1930 Packard 734 Speedster Sedan - For Sale

[Rlamb10769]

 

Price reduced by $50,000.

On Hemmings:

 

https://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/cars-for-sale/packard/734/2089325.html

Edited July 2, 2018 by Rlamb10769
Update (see edit history)

[auburnseeker]

Very nice car. From anyone in the loop of these,  Is that an optimistic or realistic price? Seems like Duesenberg money especially on a closed car. 

[Brass is Best]

What a magnificent machine!

[edinmass]

51 minutes ago, auburnseeker said:

Very nice car. From anyone in the loop of these,  Is that an optimistic or realistic price? Seems like Duesenberg money especially on a closed car. 

 

Great closed cars are in short supply............please understand the term GREAT. That being said, true market value of the best of the best is still climbing. There are lots of dollars chasing very few GREAT cars. I won’t comment on this specific car.......... but the sales price of the last two or three GREAT sedans were MUCH higher than the asking price of this car. Thus, 800 is in no way a crazy number when others are selling in the middle seven figures. Year, engine, body builder, etc all come into play. It’s a great car, and someone will be very happy with it.

[auburnseeker]

Just wondering.  So our titanic of a hobby isn't quite sinking yet I guess.  Except maybe the rough projects,  but even the rarer ones seems to be still in demand according to the discussion on the Airflow thread.   The 32 Shovel nosed coupe on the page link,  almost seemed to look like a bargain after what I have seen lately,  Of course810 to 812 cords excluded.

[sligermachine]

wow the engine looks like it's made of plastic to much body work for me . Real nice !

Edited April 3, 2018 by sligermachine
more stuff (see edit history)

[alsancle]

8 hours ago, auburnseeker said:

Just wondering.  So our titanic of a hobby isn't quite sinking yet I guess.  Except maybe the rough projects,  but even the rarer ones seems to be still in demand according to the discussion on the Airflow thread.   The 32 Shovel nosed coupe on the page link,  almost seemed to look like a bargain after what I have seen lately,  Of course810 to 812 cords excluded.

 

I'll never understand why Cord's bring no money.   My dad said that for years about the 39/42 Packard Darrin and those finally spiked in the last 5 years.

 

On the subject of this car,   "Speedster" Packards bring a lot of dough and this would be an entry level in to the speedster market.  Since I can't ever remember a sedan for sale it is pretty hard to put a number on it,  but it will bring more money than most people would think.

[edinmass]

It makes sense that the Cord’s will go up........I think the Darrin’s are still way under valued. Along with the Springfield Ghost. As the hobby continues to evolve, drivability and style will be the most important factors in values. Availability of parts and service will help out the more common makes also..........V-8 Fords will hold up well also.

[West Peterson]

12 hours ago, auburnseeker said:

Just wondering.  So our titanic of a hobby isn't quite sinking yet I guess.  Except maybe the rough projects,  but even the rarer ones seems to be still in demand according to the discussion on the Airflow thread.   The 32 Shovel nosed coupe on the page link,  almost seemed to look like a bargain after what I have seen lately,  Of course810 to 812 cords excluded.

 

I try not to associate price fluctuations with interest in the hobby. If values of cars go down, that does not mean interest in the vehicle goes down ... other than by investors. On one end of the spectrum, you have hardcore dyed-in-the-wool car enthusiasts, and on the other end you have investors. The value/price of a car will determine WHERE on that spectrum the interest lies, as opposed to HOW MUCH interest there is.

[daniel boeve]

As i said before sometimes i think i am more in an investors club  .

[Restorer32]

12 hours ago, auburnseeker said:

Just wondering.  So our titanic of a hobby isn't quite sinking yet I guess.  Except maybe the rough projects,  but even the rarer ones seems to be still in demand according to the discussion on the Airflow thread.   The 32 Shovel nosed coupe on the page link,  almost seemed to look like a bargain after what I have seen lately,  Of course810 to 812 cords excluded.

