The Ressurection of Daphne - a 1932 DL

[Kevin bc]

Kevin BC here

 

Just as well the bearings in your box were in good shape, I replaced mine in my 1930 DC 8, a couple of years back , got the bearings, and outer cones OK but got the last inner cone avaiable  in Australia, so had to have the other made, but all turned out good, my point being that if you see bearings & cones in your travels grab a set. I did find that the cones & bearings appear to be the same or very similar as in the old grey Fergi tractor , so that could be a possibility if anyone  gets desperate in the future.

 

Just a point of interest  on the steering  box, do all the readers of this forum realise that the worm gear in the steering box here in Australia wont work in the US in the same box,and vice versa as the worm is cut in the opposite direction for right hand drive. Its not just a matter of turning the worm around.

 

Regards

Kevin

 

 

[Taylormade]

Fiddly stuff today, but it needs to get done.  Once I get my new firewall pad back I can run all the wiring, the choke cable, the throttle cable, the speedometer cable, oil pressure line and the temperature gauge line through the firewall and install and wire up the dash insert.  I had my temperature guage and the sending unit and the fuel sending unit and gauge restored by Bob's Speedometer, so they are back and ready to go.  All the wires and tubes run through a rubber grommet in the firewall.  This is from Phil Kennedy's car.

 

 

My grommet was toast - hard as a rock and coming apart - although that slit is supposed to be there.

 

 

 

I can't find any repo rubber for this part so I made my own.  I bought a 1/2 inch thick rubber pad off Ebay.

 

 

After a disastrous attempt to cut the rubber to shape with an angle grinder and a cut-off wheel - that totally melted the rubber and left my garage smelling like a family of skunks had unloaded - I discovered the rubber cut very nicely with a utility knife lubricated with soapy water.  So I cut it to the correct shape and tried to figure out how to get it to the correct angles on the sides.  Sanding by hand would have taken a week, and my table-top disk sander gleefully melted the rubber again, even at slow speed.  I finally discovered my bench grinder with a rough stone wheel would take the rubber off fairly cleanly without turning it liquid.  It came out pretty well and was a perfect fit.  A little uneven around the edges, but that's hidden by the outer cover.

 

 

 

Edited April 18, 2020 by Taylormade (see edit history)

[Taylormade]

As you can see, it looks pretty good inside the cover.  All I need to do is drill the correct holes in the rubber.

 

 

 

  I was a bit worried the drill might catch and tear the rubber, but my forstner bit made a very clean hole with no problems.

 

[keiser31]

EXCELLENT! I am gonna have to make one of those for my coupe.

Edited April 18, 2020 by keiser31 (see edit history)

[Taylormade]

I've got plenty of rubber left.  I can make you up one if you need it.  I'd just need to know hole sizes and spacing if there is enough left to tell.  I think the 32s had a few more wires and cables (free-wheeling), but the cover looks the same.

[keiser31]

10 minutes ago, Taylormade said:

I've got plenty of rubber left.  I can make you up one if you need it.  I'd just need to know hole sizes and spacing if there is enough left to tell.  I think the 32s had a few more wires and cables (free-wheeling), but the cover looks the same.

Interesting....I have two holes with plates. One has about 4 1/4" center to center screw holes and the other has about 2 3/4" holes center to center screw holes. That larger one looks like yours with 4 cables/lines running through it. The other looks like it only has 2 cables/lines running through it. I hope I can find the smaller outer bezel....I know it's out in my shop....somewhere.

Edited April 18, 2020 by keiser31 (see edit history)

[Taylormade]

Both of mine are the larger size, maybe 4-1/4 or 4-3/8 inches center to center screw holes.  The Free-Wheeling cable in a big one and goes through the driver's side grommet along with the oil pressure gauge line, the water temperature gauge line and I think the large distributor wire that goes to the coil behind the dash panel..  I'm actually having an email discussion with Phil Kennedy, the PO, who owns a very original 32DL.  here is how his car is laid out - with my graphic comments.  Both distributor wires may go through there, I'm not sure at the moment.

