jeff_a

Peerless For Sale Department

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jeff_a    46

If someone was interested in this 6-90 Roadster Coupe but felt the apparent missing radiator and shell were deal-enders, there IS a unit for sale on ebay right now. It's billed as for a 1926 Peerless. Whether it's a perfect match, or works, I don't know, and it's $500. There were 3 models for 1926(6-80, 6-72, 8-69) and 5 for 1927(6-60, 6-80, 6-90, 6-72, and 8-69). Seller is "coupefinder" from Arizona. The central upper water inlet suggests a 6 instead of an 8. Ralph Cartonio told me that every model within a year used a slightly different size of radiator shell, so the fit would be important. 

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jeff_a    46

   Your're correct, the asking price is a little high. It depends on how literal they are about the "Or Best Offer" part, I reckon. I used to think that for anything over ten grand, the seller should be able to drive the car over to your house to give you a look at it, but people spend more than that all the time buying non-running cars, if the auto is something special.

 

   I tried calling the number to find out more, but got a message that the business, Thunder Road, had a busy line, so sent them a letter, instead. I think they deal in heavy truck and car restoration parts down near Springfield. So far my letters inquiring about serial numbers and car history have a 50% return rate....so who knows if we'll learn more of the Peerless. 

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jeff_a    46

I got a call from Brian, the owner of the 1927 Peerless Six-90 Roadster Coupe owner in Missouri today. He got it recently from an older gentleman who had collected some cars, who had a spotty memory of where it came from and thought it may have come from a dealer in Pennsylvania. A number of loose parts are with the car, including NOS headlight lenses and the front bumper. There's a radiator -- but no rad shell. Still not complete --- but who knows what you might find in the loose parts? One neat thing is that the engine compartment looks like it has some original brilliant blue paint, and even has an original air cleaner on the carburetor, as well as the Collins Six 289 cubic inch engine President R. H. Collins of the Cadillac Motor Car Company and its top staff brought with them when they took over Peerless in late 1921. 

 

The business deals with semi-truck parts and '55-'57 Chevrolet repro sheetmetal. He would like to sell to someone as-is looking for unique restoration material. So far the inquiries seem to be from a couple of flip-o-rama types, people maybe thinking of sinking the usual fortune into hot rod redecorating, and one Peerless Guy who lives just 25 miles away, Rod Stelford, who has a '29 Peerless with the same engine, and is the son of legendary Peerless collector Roscoe Stelford of Pingree Grove, Illinois. 

 

It's an axiom that one can do whatever they choose with a car(Well, not exactly. You have to follow some rules to have it on the road, like driving & licensing regulations), but I hope this one does not go in the hot rod bin. I know there are hundreds of people who are into it, but Peerless is an actual car. Hot Rods aren't, they're fantasy cars. There never was a Hot Rod Company. Not only are Peerlesses actual cars, and a piece of American history, but they are an important part of USA automaking history. There's a saying that hot rods are worth more than antique cars. I don't know where that came from, but as a blanket statement it's not true. Someone hot-rodded a Vega once and it sold at the Scottsdale auctions for half a million, and there are some 6-figure hot rods, but there are many for sale in the sales mags for cheap, too. Taking that into account, you could actually say hot rods are cheaper than antique cars. Neither saying is universal. If I was around when my Dad was growing up, with lots of used Model Ts available for small coin, I probably would have agreed that they were underpowered and needed a Rajo Head or a  Frontenac and been part of the early hot rod scene. Sorry to get up on a soapbox.............but there are a lot of used cars that could be hot-rodded now(take a Hyundai, a Pinto, a Mustang, a Subaru,  a Suzuki, a Chevette, a Mazda pickup, or a Plymouth Neon) but only two or three Six-90 Boat Tail Coupes in the world. Peerless cars in general are much rarer than any post-war GM(over 424 million sold, lots still around), Packard(more sold in one year than all 32 years of Peerless production, thousands still around), or Duesenberg(400+ exist). No point in hot-rodding a hot rod: in 1927 Fords were 22 HP, the Peerless 6-90 was 70 HP.

 

What's great about the seller is that he has 18 photographs on the Hemmings Motor News online ad. Because of deadlines, it won't appear in the print issue until next month(March, 2017).

