mercer09 Posted July 27, 2019 Share Posted July 27, 2019 Any suggestions, names or numbers? Need some woodwork done on a woody. have the patterns. rdz69@aol.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walt G Posted July 27, 2019 Share Posted July 27, 2019 Paul Fitz who comments on this sight is an excellent wood worker - replaced rear wheel arches on my 41 Packard Hercules bodied woody 40 years ago, also a lot of the structural wood work on my Derham bodied Franklin victoria when I restored that. He is in central NY State. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercer09 Posted July 28, 2019 Author Share Posted July 28, 2019 thank you Walt. any contact numbers or address? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PFitz Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 (edited) Thanks for the kind words, Walt. Mercer09, sorry, but I've retired from the woodworking. My suggestion, if you want it done right and not ruin the value of the car, find someone who is good at wooden boat restoration. I learned my wood working in boatyards back in the days when it was just considered "building and repair" not "restoration". The mind set of how to deal with wooden structure shapes with compound curves, loading stresses, skills, tools and materials of boat builders are closer to what was used in vehicles. No disrespect to the Amish, or other classes of carpenters, but Woodies (and pre-war wood framed bodies) are not like lightly built buggies, houses, or kitchen cabinets. If you don't get a carpenter who specializes in boat construction your less likely to have someone who can match up woody construction technics, such as the correct thickness laminations, using the best high strength adhesives, the right grain plywood, and correct size finger joint construction. And then be able to color blend the new wood to match the old so that it is not glaringly new looking. I've seen woodies at shows with wood repairs that stuck out from 100 yards away. And it only got worse the closer I got to it. With Walt's Packard you could not tell which was new or original wood while standing right next to the car. I'm sure Walt can tell you what that does for the value of the car. Paul Edited July 28, 2019 by PFitz (see edit history) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trulyvintage Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 (edited) Call my friend Al. He lives near Akron, Ohio. This is a Marmon I transported the first time I met him many years ago ... That is my youngest daughter Deva Marie with the Marmon. Jim Edited July 28, 2019 by Trulyvintage (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercer09 Posted July 28, 2019 Author Share Posted July 28, 2019 thanks guys!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 Over the years the most difficult position for us to fill has been that of woodworker. Those who call themselves cabinetmakers have been great with straight and square but often struggle with curves in more than one plane. The best woodworker we have ever had has formal training as a sculptor. For my money woody wood is about the most difficult wood working there is. Plus it's visible unlike structural wood which seldom is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTR Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, PFitz said: Thanks for the kind words, Walt. Mercer09, sorry, but I've retired from the woodworking. My suggestion, if you want it done right and not ruin the value of the car, find someone who is good at wooden boat restoration. I learned my wood working in boatyards back in the days when it was just considered "building and repair" not "restoration". The mind set of how to deal with wooden structure shapes with compound curves, loading stresses, skills, tools and materials of boat builders are closer to what was used in vehicles. No disrespect to the Amish, or other classes of carpenters, but Woodies (and pre-war wood framed bodies) are not like lightly built buggies, houses, or kitchen cabinets. If you don't get a carpenter who specializes in boat construction your less likely to have someone who can match up woody construction technics, such as the correct thickness laminations, using the best high strength adhesives, the right grain plywood, and correct size finger joint construction. And then be able to color blend the new wood to match the old so that it is not glaringly new looking. I've seen woodies at shows with wood repairs that stuck out from 100 yards away. And it only got worse the closer I got to it. With Walt's Packard you could not tell which was new or original wood while standing right next to the car. I'm sure Walt can tell you what that does for the value of the car. Paul This is excellent summary which IMO can easily be adapted to just about any aspect of vintage car restoration, i.e. to do or get things done/repaired/restored on a antique/classic/vintage car vs. to do or get them done correctly are often light years apart and why most so-called “fully restored” cars end up selling for a only fraction of what they’re being claimed to have had cost to do or get done. This also reminds me what one of my mentors (superb engine rebuilder with nearly 50 year experience, incl. vintage Ferrari et.al. F1 power plants, etc ) told me long ago (excuse the language) “... and it’s said to have a rebuilt engine, whatever the *#@^ that's supposed to mean ?”. Edited July 28, 2019 by TTR (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PFitz Posted July 28, 2019 Share Posted July 28, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, Restorer32 said: Over the years the most difficult position for us to fill has been that of woodworker. Those who call themselves cabinetmakers have been great with straight and square but often struggle with curves in more than one plane. The best woodworker we have ever had has formal training as a sculptor. For my money woody wood is about the most difficult wood working there is. Plus it's visible unlike structural wood which seldom is Yes, a sculptor is more likely to understand and think in 3d for what's needed and how best to do it, than most cabinet makers. The cabinet maker is ok with the straight wood of an early depot hack, but the later woodies were rolling sculpture. I've seen good building carpenters get totally lost even with a Pontiac Convertible Coupe wood "kit". Some pix of one of the last of the real wood woodies. 