John Lynn Posted August 8, 2018 Share Posted August 8, 2018 How do I get the red line back to its normal position. I do not want to dismantle it as it is a very rare piece and I don't want to break anything ! I have just purchased this motometer and it looks like it has been stored on its side causing the red line to fill the tube. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spinneyhill Posted August 8, 2018 Share Posted August 8, 2018 The "red line" is coloured alcohol. It should have a bulb at the bottom full of it. The alcohol expands and contracts with temperature and thus rises and falls in the tube. The tube being full like that probably means the tube is broken. You will have to dismantle it to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted August 8, 2018 Share Posted August 8, 2018 It may be like that forever. The Moto-Meter on my father's 1925 Buick fell over one winter on the workbench and looked exactly like that afterwards. He put it back on the car and even with engine heat and a lot of driving, it never flowed back to the bottom. Years of trying but it never changed. The element might be replaceable, but I think it's unlikely that you'll be able to get it to flow back to the bottom ever again. Sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted August 8, 2018 Share Posted August 8, 2018 (edited) Don't be too afraid of dismantling a "rare" part. The only thing really rare about it is the nameplate inside. You could actually find a good, working one on Ebay or elsewhere and change out the nameplate. Just be sure you find the same size Motometer. I have had a few of these and you just have to be careful of the potmetal parts when you dissect it. Edited August 8, 2018 by keiser31 (see edit history) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted August 8, 2018 Share Posted August 8, 2018 (edited) I realize you may want to keep it all original, but here's an example....https://www.ebay.com/itm/Antique-1918-Boyce-MotoMeter-Midget-Model-Automobile-Radiator-Gauge-Model-T/183357946299?hash=item2ab0fc39bb%3Ag%3AxOcAAOSwkeBbY4pX&_sacat=0&_nkw=Motometer&_from=R40&rt=nc&_trksid=p2060353.m570.l1313.TR12.TRC2.A0.H0.XMotometer.TRS0 Edited August 8, 2018 by keiser31 (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26-25Buick Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 Try the tapping process. It worked for me http://forums.aaca.org/topic/81984-boyce-motometer-repair/#comment-346812 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 Hi John, There is probably nothing wrong with it, don't take it apart or mess with it. Tapping it gently until it comes down, or rotating it, by spinning it taped to a bicycle rear wheel, will probably do it. Centrifical force will do the rest. Google it first, before you try it. Let us know if it works. Good Luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonMicheletti Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 Sometimes, and only sometimes, putting the whole thing in the freezer for a day or so will cause the fluid to go down. A long shot. You are probably out of luck on that one. You will not be able to fix anything by taking it apart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JACK M Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 I remember my mom shaking the thermometer down before sticking it where the sun don't shine. I wish that I didn't remember that and I wish I hadn't thought of it just now. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexRiv_63 Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 Try the shakedown method like Jack M said but it has never worked for me. That is a rare one, a Universal Type E, another will be hard to find but not impossible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubert_25-25 Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 John, I have 4 of these motometers that I have bought off Ebay and Craigslist for my 1925 Buick, and all of them were entirely red. I have been able to shake all of them down. I spent 20 minutes on one though. The others took less time. Here are some tips. 1) Separate the cap portion from the motometer. It probably needs a new gasket anyway. The nut should be brass. Best to use a 6 point socket if you can. If it has a lock washer, it is usually corroded, replace it with a stainless or bronze star washer. You can get a new star washer and gaskets at McMaster Carr. - radiator cap washer 90131A327 (You will need to trim this) - Bronze internal tooth lock washer for 5/8 screw 92165A055 - (I can't find the part number for the 5/8 rubber gasket, but you can select one from their website.) The main reason that I go thru this step is that you can shake them down with the cap, but it is a little harder on your wrist due to the extra weight. I always remove the dogbone style because they are very heavy. 2) Shake them like an old school thermometer. Kind of a flick of the wrist. They need a quick jerk stop to get the fluid to the bottom. 3) Occasionally bump them on a tire as the Boyce instruction suggest. Use a bike tire that is not low on air, as they are a little more forgiving than a car tire. I thought the shaking did the most good, but I think the tire approach makes sense too. I have yet to get one of these working, and I look for cheap ones that are all red because people think they are broken. Always keep them upright afterwards. I made a storage box for them until I can restore them all the way. One was renickeled and it went thru the process in good shape. www.restorationstuff.com carries parts for the motometer. Hugh 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty_OToole Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 My thought is to tie it to a string and whirl it around for a few minutes. You would have to rig it so the meter is bottom outwards, and make sure it can't come loose or hit anything, use a strong cord or light chain and wrap it up in some kind of padded bag just in case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vintageben Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 