 

 

 

[ply33]

The cover and overall shape of that wire grommet look the same as on my '33 Plymouth. Mine is located on the passenger side of the firewall while it looks like your earlier Dodge has it on the driver side.

 

I was thinking about making a mould and pouring a new one from something like urethane. But it looks like your method is simpler for. Thanks for posting!

[Taylormade]

Yeah, I have two, one on each side.  Same size, different hole patterns.  It only took about half an hour to make two.  Still have to drill the holes, but that won’t take much time.  Thanks for looking!

[RichBad]

Not sure if it helps but when I cut some rubber bump stops for my car I found that they sanded a little better when cold - so stuck them in the freezer overnight.  Helped a little.

[jpage]

I made my own firewall pad for my '36 Dodge using the painted cowlboard , homosote and a couple of layers of the felt jute. i used my old one as a pattern, then made several patterns until it fit correctly. With the 1/2 homosote and jute I was able to make it to the same thickness.The homosote mimicked  the pressed fiber backer and was very easy to cut. I was even able to incorporate the rubber flap at the bottom of mine to seal the floorboard. Your's doesn't look very much different than mine. Cost me about $60 for materials, really enough to do 2 parts.

[Taylormade]

I’m curious where you found the jute and the cowlboard.  I have a sheet of Homosote left over from another project.

[jpage]

I bought both the jute and cowl board from Restoration Specialties. of course, I had to paint the board the right color as they only stock a light gray and black since the suppliers imposed purchasing in standard packaging only! I used upholstery adhesive to glue everything together. I glued the cut out board to the homosote and then trimmed the homosote to fit the contour with a razor knife. I glued 2 layers of jute together to get the approx. thickness of the insulation then roughly trimmed it to shape. Final trimming was done after glueing it to the homosote. All holes were then carefully drilled or cut with  hole saws and the cable grommet openings were trimmed out with a sharp knife. Always a learning curve. I made one for another guy which came out even better! If you need any sheet rubber I use rubbersheetwarehouse.com. A lot of sizes  and types at reasonable prices.They carry strips, rolls, sheets and blocks. Here are a couple of shots

[Taylormade]

Very cool.  I checked Restoration Specialties and their catalog says they have black painted board and the jute padding - they call it floor padding.  What did you use to cut the board, the edges look very clean?

[jpage]

I just cut it with a utility knife with a new blade. The homosote cuts really nice too then can be clean up with a file or sandpaper. The jute is harder to cut. You really have to hold it down and you need a sharp blade to keep it from pulling. A good pair of sissors will also do the trick. Sharp hole saws make quick and clean work of the round holes.

Edited April 21, 2020 by jpage (see edit history)

[jpage]

I made the mistake of cutting 2 pieces of just and then cementing them together. It's better to assemble the whole thing and then cut it out. The hole saws make quick work of the holes.

[Taylormade]

Man, I was looking at the first page of this thread that I started back in April of 2013.  I was happy to read that my wife and I had a "comprehensive" plan to have the car restored in time for the 2014 hundredth anniversary meet in Detroit.  Boy, was I ever dreaming!  Seven years later and I'm still grinding away.  Despite downsizing, loss of garage space, knee replacement, restoration setbacks and finding parts, I'm not giving up.  I really think I can actually drive the car this summer (late summer) but it won't be finished - interior completion I suspect.  For some reason, last year it just wasn't fun to work on the car, probably due to health reasons.  That has changed and I'm suddenly really enthusiastic to work on Daphne again and having fun doing it.  So if your restoration stalls, don't give up, stick with it.  What I have in the garage, compared to what I brought home is really remarkable and I'm frankly amazed I did all that when I look at it.  I have also come to the realization that it isn't going to be perfect - I have neither the skill nor finances to make it so, but I can see the light at the end of the tunnel - a fun, driveable car that will get looks and give enjoyment to many (mostly me).

