46 woodie Posted November 28, 2022 Share Posted November 28, 2022 What are the recommended nails/tacks used for anchoring "Hide-Em" welting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldford Posted November 28, 2022 Share Posted November 28, 2022 I use staples with 3/8" long legs. just insert the staple gun between the two ribs and slide along as you insert the staples... easy peasy Frank Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
46 woodie Posted November 29, 2022 Author Share Posted November 29, 2022 Thank's Old Ford, I'm going into maple that is very hard. Can I use a T-50 hand staple machine or do I need a power staple machine? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skvitt Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 From my own experience, I didn't have a good luck with hand machine, always used pneumatic staple gun. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 (edited) In my opinion you are going to want an air staple gun. That, or learn to spit tacks. Edited November 29, 2022 by Bloo (see edit history) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldford Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 air powered staple gun... easier and staples can be pulled when you step back and view the hidem has a wave in it (cause it will) Frank 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chistech Posted November 29, 2022 Share Posted November 29, 2022 if the hidem is used on the exterior use stainless steel staples and I’ve tried all ways to staple. The ONLY thing that works is a pneumatic stapler. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akstraw Posted November 30, 2022 Share Posted November 30, 2022 Maybe not what you want to hear, but I recently restored an early thirties car and used hand-driven tacks in the hidem welt. I have used staples in the past, but have found that upon close inspection, one could see the staples. I wanted this project to withstand rigorous inspection, so I hand-tacked the welting. For tacks, you have to make some type of spreader tool so that your tack hammer doesn’t damage the welting. A fine point punch helps, too. It takes much longer than stapling, but has the authentic old-school look that I was after. I won a class award at a concours with that car, so maybe it helped. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chistech Posted November 30, 2022 Share Posted November 30, 2022 There are two techniques to keep the hidem from “rocking” side to side when a stapler is used. If you simply run the stapler head directly down the middle of the hidem, it will rock side to side if pushed on. You can inset the stapler head in the hidem and then twist the gun which puts each leg of the staple out more to the edge preventing the hidem from rocking. You can also double staple, by pushing the staple gun head to one side of the spread hidem then the other. There is room to do it that way when using a good gun with a narrow head. The biggest issue with hidem is having the air pressure right. Too little the staple and the hidem is too loose. Too much pressure and you can break he wire in the hidem causing the welt to break off the car. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmTee Posted November 30, 2022 Share Posted November 30, 2022 I bought an air stapler because I couldn't get the head of my manual T-50 gun to fit tightly against the work. The pneumatic staple gun has a narrow head that is easy to get into tight spaces. I tried using tacks, but their 'wedge' shape seemed to make them prone to loosening. My experience was that the thin staple wire was easier to hide than the tack head... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
46 woodie Posted November 30, 2022 Author Share Posted November 30, 2022 Thank you to all that have replied to my question. I think I'll invest in a pneumatic staple gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chistech Posted December 1, 2022 Share Posted December 1, 2022 23 hours ago, EmTee said: I bought an air stapler because I couldn't get the head of my manual T-50 gun to fit tightly against the work. The pneumatic staple gun has a narrow head that is easy to get into tight spaces. I tried using tacks, but their 'wedge' shape seemed to make them prone to loosening. My experience was that the thin staple wire was easier to hide than the tack head... I used to hand tack a lot of stuff on these old cars until I ran out of old manufacture black tacks. The new Chinese made galvanized tacks are terrible. Luckily at a yard sale I bought a large assortment of old Atlas brand black tacks. Hopefully it’s enough to do me until I’m no longer doing cars. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chistech Posted December 1, 2022 Share Posted December 1, 2022 (edited) On 11/29/2022 at 6:38 PM, oldford said: air powered staple gun... easier and staples can be pulled when you step back and view the hidem has a wave in it (cause it will) Frank That’s why I avoid hidem as much as I can. I specialize installing roofs on old GM pre wars and I use the aluminum molding as original where most shops use the hidem. I custom made my own bender for the aluminum molding for making the corner radiuses. Hidem doesn’t look good when it’s used on a roof as on the corners of a roof. Edited December 1, 2022 by chistech (see edit history) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Posted December 1, 2022 Share Posted December 1, 2022 How does the aluminum molding attach and how does it seal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted December 1, 2022 Share Posted December 1, 2022 Anyone else remember when tacks were advertised as "sterilized" because upholsterers would keep them in their mouths when working? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3makes Posted December 1, 2022 Share Posted December 1, 2022 And if you were good at "spitting tacks" you could hold three different sizes in your mouth. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trimacar Posted December 1, 2022 Share Posted December 1, 2022 10 minutes ago, Restorer32 said: Anyone else remember when tacks were advertised as "sterilized" because upholsterers would keep them in their mouths when working? I sure do, though I still put tacks in my mouth…haven’t seen “sterilized” for years… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chistech Posted December 1, 2022 Share Posted December 1, 2022 59 minutes ago, trimacar said: I sure do, though I still put tacks in my mouth…haven’t seen “sterilized” for years… Mine are actually rusty! Sometimes I get "orange" mouth! LOL. I was told that the saliva in your mouth would help the black tacks rust enough to help hold them in the wood better. Not sure if that's true but sounds good at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chistech Posted December 1, 2022 Share Posted December 1, 2022 6 hours ago, Bloo said: How does the aluminum molding attach and how does it seal? The aluminum is shaped in an "L" and is screwed down on the roof after holes are drilled and counter sunk. Then the aluminum gets swaged over which covers the screws. I'll post some pictures later if you want. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zdillinger Posted December 1, 2022 Share Posted December 1, 2022 4 minutes ago, chistech said: The aluminum is shaped in an "L" and is screwed down on the roof after holes are drilled and counter sunk. Then the aluminum gets swaged over which covers the screws. I'll post some pictures later if you want. I would definitely appreciate seeing this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
46 woodie Posted December 2, 2022 Author Share Posted December 2, 2022 '41-'48 Ford is different. The front of the roof uses a metal tack strip with a rubber insert. The sides have metal gutters that nail to the roof sides with a rubber insert to cover the nail head's and the rear uses the hide-em welt. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chistech Posted December 2, 2022 Share Posted December 2, 2022 Here are some pictures of the molding, the molding fitted on the car, the front roof edge molding, and the finished roof. There is a whole procedure I use when doing a roof, special templates, and tools that I designed. I used to explain the whole process in detail then found I was having other upholsterers (who weren’t admitting they were upholsterers) calling me up asking about my whole process to use it themselves for profit. It does yield the fastest and best results of any other technique in my opinion, and have never had one customer not like their roof. I’ve had cars brought to me from many miles and hours away just for the roof, which in honesty, surprises me sometimes Because of that I no longer go into details nor do I show pictures of the bender I designed and built for the moldings. 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Roth Posted December 3, 2022 Share Posted December 3, 2022 On 12/1/2022 at 9:58 AM, trimacar said: I sure do, though I still put tacks in my mouth…haven’t seen “sterilized” for years… Please don't hiccup 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trimacar Posted December 3, 2022 Share Posted December 3, 2022 1 hour ago, Marty Roth said: Please don't hiccup Or swallow! Once, at White Post Restorations, my fellow trimmer spit some tacks into a commode. A fellow visiting the shop came out of the bathroom, said damn, you trimmers are tough guys, you spit and s**t tacks… 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flivverking Posted December 3, 2022 Share Posted December 3, 2022 Depends on new wood or old previous nail trashed old dry wood. 1931 Ford redo top in the 30s, 12 oz tacks for material. Drip and trim finish moldings ,one inch flat head nails spaces 4 to 5 inches... adjust for crappy wood. Do not forget to seal all exposed edges with something to prevent leaks in the future. Every original top I replaced had some tar shit goop between the top material and wood or steel body panel edge and some kind of sealer done after the finished moldings applied ,(1923-1936) my experience. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
46 woodie Posted December 8, 2022 Author Share Posted December 8, 2022 I purchased an Arrow pneumatic staple gun from Lowe's and stainless steel staples and it worked out great. Chistech your recommendation of staggering the staple was spot on. For the life of me I don't know why the shop that originally installed the top on my station wagon wagon 20 years ago did not use stainless steel staples. After 20 years of driving and getting caught in the rain many times most of the steel staples were gone. Thank's again for your advice. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pfeil Posted December 8, 2022 Share Posted December 8, 2022 On 11/28/2022 at 12:31 PM, 46 woodie said: What are the recommended nails/tacks used for anchoring "Hide-Em" welting. Just curious. Is this the same type of tack used in VW Beetles up through the mid 60's to hold carpet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60ch Posted December 8, 2022 Share Posted December 8, 2022 cristech, Very well done roof work, absolutely beautiful. It is always a shame to see a nicely painted car with a badly done roof. Thank you for the photos and the explanation of your process. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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