There was a great article in a vintage Ford magazine about fixing this sort of thing. They used a old school bench grinder the sort you turn by hand and made brackets up to mount the motormeter where the grinding wheel would normally go. Then simply turn the handle as these grinders were geared you got better centrifugal forces . I would copy the article but I’m not even sure where I put it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Lynn Posted August 16, 2018 Author Share Posted August 16, 2018 On 8/9/2018 at 8:31 AM, John Lynn said: How do I get the red line back to its normal position. I do not want to dismantle it as it is a very rare piece and I don't want to break anything ! I have just purchased this motometer and it looks like it has been stored on its side causing the red line to fill the tube. Thanks to everyone who has replied - Im still waiting for it to arrive from Norway of all places !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Lynn Posted August 16, 2018 Author Share Posted August 16, 2018 Thanks to everyone who has replied - plenty for me to try. Im still waiting for it to arrive from Norway of all places !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hans1 Posted August 17, 2018 Share Posted August 17, 2018 You can take glass retainers off, then look between the two shield faces, there is likely some translucent celuloide there. It likely has a hole in it just the size of the hole in shields. T The celluloid is supposed to cover the hole so when driving at night oncoming headlights would illuminate the celluloid and enable driver to see if red color was up to that area , indicating coolant getting to hot. This will make your Motor Meter more authentic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubert_25-25 Posted August 17, 2018 Share Posted August 17, 2018 What is the celluloid equivalent that is available today. My old ones have turned yellow and some are brown. Some completely opaque. Is this just a piece of plastic, or is this something special? Some look like frosted glass that are not as weathered. Were they ever clear originally? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hans1 Posted August 17, 2018 Share Posted August 17, 2018 From my library, little info is available except that the celluloid diffused light to see fluid level in window ( Hole ) at night. I think you could use a piece of visqueen, the stuff used for house wrap. Some of my multi meters have very good condition celluloid where they were covered by the shields. I just turn them over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubert_25-25 Posted August 17, 2018 Share Posted August 17, 2018 Here are 2 of the original celluloids. I guess one is a daytime only version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexRiv_63 Posted August 17, 2018 Share Posted August 17, 2018 The purists won't like it but a piece of Scotch Magic Tape looks like the celluloid when assembled. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty_OToole Posted August 17, 2018 Share Posted August 17, 2018 (edited) A quick search revealed that sheet celluloid is still available. Artists acetate sheets might be the easiest to get. If you drove a lot at night there was an accessory spotlight that mounted on the cowl just to illuminate the moto meter. Edited August 17, 2018 by Rusty_OToole (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trini Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 I have a motor meter from a D. B. but it is 3 inches in diameter. It may be from a different model, not from my 28 Senior, Restoration Supply has refill for the 3 and 3/8 at 45 dollars. Is the senior motor meter 3 and 3/8 ? What I have does not look like it is made of white metal, The washer nor the housing will not drill out, too hard. I tried putting in it in the fridge, in ice and tapping it on the tyre, but no luck .Any Ideas ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hans1 Posted August 28, 2018 Share Posted August 28, 2018 I can not speak to the size of a DB motormeter. //////////// The installation of a thermometer in the housing is quite a job. ( comments from my experience ) The housing has a swaged cap on the end, carefully have the rolled over edge ground off very carefully. To save the cap. The real problem is the compound that is the bedding that locates and hold the thermometer in place. I do not know what it is, but it resembles plaster of paris with some other items to protect it. With the proper size thermometer you need to position it's calibration mark to coincide with the mark on the face plate. For accuracy, you will need to make sure the Index line on the glass tube is correlated to the line on the face plate. If you purchase a different size thermometer you will have to interpolate the proper position using the calibration marks. A larger manometer may likely be positioned to high and thus the red manometer fluid could read to high a temp. Likely, you may not be able to trust the reading. Lots to consider! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trini Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 Hans 1, you are right on the button. The washer was inserted and the "pipe" is squeezed inwards (swaged). I will try using a dremel tool with a small file. It will take lots of patience. Once I get the washer removed I will drill out the plaster seal. There is a piece of plastic at the back. These plastic s can be found in common packaging used for house door locks and a host of articles , Use some crazy glue to stick it. Thank you Hans 1. for your advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexRiv_63 Posted August 29, 2018 Share Posted August 29, 2018 On 8/27/2018 at 7:33 PM, trini said: I have a motor meter from a D. B. but it is 3 inches in diameter. It may be from a different model, not from my 28 Senior, Restoration Supply has refill for the 3 and 3/8 at 45 dollars. Is the senior motor meter 3 and 3/8 ? What I have does not look like it is made of white metal, The washer nor the housing will not drill out, too hard. I tried putting in it in the fridge, in ice and tapping it on the tyre, but no luck .Any Ideas ? Does your meter look like this? The 3" diameter model is the Universal series and usually has the logo plate with the silver band around the outer edge. The larger 3 3/8" diameter meter is the Standard series with no silver band on the logo plate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trini Posted August 30, 2018 Share Posted August 30, 2018 No, It is not like that. I sent 2 pictures to Keiser 31 and asked him to upload them on this column for me. I do not know how to upload pictures on this column as yet. Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubert_25-25 Posted August 30, 2018 Share Posted August 30, 2018 Working on alternatives for replacement celluloid for the thermometer window. Scotch tape was real close, but I was afraid any dust would get on the stricky portion of the tape. When I tried to put 2 pieces of tape back to back, it was difficult to keep the air bubbles out. I cut milk jug plastic too since it is already frosted, but it was just not right. The original celluloid is .010 thick, and is shown on the right on top of my calipers. On the left of the calipers is .010 packaging plastic that I rubbed with 2000 sandpaper. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spinneyhill Posted August 30, 2018 Share Posted August 30, 2018 I just hope that plastic doesn't yellow in UV light! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hans1 Posted August 30, 2018 Share Posted August 30, 2018 The pieces are so easy to change................make several and change 'em out as desired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trini Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 The pictures I emailed to Keiser 31 has returned . Address changed. At the back where the hole is there is the Dodge Brothers Logo. On the face there are a few instructions and parallel lines. There are no silver ring , no barley surround. Just plain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Lynn Posted August 31, 2018 Author Share Posted August 31, 2018 Hi Lots of people corresponding on this issue. I am still waiting for my motometer to arrive from overseas before I attempt to fix the red line problem. I have posted photos on my post dated 17th August. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trini Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 On Ebay there is a motor meter for sale, price 110 dollars. The description says it fits D B Senior from the years 1923, 1924, 1925, 1926, and 1927. From what I know the D B Senior was made only in 1928. I stand corrected. What is the correct size of the Moto Meter for the 1928 Senior ? This Motor I have is 3 inches in diameter and the stem fits in the hole of the dog bone rad cap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexRiv_63 Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 15 hours ago, trini said: On Ebay there is a motor meter for sale, price 110 dollars. The description says it fits D B Senior from the years 1923, 1924, 1925, 1926, and 1927. From what I know the D B Senior was made only in 1928. I stand corrected. What is the correct size of the Moto Meter for the 1928 Senior ? This Motor I have is 3 inches in diameter and the stem fits in the hole of the dog bone rad cap All Motometers were made as universal fit items with generic logo plates, then you could buy a car brand specific logo plate separately and substitute it. I have seen DB logo plates used in all size meters from the Midget to the Standard. The only thing that would be unique to your DB Senior is the size of the actual cap, not the meter itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trini Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 Thank you very much, Restoration supply has refills @50 dollars but for the larger Motor Meter only. I can try and remove the insert on my 3 inch motor meter but where can I buy a refill ? The next move is to get a good used large housing with a bad insert and get a new refil from Restoration Supply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexRiv_63 Posted September 3, 2018 Share Posted September 3, 2018 On 9/1/2018 at 2:22 PM, trini said: Thank you very much, Restoration supply has refills @50 dollars but for the larger Motor Meter only. I can try and remove the insert on my 3 inch motor meter but where can I buy a refill ? The next move is to get a good used large housing with a bad insert and get a new refil from Restoration Supply. In my opinion it is not worth the money or time to do that type of repair. Universal style meters like yours are commonly available all the time on ebay and many are in working condition. Look for one without a car brand logo plate since they are cheaper. Once you have a working thermometer with a good housing you can very easily swap the DB logo plate and even the bezels from the one you have and have a complete working unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Henderson Posted September 3, 2018 Share Posted September 3, 2018 On 8/13/2018 at 11:31 AM, Rusty_OToole said: My thought is to tie it to a string and whirl it around for a few minutes. You would have to rig it so the meter is bottom outwards, and make sure it can't come loose or hit anything, use a strong cord or light chain and wrap it up in some kind of padded bag just in case. Exactly what I have done a dozen times, works like a charm, and no dismantling is needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubert_25-25 Posted September 8, 2018 Share Posted September 8, 2018 The new motometers are a nice way to go. They are chrome plated. I used an old one because I wanted it Nickel plated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Venable Posted May 17, 2019 Share Posted May 17, 2019 I wished I would have seen your text on your motometer earlier all you would have had to do is go out to a spare tire and bounced it slowly until the red went down to normal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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