 

 

[keiser31]

Such an awesome transition for that car and great details about how you restored items! Thank you SO much for posting all that you have posted. Even though our cars are so different, the motions that I will be going through are about the same. I have done a lot already, but i have a long way to go. Thanks again for all of your insight and learning experiences.

John

[Buick 59]

What you'll have is something that is the "perfect" outcome of all your efforts! 

What most of us wouldn't give to purchase back the most memorable car we ever owned... and have the pleasure of driving it again.

You're doing great on your grand old car and can't wait to see a pic of you driving it!

[Ron Lawson]

Taylormade , I purchased my DB 2249 Senior Touring in 1976  At the start I was very keen on getting stuck into restoring it Then came a wedding in 1977. Yes I married the girl that got me hooked on old cars . Her dad restored a 27 Chevy that he purchased in 1966 and it was on the road in 1969  and she used to go with him on rallies as the navigator She is very good at this and to this day she still tells me where to go This is now her car and it still performs very well  After marrage I continued to work on my car having the Frame blasted, Springs repaired and reset And commenced the woodwork. In 1979 we purchased our own home and yes there was a garage  and workshop. Small, but  it was suitable  By 1982 I had a running engine and a driveable  hack.

In 1982 I ventured into the transport industry as an owner driver and boy it was a learning curve after working for a boss driving someone else's gear There was not a lot of time at home and what time there was, was spent servicing and maintaining my investment This lifestyle was the norm up until 2012 and after wearing out some very good and some not so good trucks I sold up So my Ford Aeromax plus trailers and dollies  (For you folks in the States A dolly is what is used to couple trailers together to make a road train) were put on the market and sold 

So then it was back into the new 65 X 56 ft workshop that I had just finished building From then on the restoration of my BD has progressed at a reasonably steady pace with the timber frame being completed and the metal work repaired or remade and fitted All of this has happened with the help of other DB members namely Gundog  who has a DB 2249 touring the same as mine I am proud to say that the only things that I have had done "outside" is the engine bearings, Head Repaired plating and the final coats of paint I did all of the prep work before it went to the paint shop Like most restorers I don't have the finances to have outside work done and I know that it wont be 100% perfect but I will be able to say with a little pride that I did it 

I am sorry that I do not have the skills to post pictures on here 

[Taylormade]

In the always popular "been there, done that" category, I'm in the process of making/getting a new firewall pad and making rubber grommets for the firewall pass-thoroughs.  I asked PO, and fellow Dodge Brothers member, Phil Kennedy to send me some firewall and under dash photos of his very original DL so I could get a good look at what things should look like.  As always, Phil quickly replied with excellent shots.  That's were the trouble started.  I noticed with alarm that there was a brace under the dash from the firewall to below the instrument panel - a brace I didn't remember seeing during my meticulous parts organization this winter.  Maybe it was still on the car.  I went out to the garage and checked.  No brace.  Then I commenced on the arduous trek so may of us have traveled - the search for the elusive missing part.  I swear I searched every shelf, box, storage container, dusty corner and rafter in the garage.  I know I had seen that brace sometime in the last year or two, but it had now vanished into the vapor, never to be seen again.  I desperation, I turned to John Kieser, knower of all cars, who had helped me find parts for Daphne in the past.  A friend of his had the cowl of an old DL and had sent me some windshield parts several years ago.  I contacted John who put me in touch with his friend, Alan.  To my amazement, the cowl was still sitting behind his house - and the brace was still there.  He took it off and sent it to me.  This is what the old car world is all about - friendly people going out of their way to help someone in need.  The brace arrived today.  I'm sure as soon as I have it cleaned up and painted, my original brace will magically appear in a space I checked at least five times a few days ago, but that's the way it always goes.  Thanks, Phil, John and Alan!

