Period images to relieve some of the stress

[hddennis]

4 hours ago, alsancle said:

 

 

The Cord E1.   Then and now.    Note the usual "upgrades" that happened during restoration.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I've got to ask. How did it gain 3 feet in wheelbase??

 

Howard Dennis

[twin6]

[twin6]

Don't know the make of car, but there are plenty of clues for the sleuths.  Plate is 1913 Quebec (dealer).

[alsancle]

1 hour ago, hddennis said:

 

 

I've got to ask. How did it gain 3 feet in wheelbase??

 

Howard Dennis

 

I think the wheelbases are close.   But  The doors are hinged differently.   I need to go back and research that,  so much for doing things on my phone.

[Bloo]

Well....

 

Look at the position of the front axle relative to the radiator shell.

 

Look at the headlights. Are they the same? It could be the camera angle, but at the least I don't think they are in the same position.

 

The contour of the front fender looks the same, as well as the sidemount's position in it, but look at where the sidemount is located compared to the cowl/hood joint. It is about a foot different.

 

Taking all that into account, it looks as though the front fenders, sidemounts, front axle, and headlights have moved about a foot forward in relation to the hood and radiator shell. Look at how much more of the hood vents are blocked by the sidemount. You can see the extra foot of flat area at the rear of the front fenders needed to reach the running boards, which in both cases begin at the back of the cowl. Speaking of the cowl, it's light has gone missing.

 

The cowl and windshield frame do appear to be the same, but look at the hood, and the body line heading forward from the cowl. On the current picture, the line intersects the headlight about 1/3 of the way down, and on the period picture it is way above the headlight, intersecting the radiator shell at the grille's upper corner. Yet, somehow, both lines are straight from the front to the rear of the car. That implies that the line in question must also be at a different angle on the body behind the cowl.

 

The window holes in the doors have their bottom edge below the height of the cowl on the recent picture, and above the height of the cowl on the period picture. You can also see the difference in how the bottom of the windshield holes align with the windshield frame. Not only do those doors have different window holes, the front one swings the opposite way and the release handles are different. The rear quarter window is larger, a different shape, and the rear roof contour is different. Speaking of the roof, it appears to be crowned over the windshield on the recent picture and not on the period one.

 

Those are the most obvious things. There are many more if you look closely.

 

 

Edited January 28, 2022 by Bloo (see edit history)

[nzcarnerd]

10 hours ago, alsancle said:

 

 

The Cord E1.   Then and now.    Note the usual "upgrades" that happened during restoration.

 

 

 

 

I think Duesenberg sedan in the b/w photo, and the Cord E-1 are two different  - unrelated - cars?

 

E-1 Cord (tomstrongman.com)

[58L-Y8]

7 hours ago, alsancle said:

I have to find the history but yes, the body has moved around over the years.

AJ:

Check Fred Roe, page 146, Judkins

 

"The Murphy clear vision convertible sedan looks great on any chassis.   I know they were mounted on Duesenberg,  Packard, Rolls, Minerva.  Any others?"

1927-'28 Hudson Super Six

 

Steve

[58L-Y8]

Anyone recognize the make of this convertible?

[keiser31]

12 minutes ago, 58L-Y8 said:

Anyone recognize the make of this convertible?

1934 or so BMW.

Edited January 28, 2022 by keiser31 (see edit history)

[nzcarnerd]

18 hours ago, twin6 said:

Don't know the make of car, but there are plenty of clues for the sleuths.  Plate is 1913 Quebec (dealer).

First answer I have had on this one is 1913 McLaughlin Model 31. Perhaps these ones with gas side lamps are from very slightly earlier?

 

 

 

[nzcarnerd]

31 minutes ago, keiser31 said:

1934 or so BMW.

There looks to have been a confusing range of models for a few years there -   BMW 303 - Wikipedia

 

I think I would go with Model 315 - 

 

 

The sports version was the 315/1. Note the front suspension - not visible in other photos.

 

 

[alsancle]

1 hour ago, 58L-Y8 said:

AJ:

Check Fred Roe, page 146, Judkins

 

"The Murphy clear vision convertible sedan looks great on any chassis.   I know they were mounted on Duesenberg,  Packard, Rolls, Minerva.  Any others?"

1927-'28 Hudson Super Six

 

Steve

Thanks Steve. I really messed that up. I need glasses and a bigger phone.

[nzcarnerd]

A photo from the Hamilton, New Zealand, library. It is unfortunate that so many think that all old cars were Model Ts.

