Trailer advice

[Joe in Canada]

Does anyone have any experience with an American Hauler open 24 Ft. car trailer 10,000 Lb. capacity and how did you like it. Also looking at Lightning enclosed 24 Ft. aluminum trailer. Any preferences or what to watch for. 

[capngrog]

Due to the greater aerodynamic drag of an enclosed trailer over that of most trailer/car combinations, you'll probably get worse fuel mileage with the enclosed trailer; however, for protection of the trailered vehicle, the enclosed trailer is the only way to go ... in my opinion.

 

Cheers,

Grog

[Xander Wildeisen]

Enclosed is the only way to go. Makes for great storage container when not in use. 24 ft slant or V-nose, what ever you want to call it. If buying one new, get one with a side loading door. So you can open the car door inside the trailer. You get what you pay for with trailers. Good used ones are out there. Mine is a 24 ft enclosed super coach from Interstate, I have no complaints on it. Have owned it for 8 years, and would recommend one. 

[padgett]

Just a thought but you can haul an open car on trailer with a lot of V6 vehicles, would recommend over 3 liters, but for an enclosed trailer a V8 or Diesel is the way to go if plan to haul in mountains or over 50 mph.

 

ps with a turbo, particularly a diesel, an EGT guage is a wise investment.

[Robert G. Smits]

If you are not on a tight budget go for the 17.5 in wheels.  I have come to the conclusion that even the load range E 16 in tires are being degraded in quality over time.  Also insist on electronic tire monitors on your tow vehicle and trailer.  

If you value security for your collector car the only way to go is enclosed.   

[Joe in Canada]

I have thought about security but when you go to a touring event your car sits outside the motel all week anyway. I notice only the show cars are put away by some folks though. On the way home from the Glidden tour I stopped at one of the motels where the CCCA were staying at. I noticed the parking lot was full of Full Classics that sat out all night getting wet like a 16 Cyl Cadillac roadster.

[padgett]

re TPMS: you want something that can monitor all tires simultaneously (not switch between them) for both pressure and temperature and the biggie is something with enough range to get from the trailer to the TV. Also look for replaceable batteries. Once installed (most mount on the valve stem which needs to be metal, not rubber) have all four balanced.

 

Finally and particularly if you go with an enclosed, you want a rear view camera mounted on the back of the trailer, wired is good but if you go wireless again make sure it has enough range to reach a monitor in the TV (may need to remote an antenna) I wire mine to the running lights so can use when cruising as well as backing.

[Friartuck]

http://www.secondchancegarage.com/public4/trailering-1.cfm

[Trulyvintage]

21 hours ago, Joe in Canada said:

Does anyone have any experience with an American Hauler open 24 Ft. car trailer 10,000 Lb. capacity and how did you like it. Also looking at Lightning enclosed 24 Ft. aluminum trailer. Any preferences or what to watch for. 

 

What is your tow vehicle ?

 

What specific vehicle are you putting in/on the trailer ?

 

What is the weather like when you are planning to tow ?

 

 

Jim

[kgreen]

I have an Aluma, open car hauler because my vehicle isn't big enough to tow an enclosed trailer.  It is a 2015 F150 with the V8.  I have found the option in the link below from a company called SnoCap.  It is an aluminum framed cover with a fabric cover.  Has anyone experience with this set up?  Would it be an option for the OP?

 

http://www.canvasworksincmn.com/SnoCaps-Trailer-Enclosures.html

 

Edited November 10, 2016 by sixseven
Spelling correx (see edit history)

[Mark Shaw]

Yes, I have seen one of these SnoCaps trailers.  The owner hauled a small French race car with his Audi sedan.  It was well built and very light weight.  I heard him say that they took only a few days to built it too.

Edited November 9, 2016 by Mark Shaw (see edit history)

[Joe in Canada]

10 hours ago, Trulyvintage said:

 

What is your tow vehicle ?

 

What specific vehicle are you putting in/on the trailer ?

 

What is the weather like when you are planning to tow ?

 

 

Jim

2500 GMC and the car Wt. is 5,400 Lb. But I did manage to see an American Hauler today and was not impressed. Bed sat up very high, poor fastener for securing fenders and the ramps were narrow so I will pass on it. With Donald getting in I think I will hold off and see where the US dollar settle's at in the next little while. Thanks for the comments though.

Edited November 10, 2016 by Joe in Canada (see edit history)

[Trulyvintage]

So,

 

You plan on putting a car that weighs 5400 pounds on a trailer & towing it ?

