Bringing home a 1937 Buick Special

[Sam I am]

Hello everyone.  I am a newbie to the site as well as to prewar Buicks. I will be bringing home this project in the next couple of weeks.  The po has had it since the mid to late 70's and it has not been tagged since 1982 when a rod started knocking.  He pulled the engine to rebuild it with inserts but then life got in the way. Since then he has found a few very nice cars but the old Buick just sat. He collected parts for it over the years but just never got back to it. Recently he found a brand new rebuilt later model engine with inserts, so that is now taken care of. My goal over the winter is to get it on the road and not worry about paint at this time. I know I will be needing lots of help along the way, so a big thanks ahead of time. 

[Jim Nelson]

Ahaaa,  a 263 engine is good.    I got my263 with mods done. (for my '3846s ).  .   You may need to use the front cover from  your '37'.    That should give you the front engine mounts.    some other guys who have done  this will give you the details.   WELCOME  to our piece of insanity.    Its  filled with nuts like me and a few others who will admit to it.....      Get your 'service manual' out and scan to get you up to speed with your great car.    my insanity includes a  '38-46s'  coupe and a  '35-58' two door sedan.  

[Sam I am]

3 hours ago, Jim Nelson said:

Ahaaa,  a 263 engine is good.    I got my263 with mods done. (for my '3846s ).  .   You may need to use the front cover from  your '37'.    That should give you the front engine mounts.    some other guys who have done  this will give you the details.   WELCOME  to our piece of insanity.    Its  filled with nuts like me and a few others who will admit to it.....      Get your 'service manual' out and scan to get you up to speed with your great car.    my insanity includes a  '38-46s'  coupe and a  '35-58' two door sedan.  

Nice couple of cars you have there Jim.  

The car came with a 1937 shop manual as well as a bunch of extra parts. I have also been lurking for a few days and have learned a few things already,  like the front plate needing to be switched....and that is about it. (Not all that I can learn, just what I found as I was perusing threads)Way to many questions,  but for now, just a few.  The guy I got the car from has a nice shop with lift and engine hoist, so we are going to install the engine before bringing the car home.  To that end, I need to be pointed in the right direction as where to attain some parts. I am on a severe budget(read cheap), so good used parts are acceptable. I have included pictures of what I have, and what I think I need. If I am overlooking anything, please let me know.  It came with a rebuilt clutch and pressure plate, (I included a picture of the edge of the clutch plate so you can tell me if it is supposed to look like that or if it is separating) as well as having the flywheel surfaced. (It needs the rust stains sanded off but machine marks are there.) I noticed that the ring gear has been abused by the starter. I think that I can clean it up with a file and be fine, but I also read here, on how to remove the ring gear and flip it around if needed? I know I need a throwout bearing and pilot bushing. He said the motor mounts were shot and needed new ones. Here is a pic of the transmission mounts, I have yet to find the front mount hardware, but have a tote of parts to go through. I also need to make sure I have all bolts needed for installing the engine. So... where do I find gaskets for changing out that front plate, and instructions so I do it right. Source for throwout bearing and pilot bushing(or bearing), transmission and motor mounts, and a spray can or two of the correct engine color so when I clean up the engine plate and bell housing, it will all match. Am I missing anything?

 

Sam

Edited September 8, 2021 by Sam I am
Forgot to add the pictures. (see edit history)

[Gary W]

Congrats on your purchase!

You've come to the right place here!

 

I'll share my complete 1937 Special Restoration here with you.  It's an extensive restoration diary, but you may find it worth the read.  (That flywheel ring gear looks familiar!)

 

Good Luck and ask away!  These guys here are the best!

 

Just touch the arrow in the upper right corner of the box:

 

 

[Sam I am]

5 minutes ago, Gary W said:

Congrats on your purchase!

You've come to the right place here!

 

I'll share my complete 1937 Special Restoration here with you.  It's an extensive restoration diary, but you may find it worth the read.  (That flywheel ring gear looks familiar!)

 

Good Luck and ask away!  These guys here are the best!

 

Just touch the arrow in the upper right corner of the box:

 

 

Thanks Gary.

