322 engine tear down

[Beemon]

I'm sorry, I'm still a little bit confused as I've never had to do this before, being a young guy and all, but where does the second letter go? Do they both go to him or does one go to the court offices? Would it be easier to serve it to him in person with witness from the shop owner or local law enforcement? We go down on Wednesday to the court office, because that's my first day off next week, but maybe we'll go down tomorrow, too, if they're open and ask questions.

[Grimy]

Two identical originals of the demand letter (more below), with attachments such as copies of your checks and his invoices, and any receipts for parts you furnished.  Set your printer to "2" to get two originals. Original signature on each.  Two envelopes, each addressed the same way to him. One you'll send via Certified Mail-Return Receipt Requested (or perhaps your jurisdiction will accept Priority Mail with tracking). The other you send regular first class mail.  Mark both envelopes ADDRESS SERVICE REQUESTED because if not so marked and is forwarded, you won't know the new address. That service doesn't cost you anything unless he DID move, and it's worth it to have his new address,

 

Demand letter and a response period has to happen BEFORE filing--at least in CA.  What gets SERVED is the summons created by your small claims filing.  You, or anyone who is a party to the claim, may NOT serve the summons--but your girl friend, friend, sibling, parent, etc. can do it.

 

While you still fired up tonight (I would be, too!), check for your local small claims court website, and see what they require, and if they (usually) explain the process.   Some jurisdictions limit where and when someone may be served--places of employment and times of day for residential service.

 

And I recommend you do not even raise your voice to the guy, much less calling him everything but a child of God.

 

BTW and I meant to say it before, I terribly sorry for all the trouble you're having. 

[NTX5467]

 What he's trying to say, IF I understand correctly, is for you to personally seek to rectify the situation of poor workmanship and other related things in the failure of your engine BEFORE you seek the court's assistance in this matter.  In other words, you contact the old machinist with your block as evidence of what happened.  Don't make any leading statements, but you might ask if "Is this normal?", but little else.  Let him do the talking, as hard as that might be.  Then you can show him a copy of the bills you paid him from and ask for compensation for what obviously didn't hold up.  ALSO read the fine print on the repair order for any type of warranty, which has probably expired by now.  Little things that might mean a lot later on.

 

Connecting rods, like piston rings, don't really get excited if used in a different motor than in which they originally came, or were designed for.  Key things are (for connecting rods) the bearing sizes and the piston pin diameters, PLUS the ctr-to-ctr length and weight (which can affect balance issues).

 

Where they took the balance metal from the shank of the rod is interesting.  There's usually a "balance pad" on the big end of the rod cap, which is there for that reason.  Factory balance rods usually have smaller pads than the correct replacement rod from the OEM, by observation.  Which means to always match the OEM production rod's weight to the new one.

 

It was also common to "stress relieve" the shanks of the connecting rods by using a bench-mounted band sander to sand off the ridge on the side of the connecting rod.  The parting lines of the casting molds. End result was that they'd look like that rod held up beside your bushed rod.  Removes a little weight, too.  The smoother and flatter surface was supposed to remove any potential "stress risers" in the casting, which might fail under VERY strong loads . . . MUCH greater than a stock motor would produce.

 

From the pictures . . . the valve seals used were the Perfect Circle "scraper" seal.  Allegedly good for racing, but keep too much oil out of the guide for extended street use.  Funny there would be that much oil buildup on the intake valve heads with those seals.  Seems like the scraper was supposed to "float" in the plastic, which is why you had to machine the guides so the lock bands would work to keep the seals on the valve guides.

 

It was an old-type high performance "trick" to use bushed piston pin connecting rods.  Possibly for a better friction interface?  Less friction?  Not sure, but when using "floating pins" (not totally related to bushed connecting rods, as some OEM engines use floating pins without busned connecting rods), which so many high performance race engines used, you HAD to have some method of keeping the pin inside the piston.  Usually, this was with a "feed into the groove" Spirolock retainer, AND a piston designed for floating pins in the first place.  The reason you don't need those with a pressed-pin piston is the friction interface is great enough, as a hydraulic press is needed to carefully install the pin with the rod slid onto it, in the first place.  EVEN in aluminum pistons (which almost everything has been for quite some time, differences being "cast" or "forged".  Other than Spirolocks, seems like I recall the use of a "C clip, which needed appropriate pliers to install and remove for a positive location of the piston pin on both sides of the piston?