 

That means the GVWR has to equal or exceed the combined weight of both the trailer and the vehicle.

 

That means for a tandem axle trailer - each axle has to be 5400 pound rated minimum.

 

Stopping a trailer is what matters - particularly in an emergency situation.

 

Safe - controlled stopping is the most important important factor in the equation.

 

5400 pounds is a heavy vehicle.

 

If it is a classic car - most likely it has a wide body - that makes it difficult to open & close the driver door

without hitting the fender on most car hauler trailers.

 

I have hauled with open & enclosed trailers - I will never transport on an open trailer again.

 

It is too risky for the vehicle.

 

 

Jim

 

 

 

 

[Trulyvintage]

22 hours ago, sixseven said:

I have an Aluma, open car hauler because my vehicke isn't big enough to tow an enclosed trailer.  It is a 2015 F150 with the V8.  I have found the option in the link below from a company called SnoCap.  It is an aluminum framed cover with a fabric cover.  Has anyone experience with this set up?  Would it be an option for the OP?

 

http://www.canvasworksincmn.com/SnoCaps-Trailer-Enclosures.html

 

 

 

You might want to look at the video for the car hauler SnoCap.

 

No way would I use that system to haul a car.

 

Deck is too high - clearance is only 78 inches - one close pass to a tree on the side and your fabric canopy is burned toast.

 

Loading ramps take up deck space - rear " door " operates with a rope & a zipper ?

 

 

Jim

[Trulyvintage]

I am on the road every day.

 

I have always custom built my enclosed trailers based on my transport needs which have to be versatile because I transport

many different vehicles year round in the lower 48 states.

 

My recommendations for hauling a vehicle are ....

 

Enclosed trailer

Load & unload with wireless remote control electric winch

Straight - not dropped axles - for road clearance and elimination of rear end trailer frame damage from hitting ground

7 foot minimum rear door

Full size access door on curb side ( 6 feet wide by 5 feet tall minimum)

Access entry door on driver side opposite curb side door

This allows access to both sides of the vehicle - eliminates traditional driver side escape door

 

 

Jim

 

 

[Curti]

There must not be a motor in that grey Pierce ?

[Joe in Canada]

46 minutes ago, Curti said:

There must not be a motor in that grey Pierce ?

If there was he would have loaded the other way around I would think. 

[Joe in Canada]

When calculating trailer load capacity do you deduct tongue weight as the weight is transferred to your hitch from the axle?

[padgett]

Is a factor in the axle loading but not for the Gross Weight. And a WDH transfers it back.

[Trulyvintage]

22 hours ago, Curti said:

There must not be a motor in that grey Pierce ?

 

Yes there was a motor in the 7 passenger Pierce Arrow roller ...

 

It weighed 6100 pounds - I know because I checked the weight

when I scaled.

 

My enclosed car hauler trailer is 34 feet long - it was loaded backwards

because the front end alignment was way off.

 

 

Jim

 

 

[LAS VEGAS DAVE]

I just started flat towing using a tow bar. Stops quick, rides best, easy to hook and easy to disconnect, no storage problem, easy initial cost, and this is the way I did it as a kid with no problems. 

[John348]

On 11/10/2016 at 1:37 PM, Joe in Canada said:

When calculating trailer load capacity do you deduct tongue weight as the weight is transferred to your hitch from the axle?

 

The tongue weight should be between 10-15% of the load in the trailer...... no more! That can be adjusted by moving the vehicle fore and aft. Trailer supply stores sell tongue scales or may even rent them, they are not that expensive. I have my box set up just right for each car as to where to stop it and strap it down. With your 2500 GM pick-up you won't even know it is behind you. I had ordered and purchased a new 2012 2500 gas engine Sierra that I traded in in 2013 for the same exact truck with a diesel, NIGHT and DAY!!!!! I was getting 7-8 MPG with the gas truck and with a 28 gallon tank you are not going too far between stops. The diesel gives me about 11-12 MPG but the the larger tank makes life much better. FYI I get 10-12 MPG with the trailer empty or loaded, I mad the mistake of ordering an 8 1/2' high trailer and I get a lot of air drag, next one will be 6'. Friends with identical trucks and show cars have a 6' high trailer and get 16-16 MPG. Joe all I can say is be selective where you get you information from

 

On 11/10/2016 at 4:46 PM, padgett said:

Is a factor in the axle loading but not for the Gross Weight. And a WDH transfers it back.

