Question on collecting pre war Cadillac years 1935-1937

[Ketron281989]

Hello,

 

I am a fellow collector with pre-war interests.  I do most of my own mechanical work out of my garage, minus rebuilding engines and full on restoration.  I have a pre war Ford from 1936 currently and want to look into upgrading to a more senior car such as a Cadillac V8 manufactured between 1935-1937.  How available are parts, say for a 1935 or 1936 year Cadillac?  I am to understand the Monoblock engine which first debuted in 1936 was a one year only model, then changed in 1937 to remain somewhat unchanged for several years after.  1935 was the last year for the old style aluminum crank case engine.  Are engine parts hard to come by for 1935 and 1936?  Several guys have helped provide the information above via the Cadillac/LaSalle club.  I wanted to garter more response though, as purchasing a pre war Cadillac and be expensive and I want to make sure I have all my bases covered before I choose.  Anything to stay away from or graduate toward?  I'm more interested in two door coupe's and convertibles which command a higher premium.  Would an original 1936 series 60 car that needs mechanical service be a car to stay away from when it come's to pre-war Cadillac.  My parts search for these years mentioned above, not very fruitful.  I understand parts cost money, I have had my fair share of hunting and spending.  I would think for the more senior cars, parts and networking are rarer to come by?  Hoping I am wrong!

 

Thank you for your time,

 

Jon

[junkyardjeff]

If you are not good with working with wood I would start at 37,I know the rest of the GM line had a bunch of wood in the body from 36 on back.  If you must have a 36 and older get a very nice one to start out with.

[58L-Y8]

Good advice about the wood structure in GM Fisher bodies through 1936.  Here is an example of what you would be up against if you bought one with bad wood.  If a 1936 is the preference, just be sure the wood structure is still good.  Buying the best car you can find for the price is always good advice. 

[Cadillac Fan]

1937 would be the best in regards to parts.

 

 1936 has a one year only water pump(it is longer).  I have seen 1937-48 water pumps on a 1936 block and the fan belt is not straight.  1936 has a one year only carburetor, but the later carburetors will fit if you are not concerned about authenticity.  1936 has a one year only block and heads.  The pistons are also different, but you can use 1941-48 pistons/rings in a 1936 block.  (This is for the 348 ci engine).  1936 series 60 has the 322 block with a different carburetor. 
 

 

 

 

 

[carbking]

36 carburetor is extremely difficult.

 

37 carburetor is extremely difficult.

 

38 carburetor is only difficult without the extremely, but is constructed out of verypricium.

 

But as mentioned by Cadillac Fan above, later carbs may be adapted.

 

Jon.

[K8096]

Another difference for 1936 versus the later years is the 1936 engine has solid tappets while 1937 & up they have hydraulic valve lifters.   1937 is also the last year for floor shift, starting in 1938 they all have column shift.    

[Ed Luddy]

Be sure to check out the 37-9 La Salle's also. A very nice car especially in the coupe model, called the little brother to Cadillac.

 

[John_S_in_Penna]

2 hours ago, carbking said:

36 carburetor is extremely difficult.

37 carburetor is extremely difficult.

38 carburetor is only difficult without the extremely, but is constructed out of verypricium.

Difficult to--what?

Difficult to find?  Difficult to get working properly,

or keep working properly?

Your insights can benefit us all.

[carbking]

Sorry - difficult to find.

 

As to working properly, all can be made to work as original; however, for the enthusiast interested in driving, a 1939 or later carburetor is probably a better choice.

 

The 36 carb was one of the last of the E series.

 

The 37 carb was basically an experimental carb, and the first of the A series.

 

The 38 carb was a big change to the 37, but still experimental.

 

The 39 was another change, and the carb became more of a production carb across several car manufacturers.

 

Jon.

Edited January 26, 2022 by carbking (see edit history)

[Ketron281989]

I really appreciate all the responses which have lead me to stay away from the 1936 year Cadillac car.  The '37 LaSalle is very nice, are parts hard to find for the Lasalle years 1934-1937?  The styling is beautiful!