 

NOW, the pistons COME with piston pins in the box with them.  1 piston + 1 piston pin = 1 box.  NO variations or mix 'n match!  Look for any hone marks in the piston pin bore where the hole might have been enlarged!  Pictures, if there are!  From what you've mentioned, the pistons and pins come separately, which they don't.  NOR are any other heat treating operations needed . . . if they were, a normal shadetree builder/racer would or could not do them.  Heat treating is usually done by a facility that does such things in volume.  In that orientation, a set of piston pins wouldn't even register.

 

In your conversation, if there is one, you might inquire as to why the piston pins are so loose in the piston?  Let him answer.  Don't say more than "I see", period.

 

Ending, it appears he might have been trying to make this "a better build" with the Perfect Circle scraper valve seals and the floating pins, as they were "racing-type" modifications.  I have a magazine article where they built a hot rod race motor, using the PC seals, as "the best available", but that was approximately 1968, probably after that "new seal" came out, but before any durability issues might have arisen.  Few engines had floating pins in the later 1950s, so if you used something like that, you had to "bush" the connecting rod so that everything had sliding friction.  As possibly good as his intentions might have been, they weren't fully orchestrated, especially the piston pin situation.  As if he knew what he was doing, but didn't, unfortunately.  Intentions might have been good, but outcomes weren't due to the way they were executed . . . or not executed.

 

So, be careful, good luck, and try to not appear that you're wanting somebody to help with your school expenses.  You just want just compensation for what you paid for and related later issues related to the engine rebuild.  No more, no less!

 

NTX5467

Edited June 4, 2017 by NTX5467 (see edit history)

[1956322]

The few times I've dealt with machine shops I've tried to feel around and see if they're a racing shop or a SBC shop and if they come highly recommended from local racers I run lol...I  don't  care about racing and I've never owned a SBC and it always seems like those shops don't have any interest in following a fancy factory manual or learning about anything not a SBC .. Once I find a shop that isn't blinded by racing or sbc I make it clear I don't want any upgrades besides say hardened seats or polishing a crank just do it factory and I have specs if needed.. Basically I am trying to say I think this is sadly another example of a shop meaning well but not understanding it's not a race motor nor a sbc it's different respect it.

[NTX5467]

By observation, there can be different levels of "race shop".  There's the competent shop that does quality work at decent prices (weekend racers aren't rich) that holds up to the test of time.  Then there are RACE shops that have lots of fancy equipment and multitudes of people working there.  The person with their name on the building does more talking to customers and directing employees than actually doing any machine work.

 

My machine shop operative kind of falls in-between those extremes.  In the earlier days, he had a cylinder block deck mounted hone.  He did his measurements, dressed the cutter with each pass, and things worked as designed.  He lightly honed the main webs and caps with a line hone on a drill motor.  He had a lathe to surface the cylinder heads and block.  All solid equipment.

 

Many magazine articles talked about line honing the mains, as a necessary thing to do.  But when you disassemble an engine, you can tell if the line bore is not as it should be by the way the main bearing halves look OR are sized differently from each other, usually.  Using a lathe to do the surfacing has increased quality control over the "rotating rock" many older machine shops had.  BUT it all depends upon having somebody knowing what they are doing and doing it consistently.  My guy's engines held up just as well as those with fancy shops' name on them, by observation.  He could do a Chevy motor in his sleep, but he also knew about other engines too, even fork lift motors.  he could build anything and do it right.  He had a loyal following of racers and normal hot rodders, alike.  He also did normal rebuilds too, from walk-in who were sent to him.