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jeff_a    46

Aluminum bodies 15 or 20 years earlier, but not on 1927 Peerlesses, to the best of my knowledge. The very first Peerless cars built in 1900 and 1901 had aluminum bodies...an improvement on the French cars they were patterned after. A '27 6-90 Boat Tail did have a large aluminum casting for the rumble seat step plate, and that 750-lb. Superb Six engine's crankcase and transmission housing would be aluminum.

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jeff_a    46

I just heard from Ed Fallon in MN and NV, and he has his 1930 Peerless Model "A" Sedan for sale for $15,000 o.b.o. He was driving it yesterday -- so it's not 10 years away from drivability. Good title. Recent work on it, but original condition. Straight 8. Dual sidemounts. This Peerless came from the Blackhawk Collection -- prior to that, the Bill Harrah Collection.post-49853-143142494326_thumb.jpg . Ed's email is hllywooded@aol.com, PH: (602) 421-5663

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jeff_a    46

4 Peerlesses are on www.hemmings.com today.

 

Today I saw a 1927 6-90 Boat Tail Coupe(289 Peerless engine); 1930 Model "B" Sedan(322 Continental engine); 50s/60s Peerless sports car(Triumph TR-3 running gear)(unrelated to Peerless of Cleveland).

 

The 4th one was a 1920 Peerless Model 56 Sedan -- newly listed on HMN online with great photos and A VIDEO. This one was in the going-out-of-business sale of an antique car museum in Tennessee last year. Appears to be a great running shape HPOF car after fifty years there. A rad leak fixed with a new custom honeycomb radiator.

 

Number of 1920 Peerlesses known: 7

Body Style: 7-P Sedan

Engine Room: 332 Cu. In. Vee-Type Aluminum Peerless Eight, dual exhaust, 80 HP

Odometer: 9,700 miles

Color: a muted green main body, grey upper, black fenders

Seller: Dream Cruise Classics #(586) 453-9316

Location: Clinton Twp., MI

New cost: about four grand

Cost today: $27,500............................................{there is only one known 1920 Peerless Seven-Passenger Sedan}

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Imperial62    308

What were the Quam's?  Didn't they have a 1920 Peerless Sedan, 7p? or was that a 1919?  I can't remember.  Do you know where the Quam Peerless' ended up?

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jeff_a    46

Grant Quam's Peerlesses were usually listed as a 1920 4-P Roadster, and a 1918 7-P Limousine w/ divider. No idea who owns them now. A lot of cars get bounced around quite a bit when they get into a big auction. The kind of guy who buys at an auction might also sell at an auction. This Peerless has been in one place for half a century. It's not priced well, though. It should be a lot more, but it's not my call. 

58733820-770-0@2X.jpg?rev=1

58733819-770-0@2X.jpg?rev=1ag(E) Pigeon Forge, TN: Smoky Mtn. Car Museum,1920 Peerless, V8 A postcard view available on ebay of this 1920 Peerless. Comparable in some ways to the gorgeous 1920 Mod. 56 Walter Miller has(owner of autolit.com). I'm able to view the other 2 photos by right-clicking and hitting "open image in a new tab"...showing what the motor car looks like now.

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Imperial62    308

Jeff

I agree that is a nice 7p sedan (limousine) and probably priced right, given it's originality and work they did.   Grant's 1918 was very similar to this one but I think the later the V8's got, the more equiposed they were, but that is going off memory. 

 

As an artifact, I would prefer the closed models. This car as the dealer points out, is almost 100 years old. Truly impressive. But - I have been a passenger in some open cars from this era (1920's) and that is an amazing experience as well. 

 

If this were an open 7p Touring I think the price would be higher. 

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Imperial62    308

The 1930 Peerless Master 8 looks like another good car to own at $24,000.  Maybe get it for $20,000 given the soft market for closed cars, maybe not.

 

It was fun looking at those photos of the Master 8, some nice archival quality photos you don't often see with ads. Like the Hayes body tag.  Looking at the photos, it is clear that even in 1930, Peerless employees were carefully fitting those interiors. Detail is there and quality is apparent. (Of course, this could be a restored car).  What is the photo of the thing on the headliner?  Not sure what that is.