1950 Plymouth P20. This one spent years in a barn with a leaking roof. It had only most of the passenger front door left as reusable. Paul Edited July 28, 2019 by PFitz (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon37 Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 You might want to check out Double E Carriages, 60 N Harvest Rd., Bird in Hand, PA 17505. Phone: (717) 768-8484. They deal primarily in restoration of fancy antique carriages (not Amish buggies), and they also work on antique automotive wood frames and trim. They replicated the 5-foot header for my convertible that sits over the windshield. Not a straight line in the whole piece, and the original had somewhat rotted and twisted over the years. They then turned out seven identical copies of the header for fellow owners of my somewhat obscure convertible. I agree that, just because one is an Amish craftsman, he may not necessarily be gifted at automotive woodwork. And woodworkers who have specialized for decades in woodies, may indeed turn out a superior product. However, I was quite happy with the work that the Amish folks at Double E turned out, and happy with the price as well. I think they're worthy of consideration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Did they need your car in their car to fit the header? Looks like nice work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 "your car in their shop"...geeze 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Wolfe Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Glazier Pattern & Coach Works, Ltd. Steven Glazier 3720 Loramie-Washington Rd. Houston, Ohio 45333 937-492-7355 gpcwsteveg@centurylink.com Steve does fantastic work and his restored cars have won many awards. Houston is a small town in Ohio and Steve lives in the country in a woods. I highly recommend him. Check out his web site and give him a call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercer09 Posted August 1, 2019 Author Share Posted August 1, 2019 wow! more responses then I ever expected. thank you everybody! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon37 Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 "Restorer": Yes, they definitely needed the car to make the header fit nicely! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jan arnett (2) Posted August 2, 2019 Share Posted August 2, 2019 I use Community Carriage & leather, Steven Stutzman, 937-386-3368, Peebles, Oh. Great job. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercer09 Posted August 19, 2019 Author Share Posted August 19, 2019 just spoke with Mr Stutzman and will be visiting him. Also spoke with Al Truly, and he ONLY deals with structural wood. no outer wood. just for the record and will update after my visit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomcarnut Posted August 19, 2019 Share Posted August 19, 2019 On 8/1/2019 at 12:41 PM, Tim Wolfe said: Glazier Pattern & Coach Works, Ltd. Steven Glazier 3720 Loramie-Washington Rd. Houston, Ohio 45333 937-492-7355 gpcwsteveg@centurylink.com Steve does fantastic work and his restored cars have won many awards. Houston is a small town in Ohio and Steve lives in the country in a woods. I highly recommend him. Check out his web site and give him a call. I have been to his shop on a couple tours. Amazing work!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
46 woodie Posted August 19, 2019 Share Posted August 19, 2019 If you are looking for a shop that specializes in "Woodie" wood then I highly recommend the Kline Family Workshop, 3225 York Haven Rd., in Manchester, PA, 717-266-8696. Tom and Mike supplied the wood for my '46 Ford Wagon and I could not be more pleased with their product, it's exactly as Ford made it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercer09 Posted August 19, 2019 Author Share Posted August 19, 2019 thank you 46- I have used the Kline Brothers many years ago and the work was quite fine. Problem is, they are usually quite backed up and I am only looking to turn this car into a driver, and not a show car. so I am going to be ok with splices, so that some of the old wood may be saved. This car will not be 20 coats of urethane finish. not what I am after. solid and a bit downtrodden in finish, is the goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
46 woodie Posted August 19, 2019 Share Posted August 19, 2019 Mercer, what year car are we talking about. I have the original interior door panels for my '46. They are in fair shape and useable. If you can use them they are yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old car fan Posted August 19, 2019 Share Posted August 19, 2019 That's more than fare Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercer09 Posted August 20, 2019 Author Share Posted August 20, 2019 thank you for the kind offer 46- mine is a 41. will they interchange? I am sure I will need some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walt G Posted August 20, 2019 Share Posted August 20, 2019 This has to be one of the best exchanges of information I have ever read on the AACA Forums, it is what the old car hobby/interest is all about - helping each other out to preserve the cars we love and continue to enjoy and use them, keep them on the road. Remember , that when we drive our cars down the road, and have a great time doing so, those seeing us doing this will also have a memory of some rolling sculpture in their minds, and more then likely it will make them happy. It is nice to be able to share the joy with others. AACA Forums are doing this for us. thank you AACA. Walt G. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
46 woodie Posted August 20, 2019 Share Posted August 20, 2019 Not exactly sure, I think that the '41 Station Wagon Door might be slightly different. Where are you located? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lump Posted August 20, 2019 Share Posted August 20, 2019 On 8/1/2019 at 10:43 PM, jan arnett (2) said: I use Community Carriage & leather, Steven Stutzman, 937-386-3368, Peebles, Oh. Great job. I'll add my words of support for Steven Stutzman of Community Carriage & Leather, of Southern Ohio. He does lots of leather and woodwork for carriages, buggies, wagons, and vintage cars. Here are a couple photos. He totally restored that all-wood hearse, by the way. It was very impressive in person. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jan arnett (2) Posted August 20, 2019 Share Posted August 20, 2019 When you go stop at Millers Bakery and get a donut. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lump Posted August 20, 2019 Share Posted August 20, 2019 Another photo of Stutzman's work. I wanted to use this one earlier today, but I was at work and it was not on my work computer. For the record, I'm sure there are lots of highly talented, skilled, and experienced woodworkers out there. This just happens to be the guy that I know. He put all new leather upholster in my touring car. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercer09 Posted August 29, 2019 Author Share Posted August 29, 2019 46-I am in Mt Laurel NJ 08054 I picked the car up and brought it home. The wood needs much more work then the photos told, and so I know the budget wood be blown........(yeah, I know) so now debating doing it my self, one piece at a time. Have also spoken with a gentleman in Cali, who has done four 41's and he has several extra pieces to sell. That may give me a jump start, but this will be a long process. On the plus side, most of the metal flooring looks usable and not seeing much metal work required. I am excited about this car, so I will get on it and stick with it and maybe sell another to fund this project. want to thank everyone for their input. I am still considering Mr Stutzman for my upholstery needs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Schramm Posted August 30, 2019 Share Posted August 30, 2019 On 8/1/2019 at 10:43 PM, jan arnett (2) said: I use Community Carriage & leather, Steven Stutzman, 937-386-3368, Peebles, Oh. Great job. They did the seat on my '15 Buick Truck. Nice job. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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