 

Later, he did get a power hone machine to do boring and honing operations and got accessibility to a selection of deck plates for even better work.  But everything he did was top notch.  AND, he knew about the flaky way that some OEMs did, like on some Buick motors where the oil feed hole in a bearing is AFTER the load rather than BEFORE the load area.  In any event, he's now in his 80s, cranky as ever, and will be building engines until he jumps into his coffin.  

 

But there are many younger people who can be just as well, just that they might not have all of the varied experiences OR understand "Why" some things are as they are from the OEMs.  For example, I always considered the Chevy o-ring valve seals to be chintzy and marginal, until it was explained to he how they worked, when compared to the "Studebaker" bonnet seals.  Then I later found out that if the valve guide clearances are "in a range", they don't really need valve stem seals anyway.  

 

With all of the issues which modern engine designs have to meet and tolerate, looking at how current production engines are designed can be beneficial and might be adapted to some of the older engine designs.  

 

But as with taking a car in for service, it's best if you have something "the young 'uns" know what they're looking at.  Same with machine shops.  AND you have to be aware of if the operatives really know about which they speak . . . or if they're going on what the latest hot rod magazine has for "Trick of the Month" (as my guy used to say about "pit mouthers".  Unfortunately, older engines are not newer engines.  There are not many younger generations that might not know what a carburetor is, much less ignition points.  One thing that's more true of the automotive end of things, than for some other things, is that CHANGE happens every year, no matter what, one way or another.  If you're a family person with children, you have yearly markers for various things. If no kids, suddenly you might pay attention and it's 10 years later and BOY what happened?

 

Sometimes, you might not have a choice of machine shops, or so it seems.  just depends upon how far you might need to drive to get one that can do the work, right the first time.  Sometimes, that inconvenience is worth the investment.  Perhaps this is one reason for the popularity of late model "crate motors" from the OEMs or similar?

 

NTX5467

Edited June 4, 2017 by NTX5467 (see edit history)

[NTX5467]

Timing chain pictures . . . As for "slap", I don't see anything really wrong there.  Noting to cause an engine failure or otherwise.  Maybe a little camshaft retard in the mix, which can also affect ignition timing, BUT a retarded cam is better for higher rpm power, but can hurt manifold vacuum and low rpm response.  What I see there is no worse than what my Camaro's timing set looked like at 90K miles.  Not sure about the "scarring" you reference.  Nothing there to cause an engine failure.  Now IF the timing marks didn't line up, which can be easy to do, that's another thing.  Pistons did not indicate any valve "touch" events.

 

You will HEAR timing chain slap when it gets so loose that it hits the timing cover.  On a small block Chevy, the timing cover is close to the timing chain.  A loose chain can rub against the cover enough to rub a hole in it, causing an oil leak.  Other engines, by observation, have more generous clearances between the chain and timing cover.  They just "jump" when the plastic cam sprocket wears enough or breaks.

 

Also, on newer engines with internal plastic timing chain "guides", those chains exhibit much MORE deflection  (from the guide) than what your finger does on that one. 
 

NTX5467

Edited June 4, 2017 by NTX5467 (see edit history)

[NTX5467]

Sure-fire way to not choose a machine shop.  When you're at a weekend cruise and you walk up to a "performance car" and the owner is bragging about how many times his motor has blown up ("It has toooo much power . . . ."), ask who builds his motors.  Don't take yours there!  If he proudly says "I do", say "Interesting" and walk on.

 

Enjoy!

NTX5467

[leon bee]

Beemon: I've mentioned before that I read and enjoy all your posts. Still do. But don't go too far with this, it's not worth it. Talk to that guy some, but entertain the possibility of walking away and putting it out of your mind. $5000, (or however much) is a lot of money, but keep it in perspective. I just paid $9200 to re-do the HVAC in our house.

 

I'm 67 years old, a disabled combat veteran, former drug addict and recovered(ing) alcoholic. Wasn't all that long ago I was your age and began getting a handle on my issues. You can always find another $5000, but you really have to work at contentment and peace of mind.

[Beemon]

Willis, you say that's what your timing chain looks like at 80k miles,  this is 8k... let me be disappointed lol. The warranty is most likely expired but this is installation error and has been messed up since day 1. 