 

[keiser31]

Wow! That really IS a lot different than the 1931 dash brace! Glad to be of assistance and that it worked out, Rich.

 

John

Edited April 25, 2020 by keiser31 (see edit history)

[Taylormade]

I may have posted this before, but this is the photo I always come back to when things get tough.  Taken by Phil Kennedy in 1970.  Note the mismatched color on the wire wheels, which were like that when I bought the car.

 

[Taylormade]

One of the irritating items that comes up when restoring early thirties Chrysler products is the use of the integral coil and ignition setup.  Finding original coils for these cars is difficult, let alone finding one that works.  They do make reproductions, but at several hundred bucks it was a little too much for my budget.  I started talking about this several years ago on this thread, but I finally figured out a possible fix that is inexpensive and retains much of the original look - as long as you don't get too far under the dash!  Most of the time, as on Daphne, when the original coil went out, they just bought a cheap coil and screwed the mount onto the firewall - inside or outside the car.  Then the wiring was jury rigged and you kept on driving.  I wanted to get the coil back up behind the ignition key where it belonged.  The original clamp for the factory coil is still there in very good shape.  Sorry these pictures are so bad - I had to use my phone to get up under there.

 

 

Here is the bracket with the replacement ignition switch installed as it was when I got the car in 1965.

 

 

There is not really enough of the bracket left with the switch installed to safely get the coil in there.  Here is what I came up with...

 

First, I bought a clear, heat resistant acrylic tube that has an inner diameter just slightly larger than my new coil and an outer diameter slightly smaller than the clamp opening.  Here are the three pieces, the coil, the tube and the ignition switch.

 

 

As you can see, the coil fits nicely inside the tube.

 

 

I'll cut the tube to length and put a cutout along the side so it will clamp down on the coil.

 

 

 

 

The ignition key also fits my sidemount locks, not sure how that came about, but it was like that when I bought the car so I'm not complaining.

I don't think any additional support will be necessary - the dash clamp is pretty robust, but I can always run a strap up to the firewall if it looks too end heavy.

We'll see how this Rube Goldberg device works as I implement it.

 

 

[Ian_Greenlaw]

Interesting fix to a problem that haunts a lot of us. Well done !!!

[JACK M]

Coils can run pretty hot.

This might result in a softening (or worse) of the clear tube.

Maybe a PVC water pipe could handle the heat better, after all it should handle hot water. (and would be stiffer)

I would keep a REAL close eye on this when you get it running.

The idea is genius however.

I hope it works.

[Taylormade]

I've discussed this ignition switch before but I'm still not sure exactly how it works.  I'm a complete idiot when it comes to wiring, so bear with me.  The switch has two positions - on and off.  You turn the key and there is no middle position, it just turns to the right and stops.

 

 

On the back of the switch there are three terminals marked BAT, STA and IGN, which I assume are Battery, Starter and Ignition.

 

 

When I turn the key on and test continuity, I get current flow between Ignition and Battery and between Ignition and Starter.  I am assuming the Ignition post receives the current and the

Battery and Starter distribute the current.  What confuses me is there is also current flow between Battery and Starter without touching the Ignition post.  With the key off there is no current flow

between any posts.  So, are the Battery and Starter posts connected and really serve no relevant purpose?  Why not just have two terminals, a current feed into the Ignition and a single post to feed to the

necessary devices on the dash?  Would a single terminal somehow overload the switch or...?  Just trying to figure out how to wire this up since I no longer have the integral coil/switch that originally

came with the car.

Edited April 28, 2020 by Taylormade (see edit history)

[Taylormade]

8 minutes ago, JACK M said:

Coils can run pretty hot.

This might result in a softening (or worse) of the clear tube.

Maybe a PVC water pipe could handle the heat better, after all it should handle hot water. (and would be stiffer)

I would keep a REAL close eye on this when you get it running.

The idea is genius however.

I hope it works.

