The Ressurection of Daphne - a 1932 DL

[RichBad]

3 hours ago, Taylormade said:

 

This is my biggest worry.  There is obvious wear to the pinion gear (not sure of the correct term) where it meshes with the worm gear.  I don't know what is acceptable in these cases, but there is certainly some damage.  I don't plan to drive the car to California twice a year, so maybe this isn't as bad as I thought, but it was disappointing to see.

 

 

 

That doesn’t look too bad, if clean it all up then re-assemble and adjust in the correct order and see how it feels and if you have too much play.  Mine was a lot worse than that and I couldn’t get a good balance between not binding and not having too much play.  I ended up having to polish the wear of the gears.  It took ages and had to polish a bit, re assemble and adjust with some blue on the teeth - try it under load then strip and use the blue markings to guide where more polishing was needed.  Took me about a week but worked out nice in the end!

[Bullfrog_eng]

I know much , if not all of this may not be applicable to your steering box, but may be worth a read.

Not sure if yours is the same, but the most important thing to realize with the DA box is that free play must be minimal in the "straight ahead" position but increases dramatically towards either right or left lock. This is normal to ensure that the car does not wander  when driving on a straight road.

Good luck

[30dodge35]

Taylmade, I have a technical builtin, I got from Harry  on adjusting Gimmer box, if you PM me your email , I will send you a link

 

Edited September 27, 2019 by 30dodge35 (see edit history)

[Taylormade]

Checking things out in the steering box and I think it looks okay. 

 

 

The bearings and races seem to be fine. 

 

 

 

The race up inside the housing looks to be fine - I don't know how I'd ever get it out of there if i had to replace it!  I'm now pretty sure the worm gear did not move on the shaft.  The key is integral to the worm and it looks like the gear is right up to where the keyway starts to rise up.  The steering shaft does not come out of the bottom of the worm - it falls maybe a quarter of an inch short.  If anyone has a disassembled unit that shows the position of the worm gear on the shaft I'd sure like to see a photo or some measurements.  A little paint and I'll put it back together.

[JACK M]

Glad to see you back on it.

Been enjoying your build for a few years.

[Taylormade]

Thanks.  I’m finally cleared for knee replacement surgery next Tuesday, but my wife has promised to haul in items from the garage so I can work on them at a table in the living room.  Since almost all parts are restored and painted, I plan to assemble the head and cowl lights with new wiring, put the taillight back together and finish putting the dash and gauges together.  Hopefully, I’ll be walking again when I’m finished with all that.

[Spinneyhill]

Great news! We all hope it goes very well for you and look forward to your speedy recovery.

[Bullfrog_eng]

That's fantastic. All the best

[keiser31]

10 hours ago, Taylormade said:

Thanks.  I’m finally cleared for knee replacement surgery next Tuesday, but my wife has promised to haul in items from the garage so I can work on them at a table in the living room.  Since almost all parts are restored and painted, I plan to assemble the head and cowl lights with new wiring, put the taillight back together and finish putting the dash and gauges together.  Hopefully, I’ll be walking again when I’m finished with all that.

EXCELLENT news!

[Taylormade]

I knew things were going to good to be true.  My clean and paint steering box project just turned into a major problem.  I noticed, when I took the box apart, the outer steering column was very hard to unscrew.  I also noticed the dreaded marks of a pipe wrench that had been uses in the distant past to remove or replace said column.  Today I started cleaning the column and discovered why it was so hard to get out - and why it probably will never go back in again.  The threads are absolutely destroyed.  I doubt if running a tap - provided I could afford or find one that large - would do much to help.  There are whole chunks missing.  Plus, check out the wrench marks on the threads - somebody went at this thing with abandon.

 

 

 

Anybody got a spare steering column for a 32 Dodge Brothers out there?   Or could a machine shop weld this up and re-thread it?  It looks like the threads in the box itself are okay, which is a relief and a surprise.

 

 

[Spinneyhill]

Don't give up on that one! I would try a thread file first. It might take a while, but it should clean up with a bit of patience.

Well, maybe a lot of patience. Mine is like that below: the ends do internal threads, the main body does external threads. This one can do 8 pitches.

 

https://www.webbikeworld.com/repair-threads-thread-file/

 

[Taylormade]

Sounds like a plan Spinneyhill.  Once I figure out the pitch I’ll get the correct file.  They seem to sell files for assorted pitches, but they all show different sizes.  Since I can do this sitting down, it may be a good recovery project.

[Spinneyhill]

12 minutes ago, Taylormade said:

Once I figure out the pitch I’ll get the correct file.

Do you have a pitch gauge? That one above can do 8 pitches, one of which is likely to be the one you want. Anyway, you should use a pitch gauge to test first.