 

In any case, in Washington, you do not need to negotiate before filing. However, the court puts you into mediation before the hearing to potentially settle out of court.

 

I appreciate what you guys are saying about cutting my losses, but I'm sorry. Justice needs to be delivered. I worked a minimum wage job full time going to school, paying off school and saving up for my dream car for 2 years to have the engine rebuilt alone. This is my passion project and I will get my money back one way or another. If I don't, you'll see my Buick in the papers because there's no way I'll ever be able to afford to get it back on the road for a long time unless one of my parents takes pity on a 25 year old college student (doubtful). I'll be $25k+ in debt after I graduate with a bachelor's and I was hoping to do many other things post graduation, while enjoying the car. There's nothing to enjoy anymore. I can't get it done before August 11th, so it will sit for 5 more years as I look on and comment about how I've been screwed over in every aspect of this hobby by professionals and experts. $5000 is a lot of money to me, because I'm literally poor. Where I live, if the system fails, street justice prevails. I can't do anything obviously because I want a future for myself, but I know how to get even, like dot3 on a cherry paint job. 

[MrEarl]

May I remind everyone that this is a public forum, viewable by anyone, friend or foe. I suggest getting back to the subject here and using private messaging for any further "legal" talk. Some self editing of previous posts might be in order also. Jus sayin! 

[KAD36]

+1 on Willies valve stem height measurement 

 

Anyone doing a 322 write it in your manual. It makes a difference 

 

Chain appears loose - what matters is how much crank rotation you get before the cam starts to move - that's the few degrees of retard or lag that Willis is referring to. See if you can get that measured. Less than a degree would be ideal for a new timing set but I'll leave it to more experienced folks for a proper threshold.  Period chains were tighter than current new stock.

Edited June 4, 2017 by KAD36 (see edit history)

[60FlatTop]

In a profession manner, firm and not dysfunctional, you can explain that his work failed and you would like a refund in the amount to get it done correctly. Sometimes it is hard to do that, but learn now. It won't be the last time. And it is probably not his first time. He probably did his best. Knowing that, you have the leverage to recognize he did his best and you can both agree that you'd like to try someone else.

I have a business, just an X type business. Every time I deposit payment for a job I put 5% of the total into a warranty account. It is labeled the Circus account for a good reason. It has a significant balance over a year that makes it easy to cover any non-billable expenses. That can be warranty, customer over-expectation, return visits, all that stuff. You engine shop may do the same thing. I created the policy specifically for customers. Try him, you never know.

 

If it was me I would say I was sorry and graciously hand over the money.

Bernie

[60FlatTop]

3 hours ago, Beemon said:

I worked a minimum wage job full time going to school, paying off school and saving up for my dream car for 2 years to have the engine rebuilt alone.

 

We are a society that recognizes rewards as a result of what we have done; and that creates expectations. Few people look at having a job, going to school, and having a car as rewards. Those are real. Sometimes expectations never are met. If you do this, this, and this you will deserve this. An expectation, don't expect it. You could be disappointed.

Bernie

Edited June 4, 2017 by 60FlatTop (see edit history)

[old-tank]

1 hour ago, KAD36 said:

 Period chains were tighter than current new stock.

And your chain is typical of a newly installed current stock.  See Mudbone's thread and video.  Find a NORS chain (TC491) in a long box.

The original cam gears can be used if the chain marks are small and you cannot catch a fingernail...yours are apparently worse.

Despite Lamar's warning I am very interested in how the legal process works out and having had to do this many times in Texas, I would like to see the comparison.  Keep me updated by PM if you start getting censored.

[NTX5467]

My point on the chain comparison was that it's not loose enough to cause an engine failure.  No more, no less.  There will always be a certain amount of slack in a chain drive, especially on the "return" side rather than the "tension" side.  This is the nature of that type of drive.  And V-belt drives, too.  The ONLY completely accurate way to drive a camshaft is with a Jessel belt drive.  They recommend you check valve/piston clearance, even or non-wild cams as "the slack" is compensated for in cam timing events, apparently.

