lincolnmatthews Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 What's the feeling out there? I maybe SOL, but the seller did say that the paint was oxidized a little & I said well it looks pretty good in pictures. He didn't say anything, so we talked a while & I forgot to ask specifically when the pics were taken,(my fault here). So I eventually won the auction & sent the deposit & while on the phone today working out details about sending the balance owed,(he didn't want to send title till he received all the money, which I was OK with). I finally asked him whether that was a pic of him & he said yes about 5 yrs ago! So I asked about the other pics & he said that basically that they were off the car after he bought it back in 09. I said that that wasn't really right & that they should have been current pictures! I told him to take pics all the way around & email them to me tomorrow. I told him I don't expect a perfect paint job but hoped that it looked close to the ones in the add. Well now I'm getting concerned, I guess I'll just have to wait now, I just don't want him to pull an all nighter & buff the heck out of it! I probably don't have much recourse over my 2k deposit, (I know I should have flown back and checked it out) but just couldn't. OK am I over reacting & give the guy a chance? (Whenever I've sold a car on Craigslist there always current pics! Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AlCapone Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I can't believe you sent $2000 for a site unseen car! In my opinion if you get burned part of the blame rests with you the buyer! Wayne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lincolnmatthews Posted October 10, 2015 Author Share Posted October 10, 2015 Your actually being to kind Wayne, MOST all the blame lies on my shoulders I know! Reasons why I didn't go look at it are like %#$*(^%# everybody got one! But there are lots of vehicles bought & sold on Ebay everyday with not to many problems. My original question was, is the seller being deceitful? I guess this is a common problem now days, people post old pictures on there adds! I know I should fly back to Iowa & check out the old Packard, but my Wife is very ill & I just can't leave now. Thank you, live & learn! Actually I think he's basically honest (he's a club officer in the old car chapters & clubs etc) I know what does this prove, nothing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AlCapone Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Of course the seller was obligated to disclose that the photographs were not current. Rather than cast blame my point is that everything looks better in a photograph than it does in real iife and they never post pictures of the bad side of parts. I would be hesitant to pay the balance until you have a full set of current photographs interior, underside, motor, etcetera! You might want to get someone in the sellers locale to have a look for you.By the way what year and make and price? Regards and good luck! Wayne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lincolnmatthews Posted October 10, 2015 Author Share Posted October 10, 2015 What a mess! Thats what I was thinking try & get someone nearby & check it out. Were not talking big bucks or a classic Packard, its a 41 Clipper. I just really like the looks of the Darrin styled car. The pre-wars just don't surface all the time, especially in my neck of the woods! I guess I'll see what the new pics look like! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
414TATA Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 It may be too late for this suggestion. I bought my Buick on photos posted on CL located 2,200 Miles from me sight unseen. I didn't know one person in the area and didn't even know about the Buick or AACA groups at that time. My wife suggested we have AAA road service take a look for us. (maybe another road service in the area if you aren't a member) I trusted the drivers opinion regarding the general condition of the car so I bought it. I Feel very lucky it all worked out fine and car arrived as represented. Wayne B1941 Buick Super Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghostymosty Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I think 6 months should be the limit on photo age for a car advertisement if the car looks basically the same now as it did then. Check the ebay listing and see if the buyer has recourse for a car NOT being in the condition advertised on the auction. I have seen cars that look identical to what they looked like up to 8 years prior so it is possible the photos are an accurate representation and you'll be happy with the purchase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R Walling Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I purchased a car on ebay sight unseen and was very satisfied. I spoke to the person and I asked for a copy of his drivers licence and googled his house. It was in a nice neighborhood and tidy so I expected the same of the car. I was going to do a complete frame off anyway so when I finally recieved the car I was surprised at the actual quality. It had been described as a driver, but if I planed to use it without any repairs, I would have been disappointed but the value was there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smithbrother Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 It's called, DOING YOUR HOMEWORK. Never buy a car in the rain, or pictures of it while it's raining, IMO Hope it works out for you, Dale in Indy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60FlatTop Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Clean it up, take fresh pictures, and put it back on Ebay. Don't write anything about your disappointment and add a thousand or two. You'll probably makes a few bucks. If you do put it in a coffee can in the garage labeled "Ventured" I just bought a car to sell on Thursday, a real pig in a poke. Yesterday morning I was having coffee at a convenient store and looked out the window noticing the diesel pump. I thought "Oh, yea, I gotta get some kerosene to wipe that car down with before I take the pictures." Guys do that, you know. I'll post a pic of the kerosene shine job