12v vs. 6v

[maok]

Are the electrons the electricity or the movement of them?

[Larry Schramm]

46 minutes ago, rocketraider said:

It's all according to how your boogaloo situation stands... or so saith the Wolfman.

 

I've seen white, electric green or blue, orange, pink and purple depending on what the surrounding atmosphere being ionized contained and what the relative humidity was at the time.

 

Breaking a 230kV or 500kV buss bar disconnect can create some fancy light shows.

 

But, electricity itself is like oxygen. Colorless, odorless and, in modern circumstances, essential to life. The colors and smells associated with it are from materials in whatever application it's being used for.

 

Back to original question: if components are sized correctly and connections are clean and tight, a 6v system will work fine on vehicles designed for it.

 

Forgot yellow as in weak spark on any of our cars.

[37_Roadmaster_C]

This has gone so far OFF TOPIC that it is not even funny.  If the OP is not disgusted with where actual answers to their post went they should be!!

 

@Peter Gariepy, if any thread needs locking this is an outstanding example. It is now in your ballpark....

[Frank DuVal]

Actually even though this seems off the rails, the color of electricity, as in the color of spark is VERY IMPORTANT to troubleshooting or antique (and newer) cars! True, the OP did not ask the color of electricity, but as long as the color of the high tension spark to the plugs is blue and not yellow the system is working properly with whatever voltage system the vehicle is. 

 

So as long as a 6 volt system makes blue sparks, a change to 12 volts will not improve the ignition system!

 

 

Edited July 6 by Frank DuVal (see edit history)

[TAKerry]

10 hours ago, 37_Roadmaster_C said:

This has gone so far OFF TOPIC that it is not even funny.  If the OP is not disgusted with where actual answers to their post went they should be!!

 

@Peter Gariepy, if any thread needs locking this is an outstanding example. It is now in your ballpark....

To say off topic is an understatement, LOL. But alas as the OP I am not bothered by it. I almost expect it. I too have been guilty in the past of going off the rails. But I do appreciate all of the relevant and even the non relevant comments. I def. have learned something.

[JACK M]

Sometimes the thread drift makes for good reading.

It is a discussion forum, no?

[EmTee]

After I have converted my car from 6V to 12V, what motor oil should I use?

[Larry Schramm]

37 minutes ago, EmTee said:

After I have converted my car from 6V to 12V, what motor oil should I use?

 

Water might make it run better??

[Dandy Dave]

On 7/5/2024 at 5:37 PM, edinmass said:

Ok boys……..simple question. What color is electricity? 🤔

My arc welder puts out white lightning. 😎 But not the drinking kind like Uncle Jed and Granny made. 🤪

[rocketraider]

 

Edison was a mere wizard.

 

Tesla was a god. George Westinghouse realized that and took the electrical industry into the future using Tesla's research and technology.

 

Though I suppose Edison did have more input on low-voltage DC electrical systems, which are our topic.

 

Whether 6v or 12v is better is always open to debate. Vehicles designed for 6v will do very well with it provided the system is maintained and uses properly sized cabling with clean connections. 12v is a little more forgiving but still has to be maintained. Yes, higher voltage is generally more efficient up to a point.

 

Is a 12v conversion the answer to old car electrical issues? I don't think so. I do think it's another myth propagated by people who have little understanding of electricity and by people who stand to benefit financially by peddling such stuff.

[37_Roadmaster_C]

The real point here is that NEITHER is BETTER.  Both work equally well as designed IF they are properly maintained.  Now what do all of you say about systems like the older vehicles that have NO BATTERY systems at all?  Should they be randomly converted to 6 volt? 12 volt? 24 volt? 48 volt? 8 volt,  blah blah blah or should they all be scrapped because they do not have the BEST voltage system...  OK, I'm gone from this thread!

[Frank DuVal]

16 minutes ago, 37_Roadmaster_C said:

The real point here is that NEITHER is BETTER. 

WELL SAID!!!!!