 

I found a way to check or a loose timing chain, some time back.  It involved levering the crank bolt to check for crank rotation with the engine stopped.  This wasin the 1950s, or thereabouts.  The amount of crank rotation was more than might be expected, as it also measured the non-tension side as you turned the crank back and forth.

 

We've been through the timing chain issue in another thread.  Seeking to find the one Old-Tank mentions in the same style of box.  I've looked at catalog listings and see that part number more places than not   Some even mention the number of links in the chain.  Makes me wonder if there are any "good" chains left out there?  Or if there might be a market out there for a modified 401 timing set modified to fit 322s, as it appears the 322 and back situation is "Iffy" at best.

 

NTX5467

[Beemon]

Here's the last thing I'll post. I just checked the bill of sale, he didn't buy any new rocker assemblies, so this is the original 300,000 mile rocker assembly, assembled in 1956 at the Flint, Michigan assembly plant. Can anyone tell me why someone would put these back into service on a fresh rebuild? This explains why the new machinist had to ground down the stem of a valve to get it out of the guide.

 

 

Or is this perfectly normal??

[Bloo]

Probably because no replacements were available? Does anyone make these?

 

No matter, those are too shot to use. He should have stopped, contacted you, and either found better ones himself or asked you to.

 

It should normally be possible for a machinist to regrind them. They cant be used the way they are. Those edges will catch on the tips of the new or reground valves. The ones in your pictures are worn clear through the pads, I don't think regrinding would fix them.

 

There are 2 main issues here, valvetrain geometry and lifter preload.

 

If the geometry is wrong, the rocker will try to scrub the valve sideways as it pushes it down. This will cause the guides to wear out too fast, and might even break stuff, its hard to say. The geometry needs to be checked by the guy rebuilding the heads. Most engines have a spec for valvestem height, and this is the reason. If the valves are a little worn, or reground, the stem will come up higher and the geometry will be wrong. The tips are ground to correct it.

 

Note that when this happens, the valvespring retainer will also be a little bit too high, and the valve spring will have less tension. This is why there is also a spec for "valve spring installed height". When wrong, it is corrected with shims between the bottom of the spring and the head.

 

When the rocker tips have severe wear like that, they need to be precision ground back to the correct contour. The loss of material also screws up the geometry, and depending on how much was removed, may cause the scrubbing sideways on the valvestems I mentioned above. Also it may cause the rockers to have too much angle, and that can put the pushrods in a bind, and even more so with a higher lift cam. It may also screw up the lifter preload.

 

To correct this, a machinist could leave the valvestems a little too tall, but that isn't really advisable, or more likely would machine a tiny bit off the bottom of the rocker shaft support towers.

 

None of this matters though, because those look way beyond regrinding to me. I think you are gonna have to find another set. Hopefully they wont need grinding at all. If they do, maybe they will need a lot less.

 

Lifter preload is the distance the lifter piston is pushed down in it's bore when the lifter is on the base circle of the cam lobe. Grinding material off of the rocker tips also lessens the lifter preload, but lowering the shaft in relation to the head has the opposite effect. A reground cam affects it too, but often not enough to matter. I think you should always check the preload. It can be fixed with different pushrod lengths if wrong. The geometry needs to be right first.

 

[Beemon]

They do make replacements (LH, RH, complete). Thanks for the explanation.

 

 

 

Edited June 4, 2017 by Beemon (see edit history)

[Bloo]

Have a look at the shafts for wear too.....

[NTX5467]

On ANY non-roller tip rocker arm, as the rocker arm pushes down on the valve stem, there is a lateral motion as the rocker arm rubs on the valve stem to push it down.  Same on the "close" function.  Always lateral forces against the valve stem's end.  On a roller-tip rocker arm, with the roller rolling, very much less lateral forces imparted to the valve stem and resisted by the valve guide.  The part of the rocker arm which contacts the valve stem is usually rounded a certain amount, which can be reduced as wear happens.

 

The valve train has many wear areas!  In some cases, it's not enough to need to be replaced when the engine is rebuilt.  But possibly 300K would have too much wear to be re-used.

