Buick Club National Dues

[Guest BJM]

Why not look into a senior membership that may be applied for when you reach a certain age, 60 or 65 or some other acceptable age?

Good idea, even if it's just $5 less, it shows appreciation for seniors, many who have been long time members. Or perhaps a long time member discount. $1 off for every year over 20 years a member.

Bad idea: Because 95 % of members qualify for the senior discount. (Just kidding)

[old-tank]

I just looked at my checkbook register and found a check for $60 made out to the BCA for my Ames registration. SIXTY DOLLARS!!!

I spent around $350 on Hotels, $800 at the swap meet, $400 on gas, and let's say around $300 on food, beverages...

How is it that the BCA gets blamed for how expensive it was?

Look at that and tell me that this is not an expensive hobby. I got so tired of the whining about $20-30 of 'excessive' dues that I thought about just offering to send that to those poor destitute individuals...I got over that thought real quick (someone might take me up on that offer).

Willie

[special55]

Look at that and tell me that this is not an expensive hobby. I got so tired of the whining about $20-30 of 'excessive' dues that I thought about just offering to send that to those poor destitute individuals...I got over that thought real quick (someone might take me up on that offer).

Willie

I guess fronting me the three+ grand I'll need for chrome on the 55 is out of the question then huh??????????

[Bill Stoneberg]

Only 3 K ??? you are getting off cheap.....

[38Buick 80C]

That begs a question that I am hopeful the National office may be able to answer, but may not...how many, or what proportion, of BCA members claim a chapter affiliation?

The following is based on the chapter survey performed by Chapter and Region Coordinators, Mike and Nancy Book, that was presented to the BOD in Ames. Chapter directors were phoned and asked questions about their chapter. One question was how many members do you have. 14 chapters failed to respond, but the grand total membership of those who did respond is 2917. Making an assumption that those chapters that failed to respond are small or under-performing chapters lets say they have an average of 10 chapter members each, that adds 140 members to about 3060 out of the 8100+ current members or 38% of members belong to a chapter.

A few caveats

1. Members can join more than one chapter which would skew the number up.

2. Its a survey and I am sure there was some estimating by the chapter directors so 38% is approximate

3. Does not include membership in BCA Divisions, only chapters

4. I like cherry pie!

Edited October 5, 2010 by 38Buick 80C
Forgot to mention what pie I like!! (see edit history)

[NTX5467]

So, if lodging and "eats" are about equal, with fuel being about 1/2 of what swap meet expdenditures might be, that might be a good rule of thumb for future national meet attendees? That might also mean that those who travel the fartherist will be the largest purchasers at the swap meet?

It appears that so many BCA members seem to be so focused on the 400 Point System judging that they have totally missed the other options they might have to display their vehicles at national meets? These other alternatives were designed to encourage MORE members to participate in the national meets with Buicks they already have. To me, the Driven Class can be an entry to the 400 Point System later on, as well as an exit from the 400 Point System later on. Similar with the Archival Class, I suspect.

Regards,

NTX5467

[buick5563]

Maybe, but I made sure I had a fistful of cash along with my detailed list of stuff I wanted / needed. That is how I chose to spend my money. Others went on other shopping expeditions or ventures. BTW, I forgot that my dad paid for hotels up and back so I would add a few hundred more onto lodging expenses. Oh yeah, then there was the matter of tow trucks, Buick dealerships, master cylinder rebuild kits, etc.

Seems like the kinds of things even someone in the BDE (an organization I respect and would love to join later) , or any street rodder on the Power Tour would have to pay for.

Just sayin'

[Guest wildcat465]

Dues, $50

Filling the tank on my 84 Riv T-Type last weekend, $52.78

Friendships and experiences developed being in the BCA, Priceless.

I like Pecan pie.

[RICK YOUNG]

Listen to that Willie.

You have to trust a guy from Texas named Willie.

[Thriller]

I had pecan pie last night at a fall supper....

Harvested pumpkins on Friday...they're green yet, but they'll ripen and than means pumpkin pie.

I'd like to hope that Paul and Kris remember Saskatoon berry pie...that may simply be the best pie imaginable.

