Mark Kikta Posted July 28, 2019 Author Share Posted July 28, 2019 Thanks Don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubert_25-25 Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 Mark, Don has explained the good marks on the flywheel. I had some of those extra marks as well. I attributed it to the new guy on the job using the flywheel marker. Hugh 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Wright Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 12 hours ago, Mark Kikta said: All done!! Any specs on how tight they should be? I did 4 grunts. I didn't think 3 grunts was tight enough. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kikta Posted July 28, 2019 Author Share Posted July 28, 2019 Guess I have a target anyway! 4 grunts 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubert_25-25 Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 On this one, you have to pick which line is the 2-5 line. The correct line is the one on the left because the ones that were done correctly at the other marks were closer to the first number. Hugh 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raydurr Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 I am almost certain that the cylinder number stamps are used to indicate TDC for valve adjustment. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kikta Posted July 28, 2019 Author Share Posted July 28, 2019 You must be correct because I have the 2-5 mark as well as this 3-4 Mark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Wright Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 On the 1-6 mark on my flywheel somebody wrote "Kilroy was here." I guess there were some real wise guys in the 1920's. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KongaMan Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 7 hours ago, Hubert_25-25 said: On this one, you have to pick which line is the 2-5 line. The correct line is the one on the left because the ones that were done correctly at the other marks were closer to the first number. Hugh Can't this be determined conclusively by taking the circumference of the flywheel, dividing by 360, then doing basic addition to find the distance from the #1 TDC mark? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonMicheletti Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 It turned out that the flywheel on my '18 was not indexed correctly for the #1 cylinder, so the timing marks were wrong. I determined #1 TDC by pulling one of the #1 cylinders valve cages. I removed the valve and replaced it with a piece of threaded rod. I adjusted the rod so the it would hit the top of the piston as I rotated the flywheel slowly. I rotated the flywheel first clockwise until the rod struck the piston and put a mark at the "timing hole". Then rotated the flywheel the opposite direction until it hit the rod and again placed a mark. Then I rotated the flywheel until the 2 marks were at thye 6:00 position. #1 TDC would be between those 2 marks and I placed a new mark there . I could also put the 7° After TDC by transferring the distance from the original marks. A lot easier that tearing the engine down to relocate the flywheel. (note the crappy hose clamp.. shame on me) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Wiegand Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 Don brought up a very good point. On my '16 D-45 (and I will think that the 1922's are the same way) there are no indexing marks on the flywheel and/or the crankshaft flange studs. I center punched one of the studs and both sides of the stud on the flywheel. I am just wondering if the two lines on the flywheel circumference has anything to do with the fact that the centerline of the cylinder bores is offset some from the centerline of the crankshaft. I do not remember just where, but, somewhere here on the forums, this offset has been discussed in relation to the center of the piston to the center of the wrist pin. These engines are almost 100 years old, but, there was still some pretty advanced engineering in them back at that time. Mark, we will all hope that you got your flywheel marked to go back on in the right position. Keep up this good work. Terry Wiegand South Hutchinson, Kansas 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kikta Posted July 28, 2019 Author Share Posted July 28, 2019 My flywheel is one of the things I did not remove. So this is good info in case I need to take it off in the future, I will know to Mark it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Wright Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 Use the #6 valve technique and look at the flywheel, and you will be at TDC if everything is right. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Wiegand Posted July 29, 2019 Share Posted July 29, 2019 From everything that I have read and from those who have gone through this procedure before, everything starts with the number 1 cylinder. It has been noted that the timing mark on the starter/generator shaft gear is irrelevant. Cannot argue with that. The distributor rotor can be adjusted through the distributor cam. Things can be set close enough this way to at least get the engine started and then the fine tuning begins. Anyone who thinks that setting these old engines back together is a walk in the park had better think again. There is a lot more to it than what you might think. Just my humble opinion here. Terry Wiegand South Hutchinson, Kansas 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kikta Posted July 29, 2019 Author Share Posted July 29, 2019 Today I got my oil distribution tubes back from the radiator shop. They cleaned them up, repaired the broken joint, checked all other joints out and pressure tested it to 15 PSI. I feel good that I should not have any further issues with these. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Schramm Posted August 3, 2019 Share Posted August 3, 2019 On 7/27/2019 at 6:56 PM, DonMicheletti said: Onec I had a packing nut loosen and a valve cage rotate. I was surprising how the performance dropped off so quickly. Took me a while to find the problem, I knew the offending cylinderI obviously had a miss, but no bad spark. When I pulled the cages to check for a burned valve , the mis-alignment became obvious Been there done that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Schramm Posted August 3, 2019 Share Posted August 3, 2019 On 7/28/2019 at 4:26 PM, Morgan Wright said: On the 1-6 mark on my flywheel somebody wrote "Kilroy was here." I guess there were some real wise guys in the 1920's. Doubt it. "Kilroy was here" is WWII graffiti attributed to some guy working for a ship yard. Not before WWII. If that is written on your car, then someone was working on it since WWII. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Wright Posted August 4, 2019 Share Posted August 4, 2019 10 hours ago, Larry Schramm said: Doubt it. "Kilroy was here" is WWII graffiti attributed to some guy working for a ship yard. Not before WWII. If that is written on your car, then someone was working on it since WWII. I don't know. I opened the mailbox coil and saw a letter from André addressed to Benedict Arnold. I showed it to George Washington and we won the war. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kikta Posted September 19, 2019 Author Share Posted September 19, 2019 Tonight I removed the fuel tank. I need to get it to my radiator shop where they are going to clean it and check it out for me. I was quite surprised how clean it looked. I hosed the dust off and it looked great. It looks pretty good inside too. I don’t see any rust inside at all. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubert_25-25 Posted September 19, 2019 Share Posted September 19, 2019 Wow, That doesn't even look like it needs paint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kikta Posted September 19, 2019 Author Share Posted September 19, 2019 There is a little bit of surface rust in this tank but I think it looks very good for its age. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Wright Posted September 20, 2019 Share Posted September 20, 2019 Don't ever, ever, ever, paint or coat the inside of a gas tank with anything. Anything, whatsoever. Whatever you coat it with, will sooner or later flake off and get into the gas and clog the filter screen. Plenty of people will sell you coatings for inside the tank, which may work for 5 or 10 years, but what about the guy 50 years from now, who buys the car and finds the inside of the tank was coated with all that now-deteriorating mystery coating that is falling apart into the tank? Gas tanks are made of steel, and clean steel it will be. Fill the tank with water and generous amounts of Dawn detergent, to dissolve all the crap, shake it around like crazy, and rinse with water and let it dry, or rinse with water and a final rinse with denatured alcohol, to shorten the drying time. Now you have a gas tank. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 Gas Tank ReNu Coated my tank over 30 years ago and I have a filler you can stick your fist thru so I can see whats in there. Looks like it did 30 years ago. Dawn detergent won't seal a leak. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Wright Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 If a tank is leaky from rust, it's dead. Gas Tank ReNu requires that you media blast down to the bare metal, inside and outside, because it doesn't stick to rust. If the tank leaks because of rust, media blasting will knock off more rust and make it leak much worse. I have no idea what ReNu is, whether it's paint or an epoxy or whatever, but if the gas tank is rusted to the point that it leaks, you need a new gas tank. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Wiegand Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 I just got the gasoline tank for the 1916 back from the folks out in Ohio who did the ReNu process on it. For those who do not know what this is this is where they media blast the inside of the tank and it is coated with a ceramic material then baked in an oven to cure it. I had this done several years ago for the 1920 and it has worked perfectly ever since. I'm with Brian about this process. It works and is definitely cheaper than going to the cost of having a new tank made. I will post some photos of the tank before it goes under paint. Terry Wiegand Out Doo Dah Way 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwight Romberger Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 Hi Mark, Whatever you decide to do, I would recommend using electrolysis to remove all the rust on the inside of the tank. Rust removal by electrolysis is all over YouTube. This is one with a nice explanation for doing a gas tank. https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=Cleaning+Rusty+Gas+Tank+Electrolysis&&view=detail&mid=066A7465A7B1194FA18F066A7465A7B1194FA18F&rvsmid=C50249BBAC70824F8111C50249BBAC70824F8111&FORM=VDRVRV Dwight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 Gas Tank ReNu gives a lifetime guarantee also. I have used them 4 times. All with perfect results. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian_Heil Posted September 21, 2019 Share Posted September 21, 2019 Speaking of tank leaks. I was on a tour years ago and a guy had a leak. He wrapped Teflon tape on a sheet metal screw and ran it in. Finished the tour just fine. He pulled the tank and had ReNu seal it that winter. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kikta Posted October 21, 2019 Author Share Posted October 21, 2019 I finally figured out how to get the rocker arm shafts out to inspect them and clean them up. The oil wick inside them seemed to be OK. I poured oil into the shafts and the wicks absorbed the oil just fine. After cleaning everything well I reinstalled them onto the engine and filled them with oil. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kikta Posted October 27, 2019 Author Share Posted October 27, 2019 Today I finally finished making my own version of an oil pan drain plug. I was frustrated because I could not stop the original drain from leaking. These things will likely leak plenty other places but I am not giving in on the oil pan drain. So I made this contraption on my new mini lathe and it has not leaked a drop in a half a day. I hope it works. Here are a few pictures of my design. The first picture shows the drain with the rotating plug removed. Then I put my pieces together with gaskets top and bottom and a copper gasket on the bolt on the bottom. So far so good. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Wiegand Posted October 27, 2019 Share Posted October 27, 2019 Mark, That is a good fix. It should work just fine. Terry Wiegand South Hutchinson, Kansas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Rawling Posted November 6, 2019 Share Posted November 6, 2019 I called Shell Oil Co. and talked to the technical Dept. . They told me that hypoid gear oil will eat into your bronze bushings. Look up Penrite Oil. Or, from the auto parts store, get the 90 - 185 gear oil. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubert_25-25 Posted November 6, 2019 Share Posted November 6, 2019 GL-4 is safe for bronze. GL-5 is not. Look for GL-4 on the label. Hugh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kikta Posted November 10, 2019 Author Share Posted November 10, 2019 (edited) In an effort to keep this thread current and complete, I am just re-posting some pictures that I already posted in another thread. At least they will all be here for future reference. Next step for me involved taking the rocker arm shafts apart to clean and oil before re-installing them. The wick material inside the shafts seemed to work fine as it still absorbed oil as I squirted it into the shafts. The shafts twisted out of the holders and cleaned up nicely. All rockers seemed to be free but not worn much. I was glad for that. So all rocker arms and shafts are installed. Edited November 10, 2019 by Mark Kikta (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kikta Posted November 10, 2019 Author Share Posted November 10, 2019 So next I installed lifters, push rods and holders. Before bolting the starter back on, I cleaned the sliding gears and overrun clutch as good as I could. I tried to knock the shaft out so I could take the gears apart to clean, but I could not get the shaft out. I was afraid to keep beating on it since I didn't want to brake anything, so I used several cans of brake clean and then lubricated the shaft and clutch with a light oil. Everything seems to operate as it is supposed to, so I am moving on. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kikta Posted November 10, 2019 Author Share Posted November 10, 2019 (edited) My newly re-manufactured water pump shaft fit perfectly, thanks to Larry Schramm and his work making it for me. I needed to drill the hole in the proper location to pin/bolt the oldham coupling properly so the starter would function properly. I taped a shim to the coupling spacer of sheet metal .045 in thickness to ensure I did not get the coupling mounted with too tight of clearance to the starter. I slid the coupling in place and punched a mark in the shaft so I could then remove it and use my drill press to drill properly. I ordered a 1/4 shoulder screw from McMaster-Carr and I decided to bolt the coupling to the shaft so I can then remove and replace easier as required in the future. I drilled a pilot hole in the shaft and then plan to fit the bolt after I get it. Also fitted the shaft at the timing gear end and it fit great. Edited November 10, 2019 by Mark Kikta (see edit history) 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kikta Posted November 13, 2019 Author Share Posted November 13, 2019 I finally got my new water pump shaft installed. As you can see it fits great and I used a stainless shoulder bolt to attach the coupling instead of a pin. The bolt will make it much easier to work around. On to the fan as I work my way around to the left side. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Wright Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 Did you have any problem getting that iron oil plug (for the pump shaft bearing) out of the aluminum block? Mine had an aluminum plug which was welded in and broke right off when I tried.....so much for similar metals. I had a huge problem, had to drill it out, tap a bigger hole, find a bigger plug, and clean all the aluminum shards out of the timing gear case. Luckily the gear cover was still off. I see yours is painted, have you taken it out yet? . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kikta Posted November 13, 2019 Author Share Posted November 13, 2019 Good question Morgan. I may not have removed that plug. I have taken everything else apart all around that plug but can’t remember if I have removed it before painting it. Guess I should check to be sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Wiegand Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 Mark, I see that you still have the Blue gasket material between the water pump shaft bearing and the back side of the timing gear case. Are you planning to remove that and possibly use a Silicone Sealant for the mating surfaces? Everything sure looks good and especially that new shaft. Terry Wiegand South Hutchinson, Kansas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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