 

NTX5467

[Beemon]

Well considering there's large chunks missing out of the rocker arm, I thought that as well but I guess they were good enough for my money. 

[old-tank]

Hopefully the later rockers (1:6) are ok.  If not:  http://www.rockerarms.com The stock (1:5) set on mine are showing no wear on the bushings, shafts or tips after 80K miles.  The do put out a shower of oil and made valve stem seals necessary.

[60FlatTop]

This topic has filled a few pages and it is interesting reading on the mechanical side. However there is a second underlining message you might want to put some deep thought into. I have read a number of times that you have little money and all this is on a tight, if not short, budget. Be very careful about delivering that message to a service provider, like the engine rebuilder.

 

If you tell the service provider funds are adequate, you can pay the bill, but both costs and quality need to be closely controlled. He will understand and work closely with you. My personal preference on a large job is to set a day of the week to make payment to date and receive an itemized bill for parts and labor on the day, paid up to date that week with full knowledge of work completed. That also monitors progress.

 

My Nephew did the mechanical work on my Park Ave convertible and below are the 9 weekly payments I made. In that instance I provided the parts. It was one of his first big jobs so I wanted to establish a precedent for him. And it was a laundry list that started with "install new engine"

Back to the message the service provider hears. He has a job and a pretty good idea of what it costs. The only part of your financial situation he needs to know is that you will pay.

Hearing the low income, college student story means little to him putting his own groceries on his kitchen table. BUT, if he doesn't have a lump of steel where his heart should be, he can be soft in one critical area. Or he can be generous and make a charitable contribution. And you know that ain't gonna happen. So, in good will, he will cheapen the job.

1. He can "try to save you money". THAT is a message you don't want him to hear. First thought "Oh, almost $400 for a set of rocker arms. Well, these look OK. He should get by with them. It will help keep costs down." That is the kind of thinking that hurts the customer and makes hard feelings. That is where many misunderstandings start. And you are at a disadvantage because a lot of customers before you conditioned him to think ALL customers want it done cheaply.

I have had contractors come to my house and, after I tell them what I want they say "I think I can save you some money." What I hear is "I am going to do something different from what you want." There are some stories of suggested alternatives. In the end they were uninvited.

 

So on this new repair be sure the machinist knows you are prepared to pay, there is no confusion about quality trade-offs, and that you want a periodic accounting of time and materials. Let him know you are the project manager and all communication needs to be clear and legible.

 

Whether you are rich or poor the message can be damaging. Don't give the guy a reason to think about it. Let him perceive you as neural and adequately funded. And be sure you are the later.

 

Bernie

Edited June 5, 2017 by 60FlatTop (see edit history)

[Beemon]

Bernie, when I had the engine built the first time, I had the full amount fully saved up for the first go around. My cost issues have only arose these last few months because I leave in August for the University and I don't have time to save up. What I had budgeted for before was $700 which is affordable to me as it was just some head work and a hone/ring job and reseal.  In two and a half months I won't be close to another $5000, that's where the poor college student comes from. 

 

I didn't know any better then, but I do now. I'm not keen on making the same mistake twice. 

[JohnD1956]

Beemon, as you know, you cannot rush this project, especially on a low budget.  You have the replacement block,  How about taking a look see at this in your home town, as a temporary vehicle while going to college?  79 Regal

[Beemon]

John, I tried my best to get out from underneath my mother's fingernails, but she said if I service all the cars in her fleet (4), I could take the 02 Jeep with me while the 322 is being worked on. Transportation is not a problem at this time. Besides, this is more up my alley.

 

Also, just found out the rotating assembly at the junkyard is going to cost me $400, mostly because it's in the back and the owner has to move two or three cars with a forklift just to pull the engine. So by they time I'm done, I'll have three blocks and two sets of heads... the more the merrier, I guess.