 

The '32 Coupe is one of the few cars that have actually become rarer over the last 20 years, so many having been made into convertibles. 

[Guest]

The speedster for sale belongs to the OP. He is too modest. He does most of his own work, and has cranked out a concours winning Cadillac, Auburn and Packards in the last few years. Richard, kudos on another fantastic job!

[Brass is Best]

The Speedsters were never really advertised by Packard. They were kept quiet. You had to know somebody at Packard to get one. It was and is a very exclusive automobile. They feature special intake and exhaust manifolds, high speed rear gears, Finned brake drums as well as special bodies. They were offered in roadster, phaeton, boat tail speedster and sedan bodies. All of the bodies were built narrow and small to keep the weight down. They were Packards version of a COPO or muscle car.

Edited April 3, 2018 by Brass is Best (see edit history)

[edinmass]

The past few transactions prove they still have a big following. They are a great “early” car..........fantastic drivers, light and nimble. I noticed when I was driving a speedster I kept smiling..........

[Rlamb10769]

1 hour ago, 31 Caddy said:

The speedster for sale belongs to the OP. He is too modest. He does most of his own work, and has cranked out a concours winning Cadillac, Auburn and Packards in the last few years. Richard, kudos on another fantastic job!

 

Thanks Rick,  hope you are doing well with your Caddy.

Regards, 

Richard

 

attached is Dennis Gage and I, will be on My Classic Car with my 32 Shovel Nose the end of this month.

[old car fan]

I will say this,buying any car for investment is the wrong way,buy it for the love of the car.If you watch the market,not car's would be sold.I

[West Peterson]

17 hours ago, Brass is Best said:

The Speedsters were never really advertised by Packard. They were kept quiet. You had to know somebody at Packard to get one. It was and is a very exclusive automobile. They feature special intake and exhaust manifolds, high speed rear gears, Finned brake drums as well as special bodies. They were offered in roadster, phaeton, boat tail speedster and sedan bodies. All of the bodies were built narrow and small to keep the weight down. They were Packards version of a COPO or muscle car.

 

 

 

 

 

Five Speedster body styles were offered. You forgot the victoria 5-passenger coupe. Packard also built a 2-passenger coupe, but never offered it. In addition, there is a full custom roadster that exists, built by a Packard dealer in 1932, as well as two full customs by Packard as they developed their Twelve cylinder boattail and phaeton for 1934.

I'm not sure the closed cars were narrower than normal, nor were they set back an extra 6 inches like the open cars. They were all much lower than regular production cars, though.

[Restorer32]

Packard seemed to like wide whites on the Speedsters.

[Rlamb10769]

27 minutes ago, West Peterson said:

 

Five Speedster body styles were offered. You forgot the victoria 5-passenger coupe. Packard also built a 2-passenger coupe, but never offered it. In addition, there is a full custom roadster that exists, built by a Packard dealer in 1932, as well as two full customs by Packard as they developed their Twelve cylinder boattail and phaeton for 1934.

I'm not sure the closed cars were narrower than normal, nor were they set back an extra 6 inches like the open cars. They were all much lower than regular production cars, though.

 

Hi West, 

Yes, the Sedan was narrowed, they were only a four passenger when a standard sedan is five.

Richard

[West Peterson]

Thanks, Richard. Interesting that they weren't set back 6 inches like the open cars, though.

 

[West Peterson]

2 hours ago, Restorer32 said:

Packard seemed to like wide whites on the Speedsters.

I think the 1930 coupe is the only factory photo I've seen with wide whites, all others had black. They did put the wide whites on the 1934 models, though.

[ericmac]

I would think the price listed is reasonable for this car. West would know better than I but to my knowledge there are likely only 2-3 Speedster Sedans extant, one of which is owned by the CCCA Museum and unlikely to wind up in private hands any time in any of our lifetimes, there is the advertised car and where is another? The Speedster Victoria (the white car West posted) appears to be the only one of those extant and is also in a museum, and unlikely to return to private hands any time in the near future. My point is, if someone wants a 734 for under $1,000,000 and wants a factory bodied car, this particular car is it. Likely there are no others out there and there are unlikely to be others coming out of the woodwork...well, ever. So, if you want a 734 this is your car. I only wish the Mega Millions gods had blessed my this past week because I would have been on the phone with the owner of this beauty yesterday.