I did find that thread and have perused it enough to know what my front mounts look like. Hopefully I can at least find the hardware for them.

[Gary W]

I sent my original front motor mounts out to be re-vulcanized.  

The bolts are a very specific shape and size with built-in shoulders to compress the rubber just the right amount

 

Here's a little detail:

 

 

[Sam I am]

4 minutes ago, Gary W said:

I sent my original front motor mounts out to be re-vulcanized.  

The bolts are a very specific shape and size with built-in shoulders to compress the rubber just the right amount

 

Here's a little detail:

 

 

A big help again Gary. Hopefully tomorrow I can sort through the tote and see what is all there.

 

My son plays the violin, so I already have an "accessory" for the back seat. 

[EmTee]

Welcome Sam!  Looks like you have a nice starting point there.  I really think the '37 and '38 Buicks are some of the most handsome cars of the era and I'd like to own one of them myself one day.  Keep us posted on your progress and problems; whatever the issue, someone on this forum has conquered it before and will steer you straight! 

[Sam I am]

19 minutes ago, EmTee said:

Welcome Sam!  Looks like you have a nice starting point there.  I really think the '37 and '38 Buicks are some of the most handsome cars of the era and I'd like to own one of them myself one day.  Keep us posted on your progress and problems; whatever the issue, someone on this forum has conquered it before and will steer you straight! 

Thanks for the welcome. After looking over the various years sourounding the 37, I'm kinda partial to the grill myself. Oh, and I don't know if you're talking about the beer fridge or the gas tank, but right now both of mine are...EmTee.

[Jim Nelson]

Your ring gear is salvageable.    If you need to replace it,,  there is a guy in Mich. who has new ones.   BUT - $300 a pop.    Of course,  its an item that will last for another 50 - 75,000 miles.    Check your tranny for condition.   Syncho's are becoming harder to find.   I got mine from a guy in N.Y..    He seemed to have what you need.     I'm a mech. nut.    First mechanicals  then pretty items.       My 38 is now good enough to take on long trips.    My longest was 1800+ miles round trip.    So, I'm a bit nuts like a bunch of us.     You just move along and do a bit each day.      Big projects always break down into many small projects that are solvable and thus affordable.       Lots of opinions so ask.    If you have someone close by,  visit and ask questions.    Nothing like putting hands on things.    Again,  welcome.    BTW,   if there is a Buick club,    I would recommend joining and finding their tech guy.    He becomes an excellent source of info.    The 36 - 38 club out of Indiana.    They are a club who drives their cars - not trailer queens.    The virus has put a halt on our traveling but things will smooth out shortly.     I am an outlier as I'm about the furthest away driving member.    A few are a bit closer but driving is our goal.     Gene Philips is the director and is a great guy.     So,  again,  welcome !    

[pont35cpe]

You will have to use the `37 front mount, intake/exhaust manifold, flywheel/clutch/bell housing. The other thing, is weather the 263 engine had a standard or Dyna-flo transmission, crankshafts are different.

[MCHinson]

Welcome to the AACA Discussion Forum. The best source of information on the forum for you is going to be Gary Wheeler's 1937 Buick restoration. If you have any other questions, just ask and you will likely receive an answer.

 

I would suggest that you are probably going to want to check out Bob's Automobila at https://bobsautomobilia.com/ for parts. (Their website is in the middle of an upgrade so it is a bit wonky, but they have many parts that you are likely to need. Another parts source is Cars Inc. at http://www.oldbuickparts.com/index.php. For used parts from parts cars the best (and most reasonably priced source) is Dave Tacheny. You can reach Dave at 763-427-3460. Get your list together and give him a call between 4 and 7 pm Central. If you don't reach him, keep trying, you will be glad you did.

 

I would also suggest you should check out the 36-38 Buick Club. I recommend that you join it. You will also find parts advertised for sale in the newsletter. You can check out the club at http://www.3638buickclub.org/. If you send me your email address via private message on this site or through the contact the webmaster on the 36-38 Buick Club website, I will be happy to send you a pdf sample of a recent club newsletter. 

[Sam I am]

9 hours ago, pont35cpe said:

You will have to use the `37 front mount, intake/exhaust manifold, flywheel/clutch/bell housing. The other thing, is weather the 263 engine had a standard or Dyna-flo transmission, crankshafts are different.