[Taylormade]

I’ve got one around somewhere - you know that story.  But I can lay a common bolt in the threads and it matches perfectly, so it’s a common size.

[Spinneyhill]

Xclnt!

[Gunsmoke]

I'd start with a thread chaser/die, any good machine shop should have one that size, and you appear to have 2-3 good threads to get it started. I've always been amazed at how a good die can correct such damage, and the main advantage is they do not alter pattern and avoid filing off excess material. A split die would be even better, but I doubt you would will find one that large. I had some poor/damaged threads on the ends of several of my 9/16" fine thread shock bolts. I cut a corresponding nut in half and clamped it on the threads with a vice grip (not too tight just able to turn), with bolt in my vise, and amazing how it cleaned things up. Machine shops have those long heavy duty handles to make the job easier.

[zeke01]

Would one of these be helpful? Ken-Tool TD30. They are used to rethread axle threads

 that have been beat on until mushroomed out. The thread pitch is as follows: 3/4-16tpi, 3/4-20, 7/8-14, 1”-13, 1 1/8-11.5, 1 1/4-11. You place the tool over the threads and tighten lightly, repeating tighter and tighter until the threads regain their shape.

Edited September 29, 2019 by zeke01 (see edit history)

[Taylormade]

The Ken-Tool would probably work, but it’s too small - the diameter of my unit is two inches at least.  You may be right, Gunsmoke, but good machine shops are hard to find around here.  McMaster-Carr has a correct sized thread chaser die for around 300 bucks.

[Ian_Greenlaw]

Hope the surgery goes well. I'll keep posting to take up the slack !!!

[ArticiferTom]

What is the size ? To me those threads do not look bad .  Clean up with a tri side file or the thread file like suggested . Than add sealant during install to prevent leaks if that your worry .

[Taylormade]

Lying in a hospital bed after having knee replacement surgery.  Everything seems to have gone fairly well.  Some pain, but not as bad as I was expecting.  They say I should be home Thursday.

 

I found a terrific machine shop, one those places full of mills, lathes and other machinery run by two guys with tons of experience who love old cars.  After explaining my problem with my steering column,  the first question was, “got it with you?”  I showed it to them and said it was from a 32 Dodge Brothers.  That was all I needed to say.  Their eyes lit up, told me it would take a couple of days, and then proceeded to show me the 29 Ford pickup, 36 Ford pickup and the 55 VW convertible in the back room.  They are going to turn the threads on a lathe and use a tap on the interior threads of the steering box.  Hopefully, problem solved.

[keiser31]

Get better QUICK like a bunny so we can see more progress! Hahaha.

[Spinneyhill]

Xclnt news on the steering box and even better on you. I don't think they will let you lie around in bed for long! All the best for your recovery.

[Ian_Greenlaw]

Glad the op went ok. Each day is a step forward.

[Bob Zetnick]

Glad your surgery went well and hope your recovery is quick. At least you have some projects on your car so you don't get bored. I sure do enjoy reading your posts and watching your car come together.

[Taylormade]

Back on my feet, no pain, totally mobile, no crutches, cane or walker.  I can finally get back to Daphne!

 

The machine shop I mentioned earlier did a great job on the steering box and only charged me 25 bucks.

 

The before picture shows the roached threads;  not a pretty sight.

 

 

The after shot looks a lot cleaner.  not perfect, but a vast improvement.  And you can't replace missing metal.

 

 

They also cleaned up the housing threads.

 

 

Now the two pieces screw together easily by hand.  No binding or drag.

 

 

Another problem solved.

 

[JACK M]

Good to see you back.

And glad you are mobile and pain free.

[Ian_Greenlaw]

Great to see your back and pain free......guess what....I'm going to see a knee surgeon on Wednesday to get an opinion......I think its catching !!!

[keiser31]

Glad you're doing better. Keep up the good work and attitude.

[C Carl]

Happy to see man and machine out of the shop doing well !    -   Carl 

[Ian_Greenlaw]

Just checking in o see how things are going ?

[Taylormade]

Working on the steering box.  Not very visual when it comes to photos.  I also put the taillight together and just got my resorted temp and fuel guages ready to put back in the instrument panel.  Super cold here at the moment which makes working in the garage almost impossible.  Thanks for thinking about me - still plugging along.

[Taylormade]

I'm putting in my windows and discovered I'm missing a few small parts.  This is for my 1932 Dodge Brothers DL sedan, but I assume these were used on many other cars.  They are the little rollers that prevent the window glass from rattling.  I have one and need three more.  They were apparently only used on the front window glass, one outside, one inside just below the window opening.  I also assume they had a rubber roller over the steel shaft - mine is long gone.  If anyone has any extras or knows of a source, let me know.