[West Peterson]

Only two known Speedster sedans. Only one known Speedster victoria coupe; however, the body to a second is known to exist "Down Under."

At least one of the phaetons is currently for sale. Not sure of the asking price, but it's seven figures.

[ericmac]

On 4/4/2018 at 7:50 AM, West Peterson said:

 

Five Speedster body styles were offered. You forgot the victoria 5-passenger coupe. Packard also built a 2-passenger coupe, but never offered it. In addition, there is a full custom roadster that exists, built by a Packard dealer in 1932, as well as two full customs by Packard as they developed their Twelve cylinder boattail and phaeton for 1934.

I'm not sure the closed cars were narrower than normal, nor were they set back an extra 6 inches like the open cars. They were all much lower than regular production cars, though.

West, 

Do you know if the 734 Coupe exists? I appreciate you posting these photos. Stunning cars.

Eric 

[West Peterson]

Not known to exist. That is the only known photo of it as well. 1:43-scale model???

[ericmac]

1:24. You know me too well.

[mikewest]

I look at it as its "Still a 4 door sedan" Yes its rare .... but If I was going to spend that much cake , the top would go down. Ive owned 2 very rare and low production custom cars that were sedans and I still enjoy the stock roadster (same year and make) 10 fold. I think its overpriced ....Just my opinion.  

[West Peterson]

2 minutes ago, mikewest said:

I look at it as its "Still a 4 door sedan" Yes its rare .... but If I was going to spend that much cake , the top would go down. Ive owned 2 very rare and low production custom cars that were sedans and I still enjoy the stock roadster (same year and make) 10 fold. I think its overpriced ....Just my opinion.  

The last one that sold where the top went down went for more than $2 million.

[alsancle]

28 minutes ago, mikewest said:

I look at it as its "Still a 4 door sedan" Yes its rare .... but If I was going to spend that much cake , the top would go down. Ive owned 2 very rare and low production custom cars that were sedans and I still enjoy the stock roadster (same year and make) 10 fold. I think its overpriced ....Just my opinion.  

 

Mike,  if you want a restored Packard Speedster (or probably any Packard Speedster) this car will represent the cheapest way in to that club.  And there are still LOTS of Packard guys with money.  I don't know what it will actually sell for,  you never know in these situations, but it will be more than what most people would ever imagine.

 

700-800K will buy lots of different open cars,  but it won't be a real open Packard Speedster.

 

 

[edinmass]

700-800 won’t even buy you an 851speedster today.......

[mikewest]

8 hours ago, alsancle said:

 

Mike,  if you want a restored Packard Speedster (or probably any Packard Speedster) this car will represent the cheapest way in to that club.  And there are still LOTS of Packard guys with money.  I don't know what it will actually sell for,  you never know in these situations, but it will be more than what most people would ever imagine.

 

700-800K will buy lots of different open cars,  but it won't be a real open Packard Speedster.

 

 

I don't want a Packard of any description. I appreciate their quality and style , but Im not interested in owning one. I was making a statement that 700-800 for a closed Packard Speedster closed sedan (in my opinion) is unreasonable. If the seller can get it though, more power to him! My dad was in the old car business from about 1957 to  mid 1970s and had a saying "There's a ass for every seat"

 

[A. Ballard 35R]

Mike, sorry of your not wanting a Packard of any description even though you claim to appreciate their quality and style. That seems like a contradiction, what makes you not want one in spite of appreciating their quality and style? If you have never owned a Packard perhaps you should "Ask the man who owns one". Have you ever driven a Model N, Model 30, Twin Six, Super Eight, Speedster, or Twelve? They are all very different but great cars to drive and represent significant periods of quality cars.