 

I reckon the car here is a four cylinder Buick - circa 1916-17.

 

 

 

 

[George K]

2 hours ago, nzcarnerd said:

I think Duesenberg sedan in the b/w photo, and the Cord E-1 are two different  - unrelated - cars?

 

E-1 Cord (tomstrongman.com)

That’s the car I saw. Plato Center is next to Pingree Grove. Thanks 

[LCK81403]

This is an interesting photo; haven't seen it until now.  Presumably the time is about 1934 or 1935.  The race officials and / or security people are a mixture of services.  At least three of the men belong to the Nazi Party's Sturmabteilung, otherwise known as the "S.A." and brown shirts; they are the one's wearing "coffee can" style kepi hats and Party armbands.  Two of the men wear saucer type hats, and the cut of their tunics does not appear to be more modern military cut of the later 1930s, but the style may be left over from the post World War One years.  The two men wearing Party armbands at the right of the photo, wearing dark tone clothing, sport unique looking head gear (one having eye goggle on his head).  They possibly belong to the NSKK organization (Nationalsozialistisches Kraftfahrkorps, or National Socialist Motor Corps).  Visual evidence taken together, this race appears to be a propaganda stunt.

[George K]

I found this blurb in a 2013 Hemmings Peeless story. This is the man who had the body on that E-1.

[John_Mereness]

On 1/28/2022 at 6:44 AM, alsancle said:

 

 

The Cord E1.   Then and now.    Note the usual "upgrades" that happened during restoration.

 

 

 

 

 

Backtrack: 

Not the same cars bodies (note the considerable differences). 

That said, there were supposedly a pair of bodies and/or grills found and the other was maroon in color. 

Did a bunch of parts from one get transplanted to the other (yes, I bet so) ?   

I have asked for years for pictures of this car as new and - no cigar.   

The body is what it is (and huge),  the grill is what it is, the runningboards and splash aprons are said to be original too, and the front fenders I believe came off the Haynes Bodied Special Coupe (and very similar to the Brooks Stevens car), plus the engine is said to have come from the powerplant (ie, so the chassis, hood, a mega bunch of trim, and ... were a whatever done during restoration)

Edited January 29, 2022 by John_Mereness (see edit history)

[John_Mereness]

On 1/27/2022 at 4:26 PM, edinmass said:

 

1931 V-8 355A delivery check list.......

 

 

O'oh - a 5-1 gear ration - lets go mountain climbing.

[nzcarnerd]

A photo taken in the domain in Hamilton, New Zealand. It well illustrates the government's preference that New Zealanders should drive British cars.  In the post WW2 era only a very small percentage of the cars sold in NZ came from North America. The photo dates from the 1950s but the car of interest here is definitely pre WW2. Maybe a circa 1936 Chrysler Airflow? Not a lot of these came to NZ. One unusual factor is there are no pre WW2 cars in the photo - except for what might be a late 1930s Chevrolet just visible in the left corner. Due to restrictions on availability of new cars there were still plenty of pre WW2 cars on the road then.

 

In case anyone is wondering the cars along the kerb at the back are; - a circa 1948 Vauxhall J-type 14/6, a mid 1950s Ford Prefect 100E, a mid 1950s Morris Minor, an early 1950s MO series Morris Oxford, a 1948-52 Austin A40 Devon, and then two E series Vauxhall Veloxes, which btw were the best selling large-ish car in NZ at that time.

 

Facing the camera are; - an early 1950s  Hillman Minx, a Morris Oxford of the series that followed the MO, a Fiat 1100 (relatively rare here), a Standard Vanguard Phase Two, a Vauxhall Velox L-series (the model that came between the 14/6 and the E series), a 1948-ish Dodge (that one will have likely been sourced ex-Canada), a Morris 8 Series E (a model that was first seen in 1939 and was continued in production after WW2 until replaced by the Minor), another Prefect 100E, another Morris Minor (the grille style tells us it is an early 1950s side valve model), another Austin A40 (this one is a pickup with a canopy) 

 

 

 

 

[LCK81403]

The vehicle motoring on the street does appear to be a 1936 Chrysler Airflow, the humpback style.

 

[nzcarnerd]

Another one from the Hamilton, New Zealand, library collection. The Duncan family of Eureka with their Oldsmobile.  

 

Ant thoughts which model it might be?

 

[nzcarnerd]

A nice clear photo of the Douglas family in their new 1915 Buick C-25. Hamilton library photo.