Edited June 6, 2017 by Beemon (see edit history)

[JohnD1956]

It's good that you have an alternative.  But instead of that one that's more up your alley, here is one I would HIGHLY recommend

 

These have a tendency to need gas tanks, and then a HVAC fan rheostat.  That cold heater is most likely the electric motor that operates the individual heater doors in the system.  That happened to my 95 Riviera once and when I rotated the assembly one time by hand it fixed itself.  But mainly it gets 30 + MPG and rides like a dream!  It's good for a hundred K more without major service.  If I was closer I'd even be on this one myself! 

[Beemon]

This is assuming I have $3000 to buy a used car right now. thanks for looking, John. 

[NTX5467]

There's always the "Easy Pay Plan" that doubles the sale price of the car, when done.  Buy it, spiff it up a little.  Fix a few things.  DRIVE it.  Sell for your total investment, or thereabouts.

 

NTX5467

[Bloo]

C'mon, guys. I think you all know buying another car is the wrong answer, unless there's just no alternative. It's a good way to get distracted.

[jackofalltrades70]

Distracted???? Who is distracted?

[JohnD1956]

11 minutes ago, Bloo said:

C'mon, guys. I think you all know buying another car is the wrong answer, unless there's just no alternative. It's a good way to get distracted.

 

Sorry Bloo, but I think another car is exactly what's needed, considering the fact that the time till College is short, and there is not enough $$$ to acquire all the parts at once.  Another car that is the right car.  By that I mean; a car that will be serviceable, and provide reliable transportation without a lot of intervention.  And one that can be sold, with no regrets, when the 56 is back together.   

 

A distraction still, but a means to an end.

[NTX5467]

IF you look around, there are still some fwd Century/Regals from about 1997-2006 which were well cared for that generally have lower miles, for well under $5000.00  That would also include Chevy Impalas and Olds Intrigues, too, regardless of which engine it had.  AND almost all of them had EPA highway ratings of 29-33mpg, too.  Don't have to spend "fortunes" for a nice car, which as mentioned, can be sold later on with no regrets.

 

Downside is that with the modern comfort and less maintenance, plus mpg, might be harder to get back into an older 1950s car.  BUT the allure of the older cars will always be there.

 

NTX5467

[Beemon]

Again, if I don't have the money to rebuild the engine, I don't have the money to buy another car. You guys are silly. I have a car to drive right now, it's just not MY car. 

[Bill Stoneberg]

5 hours ago, Beemon said:

Again, if I don't have the money to rebuild the engine, I don't have the money to buy another car. You guys are silly. I have a car to drive right now, it's just not MY car. 

 

Hell,  All of us here know what you need and are willing to spend your money. 

[JohnD1956]

6 hours ago, Beemon said:

 I have a car to drive right now, it's just not MY car. 

 

And THAT, my friend, is the BEST kind of temporary vehicle! 

[Beemon]

Well trouble doesn't cease to follow me. My grandfather let the drug dealer back into the house, not even a week after the car was moved over there, so now I have to find a way to hold up the Dynaflow and get it moved back to my house...

[60FlatTop]

Speaking of drugs. I have a Dynaflow in my cellar. The meterman came down the outside steps while I was working. He exclaimed "Wow! Did you carry that thing down here?'

I said "Naw, it was drugged."

Bernie

[MrEarl]

15 hours ago, 60FlatTop said:

Speaking of drugs. I have a Dynaflow in my cellar. The meterman came down the outside steps while I was working. He exclaimed "Wow! Did you carry that thing down here?'

I said "Naw, it was drugged."

Bernie

Well there ya go .... maybe the drug dealer can offer some help with suggestions on how to get the car drugged back home. 

Sorry Benjamin, we're not making light of your continued troubles, just trying to keep you on the sunny side. Here's a couple of songs that were my moms favorites and I remember her singing when I was growing up. in fact she and I would sing them when I visited her in the nursing home. She had forgotten a lot of peoples names and such but never forgot the words to these songs. 

 

 

 

By the way, I don't recall your Century having a name, may I suggest.......

 

 

 

 

Hang in there Brother no one ever said the Buick Highway was without potholes, just dodge what you can and hold tight the steering wheel with those you hit. 

[1956322]

Did you ever file a claim against him?