I find that trying to track expenses for a National meet can be almost depressing. We are down to one who will regularly order from the children's menu, so meals get more expensive. Ames was relatively close, so less in fuel, but because it was close, we brought a second car. Between gas at around 15 mpg and diesel at 12 or so, even the relatively short trip (something like 1300 miles round trip) along with hotels and meals definitely made the meet registration a small portion of the cost. Actually, we spent more at the tie dye guy than we did with the meet registration.

[RICK YOUNG]

OK, My serious reply is this.

The last movie we saw in a Theatre was "Twister". I gave up on golf (actually it gave up on me).

For $4.17 per issue (divided by 2, as the first lady now snags it from me) is near $2.00 per month each, plus membership benefits, plus 8,500 of the best/nicest people you'll ever meet on this great planet we live on.

A monthly magazine that is of the utmost quality.

I can't run the 455 for 5 minutes for that.

I agree there could be ways to run a lower cost National. If someone out there believes they can, then "SHOW ME THE BID" .

If you want to have it in a desolate place (no Iowa jokes here please) in the parking lot of a Super 8 . No tours? No Hospitality Room (not a bad idea)? No judging?

Somebody try it.

Buick has a reputation for dignity. The National events and the Bugle are a notch above the rest.

As a GM rep told me..."We want Buick to be the Premium Brand" , I think our members are of "Premium Caliber".

Now keep this in mind.

Just around the corner is 2016, which will be our 50th Anniversary National.

Whoever is awarded that event will surely have the opportunity to not only have a great event , but also make some "big bucks".

Remember that before "opening mouth and inserting foot".

[1957buickjim]

Touche Rick! All good points for the organization and why it is important to particiapte/join. My question is are we addressing the issue with Mr. Weatherly regarding the dues / MAL? or going off on a tangent regarding the Nationals? With the original post, the question was about a sub level of dues that someone could pay.

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

BRAVO, Rick!!!!

Ben

[buick5563]

Jim, this discussion ALWAYS goes off on a tangent.

In the past, there have been threads started saying the dues are too high, the Nationals cost too much or are in the wrong place, the BOD is made up of incompetent buffoons, etc.

I'm not sure how to resolve this. BJM had a jokingly good point. If the AARP starts bombarding your mailbox when you hit 55, that makes many of the BCA members eligible for the Senior Discount. That leaves you (I assume), me, Thriller, BJM, the Syrdals, Special 55, and maybe a few others paying full price.

BUT WAIT, you say, the original poster didn't mention (specifically) a "Senior Discount", I did! Yeah, but as Apollo 455 said in his last (looooong) thread on this topic, the BCA will have died off in 12 years because the average age is 74 (or some made up statistic).

I am truly not trying to make light of this situation, but my point that I have made repeatedly is that for a family membership in an expensive hobby, $50 is not that much.

Then the Nationals costs get thrown around. Yes, going to some landmark (insert landmark here) and paying for a bus ride for two like I did a few years back is most likely not worth $40 (especially when hungover and promised a lunch that they ran out of!) . A la carte is the term that has been thrown around. You can conceivably spend a grand at a National if you paid for everything, which is why you must pick and choose. Thus, my swap meet theory. I can't just regularly go to Autozone and find NOS exhaust hangers for my car, so I bought them at the National Meet.

Then the "How can we attract new members at these prices?" start. I don't know. Maybe try being nice to people instead of saying whatever street rod project or lowrider POS doesn't belong in these hallowed halls, or some such nonsense.

I like the mentor idea that was suggested last time around where we give advice to a younger member and help them restore a car and teach them about it. The problem with that is that MY mentor who taught me a TON about cars lives 60 miles from my house. When I was going down there EVERY WEEKEND for six months, gas was a measly $1.50 a gallon. So on top of rebuilding my engine ($3k approx) I was also buying gas to get there. Well, there you go again, bragging about how much you spend on your car!!!

No Dude, you don't get it, I'm trying to show that spending money is part of this hobby. Even if your car is finished and pretty, and all you want to do is go on a vacation across this beautiful land of ours, you can have a mechanical problem that costs unknown money and time.

Mr. Weatherly, thank you for your question, and the time you have spent growing this club. Respectfully, IF you had sent me the letter, I would regretfully be one of the ones who told you no.

