edinmass Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 The RM car above is actually a bit different than the previous car. The first PII you posted at the Ocala Florida meet a few years ago took me to breakfast this morning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted January 16, 2023 Author Share Posted January 16, 2023 4 minutes ago, edinmass said: The RM car above is actually a bit different than the previous car. The first PII you posted at the Ocala Florida meet a few years ago took me to breakfast this morning. I think it might be a Phantom I. I need to go find it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted January 16, 2023 Author Share Posted January 16, 2023 It is 301AJS so it is a PII. Interesting that it doesn't seem to have the full length hood. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8E45E Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 1 hour ago, Gunsmoke said: I've always hated anything fake, whether on a car (padded tops, portholes, non-functional vents etc), a house (fake shutters, fake bricks/stone, fake Greek columns, etc), no matter the make/model/year. Just my preference that "less is more". There's a reason why Mercedes Benz, BMW and Audi sales only went UP in the 1970's while Cadillac, Lincoln, and Imperial went in the toilet. The Germans increased their use of REAL wood and leather, while the (once) Big Three's luxury offerings started to use fake wood & leather trim inside. Most luxury car buyers agreed. Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramair Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 AJ, I also would be a buyer for that car, as you know garage space is a premium and I only have one spot left that’s a little less than 10’, I was saving it for a Crosely hotshot, but looking closely at your photo I think I can fit it in😀 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West Peterson Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 47 minutes ago, alsancle said: It is 301AJS so it is a PII. Interesting that it doesn't seem to have the full length hood. The image has been foreshortened horizontally, as evidenced by the oblong wheels/tires. Try this. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted January 16, 2023 Author Share Posted January 16, 2023 Not a Special Newmarket but not bad. I remember one of these for sale no reserve at the Hershey Auction back in 2001. Might have been this exact car as it was black also. Note the full length hood and rear mounted spare. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted January 16, 2023 Author Share Posted January 16, 2023 (edited) A PII with a PI Dover body. Edited January 16, 2023 by alsancle (see edit history) 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted January 16, 2023 Author Share Posted January 16, 2023 After RR bought Brewster (and it bankrupted them) you didn't see a lot of Brewster bodies on non RR chassis. Here is one on Packard. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted January 16, 2023 Author Share Posted January 16, 2023 Willoughby Packard that is not bad looking. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted January 16, 2023 Author Share Posted January 16, 2023 Willoughby Lincoln 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted January 16, 2023 Author Share Posted January 16, 2023 And another. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George K Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 22 minutes ago, alsancle said: And another. Were does this car score on the Grandpa meter scale. I would believe very high. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bryankazmer Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 1 minute ago, George K said: Were does this car score on the Grandpa meter scale. I would believe very high. I think low - the fastback rear styling is more sporting that the typical trunk back touring sedan of the time. Grandpa might go to Rollston for one of their high roof specials. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1937hd45 Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 That four cylinder version isn't as striking as the six on top . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1937hd45 Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 Just wondering is 1934 the year that slim and trim looking cars ended, they seam to look like they could out run the later plump versions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted January 16, 2023 Author Share Posted January 16, 2023 7 minutes ago, 1937hd45 said: Just wondering is 1934 the year that slim and trim looking cars ended, they seam to look like they could out run the later plump versions. 34 is the BEST year for GM products. For Chrysler, Packard, Ford it was 32. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
58L-Y8 Posted January 16, 2023 Share Posted January 16, 2023 Let us not forget this marvelous Pierce-Arrow. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted January 17, 2023 Author Share Posted January 17, 2023 Good one Steve! Here is a Willoughby Duesenberg that is not too bad looking. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted January 17, 2023 Author Share Posted January 17, 2023 I've been focused on American coachbuilers, but there are lots of great European 4 door sedan bodies. This is semi-obscure. An Erdmann and Rossi body on a Maybach. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8E45E Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 55 minutes ago, alsancle said: I've been focused on American coachbuilers, but there are lots of great European 4 door sedan bodies. This is semi-obscure. An Erdmann and Rossi body on a Maybach. Sodomka in Czechoslovakia did as well: The Last Pre-War Car From Sodomka | CEAutoClassic Craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West Peterson Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 2 hours ago, alsancle said: Good one Steve! Here is a Willoughby Duesenberg that is not too bad looking. 6 hours ago, alsancle said: Willoughby Packard that is not bad looking. Identical, no? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West Peterson Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 9 hours ago, West Peterson said: Identical, no? The Willoughby club sedan carries off better on the 153-inch wheelbase Duesenberg chassis. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted January 17, 2023 Author Share Posted January 17, 2023 Just now, West Peterson said: The Willoughby club sedan carries off better on the 153-inch wheelbase Duesenberg chassis. Because it has a relatively high greenhouse. The longer wheelbase and hood stretches things out. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West Peterson Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 31 minutes ago, alsancle said: Because it has a relatively high greenhouse. The longer wheelbase and hood stretches things out. Something wrong with this one, other than the fake landau bars not only being upside down, but on the wrong sides of the car. This more than likely started out as a six-window limousine/sedan 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted January 17, 2023 Author Share Posted January 17, 2023 24 minutes ago, West Peterson said: Something wrong with this one, other than the fake landau bars not only being upside down, but on the wrong side of the car. This more than likely started out as a six-window limousine/sedan Agreed. I posted it because I knew you would appreciate the tires, spotlight and white top. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West Peterson Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 10 minutes ago, alsancle said: Agreed. I posted it because I knew you would appreciate the tires, spotlight and white top. Yeah.... the smaller wheels and skirted fenders are the cherries on the top, so to speak. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
