 10, 2020 by Pfeil (see edit history)

[SC38dls]

I have read the rules and agree the AACA has a specific purpose. Does that mean we can’t help out a person asking about a car/ motor that qualifies under those rules and has little or no idea what he should do. He was asking what the people that know about these cars thought he could do. He didn’t say he wanted to make it a hot rod or a rat rad or anything other than what body could he put on the frame and if it was possible.  I really am discussed with attitudes that cant be understanding with someone asking for a little help. If we can’t be decent to a possible new person in this association and help him realize what is involved in a project like this it may be time to rethink my membership.  
I would love to know if other members feel the same way I do. 
dave s 

[Pace]

You and your understanding is exactly what my intentions are and I thank you for your understanding. I signed up to this forum for advisement from intellectuals who are familiar. The project is actually for my father as a gift, besides the one member I have been lead in some awesome directions and have actually bid on a vehicle that will work. I will share with you my process. Thanks again 

[Pfeil]

1 hour ago, SC38DLS said:

I have read the rules and agree the AACA has a specific purpose. Does that mean we can’t help out a person asking about a car/ motor that qualifies under those rules and has little or no idea what he should do. He was asking what the people that know about these cars thought he could do. He didn’t say he wanted to make it a hot rod or a rat rad or anything other than what body could he put on the frame and if it was possible.  I really am discussed with attitudes that cant be understanding with someone asking for a little help. If we can’t be decent to a possible new person in this association and help him realize what is involved in a project like this it may be time to rethink my membership.  
I would love to know if other members feel the same way I do. 
dave s 

Instead of politely telling Pace that we are not supposed to post that kind of thing here and referring him to Jalopy Journal or some other web site you added fuel to the topic by talking about stuffing a 289 into a Austin Healey. 

[SC38dls]

The fact I was saying it is not easy to do any swap was the point and he seems to understand that based on his thanks and later post. 
How does my trying to help him excuse your rudeness and the fact you missed his whole point of asking questions. 
You seem to have a set idea of what is allowed and if it doesn’t fit your definition it must be wrong. So I will end the discussion with that comment. 
dave s 

[Morgansdad]

My advice for what it's worth, Like so many before me said, HAVE FUN above all else. That way you are more likely to stick with it. Also no matter how much you know or not, there is always someone willing to help. Just a few keystrokes away. Good luck.

[padgett]

And here I always thought the idea was to enjoy old cars wherever that might lead. Sure there are those who pursue "as built" at all costs (though a few times I have pointed out what that really means) and those who just do what it takes to maximize driving pleasure without blowing an entire 401K. Some focus on a single make/model. My enjoyment comes from having different cars for different purposes. There is a seat for everyone (though for some the sub-forums are a better fit).

[Pfeil]

1 hour ago, SC38DLS said:

The fact I was saying it is not easy to do any swap was the point and he seems to understand that based on his thanks and later post. 
How does my trying to help him excuse your rudeness and the fact you missed his whole point of asking questions. 
You seem to have a set idea of what is allowed and if it doesn’t fit your definition it must be wrong. So I will end the discussion with that comment. 
dave s 

First, it's not my rules so it's not my definition. Second, I said nothing to you or anything that was rude.

My conclusion is you have a hard time understanding the rules of this forum and you have a misunderstanding of the word rude and what it means. 

[edinmass]

Here is a strange project.......a pre war Seagrave fire truck engine placed in a Chevy pick up. He spent years doing it, and the work quality was decent. Unfortunately he had zero clue as to a overall design. I bet he had 50k out of pocket and 3000 hours in it. Guess what happened when it put it for sale...........just because someone can do something, doesn’t mean they should.

[Rusty_OToole]

This is a fairly straight forward swap in a GM car or pickup truck that was available with a big block engine in the period 1965 - to late seventies. The Caddy used a TurboHydramatic 400 transmission of the BOP or Buick, Olds, Pontiac type which means the engine will fit on the transmission of those cars. If you use the Cadillac engine and transmission assembly it will fit into most GM cars without too much trouble. I know guys who have done similar swaps into Firebirds, Chev pickup trucks etc and it is mostly a matter of mixing and matching stock GM parts.

 

Something like a Nova would be too small. It would be possible but a lot of hassle and hand work. A Chevelle, Camaro, Tempest  or larger car would be practically a bolt in deal. If you have a certain car in mind see if there is a forum for that car, and ask for specifics there. Chances are someone has already done the same swap.

[Buffalowed Bill]

Saying that a person's question is off limits, doesn't make it go away. I guess the attitude should be ignore the question or be rude, but it still doesn't answer the question. Although this is a site for the maintenance of original cars, there is some membership crossover, with  some contributors having the expertise to answer the question. To me it's simply bad manners to fail to answer another car guy's question. Our response will likely will reflect on the  organization in the future. I guess solution should be beat him up, and sent him on his way with his tail between his legs. I want to suggest H.A.M.B a website that he will be more readily accepted.

 

Bill

Edited June 11, 2020 by Buffalowed Bill (see edit history)

[54vicky]

my thoughts exactly

28 minutes ago, Buffalowed Bill said:

Saying that a person's question is off limits, doesn't make it go away. I guess the attitude should be ignore the question or be rude, but it still doesn't answer the question. Although this is a site for the maintenance of original cars, there is some membership crossover, with  some contributors having the expertise to answer the question. To me it's simply bad manners to fail to answer another car guy's question. Our response will likely will reflect on the  organization in the future. I guess solution should be beat him up, and sent him on his way with his tail between his legs. I want to suggest H.A.M.B a website that he will be more readily accepted.

 

Bill

my thoughts exactly if it had been suggested right off it would have saved band width.it is one thing to encourage but there are rules.if you want to help you can take it off the forum and use the PM function

[Pfeil]

6 hours ago, 54vicky said:

my thoughts exactly

my thoughts exactly if it had been suggested right off it would have saved band width.it is one thing to encourage but there are rules.if you want to help you can take it off the forum and use the PM function

 

We had this problem not long ago and finally a moderator had to step in. The topic was about modifying Buicks and the author of the thread was directed to the Buick section of the forum where they in that section can talk about anything they want about modifying Buicks.

 

  This General section of AACA is about the only place a person can go and talk about stock cars from the factory.

 It seems many of the national clubs for a certain make of vehicle have given in to the modifier / hot rod/ rat rod crowd and the most disheartening thing about it is by letting people bring modified cars and also discussing them in their forums they violate their own mission statements.