 

17 minutes ago, 37_Roadmaster_C said:

Both work equally well as designed IF they are properly maintained. 

And there you have it! Perfectly said.🏎️🚗🚓🚋

[Steve_Mack_CT]

I will say this Kerry - as with many of us with more than one vehicle sometimes one gets shifted to the side.  I have not driven my Model A since July of 2022.  Weeks turned to months, blah blah.  My point is, I did a quick fix today on a short although a new wiring harness is really what needs to happen.  I assumed a dead battery after 2 years of sitting in the shed.  Nope!  About a 60% charge on an older NAPA Gold 6 volt battery!!  I was impressed!  I believe the construction of the 6 vokt batteries helps make them hold a charge and recover from a low charge vs. 12 volt batteries but I cannot recall the technical details on that front.  Anyway, looking forward to getting Clyde back on the road next weekend! 😊

[EmTee]

10 hours ago, Steve_Mack_CT said:

I assumed a dead battery after 2 years of sitting in the shed.  Nope!  About a 60% charge on an older NAPA Gold 6 volt battery!!  I was impressed! 

I see similar performance with the battery in my '38 Century as well as my 12V classic cars.  I think the key is the battery needs to be fully charged when put into storage and the car either needs a battery disconnect switch or a cable removed to ensure no stray current draw.  I put my battery tender on my batteries every couple of months to keep them 'full' and discovered the tender only needed ~10 minutes to top-off the charge.

 

Newer cars with ECM, BCM, TCS, etc. are a different story.  Those computers will kill a battery if left idle and connected without a battery tender...

[Steve_Mack_CT]

@EmTee yep a side note what sidelined my A was the fact I parked it and was messing with tightening the aftermarket float-a-motor mounts.  The rubber doughnuts expanded pinching the brake/tail light wires that run inside the frame.  This caused a short and a blown fuse.  So, to your point, no drain on the battery which no doubt helped it to remain charged.

[Bloo]

In my opinion battery tenders are a good idea on anything.

 

6 volt batteries that sat around in the winter never fared well around here. Back in the 70s and 80s if a battery sat around it got forgotten. If my dad or I got 2 years out of an "occasional use" 6 volt, it was a miracle. I year was more typical. If you let them sit for more than a few hours discharged, it damages them. Sometimes they still sort of work, but they are never the same. Also they can freeze.

 

Every 6 volt around here now is more than 2 years old. One of them is 10 years old. All are still working fine. The difference is night and day.

[Matt Harwood]

We go through a lot of cars and a lot of batteries and I haven't found that Battery Tenders make batteries last longer. We use them, but batteries still die fairly regularly. Mostly we use them to top off batteries periodically by moving them from car to car. But there have been multiple times when the Tender showed a full charge and the battery was toast (including most recently on my 1941 Buick). I have seen no functional difference in longevity between using a Tender and simply disconnecting the battery.

[Larry Schramm]

5 hours ago, EmTee said:

Newer cars with ECM, BCM, TCS, etc. are a different story.  Those computers will kill a battery if left idle and connected without a battery tender...

 

In about 30 days or less.

[Reynard]

[mrspeedyt]

and how about positive ground verses negative ground?

[Lee H]

21 hours ago, Bloo said:

Every 6 volt around here now is more than 2 years old. One of them is 10 years old. All are still working fine. The difference is night and day.

That has been my experience as well. I’ve always had 3 to 5 seldom-driven 6 and 12v cars for the last 40 or more years. And for about half that time I did not use battery tenders. I would disconnect batteries, and charge them every month or two (when I remembered). And probably averaged less than 3 years life, if that.

 

Since I started always using maintainers, battery life has at least doubled, and right now the 6v cars are at 6 and 9-1/2 years, and the 12’s are at ca. 5 and 8 years. 
 

I know this is all anecdotal, but I think the reason is that keeping the batteries at 100% all the time doesn’t allow sulfation, and that is what really kills batteries.