58L-Y8 Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 22 minutes ago, West Peterson said: Something wrong with this one, other than the fake landau bars being upside down. This more than likely started out as a six-window limousine/sedan Did Bohmann and Schwartz get their hands on this Duesenberg j Willougby six-window sedan-limousine? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
63RedBrier Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 18 hours ago, alsancle said: And another. I believe this Willoughby was in the Northern Virginia area for a few years… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 (edited) Speaking of fastback design, I've always been partial to the 1939 Lincoln Zephyr. Everyone might have their favorites, but to me the 1939 gets all the details right--delicate grille with pointed nose, awesome dashboard with that center stack, and highly detailed tail with so many wonderful curves coming together perfectly. It's a car that just gets better and better the more you look at it, especially from the rear. I regret selling this mostly original one (the fenders have obviously been repainted at some point) and still think it's one of the prettiest 4-doors of the immediate pre-war period. Edited January 17, 2023 by Matt Harwood (see edit history) 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SC38dls Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 Matt that is good looking even with the skirts and white walls. The lines do come together nicely. dave s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walt G Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 (edited) De trunk of De 1939 Lincoln Zephyr to show how they actually got a spare tire to fit , have an image of the body skeleton as well. Edited January 17, 2023 by Walt G (see edit history) 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 2 minutes ago, Walt G said: De trunk of De 1939 Lincoln Zephyr to show how they actually got a spare tire to fit , have an image of the body skeleton as well. Pretty clever design although you'd have to be very careful packing your gear so the tire will still clear. There's decent space in there. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHuDWah Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 14 minutes ago, Walt G said: De trunk of De 1939 Lincoln Zephyr to show how they actually got a spare tire to fit , have an image of the body skeleton as well. I bet the little old granny owner had fun getting the spare down and more so, back up, not to mention wrestling luggage in and out over it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walt G Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 Take a few moments to look at the image I posted - look at how the way the fenders and body flow into each other, motion captured in sheet metal. All designed with pencils and erasers, ellipse templates, then sculpted in clay so moulds could be made to produce them. No computers to generate images, all hand done - think about that , appreciate the flow and the skill it took to turn a two dimensional image into a three dimensional object. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 3 minutes ago, Walt G said: Take a few moments to look at the image I posted - look at how the way the fenders and body flow into each other, motion captured in sheet metal. All designed with pencils and erasers, ellipse templates, then sculpted in clay so moulds could be made to produce them. No computers to generate images, all hand done - think about that , appreciate the flow and the skill it took to turn a two dimensional image into a three dimensional object. I find that to be one of the most remarkable things about our old cars, particularly the complex ones. I look at the Marmon Sixteen in our showroom, a work of art in aluminum, and it boggles my mind that some guy drew that engine on a piece of paper, then handed it to a guy in the machine shop and they made it from nothingness. That it works at all is remarkable, but the fact that it is so buttery smooth with massive torque, all working in virtual silence is truly miraculous. When we think that we're smarter than these guys because we have computers and 80 years of additional knowledge on our side, take a look at a Duesenberg J engine or a Cadillac V16 or that Marmon engine and think again. Those were brilliant men who forgot more about making machines work than most of us will ever know. 3 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8E45E Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 54 minutes ago, Matt Harwood said: Those were brilliant men who forgot more about making machines work than most of us will ever know. Because they knew how to use a Slide Rule. Craig 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
31nash880 Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 This question fits in here. Maybe 40 years ago went to look at a Rolls-Royce for sale. Of all things in a chicken coup. Remember a story that they are made of hand formed aluminum (which saw since it was stripped), but many of the craftmen where alcoholics and lived under bridges. I have always hoped this was a false story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walt G Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 Outer skin was hand formed aluminum, the structural framework would have been wood, most of the time 2nd growth ash for its strength and somewhat flexibility. Oak is a strong wood as well but can split and fracture much more easily thus was not used for the most part because of that. Do not know about the living conditions nor alcohol consumption but am sure the purchaser had to consume some adult beverage when quoted the cost to have a body built. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHuDWah Posted January 17, 2023 Share Posted January 17, 2023 1 hour ago, Walt G said: Outer skin was hand formed aluminum, the structural framework would have been wood, most of the time 2nd growth ash for its strength and somewhat flexibility. Oak is a strong wood as well but can split and fracture much more easily thus was not used for the most part because of that. Do not know about the living conditions nor alcohol consumption but am sure the purchaser had to consume some adult beverage when quoted the cost to have a body built. Like the old saying, "If you have to ask the price, you can't afford it!" 😉 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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