this weekend. I have bought cars that didn't meet my expectations, but I don't remember any I have been disappointed with. They just got new owners. This is discretionary money, compare it to buying bullets for target shooting.Bernie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60FlatTop Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Oh, it was the Clipper?B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JD in KC Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 (edited) Yes, he should have disclosed the age of the photos. Don't panic yet. Wait and see what the current photos show. I have purchased 3 Packards discovered on the internet, 2 via ebay and 1 via Craigslist. As a guy new to the hobby, I seriously overpaid for the first one (1941 180 Limo), then with more knowledge about Packards, paid about what it was worth for the second (1950 Custom Sedan) and more recently got a spectacular deal on the third (1949 Custom Sedan). It all evened out. When you were originally thinking about that Clipper, I didn't add the comment that it seemed very odd that the owner has had the car for 6 years driven it for "hundreds" of miles but has never tested the Electromatic Clutch. I can't imagine owning a Clipper with an Electromatic Clutch and never in six years activating the button on the dash to see if the clutch did its own thing without the help of my foot. I guess the current owner has zero curiosity. Edited October 10, 2015 by JD in KC (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capngrog Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I've purchased two cars from Ebay auctions. The first, ten years ago, was located in Tulsa, Oklahoma, and I was living in Miami, Florida at the time. I flew out on an early Saturday morning flight, inspected the car, and flew back to Miami that evening. I still have that car. The second car was located in Ocala, Florida, not far from my (now that I'm retired) Paisley, Florida home, and I just drove over to inspect it. Inspecting a prospective ebay purchase yourself or having a dispassionate third party inspect it, is essential in my opinion. I've been luck so far,Grog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RansomEli Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 You purchased the car based upon seller misrepresentations. I'd scream loudly to the seller and eBay and demand rescission of the deal, including full refund of the deposit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60FlatTop Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I tried out a 2012 Cadillac STS with a V8 a couple of weeks ago. I think I'm becoming a dispassionate third party. Looking at a 40 year old Fleetwood now, just to find a smoother ride than my Chevy truck. Most of the misrepresentations I have came out of my own head.Bernie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarrsCars Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Hi, I see the seller in some way described the paint condition to you, was this in writing? If so, and the paint doesn't match his description, ie: more than just "a little oxidized" then he may have acted against his obligation of warranty of merchantability, or essentially making claims as to the item's true condition. I am not a lawyer so I will not get into details but you can research this and possibly use this to get out of the deal if you were misled or recover losses in small claims court if her refuses your deposit back in such a case. This may not apply in your case, but the first thing that came to mind. I also believe the standards for such vary by state so research your state, and the seller's state, laws on the matter. Otherwise, it's a good lesson learned, if not a cheap one. I maybe SOL, but the seller did say that the paint was oxidized a little & I said well it looks pretty good in pictures. He didn't say anything, so we talked a while & I forgot to ask specifically when the pics were taken,(my fault here). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed Luddy Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I've bought 5 vehicles off the 'net. Did a lot of talking with the owners before handing money over. You can tell enough about a person by online and over the phone if they are honest. I bought all of them at less than I could buy them locally and didn't even think on 3 of them that my high bid was close enough and was willing to go more but didn't have too. Doing your homework beforehand saves grief, money, and time, but if you have a dishonest seller this all goes down the drain.If anyone is sketchy in conversation, or doesn't send me requested pic's I quit the process. There's always more cars! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60FlatTop Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 You can tell enough about a person by online and over the phone if they are honest.\Personalities are rarely hidden very deep. In fact, they are so close to the surface it can be downright entertaining to predict and watch.Bernie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackofalltrades70 Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 Old pictures are misrepresentation and you can ask for a refund and get out of the deal. Ebay is more out to protect the buyer.Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LINC400 Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 While I would also want current pictures of a car I was buying, it sounds like you might be overreacting before you see the actual car. For a daily driver, 6 year old pictures would make a huge difference. For a collector vehicle that sits in the garage without much use, it could look the same now as it did then. I have pics of my car from '09, and it does not look any different now than it did then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dandy Dave Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 41 Packard Clipper, Straight 8, Sold one of them about 10 years ago. Dandy Dave! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