 

 

 

 

[nzcarnerd]

Some photos of the Douglas family on holiday in the north of New Zealand in their mid 1920s Austin.   Hamilton library photos.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Terry Harper]

[LCK81403]

Now this is an interesting article for this old Minnesota fella.  The article mentions Melrose where a number of my relatives live.  Weed growth in the lakes is a problem.  The few Model T rigs I saw were used for cutting firewood with a buck saw, a corn sheller, and a water pump.

[John_Mereness]

[nzcarnerd]

Pomeroy's garage in Alexandra St, Hamilton, New Zealand, was general service garage as well as being a coachbuilder. Note even then the signwriter felt the need to put an apostrophe in Willys.

 

 

 

 

[nzcarnerd]

Posted a short time ago on facebook. Comments say Stutz but I reckon it isn't. Several reasons - lack of visible rear springs, and it has left hand drive.

 

I reckon it is a custom, built from a late teens Buick touring car. The roadsters have different fenders - curved down to the running board.

 

[nzcarnerd]

Another Pomeroy bus body. I am not sure whether it is a Dodge or a Graham Brothers. I suspect at that time where was little difference and it depended on what badge the customer wanted.  The photo dates from 1928-29 but I think the chassis is a few years older When did front wheel brakes become available on these?

 

[nzcarnerd]

This photo was linked from the Harley-Davidson museum facebook page and shows Milwaukee Engine Company 24 with their ladder truck and and H-D bike in 1914. Any clues as to what make the fire truck is? 

 

 

[George K]

My first thought is Seagrave. The solid center section of the front axle, radiator and heavy frame rails with fast turn down dumb iron suggest Seagrave. The radiator is the right shape but the decoration confuses me a bit. Attached is the Seagrave emblem of later trucks.

[twin6]

[LCK81403]

This old tyme mod possibly is a former American LaFrance firetruck; strongly resembles the 1920 American LaFrance in a garage.  The '27 A.L. fire pumper truck doesn't show a whole lot of styling changes, except for the wheels and tires.  American LaFrance speedsters are not underpowered by any means.  The custom modified 1917 American LaFrance boattail speedster tips the scale into the realm of steam punk.

[nzcarnerd]

1 hour ago, LCK81403 said:

This old tyme mod possibly is a former American LaFrance firetruck; strongly resembles the 1920 American LaFrance in a garage.  The '27 A.L. fire pumper truck doesn't show a whole lot of styling changes, except for the wheels and tires.  American LaFrance speedsters are not underpowered by any means.  The custom modified 1917 American LaFrance boattail speedster tips the scale into the realm of steam punk.

 

I don't think this is an 'old tyme mod' I think it is a standard tractor unit, for hauling a big long ladder trailer. At a guess this one is a LaFrance?

 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, LCK81403 said:

 

 

 

 

 

[hddennis]

nzcarnerd, you beat me to the punch. My thoughts exactly, I just took too long to find an example.

Howard Dennis

[George K]

19 hours ago, nzcarnerd said:

This photo was linked from the Harley-Davidson museum facebook page and shows Milwaukee Engine Company 24 with their ladder truck and and H-D bike in 1914. Any clues as to what make the fire truck is? 

 

 

Here’s a 1915 Seagrave on pneumatic tires and electric lights.

[HK500]

Here's a great looking Rolls-Royce!  I wonder if it survived.

[HK500]

Lots of Weird going on here - 17" lockring wire wheels, 1930 Packard senior headlamps, and a very unusual B and C  pillar curve on what looks like a pre-1930  LHD Rolls Town car.  Note on the back says taken in 1935 for the California Auto Co.

Edited February 1, 2022 by HK500 (see edit history)

[edinmass]

On 1/28/2022 at 5:26 PM, 58L-Y8 said:

AJ:

Check Fred Roe, page 146, Judkins

 

"The Murphy clear vision convertible sedan looks great on any chassis.   I know they were mounted on Duesenberg,  Packard, Rolls, Minerva.  Any others?"

1927-'28 Hudson Super Six

 

Steve

 

There is one all original PI Murphy in a collection in LA. Fantastic car.....owned by a gentleman.

 

It was parked in New York City parking garage for decades next to the Leno Duesenberg Town Car with the square body who’s builder escapes me due to covid brain. 

Edited February 1, 2022 by edinmass (see edit history)

[George K]

You must be talking about these cars.b