 

Here is what they look like.

 

 

Thanks.

[keiser31]

31 minutes ago, Taylormade said:

I'm putting in my windows and discovered I'm missing a few small parts.  This is for my 1932 Dodge Brothers DL sedan, but I assume these were used on many other cars.  They are the little rollers that prevent the window glass from rattling.  I have one and need three more.  They were apparently only used on the front window glass, one outside, one inside just below the window opening.  I also assume they had a rubber roller over the steel shaft - mine is long gone.  If anyone has any extras or knows of a source, let me know.

 

Here is what they look like.

 

 

Thanks.

It looks like you might be able to slit a tube of rubber down the side and slip it on and glue it onto the roller.

[Taylormade]

When it comes to cutting gaskets, I'm about as bad as it gets.  We have a Cricut machine which we use to cut out paper, cardboard and light plastic.  I use it to build models.  It makes very accurate cuts and can cut perfect circles.  When I was working on a project with my daughter, I suddenly realized that the machine would be ideal for making gaskets, so I thought I'd give it a try.

 

This is the machine.  It's just really just a C and C machine and works cutting on two axis.

 

 

I took what was left of the gasket to my Steering box and taped it to a sheet of paper.

 

 

 

Then I scanned it and brought it into Adobe Illustrator and used it as a pattern to make the shape of the gasket.  I set it up so I could cut two at a time, just in case.  The artwork was saved as a PNG file with a transparent background.

 

 

Then I put the files into the Cricut's software program and had it cut the gaskets.  This is on cardstock, but it will cut gasket paper just as well.  I was amazed at the fit.  And the cuts are absolutely clean and flat.

 

 

 

It's always great when a plan works out.

 

Edited April 8, 2020 by Taylormade (see edit history)

[Ian_Greenlaw]

Does a great job on the gaskets !!

[dlong]

It is great to see the progress on this car and that man and machine are together.

[Taylormade]

Put the steering box back together today.  The bearings as races were in pretty good condition so I just cleaned them up and then repacked them before assembly.

 

 

I figured it would be a pretty straightforward job as it's just a sandwich, with the bottom race already in place (how you get it out of there is beyond my pay grade and it didn't need to be removed, anyway) the bottom bearing, the worm gear, the other bearing and then the upper race.  The upper race proved to be more of a pain then I expected.  If I'd had a large piece of pipe I could have probably done better, but the local hardware stores are all closed because of you know what, so I had to try a tap it in slowly with a small drift and a hammer.  Tapping is probably a bit mild, as it took a lot of force to get it started.  About the time I was about to give up and call it a day, my final "tap" sent it down into place.  You can  just see it down there in this shot.

 

 

The steering shaft and worm gear turned smoothly so I guess i got things right.

 

 

 

 

There are no other bearings in this Gemmer box, just the bushings for the gear shaft.  Both the shaft and the bushings are in good shape.  Clearance is about .002 as near as I can measure.

 

I just made the gasket for this application, so it's time for cleanup and paint, and then final assembly.  I'm using Corn head grease as lubricant.

 

 

I did have one question.  The outer steering tube screws into the steering box.  i discussed my problems with the threads in an earlier post.  According to the owner's manual, you screw in this outer tube to adjust the load on the bearings.  It says to tighten it down with the front wheels off the ground until you feel a slight drag on the steering wheel, then back it off a quarter turn.  This makes some sense, but as hard as it was to get the bearing race in there, it seems as if you tightened it down and then backed it off, the race wouldn't back off as it's not attached to the outer column.  Maybe just using the steering for a bit backs it off, but I'm a bit confused as to how that would work.  They don't give any play specifications as to bearing clearance in this unit.

 

Going to start putting the windows back in tomorrow.  

[Taylormade]

Since I need to get my dash wired, I finally got around to addressing the problem of my firewall pad.  This is very visible in my car and the original is in really bad shape and has also separated.  The black surface faces inside and is visible.  There are also many unnecessary holes drilled in the firewall, so I will have to determine which holes should be punched in the new pad.  I found a company called Quiet Ride Solutions that will make me a new pad.  They didn't have a pattern for a 32DL, but I told them I had the original pad and they offered to make me a new pad based on my old one and only charge me half price since I was supplying them with a pattern for this model.  At this point I know I should have filled the excess holes in the firewall, but I'm just going to install rubber plugs and call it a day since I would like to drive Daphne before I die.

 

 

 

[Alan Cutler]

5 hours ago, Taylormade said:

 I found a company called Quiet Ride Solutions that will make me a new pad.  

 

Great company and if its not right, they will make it right, on them....be sure to get the kick panels too, that way the patterns will match.