 

The OP mentioned he has a 2500 Series truck, so he really does not need a weight distribution hitch, it can not hurt to use one but that a poor excuse for people allowing them to use their tow vehicle for more then it is rated for.  also you must have forgot to mention the bigger the axles the bigger the tires, brakes and bearings.... Just because a vehicle can pull a load does not mean it can do it safely. The strong man at the carnival can pull the trailer with his teeth, but did you ever see him stop it?

 

[padgett]

I have flat towed but don't forget to tie down the steering & don't try to back up.. Presently I have a tow dolly because of a  Florida law that does not require a license plate on either the dolly or the toad. Some use only over the tire tiedowns so not to limit suspension travel. I also use fore/aft essentially horizontal tiedowns (e.g. leave connected to winch) because I have seen ones just using tires slip a bit (e.g. fall off the dolly) even when initially very tight.

 

ps if you have a steering tow dolly make sure it is locked when towing empty.

 

Surge brakes are OK and used by rental companies because most cars are not equipped with a controller (I like Prodigy products). They can make it difficult to back up (which may be good for amateurs). I have electrics on both my camping trailer and tow dolly.

 

Edited November 12, 2016 by padgett (see edit history)

[Guest]

Any surge brakes that I have ever seen had a pin that could be inserted to lock the cylinder so you could back up.  You should NEVER tie the steering wheel when using a tow bar.

[padgett]

Didn't say it is tight, steering is unlocked, just has a strap to keep wheel from more than a 1/4 turn in either direction. Started doing that after a 70 GP went to full lock on a turn and would not straighten out.

 

Just had a U-Haul a few months ago and do not recall a pin, just had to be gentle backing.

[JACK M]

My boat trailer has a solenoid affair that cuts the pressure off when backing up.

It is activated with the back up lights.

[LAS VEGAS DAVE]

I have found this about flat towing our 38 Buick, when turning if I go at least ten mph the Buick tracks and follows with ease, If I go to slow the wheels seem to turn more than necessary and return much slower. This is especially noticeable if the wheels fall into a depression while turning such as a dip to keep rain water running across the intersection until it runs next to a curb again. So far I like flat towing better than towing on an open trailer but it does require the driver to be more aware of what the towed vehicle is doing at all times. I don't remember giving it a second thought when I was young and we had some pretty ratty tow bar set ups back then. I do remember locking the wheels on occasion trying to make a sharp turn into an alley or something similar but never any problems on the road.

Edited November 16, 2016 by LAS VEGAS DAVE
spelling (see edit history)

[kgreen]

On 11/12/2016 at 0:54 PM, JACK M said:

My boat trailer has a solenoid affair that cuts the pressure off when backing up.

It is activated with the back up lights.

Yes, I have one on a heavy boat trailer and I love it.  Before I used this solenoid the trailer was a bear to back up if there was a slight incline.  Level surfaces were fine if I went slow, but backing up an incline heated my transmission as the trailer brakes were fully applied.

[padgett]

" If I go to slow the wheels seem to turn more than necessary and return much slower."

 

Exactly, why I use a strap to limit the steering wheel to 1/4 turn each way. Had a GP go full lock and not return. But since I bought a dolly, I use that.

[Guest]

If the towed vehicle doesn't track perfectly then something is not correct in the steering/alignment on the vehicle.  Of course I am talking about real vintage/antique vehicles (non power steering).  Sometimes it is as simple as needing a lube job but it can be caster, camber, toe in or as simple as tire pressure.

[padgett]

Wasn't referring to tracking. Have seen a number of vehicles do the same thing: track fine in a straight line but on a turn past a certain angle, the steering goes to full lock and stays there. After the second time  I just limited how far from center they can turn (and problem  is not present with a dolly. Falling off if not properly secured now...)

[Bhigdog]

Whatever you buy if it has Carlisle tires on it plan on buying 4 new tires in your near future..............Bob

[John348]

How did this topic go from trailer advice to using a tow bar? A little unrelated........ huh? Why would anyone with any car of any collector value consider the use of a tow bar? I wonder what your collector insurance would say if an incident occurred?

 

56 minutes ago, Bhigdog said:

Whatever you buy if it has Carlisle tires on it plan on buying 4 new tires in your near future..............Bob

 

Anyway glade it is "steering" back on topic, I agree with you Bob, seems that the belts separate on them real easy  

[padgett]

Started with Dave's comment about flat towing.