[Guest Dans 77 Limited]

Then the "How can we attract new members at these prices?" start. I don't know. Maybe try being nice to people instead of saying whatever street rod project or lowrider POS doesn't belong in these hallowed halls, or some such nonsense.

I am one of the above mentioned price complainers. However I have never judged anybody elses cars as unworthy. Hell my 67 Skylark has a big scrape down the side and lord fobid my Pontiac has (oh god im so ashamed) PRIMER on it . I still take them out , show them and enjoy them , and I also have the 67 listed in the BCA and the Pontiac has had me join POCI. I have seen many "less than perfect" Buicks and have tried to recruit them all. If anyone remembers back to the Opel thread I was one of the supporters for allowing them into the club. And now that I think about it I have been hands down the BIGGEST complainer about trying to recruit at the current club dues . So Im afraid that this dog just wont hunt Buick5563. The only Buick I really dont like is the 75-79 Skyhawks and thats due to bad personal ownership experiences. Those are about the only Buicks I would avoid.

I agree that this is beating a dead horse , god knows Ive left enough whip marks on it . Its time to let it go. We have stated our case and have been told to shut up and MYOB. Thats what we need to do right now. We have been asked to help save the BCA but in truth what we were really asked to do was to just agree with whatever we are being told is being done to save the BCA. Discounted dues , Members at large , electronic bugles, opening up the club to Opels these are all ideas that those in charge have decided will not work , (even though they havent given them a try ) and there is nothing in heaven or hell that is ever going to change their minds. To say or do anything else to change their minds is just wasting your time and your electricity. Follow my lead and give up !!!! youll sleep better and in the end you will have the ultimate weapon , you will have the I TOLD YOU SO

Time to go back to my self imposed banning from the site !!!!!

Dan

[rivgs]

Discounted dues , Members at large , electronic bugles, opening up the club to Opels these are all ideas that those in charge have decided will not work , (even though they havent given them a try ) and there is nothing in heaven or hell that is ever going to change their minds. To say or do anything else to change their minds is just wasting your time and your electricity. Follow my lead and give up !!!! youll sleep better and in the end you will have the ultimate weapon , you will have the I TOLD YOU SO

Dan,

Wonderful attitude, Please go back and look at the thread about a trial electronic Bugle. Also look at the Opel Forum. These are the start of things the board is trying to get membership up from ideas from the members. We have to be financialy responsible to the club and all of its members in the things we do. We can't spend money we don't have to try things if we don't see a viable outcome just because someone thinks it is a good idea. We are listening to the ideas submitted and debating their pros and cons. Those that really look like they will work get the green light. I have tried to give you logical reasons for what the board is doing in the past, but it seems you have chosen not to listen to what I or any number of the other posters on this forum have to say.

That is your right.

But please, as you're lurking on this forum ( your name does appear when you are logged in, so we know you are there ) try to get your facts correct when you are ready to come back and post again.

[NTX5467]

Dan, thanks for sticking your head up and contributing!

From my own observations, there are MANY, repeat . . . MANY who want the BCA to be what THEY want it to be. To them, if it's not 25 years old, it's just a "used car" and not worth of much else. OR . . . if it's not 12 years old, then it's not worth of being in the 400 Point Judging (they still might be building them more precisely, but there are still things that aren't absolutely "right" in fit and finish--by observation).

It was at the Kokomo, IN meet that the Driver's Class was proposed at the General Membership Meeting. Afterward, I heard an older-demographic member state to Mr. Brooks that he didn't think it should be for "used cars", or more modern cars, but limited more to "older" cars (as this member probably owned, I suspect).

So, Dan, I understand your orientation that "Nobody listens", as I've been advocating the removal of the Twelve Year Rule for many years. Heck, even make it 5 years rather than 12 . . . something to get more recent vehicles in the mix to possibly diminish the "antique" or "old cars only" perception by the general public of OUR group. Head on over to redirect and you'll find LOTs of younger Buick owners--of (GASP!!!) 4-door Buicks . . . Front Wheel Drive BUICKS . . . the same cars that some "normal" BCA Members would not consider collectible or show-worthy. Only problem is that this "unknown group of Buick owners" was apparently shunned by "somebody" and went off to do their own thing in the world of the Internet. Therefore, they don't really need US to enjoy their Buicks or network with other similar Buick owners in resovling service and repair issues.