Is there an external way to tell if it had a Dyna-flo or not, and if it did

, is there a workaround? I really don't want to open it up if I don't have to. 

I have all the other parts, but my exhaust manifold is in two pieces. While perusing the forum I have found a few posts saying that it is a common problem with them cracking, if I am understanding correctly that is.

 

8 hours ago, MCHinson said:

Welcome to the AACA Discussion Forum. The best source of information on the forum for you is going to be Gary Wheeler's 1937 Buick restoration. If you have any other questions, just ask and you will likely receive an answer.

 

I would suggest that you are probably going to want to check out Bob's Automobila at https://bobsautomobilia.com/ for parts. (Their website is in the middle of an upgrade so it is a bit wonky, but they have many parts that you are likely to need. Another parts source is Cars Inc. at http://www.oldbuickparts.com/index.php. For used parts from parts cars the best (and most reasonably priced source) is Dave Tacheny. You can reach Dave at 763-427-3460. Get your list together and give him a call between 4 and 7 pm Central. If you don't reach him, keep trying, you will be glad you did.

 

I would also suggest you should check out the 36-38 Buick Club. I recommend that you join it. You will also find parts advertised for sale in the newsletter. You can check out the club at http://www.3638buickclub.org/. If you send me your email address via private message on this site or through the contact the webmaster on the 36-38 Buick Club website, I will be happy to send you a pdf sample of a recent club newsletter. 

 Thanks for all the links, they will quite helpful I am sure. 

 

 

So here is what I found, and by the shape of the one motor mount, it looks like I will be needing one just to rebuild...along with a bolt. It looks like I also found a new pilot bearing.  To further complicate the matter, there are two front engine plates. 

 

Also,  as part of the package,  is a third engine that is complete and in unknown condition. I have included an engine number for decoding purpose, and it has a flex plate on it so it must have had a Dyna-flo behind it. 

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

The pictured engine is a late 1952 or a 1953 engine. 

 If it has a flex plate you should be able to determine if the crankshaft is the same or different. The hole for the pilot bearing is different for the standard and the Dynaflow.  I believe adapters are available to install a pilot bearing in the Dynaflow crank.

 

  The starter gear on the flywheel will clean up. Mine was worse. I used a small hand held grinder. Just go easy.

 

  Where is home, Sam?

 

  Ben

Edited September 9, 2021 by Ben Bruce aka First Born (see edit history)

[Sam I am]

3 minutes ago, Ben Bruce aka First Born said:

The pictured engine is a late 1952 or a 1953 engine. 

 If it has a flex plate you should be able to determine if the crankshaft is the same or different. The hole for the pilot bearing is different for the standard and the Dynaflow.  I believe adapters are available to install a pilot bearing in the Dynaflow crank.

 

  Ben

I really appreciate all of the quick, clear, and concise posts by everyone.  It reflects well on the quality of what this forum must be.

 

Also, I am somewhat relieved to know that it might be a simple workaround on the crank.

[Sam I am]

18 minutes ago, Ben Bruce aka First Born said:

 

 

  The starter gear on the flywheel will clean up. Mine was worse. I used a small hand held grinder. Just go easy.

 

  Where is home, Sam?

 

  Ben

 

Toledo Oregon,  near Newport on the beautiful Oregon coast. 

[Sam I am]

9 hours ago, MCHinson said:

If you send me your email address via private message on this site...

I tried but I do not have enough of a post count yet for messaging. You may need to initiate the pm.

[37Special]

Welcome!  I also acquired a 37 special recently and have been lurking on the forums.  There is a wealth of information and as you can tell friendly people willing to help.  I look forward to your build!

[pont35cpe]

Sam, could you also post a picture of the flywheel end of the crankshaft of the 263.

[Sam I am]

25 minutes ago, pont35cpe said:

Sam, could you also post a picture of the flywheel end of the crankshaft of the 263.

I will try and get pics soon, I won't be around the car or the engines for a few days.

[MCHinson]

14 hours ago, Sam I am said:

I tried but I do not have enough of a post count yet for messaging. You may need to initiate the pm.

