Period images to relieve some of the stress

[John_Mereness]

[alsancle]

6 minutes ago, John_Mereness said:

 

 

I wonder how many were made?  Looking at period pictures at least 2 or 3.

 

 

[Johan Boltendal]

The first car could be an Austro Daimler the second a Peugeot D' Arlmat

[alsancle]

5 minutes ago, Johan Boltendal said:

The first car could be an Austro Daimler the second a Peugeot D' Arlmat

 

With the English Bristol in the background I was thinking post war British auto show.

[Walt G]

A.J. a pencil note on the back of the photo says 1950 so it is just postwar

[alsancle]

[John_Mereness]

[John_Mereness]

[John_Mereness]

[John_Mereness]

[John_Mereness]

[John_Mereness]

[John_Mereness]

[John_Mereness]

[John_Mereness]

[John_Mereness]

 

 

[John_Mereness]

Auburn

[John_Mereness]

[Walt G]

Ok identity time for the three period photos I posted: Steve has it correct about the conv. sedan that it is an Opel Admiral , the race car at the automobile show is a Frazer Nash LeMans type,  and the first one is a Minerva ( yes the shell over the radiator is not what one is used to seeing) with a body by Alexis Kellner Carrossier of Berlin , Germany. This photo is in a hard bound soft felt covered presentation catalog that was in a dealership or at Kellner's factory. that same type shell is also pictured on several other Minervas in that book , all on Minerva chassis and a penciled in date says the year is 1913.

So many photographs/images never before seen and so little time.  It is just incredible what was designed and built and most of us have never seen. Not just in the coach builders promotional material to entice people to want to buy their efforts/product but magazines most people here in the USA are not familiar with like OMNIA , a periodical in France that was monthly , with many pages, issued from 1920 thru 1936 ( I have nearly a full run except for about 4 issues for 1936) . La Carroserie magazine, auto show issues of L'Illustration magazine  - and they had a great representation of custom coachwork on chassis of American manufacture.

Walt

[58L-Y8]

30 minutes ago, Walt G said:

...", the race car at the automobile show is a Frazer Nash LeMans type,  and the first one is a Minerva ( yes the shell over the radiator is not what one is used to seeing) with a body by Alexis Kellner Carrossier of Berlin , Germany. This photo is in a hard bound soft felt covered presentation catalog that was in a dealership or at Kellner's factory. that same type shell is also pictured on several other Minervas in that book , all on Minerva chassis and a penciled in date says the year is 1913.

Walt:

1) What would be the year range of the Frazer-Nash LeMans type?

2) Was that deep-V'ed radiator shell typical of what Minerva used before the style with which we're generally familiar?

 

A comment on the Opel Admiral styling:  Certainly Harley Earl had influence on Opel styling in general being a GM operation then.  But, its interesting the headlights faired into the hood-sides were closely identified with the Hupmobile Aerodynamic, yet no American GM displayed that feature.  

Steve 

 

[Walt G]

Steve

The photo of the Frazer-Nash is dated 1950 on the back in pencil.

the Minerva radiator shell we are all familiar with ( I think was one of the most attractively styled in the car industry) was what was being used when that car was bodied by Kellner. In the sales book/album both are shown ! some with the "normal" styling we are used to seeing and some with that pointed look. It is the only time I have ever seen that pointed look so I am wondering if the coach body builder Kellner decided that's what they wanted ?

Walt

[58L-Y8]

Walt:

I'd surmised the Frazer-Nash might have been around 1950 by the Bristol 401 displayed in the background.  This Curbside Classic article quite affectively details their history:

https://www.curbsideclassic.com/automotive-histories/automotive-history-british-deadly-sins-high-brow-hybrids-part-2-bristol-603-britannia-blenheim-arrested-development/

 

Of the Minerva, perhaps the elegantly-styled 'normal' radiator shell wasn't considered prestigious enough for some customers who demanded the deeply-V'ed pointed style that mimicked the look of another higher prestige maker of the times.  I'm thinking of those Uppercu Cadillac buyer who had the "Rolls-Royce-styled" radiator shell to give their cars a greater touch of 'class'.   

 

Steve 

[George Cole]

[George Cole]

Edited October 5, 2020 by George Cole (see edit history)

[edinmass]

Love the photo with the seat above the trunk! 👍👍👍

[George Cole]

[George Cole]

15 minutes ago, edinmass said:

Love the photo with the seat above the trunk! 👍👍👍

That was a custom 1912 Cole 40 built for Princess Victoria, a 'vertically challenged entertainer' of the time.  I believe she was 27" tall, and her butler was 7'1".  All part of her show...as was the car.  Here's another picture of it/her/them.

Edited October 5, 2020 by George Cole (see edit history)

[George Cole]

1929 Cadillac wrecker.

[George Cole]

[George Cole]

 

 

Edited October 5, 2020 by George Cole (see edit history)

[George Cole]

7 minutes ago, George Cole said:

That was a custom 1912 Cole 40 built for Princess Victoria, a 'vertically challenged entertainer' of the time.  I believe she was 27" tall, and her butler was 7'1".  All part of her show...as was the car.  Here's another picture of it/her/them.

Notice the stairs and handrailing going up the fender for her to get into the coach.  Her butler also put out steps for her to climb up and down from the running board to the ground.