Many keep talking about getting younger members in the BCA, but it appears that WE want THEM to like the same Buicks WE do, rather than other types of Buicks (that lay rubber from the "wrong end" of the car). In many cases, younger Buick enthusiasts aren't all GS racers either, but have a real appreciation for vintage Buicks. Still, though, they will need something modern to drive around during the week, so why not a Buick . . . but according to some BCA operatives, these newer Buicks "don't count" as they are not like THEY like. Yet WE want all Buick owners to be proud enough of their newer Buicks to promote the Buick hobby, but if they want to show their pride-and-joy newer Buicks . . . that dang Twelve Year Rule jumps up.

How about if we implement a "Twelve Year Class" at the BCA National Meets? EACH participant gets a recognition award for showing a newer Buick. Then let the participants vote among themselves as to which vehicles are the best . . . by whatever measure they can agree upon. Use them as a learning tool for future judges of those vehicles, too!

The problem with adding more "groups" or "classes" at the BCA National Meet is that it makes it a bigger circus (I mean that positively, but some might look at it otherwise). A bigger circus that needs larger venues to hold it all, which has already posed some problems with meet planners (I suspect). More groups means more judges . . . more related expenses . . . more volunteers needed. Still, though, trying to shrink the size of the national meets or break them up into more regionalized events is not a good idea . . . at least to me . . . although other groups do that.

By observation, there are many BCA members who want the BCA to be what THEY want it to be. To reflect their orientations and tastes in specific areas, with respect to Buick automobiles and such. So, with all due respect, we have people so focused on what THEY want the BCA to be . . . somewhat unyielding in such orientations . . . getting "out of shape" when "nobody listens" (or evidence of such "listening" is not observed--by words or actions) . . . such that many get "cross-threaded" and otherwise upset with the particular state of affairs rather than embracing the diversity (which any large group with a central focus usually has) and using THAT to build the organization to greater glory.

Many don't seem to want to know about Buicks other than the ones they like. Nothing wrong with that, but it can also engender a latent dislike of anybody that might like what the particular member doesn't like. Those "signals" can come out in speech patterns and body language . . . all of which can send prospective members to other groups where what they like is more agreeable to the general membership.

Many claim the BCA is an "antique" car club, yet I've never found that term used in any of the official documents about the organization--I've looked many times. Yet this "antique" mentallity seems to be alive and well . . . which is good, but also limiting to future growth. To many, that "antique" word can keep them away and also indicates "old folks" in a society that usually treasures youth.

Yes, Dan, some don't listen. Some don't want to listen if it might cause them to think about different points of view or orientations. Some might not understand, anyway, with all due respect, as there are many levels of knowledge and understanding of the BCA and how it got to be where it now is, among the many members . . . even some members with low membership numbers who have not followed the various goings-on and dynamics of the BCA organization over the years.

The BCA is a diverse and dynamic organization comprised of many GREAT people. We keep talking about that but somehow haven't figure out how to leverage that resource effectively.

In some cases, lessons from past miscues were not learned . . . or those that learned them were replaced by some who might not be aware of what happened. Still, though, I feel that ANY group (and members thereof) should be rekindling the "continuous improvement" orientation that was a buzz word of prior decades--put "mentoring" into that mix, too. These things can have a greater bearing upon the future health of ANY entity rather than just getting all balled-up in talking about membership dues.

In our modern business society, I feel that too much emphasis is put upon "numbers" (and generation thereof) rather than the quality of the operations of the particular business unit. The deliverance of a quality product will not go unnoticed, typically, especially if it's at a price that allows the business unit to be sustainable. Too little . . . well, we're seeing what's going on now with decreased tax revenues by municipalities and the impact it's having on staffing and services (even some tax rate increases!). Too much . . . limits potential clientel, especially in a time of economic flakiness, although many can still afford them if so motivated as others have to put things on hold at that price level. Finding that "sweet spot" where customer base is retained and expanded can take some doing, but is rewarding. Perhaps even having the price point just a hair "high" in order to initiate "aspirational" orientations of ownership or participation in the future can be beneficial . . . as long as the product is of generally high quality to not disappoint the future owner/participant.