I sent you a PM. If you can't see it yet due to your low post count, you can also contact me through the Contact the Webmaster link on the 36-38 Buick Club website. 

[Sam I am]

Looks like I can respond to any pm sent to me.

[Jack Worstell]

About putting a 263 engine into a 1937 Buick...on the flywheel issue

I thought there was more to it than

just the pilot beating question.    I know a guy in Germany ( Jenz38???)

fabricated a special flywheel so that he could fit a Dynaflow 263 into 

his 1938 ( or '37 ?  )

 

Jack Worstell

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

33 minutes ago, Jack Worstell said:

About putting a 263 engine into a 1937 Buick...on the flywheel issue

I thought there was more to it than

just the pilot beating question.    I know a guy in Germany ( Jenz38???)

fabricated a special flywheel so that he could fit a Dynaflow 263 into 

his 1938 ( or '37 ?  )

 

Jack Worstell

    May be wrong, but I THINK re drilling the flywheel mounting bolt holes takes care of that.

 

  Ben

 

 

[Brooklyn Beer]

following as I myself am also eyeballing a 38

[mcdarrunt]

On the 263 in my 37 Special I just welded some ears onto the 263 front plate and used flathead Ford biscuit mount cushions. Much more stable than the factory mount. My rear mounts were shot and got sticker shock from Steele so recast my own using liquid urethane and home made mold. Zero trouble for 20 years. Pic shows mount tabs and cushions:

 

[Sam I am]

On 9/12/2021 at 1:38 AM, mcdarrunt said:

On the 263 in my 37 Special I just welded some ears onto the 263 front plate and used flathead Ford biscuit mount cushions. Much more stable than the factory mount. My rear mounts were shot and got sticker shock from Steele so recast my own using liquid urethane and home made mold. Zero trouble for 20 years. Pic shows mount tabs and cushions:

 

Can you shoot me a pm so we can chat please,  my post count still is not high enough to pm, but I can receive. 

 

So I have everything unloaded and stashed away. Sometimes jigsaw puzzles are not fun to figure out. I have the bolts sorted and now need to figure out which ones I need for flywheel, clutch plate, bell housing,  and transmission mounts.

[Uptowndodge]

Nice car you have and good luck with it. Hope you are big time hands on because these cars and parts can get real expensive besides hard to find. So have patients trying to put these together as you put it “tight budget or cheap” can make a seven month project turn into seven years, just ask the guy you bought it from. Good luck with it.

[Jim Nelson]

Well,  the engine is the most expensive part.   We understand that  and time is not the issue.   Its the challenge to learn about the very nice - engineered car from Buick.    I've been down that road.   My second Buick (1935-58)  was the last of the wooden bodied cars from Buick.   But I liked the style / design over my  1938-46s.    I knew up front that the '35' was going to be more expensive because of the mechanics - last of the first design of the 8 cylinder design.   The '36' began the design of the lasting design that Buick used all the way until 1954 with the first V-8  engines.   I'm retired so time was not the issue.    Just the enjoyment and the other old Buick guys makes it worth it.   

[Sam I am]

Thanks guys. I am a realist when it comes to old cars. If it is not a Chevelle or Mustang,  it costs more.

 

I finished up the work I did on the guys 1970 Monte Carlo. (He is the guy who I am getting the '37 from) I rebuilt the front suspension with tubular a-arms, heavy duty sway bar, all new steering linkage, turned the bench seat column shift into dual buckets with console shift, new carpet, foam and upholstery kit. I added seat heaters and tilt wheel, cruise control, and a Dakota digital dash.  I brought back his 1965 Bonneville conv so I can rebuild the front suspension, install a dual master cylinder,  add cruise control, install the factory optional eight lug alloy wheels...and who knows what else. After that is more work on his 1960 T-bird, which I already did a complete interior kit, and taking the entire dash out to install an N.O.S. padded dash was no fun. Also installed carpet in his 1949 Chrysler.

 

So I am not expecting to get a lot done on my Buick over a short period of time. 😄

 

Sad part about today was not delivering the Monte Carlo, or bringing the Bonneville home, but forgetting to take pictures of the 263 crank to see if it had a four speed behind it or a Dyna-flo...and it is only 135 miles away. Oh well, next time. He did say that he is pretty sure both of the 263 engines had Dyna-flos behind them. 

