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"Hide-Em" Welting


46 woodie

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Maybe not what you want to hear, but I recently restored an early thirties car and used hand-driven tacks in the hidem welt.  I have used staples in the past, but have found that upon close inspection, one could see the staples.  I wanted this project to withstand rigorous inspection, so I hand-tacked the welting.   For tacks, you have to make some type of spreader tool so that your tack hammer doesn’t damage the welting.  A fine point punch helps, too.  It takes much longer than stapling, but has the authentic old-school look that I was after.   I won a class award at a concours with that car, so maybe it helped.

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There are two techniques to keep the hidem from “rocking” side to side when a stapler is used. If you simply run the stapler head directly down the middle of the hidem, it will rock side to side if pushed on. You can inset the stapler head in the hidem and then twist the gun which puts each leg of the staple out more to the edge preventing the hidem from rocking. You can also double staple, by pushing the staple gun head to one side of the spread hidem then the other. There is room to do it that way when using a good gun with a narrow head. The biggest issue with hidem is having the air pressure right. Too little the staple and the hidem is too loose. Too much pressure and you can break he wire in the hidem causing the welt to break off the car.

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I bought an air stapler because I couldn't get the head of my manual T-50 gun to fit tightly against the work.  The pneumatic staple gun has a narrow head that is easy to get into tight spaces.  I tried using tacks, but their 'wedge' shape seemed to make them prone to loosening.  My experience was that the thin staple wire was easier to hide than the tack head...

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23 hours ago, EmTee said:

I bought an air stapler because I couldn't get the head of my manual T-50 gun to fit tightly against the work.  The pneumatic staple gun has a narrow head that is easy to get into tight spaces.  I tried using tacks, but their 'wedge' shape seemed to make them prone to loosening.  My experience was that the thin staple wire was easier to hide than the tack head...

I used to hand tack a lot of stuff on these old cars until I ran out of old manufacture black tacks. The new Chinese made galvanized tacks are terrible. Luckily at a yard sale I bought a large assortment of old Atlas brand black tacks. Hopefully it’s enough to do me until I’m no longer doing cars.

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On 11/29/2022 at 6:38 PM, oldford said:

air powered staple gun... easier and staples can be pulled when you step back and view the hidem has a wave in it (cause it will)

 

Frank

That’s why I avoid hidem as much as I can. I specialize installing roofs on old GM pre wars and I use the aluminum molding as original where most shops  use the hidem. I custom made my own bender for the aluminum molding for making the corner radiuses. Hidem doesn’t look good when it’s used on a roof as on the corners of a roof.

Edited by chistech (see edit history)
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10 minutes ago, Restorer32 said:

Anyone else remember when tacks were advertised as "sterilized" because upholsterers would keep them in their mouths when working?

I sure do, though I still put tacks in my mouth…haven’t seen “sterilized” for years…

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59 minutes ago, trimacar said:

I sure do, though I still put tacks in my mouth…haven’t seen “sterilized” for years…

Mine are actually rusty! Sometimes I get "orange" mouth! LOL. I was told that the saliva in your mouth would help the black tacks rust enough to help hold them in the wood better. Not sure if that's true but sounds good at least. 

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6 hours ago, Bloo said:

How does the aluminum molding attach and how does it seal?

The aluminum is shaped in an "L" and is screwed down on the roof after holes are drilled and counter sunk. Then the aluminum gets swaged over which covers the screws. I'll post some pictures later if you want.

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4 minutes ago, chistech said:

The aluminum is shaped in an "L" and is screwed down on the roof after holes are drilled and counter sunk. Then the aluminum gets swaged over which covers the screws. I'll post some pictures later if you want.

I would definitely appreciate seeing this.

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'41-'48 Ford is different. The front of the roof uses a metal tack strip with a rubber insert. The sides have  metal gutters that nail to the roof sides with a rubber insert to cover the nail head's and the rear uses the hide-em welt.

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Here are some pictures of the molding, the molding fitted on the car, the front roof edge molding, and the finished roof. There is a whole procedure I use when doing a roof, special templates, and tools that I designed. I used to explain the whole process in detail then found I was having other upholsterers (who weren’t admitting they were upholsterers) calling me up asking about my whole process to use it themselves for profit. It does yield the fastest and best results of any other technique in my opinion, and have never had one customer not like their roof. I’ve had cars brought to me from many miles and hours away just for the roof, which in honesty, surprises me sometimes Because of that I no longer go into details nor do I show pictures of the bender I designed and built for the moldings. 

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On 12/1/2022 at 9:58 AM, trimacar said:

I sure do, though I still put tacks in my mouth…haven’t seen “sterilized” for years…

Please don't hiccup

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1 hour ago, Marty Roth said:

Please don't hiccup

Or swallow!   Once, at White Post Restorations,  my fellow trimmer spit some tacks into a commode.  A fellow visiting the shop came out of the bathroom, said damn, you trimmers are tough guys, you spit and s**t tacks…

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Depends on new wood or old previous nail trashed old dry wood. 
1931 Ford redo top in the 30s, 12 oz tacks for material.

Drip and trim finish  moldings ,one inch  flat head nails spaces 4 to 5 inches... adjust for crappy wood.
Do not forget to seal all exposed edges with something to prevent leaks in the future. Every original top I replaced had some tar shit goop between the top material and wood or steel body panel edge and some kind of sealer done after the finished moldings  applied ,(1923-1936) my experience. 

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I purchased an Arrow pneumatic staple gun from Lowe's and stainless steel staples and it worked out great. Chistech your recommendation of staggering the staple was spot on. For the life of me I don't know why the shop that originally installed the top on my station wagon wagon 20 years ago did not use stainless steel staples. After 20 years of driving and getting caught in the rain many times most of the steel staples were gone. Thank's again for your advice.

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