I had the same concerns.  The acrylic tube I got has a very high temperature rating.  It's designed for high heat situations.  I am a bit worried that it might hold in the heat from the coil and cause problems.  Still have some concerns on that front.

[keiser31]

1 hour ago, Taylormade said:

I had the same concerns.  The acrylic tube I got has a very high temperature rating.  It's designed for high heat situations.  I am a bit worried that it might hold in the heat from the coil and cause problems.  Still have some concerns on that front.

You could always drill the tube full of holes to alleviate the heat buildup.

 

[Taylormade]

Well, with a little persuasion, the tube fit into the dash mount perfectly. I was surprised at how little stress there seemed to be with the coil inserted in the other end of the tube.  it doesn't weigh as much as I thought or stick out as far as I thought it would.  I may drill a few holes in the tube as kieser31 suggested, but I don't want to weaken the tube to the point it fails.  Just how hot do coils get?  There doesn't seem to be any cooling setup to dissipate the heat, and I've also seen hotrodders put them inside billet mounts that I suspect would also hold in heat, fins or not.  I've seen coils mounted on the top of the engine, which is definitely not the coolest place on the car.  I guess if it starts to melt, I'll have my answer.

 

[ply33]

6 hours ago, Taylormade said:

I've discussed this ignition switch before but I'm still not sure exactly how it works.  I'm a complete idiot when it comes to wiring, so bear with me.  The switch has two positions - on and off.  You turn the key and there is no middle position, it just turns to the right and stops.

 

On the back of the switch there are three terminals marked BAT, STA and IGN, which I assume are Battery, Starter and Ignition.

 

When I turn the key on and test continuity, I get current flow between Ignition and Battery and between Ignition and Starter.  I am assuming the Ignition post receives the current and the

Battery and Starter distribute the current.  What confuses me is there is also current flow between Battery and Starter without touching the Ignition post.  With the key off there is no current flow

between any posts.  So, are the Battery and Starter posts connected and really serve no relevant purpose?  Why not just have two terminals, a current feed into the Ignition and a single post to feed to the

necessary devices on the dash?  Would a single terminal somehow overload the switch or...?  Just trying to figure out how to wire this up since I no longer have the integral coil/switch that originally

came with the car.

 

On my '33 Plymouth the switch has two positions: On and Off. But, like yours, there are three contacts in the switch. In the off position the wiper does not make connection with any of the contacts. In the on position the wiper connects all three contacts

 

In the case of my switch, one of those three contacts is to a wire running in an armored cable to the firewall mounted coil. Of the other two, one goes to power on the ammeter the other powers the fuel gauge and coil.

 

The design is such that you can’t hot wire the coil by putting power on the opposite terminal from the normal feed.

 

But in your case, I don't see why they would bother unless that switch was somehow designed to be hard mounted to the coil without the third terminal being externally accessible.

[Taylormade]

I’m not sure the switch cares, but I would think that the Ignition terminal takes the power feed coming in from the ammeter.  Then the other two terminals are the wire to the negative terminal on the coil and the other to the fuel gauge.  So, when the switch is turned on, you get power to both the coil and fuel gauge.  Basically like your car with the external coil.  I guess they gave up the one piece coil/ignition switch arrangement after 32.

[Taylormade]

I was putting my driveshaft back in today and noticed some seepage around the edge of the front U-joint.  I realized I hadn't put the gasket back in when I installed the u-joint.  I also realized I don't have any gaskets - so I scanned the bottom plate of an extra u-joint base and made new gasket technical drawings that I can cut out using the method I described in an earlier post using the Cricut C and C machine.  Here is the artwork.  The bar at the top is exactly 5 inches so I can scale the drawing correctly in the Cricut software.  Again, the advantage of this method is the gasket is perfectly flat after it's cut out, with no raised edges from punching holes and i get a perfect fit.