And if somebody tries to use "numbers" and "projections" to prove their point, with counter-discussions, it can get to be like nothing more than two "duelling" economists talking about which one has the better solution to a particular economic problem/situation. Only problem is that it will take many years to prove who had the more correct solution. In the mean time, the mirrors reflect lots of smoke and dust as the discussions intensify . . . with NOTHING being accomplished other than possibly fist-shaking or seeing who can hurl the most verbal darts at the other.

So, Dan, thanks for popping your head up for a little while! How about some lemon chess pie??

Regards,

NTX5467

[Reatta Man]

Willis makes some good points (as usual) about the direction of the club.

Where DO we want the club to be in 10, 20 or 25 years?

If some say they want it to be limited to cars of a certain age or a certain era, then there are ramifications of that choice. They at least appear to be that this will be a smaller club, since there will be fewer of those cars around, and fewer people to collect them.

If some say we want the club to grow to XX,000 members, then that will likely drive (force?) some changes.

Should there be a driven class of cars less than 12 years old? Have other clubs tried this and what were the results?

Should there be an electronic-only membership? Have other clubs tried this and what were the results?

Should there be a push to use regional and national meets to raise money for a noble charity in order to draw more non-Buick interest to the club? Have other clubs tried this and what were the results?

Should there be a merger with other national clubs? Have other clubs tried this and what were the results?

Should there be an exploratory committee set up to receive and examine new ideas having to do with technology, membership, fundraising or other concepts that reports back to the board and then the general membership? If so, would the general membership agree to and be willing to abide by their recommendations, and thereby reduce some of this time spend debating the same ideas over and over in the forum?

I'm really not sure where the membership is focused; is it on getting new members, preserving a type of club that we like and remember, or is it on just complaining to the board year after year, claiming that they don't listen? (Yeah, I believe some people have made their membership all about complaining and not about improving things....)

Just some thoughts to consider. I, for one, would like to grow the club. And, if that means we have to vet out some different ideas and deal with the complaining as it comes when the change is brought about, so be it if the end result is a stronger, healthier BCA.

Joe

[Guest BJM]

But please, as you're lurking on this forum ( your name does appear when you are logged in, so we know you are there ) try to get your facts correct when you are ready to come back and post again.

Kevin,

Sometimes it's best not to comment. But still look. I am not sure that's what was meant by lurking.

I really should not be on here at all. So If my tag comes up it doesn't mean I'm lurking. There is nothing more to add to this thread.

[Thriller]

To add to Joe's questions, one consideration is that, if membership is around 8500, then less than 10% of the membership attends the National meet. Similarly, the number of BCA members debating here on the forum is smaller yet, I would venture.

So, if we want to assess the feelings of the membership, some sort of survey would probably be best. This would be best not to be a voluntary thing that is a few questions listed in the Bugle as this would likely just elicit response from those passionate enough about the club or topic. That has its place. Perhaps something a bit more in depth could be sent out with renewals. It would then of necessity be a longer term project, but perhaps would yield a better gauge of where the membership is and what the membership would like to see the club going. The down side to that is that well-designed surveys have to be carefully crafted and results well-assessed.

Just a couple more points to ponder. I'm sure everyone has their own idea of what the club should be, but I'm not convinced we have a definitive grasp of what the majority want in addition to being inclusive to sub-groups within the collective (e.g. the modified group or those with newer Buicks, etc.).

[Guest Dans 77 Limited]

Discounted dues , Members at large , electronic bugles, opening up the club to Opels these are all ideas that those in charge have decided will not work , (even though they havent given them a try ) and there is nothing in heaven or hell that is ever going to change their minds. To say or do anything else to change their minds is just wasting your time and your electricity. Follow my lead and give up !!!! youll sleep better and in the end you will have the ultimate weapon , you will have the I TOLD YOU SO

Dan,

Wonderful attitude, Please go back and look at the thread about a trial electronic Bugle. Also look at the Opel Forum. These are the start of things the board is trying to get membership up from ideas from the members. We have to be financialy responsible to the club and all of its members in the things we do. We can't spend money we don't have to try things if we don't see a viable outcome just because someone thinks it is a good idea. We are listening to the ideas submitted and debating their pros and cons. Those that really look like they will work get the green light. I have tried to give you logical reasons for what the board is doing in the past, but it seems you have chosen not to listen to what I or any number of the other posters on this forum have to say.

