Mark Kikta

1922 engine progress

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While I had everything off the bottom end,  I decided to clean the flywheel and make the timing marks easy to see.  I see the 7 Deg mark but wonder what the others are?

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Next I decided to put the valve cages back in the block.  They looked so pretty all cleaned up and reworked,  I hated to put them back into the cylinder head where I couldn’t see them any longer.

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I wanted to install the valve cages before installing the manifolds so I could make sure they didn’t turn any when I tightened them.

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1-6 is top dead center. 7° is seven degrees after top dead center.

If you are hand cranking, you want it to fire after TDC so it doesnt kick back. It is also the "full retard" ignition timing point.

 

Onec I had a packing nut loosen and a valve cage rotate. I was surprising how the performance dropped off so quickly.  Took me a while to find the problem, I knew the offending cylinderI obviously had a miss, but no bad spark. When I pulled the cages to check for a burned valve , the mis-alignment became obvious

 

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Mark, 

    Don has explained the good marks on the flywheel.  I had some of those extra marks as well.  I attributed it to the new guy on the job using the flywheel marker.   Hugh

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12 hours ago, Mark Kikta said:

All done!!

Any specs on how tight  they should be?

 

 

I did 4 grunts. I didn't think 3 grunts was tight enough.

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On this one, you have to pick which line is the 2-5 line.  The correct line is the one on the left because the ones that were done correctly at the other marks were closer to the first number.   Hugh

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I am almost certain that the cylinder number stamps are used to indicate TDC for valve adjustment.

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You must be correct because I have the 2-5 mark as well as this 3-4 Mark.

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On the  1-6  mark on my flywheel somebody wrote "Kilroy was here."

 

I guess there were some real wise guys in the 1920's.

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7 hours ago, Hubert_25-25 said:

On this one, you have to pick which line is the 2-5 line.  The correct line is the one on the left because the ones that were done correctly at the other marks were closer to the first number.   Hugh

Can't this be determined conclusively by taking the circumference of the flywheel, dividing by 360, then doing basic addition to find the distance from the #1 TDC mark?

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It turned out that the flywheel on my '18 was not indexed correctly for the #1 cylinder, so the timing marks were wrong.

I determined #1 TDC by pulling one of the #1 cylinders valve cages. I removed the valve and replaced it with a piece of threaded rod. I adjusted the rod so the it would hit the top of the piston as I rotated the flywheel slowly.

I rotated the flywheel first clockwise until the rod struck the piston and put a mark at the "timing hole". Then rotated the flywheel the opposite direction until it hit the rod  and again placed a mark.

Then I rotated the flywheel until the 2 marks were at thye 6:00 position.

#1 TDC would be between those 2 marks and I placed a new mark there . I could also put the 7° After TDC by transferring the distance from the original marks.

A lot easier that tearing the engine down to relocate the flywheel.

(note the crappy hose clamp.. shame on me)

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Don brought up a very good point.  On my '16 D-45 (and I will think that the 1922's are the same way) there are no indexing marks on the flywheel and/or the crankshaft flange studs.  I center punched one of the studs and both sides of the stud on the flywheel.  I am just wondering if the two lines on the flywheel circumference has anything to do with the fact that the centerline of the cylinder bores is offset some from the centerline of the crankshaft.  I do not remember just where, but, somewhere here on the forums, this offset has been discussed in relation to the center of the piston to the center of the wrist pin.  These engines are almost 100 years old, but, there was still some pretty advanced engineering in them back at that time.  Mark, we will all hope that you got your flywheel marked to go back on in the right position.  Keep up this good work.

 

Terry Wiegand

South Hutchinson, Kansas

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My flywheel is one of the things I did not remove.  So this is good info in case I need to take it off in the future, I will know to Mark it.

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Use the #6 valve technique and look at the flywheel, and you will be at TDC if everything is right.

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From everything that I have read and from those who have gone through this procedure before, everything starts with the number 1 cylinder.  It has been noted that the timing mark on the starter/generator shaft gear is irrelevant.  Cannot argue with that.  The distributor rotor can be adjusted through the distributor cam.  Things can be set close enough this way to at least get the engine started and then the fine tuning begins.  Anyone who thinks that setting these old engines back together is a walk in the park had better think again.  There is a lot more to it than what you might think.  Just my humble opinion here.

 

Terry Wiegand

South Hutchinson, Kansas

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Today I got my oil distribution tubes back from the radiator shop. They cleaned them up, repaired the broken joint, checked all other joints out and pressure tested it to 15 PSI. I feel good that I should not have any further issues with these.

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On ‎7‎/‎27‎/‎2019 at 6:56 PM, DonMicheletti said:

Onec I had a packing nut loosen and a valve cage rotate. I was surprising how the performance dropped off so quickly.  Took me a while to find the problem, I knew the offending cylinderI obviously had a miss, but no bad spark. When I pulled the cages to check for a burned valve , the mis-alignment became obvious

 

 

Been there done that.

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On ‎7‎/‎28‎/‎2019 at 4:26 PM, Morgan Wright said:

On the  1-6  mark on my flywheel somebody wrote "Kilroy was here."

 

I guess there were some real wise guys in the 1920's.

 

Doubt it. 


"Kilroy was here" is WWII graffiti attributed to some guy working for a ship yard. Not before WWII.   If that is written on your car, then someone was working on it since WWII.

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10 hours ago, Larry Schramm said:

 

Doubt it. 


"Kilroy was here" is WWII graffiti attributed to some guy working for a ship yard. Not before WWII.   If that is written on your car, then someone was working on it since WWII.

 

I don't know. I opened the mailbox coil and saw a letter from André addressed to Benedict Arnold. I showed it to George Washington and we won the war.

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Tonight I removed the fuel tank.  I need to get it to my radiator shop where they are going to clean it and check it out for me.  I was quite surprised how clean it looked.  I hosed the dust off and it looked great.  It looks pretty good inside too.  I don’t see any rust inside at all. 

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