 

At any rate, as long as a person could be happy with 2 early closed cars, I think getting the 1920 and the 1930 for $50,000 all in would set a person up for some old car hobby fun for the rest of their lives. 

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jeff_a    46

   The thingies on the ceiling fold down to block glare from the sun. You're probably not used to seeing them on 87-year-old cars. My 3/4 ton Toyota pickup has them, and it's not noteworthy....but in 1930 it was. They were in all 3 of the 1930 Peerless models(Standard 8, Master 8, Custom 8). Maybe other makes had sunvisors 87 years ago, but I don't know of any. One source* says the sun shades were part of 4 or 5 changes for the 1931 model year. I'm sure it's the original interior. I talked to Mr. Schrecengost, 84, 5 years ago, the owner in 2012. It had been in storage for 50 years, but the pre-2000 owner had some trophies from local car shows around Sligo, PA(a little town near Pittsburgh). He had the Peerless listed with one of those online marketers for collector cars at $59,900. It changed hands and now Jeff McIntire from Homer City, PA owns it. I don't know, Bryan, what would your family do with 115 horses, a 90 mph speedometer, and a 322 under the hood. You'd turn into speed demons, that's what.

 

   It would be kind of cool for someone to have both a 1920 and a 1930 Peerless. KPAIE shows just 13 of these Model "B" Peerlesses around, plus 7 "A", 8 "C" and a few unknowns, for all of the 1930-1932 cars. Glad you appreciate the interior of the 1930. It was a collaboration by Count Alexis de Sakhnoffsky and "a foremost woman illustrator"(she designed "the exclusive type of hardware and fittings"*in the interior). You probably didn't find a gym bag full of 100s today on your way out of the house, so couldn't pony up the 359/mo for it, but if someone reading this is thinking of getting it, there's a fantastic DriveReport in a back issue of Special Interest Autos of a Survivor 1932 Peerless "Master Eight"/Mod. "B" Sedan. The article talks about the pros and cons. It was the April, 1984 [SIA #80] issue, with 8 pages and 20 photos.

 

   Speaking of the interior hardware, the one Ele Chesney has, a 1930 "Custom 8"(Mod. "C"), is fitted with solid sterling silver throughout --- but it's supposed to be a special-ordered car, and I wouldn't expect any of the other 1930/1931/1932 Peerlesses to have that. Personally, I like the 1930 Standard 8/Mod. A for sale by Doug in BC. Also here on the Peerless For Sale Department thread. He's dropped his price to 27,500 USD. Seven inch shorter w.b., same color, smaller straight-eight, but it looks like a new car. For my part, I haven't found a sack full of money to buy that one either. 

 

*Wager, Richard, Golden Wheels, 1986, pp 70-87. An excellent chapter on Peerless in his book on carmakers from the Cleveland area.

 

 

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jeff_a    46
On 3/19/2017 at 7:10 AM, Imperial62 said:

Jeff

I agree that is a nice 7p sedan (limousine) and probably priced right, given it's originality and work they did.   Grant's 1918 was very similar to this one but I think the later the V8's got, the more equiposed they were, but that is going off memory. 

 

As an artifact, I would prefer the closed models. This car as the dealer points out, is almost 100 years old. Truly impressive. But - I have been a passenger in some open cars from this era (1920's) and that is an amazing experience as well. 

 

If this were an open 7p Touring I think the price would be higher. 

A 1920 would be one of the Mod. 56 Peerlesses, subdivided into Series 1 through 7, year 1916-22. That was followed by the Mod. 66 when wheelbase went from 125" to 128", built just for 1923 and 1924. The "Equipoised" V-8s with an improvement in timing and balance, plus removable heads, didn't come out until 1925(with the Mod. 8-67); and continued into '26-'28(Mod. 8-69). I'll try to post some photos of Walt's 1920 Mod. 56:

 

Image result for 1929 Peerless roadster  185B3E23C3DE464AAB23-7.jpg

photos from pinterest, autolit.com, and the Peerless Co-Operator

 

 