[edinmass]

Don’t confuse open and closed with associated price.......consistently closed cars can and often do bring more than open cars at the “super” car level. Duesenberg, Packard, Pierce and others often have their most expensive sales prices in the closed category. Two to three million and more  for a good V-12 Sedan has been achieved several times in recent history. With the evolution of the hobby over the past decade, two door cars usually bring more money than Sport Pheaton’s. Example- Two nice V-16 Caddy’s in the last year, similar condition, the Roadster will bring THREE to FOUR times the money of a convertiable Coupe .........and the Pheaton will bring half the Roadster. As for me, I’ll take the Pheaton first, Sport Sedan seconded, and the Coupe third, with a Roadster as my fourth choice. Don’t forget the 10 million Duesenberg Coupe from ten or twelve years ago.........

Edited April 8, 2018 by edinmass (see edit history)

[mikewest]

1 hour ago, A. Ballard 35R said:

Mike, sorry of your not wanting a Packard of any description even though you claim to appreciate their quality and style. That seems like a contradiction, what makes you not want one in spite of appreciating their quality and style? If you have never owned a Packard perhaps you should "Ask the man who owns one". Have you ever driven a Model N, Model 30, Twin Six, Super Eight, Speedster, or Twelve? They are all very different but great cars to drive and represent significant periods of quality cars.

Mr Ballard, I should explain that I don't want a Packard is because I am happy with the cars I own now. Ive owned 3 Packard's and been around a few more besides. I am always careful when making a statement that its "My opinion" . Maybe closed  Speedsters are worth almost a million , but it took this farm boy by surprise.

[alsancle]

I'm not sure it will bring the asking price either, but you have to start somewhere I guess.  Also, since I know Mike has some pretty cool closed cars,  I'm sure he knows that a cool closed car can bring more money than a less closed open car.   In fact,  I think that convertible sedans have become one of the tougher sales in the prewar dept.

[auburnseeker]

2 hours ago, alsancle said:

In fact,  I think that convertible sedans have become one of the tougher sales in the prewar dept.

I hope so.  That should mean a bit of a price drop on the Auburn Convertible sedans I have been lusting after.  Of course you meant all convertible sedans excluding Auburn,  probably.

[alsancle]

Its funny you should say that.  The 851/852 cars have been doing pretty well.  I think because they represent the nexus of cool, easy to maintain, strong club support,  high touring speeds, parts availability, etc.

Does it have to be a 35/36 blown car?   If you will take a 34 you should be able to even swap your Cord for a really nice one.

[West Peterson]

Auburn convertible sedans are smaller, and I think an easier sell than a huge Senior Packard convertible sedan.

[auburnseeker]

1 hour ago, alsancle said:

Its funny you should say that.  The 851/852 cars have been doing pretty well.  I think because they represent the nexus of cool, easy to maintain, strong club support,  high touring speeds, parts availability, etc.

Does it have to be a 35/36 blown car?   If you will take a 34 you should be able to even swap your Cord for a really nice one.

I actually would like a 31-33,  with a 33 being the preference because of the engineering improvements,  but I might consider a 34.  I like the 31 to 33 styling best.  I'm not as fond of the 35-36 as it just looks a little chunkier. I just used that photo in my avatar as I liked the photo.   If you here of any one who just has to have a Cord and doesn't know what to do with their Auburn,  let me know. 

[John_Mereness]

11 hours ago, auburnseeker said:

I hope so.  That should mean a bit of a price drop on the Auburn Convertible sedans I have been lusting after.  Of course you meant all convertible sedans excluding Auburn,  probably.

1935 -1936 Auburn Phaetons are near ideal tour cars and cherished by those who own them - there are about 100 surviving Phaetons with good representation between Supercharged and Non-Supercharged - the prices slowly creep up and I see no reason why that would change.  And, when you find a "bargain" car it usually is a bargain because it will need an influx of cash put into it.   By the way:  1934's are Phaetons are worthy of a glance.