That is your right.

But please, as you're lurking on this forum ( your name does appear when you are logged in, so we know you are there ) try to get your facts correct when you are ready to come back and post again.

You know Kevin I really dont know what you want from me. Now Im a lurker ????? With well over 400 posts and membership on this site since September of 01 How can you actually with a straight face sit there and accuse me of being a lurker. What exactly do you have to do to NOT be considered a lurker in your world. Should I quit my job , abandon my life and sit on this site 24/7 and answer EVERY post that comes up ? Would I then no longer be considered a lurker in your eyes ?

In all honesty and Im really NOT trying to stir the pot , but I think there is a wire crossed in your thought process somewhere. Seriously.

I CHOSE to stop posting for a while because frankly I was getting tired of bullsh*t like this. I was getting tired of trying to help this club , you know crazy things like actually trying to come up with an idea to help increase membership that the BOD asked each of us to do only to have it shot down, ridiculed and generally made to feel like I was an idiot for even trying by the very same people that asked for my help in the first place (I.E. YOU!!!!! and the rest of the BOD) . And I have to put up with crap like this as the result of trying to do my part ? I chose to stop posting , not stop reading . that was my choice to make and if you dont like it ....... I suggest YOU step back from the keyboard for a while

If you think Im just going to roll over and agree with you ..... dont hold your breath on that one.

Dan

Edited October 11, 2010 by Rawja
expletive (see edit history)

[RICK YOUNG]

HERE YOU GO BERTA

[Guest Dans 77 Limited]

HERE YOU GO BERTA

Yea and the brand on that horse is KK. Or maybe its BCA but all I can say is I hope all you geniuses are as infallable as you believe you are . You better be right , if you want to stay in your posts , cause your people skills sure as hell arent going to keep your posts for you

Edited October 7, 2010 by Dans 77 Limited (see edit history)

[stealthbob]

Might want to change your signature..its out of date

[rivgs]

Yea and the brand on that horse is KK. Or maybe its BCA but all I can say is I hope all you geniuses are as infallable as you believe you are . You better be right , if you want to stay in your posts , cause your people skills sure as hell arent going to keep your posts for you

Dan, I am not infallable, I have made plenty of mistakes in my life. I have given ideas on things that I thought would make things better and have been told they would not work. I believe everyone has done that. The difference is that I do not go ballistic when this happens i.e. name calling, threats, that sort of thing. My people skills are not perfect, but are certainly better then some posters on this board.

As for the lurker comment, I remembered that you wrote you were going away from the forum for a while ( forced vacation I think you called it ) I took that to mean that you would not be on the forum at all and not just posting. For that I am wrong and I will apologize to you for calling you a lurker.

Edited October 7, 2010 by rivgs (see edit history)

[MrEarl]

Did nobody take me serious about the BCA decals. I mean $50 a year and all I get is one decal for life. How am I suppose to decide which car to put it on, flip a coin? Y'all are gonna miss me when I'm gone.

'til then....

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[rivgs]

Boots Randolph classic "Yakety Sax"- Love it.

[NTX5467]

When I first heard the term "lurker" used with respect to Internet boards and newsgroups, I wrinkled my brow a little (there are already some there, so it's not too hard to do these days). I took it as a "negative", all things considered. Later, I noticed that for Internet items, it didn't have the negative connotation that I suspected . . . being a person that comes in and looks/observes without making their presence known to other posters (other than the very efficient "Who's here" file that might be listed somewhere for us to see--or at least the moderator(s)). I'm NOT sure how that term came to be used for Internet boards, but it was and it stuck long years ago . . . but I still don't like it.

Heck, Dan, we ALL lurk at one time or another. Like when one just wants to see what's been posted and not respond, or just to look and then leave to return when there's more time to consider and offer responses. OR if one might access the forum from a different computer, not logging-in, and just see what's in the forums. Remember, a number of posts back, when some people came out of the woodwork to make comments? They were previously lurkers who decided to get involved . . . and DID get involved. No doubt, they are sitll following some of these threads.

A couple of things >>>>>> bury the horse, QUICKLY To not do so might be termed "animal cruelty", even if it's not a real horse. We DON'T need that "blood on our hands".