[George Cole]

[LCK81403]

Different posts on this thread have provided a B&W and a colorized photo of actor Gary Cooper with a Duesenberg car.  The shade of blue on the Duesenberg is possibly called “Robin’s Egg Blue”.  Not sure.  I remember reading an old report many years ago, a police investigation of a crime in the 1920s, in which it mentioned a "Robin’s egg blue" car.  So that color did exist as a color choice in those days, at least for that particular automobile in the crime report.  The make of the car is not definitely remembered at this late date.  However, regarding colorization of this Duesenberg, is this shade of blue a factory color?  A best guess is that the color in fact is factory rather than after market repaint.

[ericmac]

6 hours ago, LCK81403 said:

Different posts on this thread have provided a B&W and a colorized photo of actor Gary Cooper with a Duesenberg car.  The shade of blue on the Duesenberg is possibly called “Robin’s Egg Blue”.  Not sure.  I remember reading an old report many years ago, a police investigation of a crime in the 1920s, in which it mentioned a "Robin’s egg blue" car.  So that color did exist as a color choice in those days, at least for that particular automobile in the crime report.  The make of the car is not definitely remembered at this late date.  However, regarding colorization of this Duesenberg, is this shade of blue a factory color?  A best guess is that the color in fact is factory rather than after market repaint.

The car is absolutely fabulous in that color.  Alas, someone at Duesenberg liked yellow over green.

[edinmass]

1 hour ago, ericmac said:

The car is absolutely fabulous in that color.  Alas, someone at Duesenberg liked yellow over green.

ericmac............having seen and played around with this actual car......I can confirm the colors are authentic and terrible. 🤮

[wayne sheldon]

This one was on the MTFCA (model T) forum this morning. I thought some people here would really enjoy it. Thanks go to Tom Rootlieb.

 

I am not sure, and when I zoomed in, couldn't quite make out the script on the radiator, but I think this may be an EMF/Studebaker. The script looks like it may be Studebaker. For awhile in around 1911 through '12, cars were sold badged either way. Studebaker had experimented with automobiles for awhile in partnership with others to see where they wanted to go in the automobile business. For 1913, they dropped the EMF name and became simply Studebaker.

 

[ericmac]

9 hours ago, edinmass said:

ericmac............having seen and played around with this actual car......I can confirm the colors are authentic and terrible. 🤮

J-111, a Lebaron Phaeton was a demonstrator car used by the Los Angeles dealership. Eventually Irving Gilmore bought the car and it has become the crown jewel of the Gilmore Car Museum's permanent collection.  In 1984 an exhaustive restoration was started and at the time a fateful decision was made,  not to restore the car using authentic colors, a color scheme that nearly matched the Cooper car. I think Gilmore made the correct decision. 

[edinmass]

1 hour ago, ericmac said:

J-111, a Lebaron Phaeton was a demonstrator car used by the Los Angeles dealership. Eventually Irving Gilmore bought the car and it has become the crown jewel of the Gilmore Car Museum's permanent collection.  In 1984 an exhaustive restoration was started and at the time a fateful decision was made,  not to restore the car using authentic colors, a color scheme that nearly matched the Cooper car. I think Gilmore made the correct decision. 

 

 

J-111 used colors based off of another identical car.....and I think they were correct to make the change. I also like the fact they didn't muck up the lines with too many bolt on accessories. The car is simply beautiful the way it sits. 

[Walt G]

Ed, I totally agree with your comment about how they did not "muck up the lines with to many bolt on accessories".  I would guess 35 or so years ago the trend was to paint a any car - bright colors, chrome everything that could be removed, and add every possible light, do dad, giz mo, and wind up toy that could be bolted to the car. Yes, when new that could have been done to the car by the original purchaser - BUT was seldom if ever done and if done was usually on the left coast in the Hollywood/L.A. area where attention was sought by the movie studios or movie stars ( that's what they were called then not 'celebrities') .  The car companies and designers for same wanted a "perfect" product to offer to the public as is and yes they did indeed have accessory catalogs from the factory but those were not often consulted by a customer. Most popular accessories seem to be trunks, an additional spare tire and cover for same, and on open body styles wind wings for the windshields. ( if a touring car or phaeton perhaps a tonneau windshield).  Maybe even a license plate frame.  Fog and Trippe, pilot ray lights are on more cars now of the era then they were when new.

I have many accessory catalogs of the pre war era in my archives, both factory and "after market" the top end accessory company for vehicles was Nil Melior ( translates to none finer) in New York City who were in business approximately a decade from 1929 to 1939. At one time they had a store in the lobby of the Waldorf-Astoria Hotel ! Yes, a car parts store in one of the finest hotels in N.Y. City.  I always wanted to go there and announce at a clear and robust voice that it was a great location for a auto parts store. 🤣  I know there are a few of you reading this thinking ' yeah Walt would do that too'.

WG

[Cadillac Fan]

3 hours ago, edinmass said:

 

 

J-111 used colors based off of another identical car.....and I think they were correct to make the change. I also like the fact they didn't muck up the lines with too many bolt on accessories. The car is simply beautiful the way it sits. 

My favorite car ever. Was there in 1987 as it was unveiled in those colors at the first CCCA experience.   I was 11.  Made a huge impression on me.  

 

Edited October 8, 2020 by Cadillac Fan (see edit history)