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jeff_a    46

Now that the 1928 PEERLESS Mod. 8-69 V-8 Sedan which Significant Cars had FS in Indianapolis has sold, another motor car from the same private collection in Dayton, OH has been put on the market, a 1928 PEERLESS Mod. 6-80 Roadster Coupe. This boattail coupe with rumble seat is on consignment by www.significantcars.com AND the good old boys at e-Bay. 40 high-quality photos on the Significant Cars website. Car is partially-restored, descibed as a "stalled project". Ebay starting figure is $15,000 (below reserve); bidding ends Wednesday(3/29/17). The car needs some body work before painting, and interior work. Based on the ad copy, these are some pluses:

     +complete chassis, mechanical & drivetrain restoration

     +engine tested...................the correct 230 c.i.d./63 h.p. Continental flathead six

     +extensive body work done

     + "all parts there to complete"

     +wood wheel restoration

     +new tires

     +complete body wood restoration

This is, I believe, a car that sat in the Dexter Dotson Collection of Virginia for a while, then belonged to Ed Matthis of Ohio from about 1992-2011. I've seen pictures of when it was in a storage unit pre-2011. Though not finished, car has benefited from time in the latest owner's restoration facility, with engine rebuilding in-house. 

 

In my opinion, the buyer will be getting a vast amount of completed work with his or her purchase. 3 of the photos from Significant Cars:

 

030.jpg

 

1. Re-wooding detail.

                022.jpg  

2. Correct rebuilt Continental 8U engine w/ Stromberg carb.

 

009.jpg

 

3. 1928 Peerless Model Six-80 Roadster Coupe rear view. Compare to photo in next post. Same car.

 

 

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jeff_a    46

Photos of the Peerless mentioned above, a 1928 Model 6-80 Roadster Coupe. These pictures were taken by Peerless authority Don Bettes 10 or 20 years ago when the car was in storage in Mansfield, OH 1992-2011 -- before having a partial restoration. You can see what the last owner had to start with. He acquired a world-class inventory of parts for Peerlesses....and seven Peerless cars. I was able to assist him in selecting the right engine from among several spares......there being an 8U, 18C, 12K, and 332 V-8  to choose from. Body would be by Peerless Body.

PEER1.jpgseven

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jeff_a    46

A 1910 Peerless Model 27 Seven-passenger Touring Car is for sale for $285,000. The contact person is Glyndon Knutson in South Dakota, 605-six-six-zero-0492. It's listed on the HCCA Forum on the AACA Forums, with several photos, if you go to the club link and classifieds.

 

11800_1.jpg

photo by G. Knutson/HCCA

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jeff_a    46

Anthony Cartonio, the late Ralph Cartonio's son, has emailed me that he would like to sell two Peerlesses located in Maine. More information to follow...

 

Anthony Cartonio

E-Mail: anthonycart58@gmail.com

Phone: #(207) 776-1610

 

1. 1929 Peerless Model 6-61 Deluxe Coupe

Purchased from Peerless authority Don Bettes after he meticulously replaced all of the body wood. Appears primered and ready to paint. D/S/M, wire wheels.

 

2. 1926 Peerless Model 6-80 boattail Roadster

June, 2017 photo below.

 

 

SAM_1646.JPG

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29 franklin    11

I think Don said he had the engine professionally  rebuilt in that 6-61. He said all that was needed was paint and an interior.I guess Ralph never got around to do it.  Top was done also. I know Don and if said it, you can take it to the bank. His work was beautiful. Like you said he is the authority on Peerless. Great guy . I would love to get ahold of that car but am up to my ears in Franklins .

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jeff_a    46

I am not a dealer in antique automobiles, but if someone desired to start a Roaring 20s Peerless Collection or museum these cars are available right now:

  • 1925 6-72 7-P Touring Phaeton
  • 1926 6-80 Roadster
  • 1927 6-80 Landaulet
  • 1928 6-80 Roadster Coupe
  • 1929 6-61 Deluxe Coupe

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jeff_a    46
1 hour ago, 29 franklin said:

I think Don said he had the engine professionally  rebuilt in that 6-61. He said all that was needed was paint and an interior.I guess Ralph never got around to do it.  Top was done also. I know Don and if said it, you can take it to the bank. His work was beautiful. Like you said he is the authority on Peerless. Great guy . I would love to get ahold of that car but am up to my ears in Franklins .

 You're right, Don is extremely knowledgeable about Peerlesses, especially from the 1920s, and has restored a number of great cars.

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