 

BTW I'd only buy a trailer tire that had a nylon cap or overlay (shows up as one nylon ply in the tread).

[Marty Roth]

My 24ft-box All-Aluminum trailer has a wedged and tapered nose which adds nice inside storage and walls to attach 2 spare tires.

The trailer is built on a pair of 6,000lb axles with 8-lug wheels

I run Michelin LT235/85-R16 Load Range "E" tires. After the failure of the original Chinese tires which all suffered splits and/or belt separation, as well as belt separation on another Wrangler series of an American brand, I only use Michelin, and other than damage from a big spike in the road on one tire, I've had excellent results and no surprises with regard to tires in the most recent 85,xxx miles of trailering.

 

Of course I do check tire pressure and torque of lug nuts every morning when trailering. 

 

Plan on replacing trailer tires, as well as any radials every 5 - 7 years, even if they look excellent.

 

Click on pictures to see in larger detail

[padgett]

Marty: Nice rig & the light truck tires (I have Michelin LTs on my tow vehicle, are great in the rain) do not limit you to 65 mph like a ST (special trailer) does. It is a good ST tire that has the overlay.

 

BTW people with campers like mine who have LRE tires run them at 65 psi and not 80 to keep everything in the trailer from being all shook up. Still have all the strength of a LRE just the same load rating as a LRD. Just a thought.

 

It is critical to have any trailer tire properly balanced since you will not feel vibration in the TV and I have a long range TPMS that displays both psi and temperature but am a bit of a fanatic about trailers.

[John348]

1 hour ago, Marty Roth said:

My 24ft-box All-Aluminum trailer has a wedged and tapered nose which adds nice inside storage and walls to attach 2 spare tires.

The trailer is built on a pair of 6,000lb axles with 8-lug wheels

I run Michelin LT235/85-R16 Load Range "E" tires. After the failure of the original Chinese tires which all suffered splits and/or belt separation, as well as belt separation on another Wrangler series of an American brand, I only use Michelin, and other than damage from a big spike in the road on one tire, I've had excellent results and no surprises with regard to tires in the most recent 85,xxx miles of trailering.

 

Of course I do check tire pressure and torque of lug nuts every morning when trailering. 

 

Plan on replacing trailer tires, as well as any radials every 5 - 7 years, even if they look excellent.

 

 

 

Hey Marty,

I seem to not have an option on replacing my trailer tires every 5-7 years, I always seem to find that "big spike" also. As far as the asian made trailer tires most of them are, I was told by a tire salesman many tires are made in the same plant regardless of the make, they pay the licensing fee to use that particular manufacturer's name on the side wall, true or not I don't know.

Is that a 2500 series Suburban? seems like a mighty large load for a 1500, you just don't see the 2500 Suburbans very much. 

 

31 minutes ago, padgett said:

Marty: Nice rig & the light truck tires (I have Michelin LTs on my tow vehicle, are great in the rain) do not limit you to 65 mph like a ST (special trailer) does. It is a good ST tire that has the overlay.

 

BTW people with campers like mine who have LRE tires run them at 65 psi and not 80 to keep everything in the trailer from being all shook up. Still have all the strength of a LRE just the same load rating as a LRD. Just a thought.

 

It is critical to have any trailer tire properly balanced since you will not feel vibration in the TV and I have a long range TPMS that displays both psi and temperature but am a bit of a fanatic about trailers.

Also a handy tool I use is an infra-red temperature gun and take a quick reading on all of my tires as well as the hubs when I stop, everything should be within a few degrees of each other and of coarse the sunny side will be warmer. I also liked the TPS system but found I need a booster for my trailer, the signal just goes in and out, and had a few false alarms. As far as feeling vibration in the tow vehicle, with a 2500 series truck or higher you could probably drag the trailer behind you on flats and not feel it. I think we discussed this before, but I strongly feel your "TV" is really at the edge of it's limits with the job you are asking of it. I myself would never even attempt it, I just don't think it is safe  

[Marty Roth]

6 hours ago, John348 said:

 

Hey Marty,

I seem to not have an option on replacing my trailer tires every 5-7 years, I always seem to find that "big spike" also. As far as the asian made trailer tires most of them are, I was told by a tire salesman many tires are made in the same plant regardless of the make, they pay the licensing fee to use that particular manufacturer's name on the side wall, true or not I don't know.

Is that a 2500 series Suburban? seems like a mighty large load for a 1500, you just don't see the 2500 Suburbans very much. 