>>>>> Everybody please remove objects from your sholders, if applicable. We NEED to be "friends"--period--although we might chose to disagree on some subjects.

>>>>> Sometimes, it's good to get away from the computer and re-connect with our cars and other human beings "in person". This is my own observation. The car hobby can be one of the best therapies in the world, from my own experiences--it makes you focus on something else for a period of time to solve problems and make things better.

>>>>> So "a power that be's" says something "won't work", that's just ONE person talking . . . or perhaps many people talking, but perhaps they don't fully understand OR want to fully understand the orientation of the "won't work" item. Maybe they're correct . . . maybe not -- ONLY way to find out is to implement it and see how it works . . . if it doesn't work, "WHY didn't it work?" Others, though, might have already been down that road . . . hopefully, they'll share their experiences rather than flatly slamming the door in your face.

>>>>> When information flows BOTH directions with respect to obtaining particular objectives, progress CAN be made. Progress can also be made dictatorially, but unless those being directed really buy into what they're being told to do, progress CAN happen, but not to the same level of execution as when the majority of the directees buy-into the particular directions being given. Sure, the director(s) might have to spend some extra time explaining things they might not feel they have to explain, but if they don't "sell" it, full progress will be hampered.

SSOOOOO, let's give the horse a suitable burial. Mr. Earl can cue some appropriate music. AND LET'S GET ON WITH ENJOYING LIFE, OUR BUICKS, AND OUR FRIENDSHIPS--PLEASE!!!!!

Regards,

NTX5467

[buick5563]

>>>>> Everybody please remove objects from your sholders, if applicable. We NEED to be "friends"--period--although we might chose to disagree on some subjects.

THIS...

SSOOOOO, let's give the horse a suitable burial. Mr. Earl can cue some appropriate music. AND LET'S GET ON WITH ENJOYING LIFE, OUR BUICKS, AND OUR FRIENDSHIPS--PLEASE!!!!!

...AND THIS.

[buick5563]

Lurk rhymes with Jerk.

I know at least 98% of you hope that my post-surgical 10 lb. lifting limit is lifted soon, so I can go talk to myself in the garage, while working on a car, instead of posting here.

Believe me, I'm one of the 98%. you other 2% really need help.

[Guest wildcat465]

Oh, Lamar.

Simply put, LMAO-ROTF!!!

[Guest buickapollo455]

DUES:

then make the dues help status for those in need:

out of work 20 dollar

disabled 20 dollars,

familys with kids under 18 in the home , 20 dollars

help those in need in the economy now. to simply raise the rates wont work, the average age over 60 in the club, in 15 years, there will be NO magazine or maybe even a club as younger members wont join due to cost of a local club and national club to belong!!!

or make national dues one price and the local clubs are included up to ONE club participation in USA bca local.

The newsletter was last bid on over 3 years ago, and the board wont bid it out to get a better price , Bill, Kris , and the president said.

What is the board afraid of getting a bid to print the newsletter as is now, and see if cost can be cut. Maybe get the print out of California and a small town America would do it for less?

WE need a new board to step up to save the club from future ruin. Raising costs beyond cost of living increase is not right.

Our older members are the back bone of the Club. But if they dont stand up for lower costs now, New members wont join, and future finance is in great jeopardy. For every older member that pass's away, we need 2 new members to keep this club going. And a board that will stop raising dues and not cutting costs like Iowa moneys spent on the grounds instead of Hotel lots used like other years at lower cost and members stay at that hotel. Many members did not stay at host hotel due to high costs, many used motel 8 , marriott, motel 6, fairfield inn. and others this past year. Every member not staying at host they say hurts the club, well then get a 59 dollar room not 89-119 dollar ones. I wont stay at region show hotel next year due to I can get the same for 42 verses 79 at other famous hotel. The club needs to think that out and get members to the show at a budget.

Help older members 58 up, and start thinking of the future not NOW wants and spoil future members from maybe not having a club at all.

[Guest 53Nailhead]

Hmmmmm

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

10-4, Les, 10-4

[old-tank]

I thought I smelled pie, but I guess it is something else...

[BUICK RACER]

This thread has run it's course, by the powers invented by me and messages from BCA Board members this thread is now closed, and better not be restarted!