 

[Taylormade]

 I've complained about this before, but I have the distinct impression that the Chrysler engineer who designed the Floating Power transmission mounting setup ended up on the breadline once the DL models went into production.  I had the unfortunate experience of removing the front U-joint this morning (for at least the fifth or sixth time) and it doesn't get any easier.  As I said above, I neglected to put gaskets on the surface between the U-joint and the parking brake drum.  The problem is the way the bolts that hold it on are positioned.

 

As you can see in this shot of the entire drivetrain assembled, the u-joint is held on by six bolts that extend through the parking brake drum and are held on by lock washers and nuts.  If you look closely you can see the edge of the metal shield near the forward part of the drum.  There are two shields, top and bottom held on by two bolts each - and, at least, these bolts attach to threaded mounts.  They are designed to prevent crud getting up inside the drum.  So after getting a wrench up into a nearly inaccessible area and removing the bolts and the shields, you finally have access to the inside of the brake drum and the six captive nuts for the u-joint bolts.  HOWEVER, it is nearly impossible to get any kind of wrench in there to unscrew the nuts.  The only way I could find was to use a socket wrench with a u-joint adapter.  Even then, there is only one area where the socket will fit and reach the nut, and the socket u-joint has to be used at a sharp angle to work.  It's a real nightmare.

 

 

Here it is with the u-joint finally off.

 

 

Even worse is putting it back on.  You have to reach back inside the drum with two fingers and carefully get the lock washer on the bolt end.  It has to be done entirely by touch.  Then, using the same two finger method, you have to try and get the nut in there and get it threaded on the bolt.  I'm usually successful about twenty-five percent of the time - on a good day.  I'm printing out the gaskets today and steeling myself for reassembly tomorrow.  The only good news is I discovered I had actually installed gaskets on the u-joint covers, so I don't have to take the u-joints apart - just install the gasket between the u-joint and the mounting flange on the brake drum.  Once this is done, the driveshaft goes back on and I can install the new floors.

Edited May 4, 2020 by Taylormade (see edit history)

[keiser31]

I feel your pain. Mine are NEARLY the same to remove. A bit easier, but SHEESH, what a job!

[Taylormade]

Finally got around to finishing up the instrument cluster.  Bob's Speedometer rebuilt the water gauge, calibrated the fuel gauge and rebuilt the tank sending unit.

 

 

 

 

Based on what was left of the old gaskets, I used my previously mentioned method to cut new ones.  I can't stress how accurately these things are cut, especially the round holes for the screws/bolts.

 

 

They fit like a glove (unless you're O.J. Simpson).

 

 

Everything went together very easily and now it's ready to install in the dash.  The new face on the water gauge is indistinguishable from the other originals.  They are all the same shade, it just doesn't show in this photo for some reason.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Taylormade]

Another example of the gaskets I cut with the C and C machine.  This one was for the speedometer.

 

 

My Rube Goldberg coil holder turned out great.  It fits in the clamp behind the dash where the original coil was located.  I drilled a hole for the wires to the ignition switch and slotted the sides for the clamp to hold the coil in.

 

 

 

All the dash wiring is ready to go.  As soon as I get firewall pad I can install the instrument cluster, the choke, throttle and Free Wheeling cables, the coil and the ignition switch and I'll be ready to start Daphne the way she was meant to be started.

 

 

[zeke01]

If I may offer a suggestion, test the temperature gauge in a pot of boiling water before installing. Stand over the bulb and see if you smell any chemical smell. Those bulbs don’t always seal up completely.  Knowledge gained the hard way. Zeke

[Taylormade]

I’m sure Bob’s stands by their work.  I did the boiling water test when they first sent it back and it was dead on.  Thanks, it’s a good tip and an easy way to test the gauge.

[zeke01]

It has been several years, but I believe it was Bob’s who did my gauge. Of course they remedied the problem, but it is a trial and error kind of project. Zeke

Edited May 5, 2020 by zeke01 (see edit history)