 

Also a handy tool I use is an infra-red temperature gun and take a quick reading on all of my tires as well as the hubs when I stop, everything should be within a few degrees of each other and of coarse the sunny side will be warmer. I also liked the TPS system but found I need a booster for my trailer, the signal just goes in and out, and had a few false alarms. As far as feeling vibration in the tow vehicle, with a 2500 series truck or higher you could probably drag the trailer behind you on flats and not feel it. I think we discussed this before, but I strongly feel your "TV" is really at the edge of it's limits with the job you are asking of it. I myself would never even attempt it, I just don't think it is safe  

 

John, You have made some excellent points, and I agree with many of them - thanks for your comments.

 

Yes, The Suburban, as well as our 2006 Avalanche 4x4 are both 3/4 Ton - 2500 Series, and both have the 8.1 Litre engine. The Excursion is a 3/4 Ton 7.3 Litre Turbo Diesel, also with 4x4.

Politely disagreeing, in my opinion, none of my Tow Vehicles "is really at the edge of it's limits with the job you are asking of it". My Suburban was specifically ordered and built to tow a 12,000 lb trailer. The trailer was also ordered and built, and is "rated" for 12,000 lbs with a pair of 6k American-built Dexter Axles and 8-Lug wheels, with self-adjusting brakes on all wheels. The all-aluminum Forest River trailer weighs just under 3,400 lb; most of the cars I transport weigh in at 3,500 to 4,500 lb; even if you add another 500 lb for tools, spare parts, etc, and yet another 500 lb luggage and passengers, we are still 3,500 lb BELOW the trailer's RATED capacity, and at least 3,000 lb BELOW the tow vehicle's rated capacity. In an age when too many folks tow a travel trailer, a big utility box, or even a car hauler with a Toyota, a Cross-over, or a mid-sized pickup, I'm not anywhere near capacity or anywhere near the limits of my tow vehicles.

 

I always use an Equalizer Hitch, so no bobbing and jerking Up & Down, Back & Forth - It runs and feels like a 40ft wheelbase, and is far more stable down the road.

Like you, I check the temperature of the tires and hubs, at least at every fuel stop and/or rest stop (being an "older" guy, I now make at least as many rest stops as for fuel).Having an inexpensive Laser heat gun from Harbor Freight yet another quick way to check hub temps, in addition to actually putting my palm on each one. The minute or two taken while the tank is filling is small in comparison to knowing that we stand a better chance of safe trip completion. When I see a overloaded trailer on the shoulder with a broken axle, flat tire and no spare, or worse yet - the guy hauling all his possessions down the interstate with a trailer tire running 30 degrees camber off of vertical due to a shot  wheel bearing, I just hope I'm not in his way when it decides to let go, that other folks are out of his way, and that his family survives the result.

 

By the way, my trailer has Torsion axles, and with the equalizer hitch it rides really smoothly. No need to reduce tire pressure! Running 80 psi allows the tires to run cooler with less chance of heat-related failure or hydro-planing).

 

 

Edited November 19, 2016 by Marty Roth (see edit history)

[padgett]

Sounds like you really know what you are doing, wish everyone was that way.

 

Cannot emphasize enough the value of the factory towing package on a modern vehicle, is far more than just a hitch and lights wiring but often also include A Lot of heavy duty equipment: alternator, radiator, rear axle, load levelling, and some even have a brake controller.

 

ps like you I also like to leave about 25% extra. Gross on my camper is 4k lbs & is running about 3500. Jeep is rated at 5,000 lbs and new ones with V6 are 6400. Also have a Dexter TorFlex but just one.

Edited November 19, 2016 by padgett (see edit history)

[Marty Roth]

21 minutes ago, padgett said:

Sounds like you really know what you are doing, wish everyone was that way.

 

Cannot emphasize enough the value of the factory towing package on a modern vehicle, is far more than just a hitch and lights wiring but often also include A Lot of heavy duty equipment: alternator, radiator, rear axle, load levelling, and some even have a brake controller.

 

ps like you I also like to leave about 25% extra. Gross on my camper is 4k lbs & is running about 3500. Jeep is rated at 5,000 lbs and new ones with V6 are 6400. Also have a Dexter TorFlex but just one.

 

Padgett, thanks for your comments. You are a very frequent contributor to our FORUM, and we appreciate that you share your experience.

 

Hopefully we can meet when the AACA Southeast Spring Meet is held in Ocala, just 3 months from now.