 

Thanks,

 

Jon

[John_S_in_Penna]

On 1/25/2022 at 10:32 AM, 58L-Y8 said:

Good advice about the wood structure in GM Fisher bodies through 1936. 

 

Did Cadillac use wood in the bodies beyond 1936?

One of our local members wrote an article for our

newsletter about restoring his 1937 Buick Roadmaster

phaeton (4-door convertible).  He said it had lots of

wood in its structure;  and that if he had known in

advance, he would have stayed away from it.

 

It sounds as if General Motors used wood beyond 1936

in at least some of their senior-car bodies.  Here are 

two pictures, before and after:

 

 

[58L-Y8]

4 minutes ago, John_S_in_Penna said:

 

Did Cadillac use wood in the bodies beyond 1936?

One of our local members wrote an article for our

newsletter about restoring his 1937 Buick Roadmaster

phaeton (4-door convertible).  He said it had lots of

wood in its structure;  and that if he had known in

advance, he would have stayed away from it.

 

It sounds as if General Motors used wood beyond 1936

in at least some of their senior-car bodies.  Here are 

two pictures, before and after:

 

 

John:

 

GM did still use wood in the lower-volume body styles after 1936.  It was less in the structure where stampings would function, but still used in tacking strips, seat framing, convertible top header bows, etc.  Even the 1938-'41 Cadillac 60 Special have long wood sill pieces for body mounting between the body and frame rails.  Where the 1937 and later eliminated wood were the interior structure components on the high-volume sedans and coupes. 

 

Regarding models to consider, including the 1937-'38 LaSalle would be wise.  Comparing the LaSalle with its Cadillac counterpart Series 60, other than engine size, frontal styling, interior trim and instrument panel, they are largely twins.  Given the LaSalle sold in multiples of the Series 60, it's an easier car to source in good condition for a reasonable price.

 

Steve

 

[jdome]

34-36 LaSalle have a unique straight -8 engine that was based on Olds block.  34-36 LaSalles and parts are harder to find than other years.

 

Personally, I prefer the 39-41 Cadillac. Great driving cars, enough power & speed for h-iway driving with good brakes. 39-48 are the best generation of the flatheads and easiest to source parts for. 

Edited January 28, 2022 by jdome (see edit history)

[Cadillac Fan]

Here is an example of the difference in cost between two flathead Cadillac carburetors, and why the one year only 1936 engine costs more to restore,if you are starting with an incomplete car.  

[Ketron281989]

I think the writing is clearly visible to stay away from 1936.  To think, the 1936 convertible I was looking at was missing it's original carb and air cleaner, as well as voltage regulator, choke cable/knob, cigarette lighter knob as well!! While the Lasalle is a beautiful car, I want to stick with Cadillac.  How do the 1935 series fair compared to the 1936?

 

Thanks

 

Jon

[hidden_hunter]

Is being CCCA eligible important to you? 

[edinmass]

I’ll go out on a limb here, and say that ANY Cadillac pre 1938 shouldn’t be anyone’s first time buying a pre war car. That stated, 35-37 isn’t impossible to deal with, and in reality not too difficult from a parts and service standpoint. Asking the question was brilliant........too many jump in and get burned out the first try.

[Cadillac Fan]

My suggestion for anyone considering a car is to join the club of that mark and go to the national meet.  Talked to owners of the cars you are interested in.

 

 

the CLC grand national is outside of Chicago this summer.   

 

 

Most 1936 Cadillacs are missing those items, especially the voltage regulator and carburetor/ air cleaner.   It will depend on what you want to do with the car.  If it is for touring, then not really a big deal.   

 

 

 

[John_Mereness]

 A friend (Charles J. Koch, Jr.) and I restored this 1936 Cadillac V-8 Town Cabriolet (right about the time Mr. Koch and his son Jim founded Boston Beer Company/Samuel Adams) and it won nearly every award you could ever win (the carb set up was 1941 - we liked the set up better and that is what we had on hand too).  As a sidenote:  The car started to be restored as a "tour car" and then ended up on the show field.  The body required extensive rewooding (not from wood rot, but from the mere weight of the doors, plus a year in we had to do some adjustments) - NOT FUN.  And we did a little re-restoration of fenders and runningboards post getting caught in an ice storm and doing a 360 with the truck and trailer - had to drive back from Indianapolis to Cincinnati with it shifted in the trailer - ultimately to have a dozen or so people pick it up to  get it out of trailer.   