 

My dad collected, restored, and built from piles of parts, Model T Fords. We also had a 1924 Dodge Touring, 1924 Star Coupe, and a 1930 Model A pickup with '32 flathead 60, radiator and grill.  We also had a 36 Pontiac coupe for a short period of time, never worked on it, just passed it on to someone else who would. So I am not completely unfamiliar with pre-war automobiles.

 

If I am a complete glutton for punishment,  I do have a line on a 1920 Reo touring car....a much larger jigsaw puzzle than the Buick.

Edited September 15, 2021 by Sam I am (see edit history)

[MCHinson]

Unless you really want the job of rebuilding the engine, I would suggest you call Dave Tacheny. He likely has a running engine that you could buy a lot cheaper than you can rebuild what you have, and it would also save you a lot of time. You can best reach Dave at 763-427-3460 between 4 and 7 pm Central. He is the best and most reasonably priced source of parts from parts cars for 1936-1941 Buicks that I know of.

[Sam I am]

9 minutes ago, MCHinson said:

Unless you really want the job of rebuilding the engine, I would suggest you call Dave Tacheny. He likely has a running engine that you could buy a lot cheaper than you can rebuild what you have, and it would also save you a lot of time. You can best reach Dave at 763-427-3460 between 4 and 7 pm Central. He is the best and most reasonably priced source of parts from parts cars for 1936-1941 Buicks that I know of.

I am not rebuilding the original engine, just sorting through all the parts that I need to install the brand new rebuilt 263 in the '37. 

 

Thanks for Dave's contact info, I am sure that I will be calling him for something...or ten, before I am done.

[Jim Nelson]

Good choice !   For many mechanical reasons.   Its why I did mine that way. 

[jenz38]

Your 263 is out of a manual tranny car ?

You can see it if you have a throwout bearing or the flange for it inside the crank.

If not, you can not installing easily your  37 flywheel to this 263 automatic crank.

You need a adapter for installing a TO bearing inside the crank an the bolt circle also is different.

[jenz38]

The Waterpump and it's short cast iron angled tube on driver side is also 263 only.

If you don't have this tube  maybe Dave have one for a 263 ?.

The 38 Fuelpump is fit in the 263 block, I also ride the 38 OEM pump on the 263 because it looks cleaner than the Fuel Vacuum combo of the later rigs.

248 Manifolds fits to the 263 with little metal work in front  of it  ,because of the angled water tube in front.

 

 

Cheers Jenz

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

in 1950, the 248 and 263 had the new water pump.  I think all manifolds will fit.  

 

 Ben

[Brooklyn Beer]

3 minutes ago, Ben Bruce aka First Born said:

in 1950, the 248 and 263 had the new water pump.  I think all manifolds will fit.  

 

 Ben

And all engines went to hydraulic lifters right ?  Not just the larger engine ?

[Sam I am]

After talking to the previous owner, I am 90% sure the rebuilt 263 had a Dyna-flo behind it.

 

The second 263 is complete,(also had a Dyna-flo behind it),with generator, starter, distributor, water pump, pulleys, fan, water neck, flex plate, manifolds, carb and air cleaner, etc. Most of witch is still installed on the engine. 

 

So from what I am hearing,  is that I will also need the 248 water pump and manifolds?  If that is the case,  I am missing the waterpump, and the exhaust manifold is broken. But hey, at least I have a newly rebuilt carb for a 248 manifold...

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

5 hours ago, Brooklyn Beer said:

And all engines went to hydraulic lifters right ?  Not just the larger engine ?

Only the Dynaflow ones, I believe.

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

Sam, as I said in my precious post, ALL engines from 1950 on had the new water pump.  The broken manifold is NOT from the 1937.  Probably from one of the 263s. The carburetor is not 1937.  Probably from one of thev263s. All I can tell from the engine pictured is that it is 1948 or later. If we can see the other side we can get closer.  OR, the engine number will tell us. Right in front of the distributor on that machined surface.

 

  Ben