padgett Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 My cars are all garaged and look better than when I bought them, even in central Florida garaging or at keast being kept under cover makes a tremendous difference. Since cars are usually in better condition and lower priced here than elsewhere, I only bought one car remotely and that was from a forum member and I had both many pictures and othere marque members from the same location vouch for its condition. Am odd that when selling I always post pictures of the underside of the car. Those pictures tell me more about overall condition than ones of shiny paint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60FlatTop Posted October 11, 2015 Share Posted October 11, 2015 (edited) Here's one of my cars July 7th, 2005. I'd use that picture today. Times passes quickly and people in the hobby are selling off things they have had a while. If the seller was a old guy without the technical savvy to grab a digital camera and upload some fresh pictures he is more likely the kind of person I'd like to buy a car from. Oh, the car I shined up with a little oil, it sold on Ebay yesterday in less than three hours. Bernie Edited October 11, 2015 by 60FlatTop (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lincolnmatthews Posted October 12, 2015 Author Share Posted October 12, 2015 Update! The seller sent current pics last night. He must have been busy yesterday buffing? The pics looked really good. But it was the last pic underneath the pass rocker panel that I decided not to buy the car (or follow through with the purchase). He had said that he was told that the car must have driven over a rock or something & creased a 3ft length of the rocker, well when he finally disclosed a pic it showed a huge rusted out gap full length of the rocker panel running between the front to rear wheel. It was a nasty jagged gash, it would have had to be all cut out & new metal welded in. There was no way it was like this from running over a rock way back when! (although I think he believed this from what he was told when he bought it back in 09) There was a couple of other areas that looked kind of rough to. I called & said that I was going to have to pass because of this body damage or rot, he called back & said that he will refund my deposit, & was sorry that he hadn't disclossed everything. The car did really look nice from the exterior, & its been a very difficult day today! thinking that maybe I should have just bought it & accepted it the way it was. What a crappy deal, to bad there was 2000miles between us, I would have liked to have gone back there & seen the car, listened to the engine & brought it home.......such a gourgous car those 41 Clippers. I don't know if I'll ever find another closer to home, I'm a sad panda tonight! Some lessons learned on this go around, ask more questions, & check it out myself or hire an independent appraiser/inspector! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_S_in_Penna Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 (edited) ...he called back & said that he will refund my deposit, & was sorry that he hadn't disclosed everything. The car did really look nice from the exterior, & its been a very difficult day today! thinking that maybe I should have just bought it & accepted it the way it was... Since he refunded your deposit and apologized, it sounds like you did find an honest and sincere seller. I don't think that older pictures by themselves are proof of dishonesty. It depends, of course, on a person's motive. Honesty between fellow hobbyists, fair prices, and truth, build our hobby on a solid foundation. Since you evidently found an honest man, maybe you would want to negotiate a price privately now that the auction has ended. Edited October 12, 2015 by John_S_in_Penna (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bkazmer Posted October 12, 2015 Share Posted October 12, 2015 Never buy a car in the rain, or pictures of it while it's raining, IMO LOL - I remember that lesson - I came back the next day to negotiate and close the deal and saw what a fright pig it had become when it dried out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lincolnmatthews Posted October 13, 2015 Author Share Posted October 13, 2015 The thought had crossed my mind about maybe renegociating a new price, but I couldn't do that. I just felt that this would make me look like a jerk. Besides he was going to refund my deposit & was decent about it. Besides he had a guy flying out from AZ to pay 2k more for it, (he had told me this earlier, if something fell thru). He said that he showed him all the current pics including the one of the rotted out rocker panel. I guess if anything good came out of all this crap, was one I did the guy from AZ a favor, two, I learned a heck of a lot next time around & 3 the seller learned something to. I must say that if the current photos showed the car being just backed out of the garage, (and if he didn't buff or wax it for the pics) then I understand why he just posted the older glamour shots, the car looked the same! I just told him that if he wanted to post the old pics, acknowledge them & then include also some current ones including the damaged area, he agreed.I decided to stick to the Western States only for looking anymore for a car. If I can't drive there in a day or two, (I still work) then its just to much of a hassel! Shipping cost's to much anymore, (2k for enclosed mid-West) on a 13k car thats alot. I think I'll just spend the 7k & have H & H Flatheads just rebuild my 42 Cont then I'll have a pretty good driver/touring car. Thanks all you guys! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazycars Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 I have purchased six cars thru eBay over the past ten years. I always ask the seller for his phone number then call him and ask very specific and detailed questions about the car. I have always been able to tell a BSer from an honest guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 Buyers' remorse comes in many forms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60FlatTop Posted October 15, 2015 Share Posted October 15, 2015 Buyer's remorse is transferable. Seller's remorse is the one you have to live with. But than can be overcome.Bernie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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