 

So, my advice 1936 to 1948 (and really 1926 to 1948):

It better have good wood or be the rare of rare

The 1936 to 1948 cars are hard to restart when they are hot and that takes some time and patience (think metal to metal contact).

Shiny trim parts are difficult to find (you will have a steep chrome plating bill)

Takes time, diligence and a checkbook to parts source 

Lovely automobiles.

Edited January 30, 2022 by John_Mereness (see edit history)

[John_Mereness]

Here is a photo of my HPOF winning 1941 Cadillac 60 Special Fleetwood.  The car had 17.5K-ish miles on it when I bought it at age 14, in 1979.  I sold it in about 2016, at 97.5K-ish miles.  In all those years of touring it let me down three times (The first time was on an AACA tour and it ended up on the roadside [but made it home] to have a fellow [Packard V-12 Town Car owner - but he turned out ok in long haul] on the tour bitch me out that we needed to spend more time on the car prior to touring - so I rebuilt the engine, plus I ran it out of gas once and dad ran it out of gas once).  Over the years of ownership I had my hand on most every mechanical part at least twice if not three or four times.  

Overland, Cadillac, Pierce Arrow, Talbot Lago, Oldsmobile, Dodge, X, X, and Rolls-Royce on Southern Ohio AACA Tour

Edited January 30, 2022 by John_Mereness (see edit history)

[Walt G]

This is the kind of advice we all need to read. DO not be afraid of the car nor to buy one just be really aware of what can and does happen even to "seasoned" enthusiasts with mechanical ability and savvy like my long time friend John.  Do not blame the car if something does go wrong and it stops or 'fails to proceed' take into consideration its age! Spend the time, effort and $ to have the car totally sorted out first - everything from grease in wheel bearings to possible corrosion on bulb sockets. 

Heed the advice of some of us here who have been in this hobby hands on for a few years, decades .................. especially the ones that point you to how to correct something or where to find the parts or who can fix it properly. Pretty cars that don't work are lawn ornaments and driveway flash.  "Pretty" ie chrome, paint etc can be done once the car works well consistently.

Structural wood work replacement is not for the faint of heart , even locating the correct material to do that can be a chore.

 

But all the above being said I still love cars with running boards

Walt

[John_Mereness]

Maybe I should mention here what dad says when someone wants a Cord.  Being out in an Auburn raises more Cord questions than Auburn questions.  There is a reason we have the Auburn - it is a fine automobile that tours well.  That said, a wonderful friend bought an Auburn as mine is so "dependable" - what he did not realize was the time the car gets spent on it in the garage so that you may see it publicly without issue.

 

So, what does dad say when someone asks about Cord Ownership ?

I would like to own a Cord:

Question 1:  Are you an Engineer ?

If Yes, we are good to go and if No, then on to question 2.

Question 2:  Are you handy ?

If yes, it is a car that requires "handy" and if No, then on to question 3.

Question 3:  Do you have a lot of disposable income ?

If yes, then possibly good to go and if No, then car probably will not perform as you would like and will just be a garage ornament.

 

My point of saying this is just to be aware of your weaknesses as a luxury 30's car will throw them in your face.  If you are not a woodworker then you are dependant upon someone else, but the woodworker also probably has bad wood as they are doing someone elses woodwork.  That said, if you "plan" to buy one then you probably will not get one - they in my opinion really are more impulse buy - jump in and enjoy.

 

Sidenote:  All 1927 to 48 Cadillac's are LOVELY automobiles.  If you like a 1935 get a 35, if you like 1936 then get a 36,  Do not fear any year.  Just keep in mind that if you do not want to deal with wood then get a car with good wood.  If you do not have mechanical skills then give yourself half a chance and get a car that someone has spent time on mechanically.  If you do not have a painter or ... then get a car with good paint.  If you do not have 20K plus to do chrome then get a car with good chrome.  And, etc. 

[Ketron281989]

Great advise, thank you.

 

Jon