wayne sheldon

I love that one! The ironic thing about the color is, that one of the best really original paint cars I ever saw in colors really close to this, was a 1927 Cadillac (one of two built) Fleetwood limousine. Beautiful original car! In beige and brown before the craze of painting anything those colors. Those colors were used on some cars in the 1920s and early 1930s. They were not common colors, but they were around.

I like a nice dark green on a lot of antique automobiles. Especially on commercial vehicles. I think a Hunter or Brewster green looks great on trucks. I generally like an original factory color on cars, which were more standardized, but trucks were often painted the company's color regardless. I have had two antique truck I restored. A 1925 Ford TT truck with a wooden after-market body, and a brass era model T pickup, also an after-market wooden body. Both I painted dark green. People love "natural finish" on wood on antique automobiles. But the truth is, that back in the day it was not commonly done. I can think of several beautiful trucks with natural finish inside that I wouldn't want to change a thing on them. Even though I know it likely wasn't that way originally (although one I knew quite well in fact was done that way originally). It always pleases me when someone paints the interior of their antique truck. To me, it just feels right.

The aluminum heads on these engines are famous in Studebaker circles for being very difficult to work with. You are fortunate to have one in better condition than most. And folks! This is one of the best writeups I have seen about how to remove the head, and then remove the studs which often are also very difficult! Good pictures, actual temperatures given. A combination of the right kind of penetration oil, soaking time, heat and more penetrant, where and how to get ahold and apply selective force and vibration to break parts loose. The way to fix the passageway corrosion I don't think can be beaten. Welding on this sort of aluminum is problematical at best. It takes a real specialist to even attempt welding, very careful temperature balances are required or severe breakage of the head would be almost guaranteed! Plugs, properly fit, with frozen plugs into a very warm but not too hot head can make a "permanent" repair that will likely outlast the head itself. The last time I removed a similar studded head (not a Studebaker), after soaking with Kroil for a couple weeks (sometimes applied after heating), I used over twenty screw drivers, chisels, and assorted wedges around the block. They were literally two to three inches apart all the way around the block! It took a couple hours carefully tapping and wiggling each and every one around and around and around! The head came off with no harm to the head or block. Don't force it! Finesse it!

I remember now, that wagon was so long and low, I used to call it the "battleship".

FYI, Delco and Remy merged in September of 1926. I just googled it. I remembered it was right about 1927 as my 1927 Paige 6-45 sedan has all Remy badged electrical parts. I had discovered many years ago that the merger was just before the car was built, making it one of the last (million or so cars?) to be so badged. I have a couple spare distributors I found many years ago for my Paige that look identical to its original distributor, except the spares are badged "Delco-Remy".

We had a 1972 Chrysler station wagon similar to this one back about 1980. Ours had the 440, was dark brown metallic with the fake wood sides. It was a beautiful station wagon! The stories I could tell.

For whatever it is worth, the Ford headlamp is unusual, used for only a few months in late calendar year 1925 on the early 1926 model T cars.

I had a feeling that car was going to clean up pretty nice! I love the look of really old paint buffed up to a good shine. Hey Ed, I see it is the right arm in a sling. Don't you know you are supposed to crank the T with your left? I "say" that, however, in all honesty I have cranked my cars with my right hand for over fifty years now! It was the way I was taught, so even after I learned differently (and the reasons for it!) I never changed my ways. Never broke my arm. (So far????)

From the look of it, I would expect it is an English built body. Nothing that era in a typical USA built Chrysler looks like that. That leaves engine and chassis details to determine model.

I have a very healthy respect for heights, and generally take reasonable precautions and care in climbing. Usually. I did communications contracting for most of my adult career, and climbing towers was a large part of that work. I never had to climb any of the really tall towers. My dad on the other hand on several occasions had to climb towers to over 500 feet! I think the highest I ever had to go up a tower was about 200 feet. There was one tower that we installed that topped out at 150 feet, which we serviced for over twenty years. I went clear to the top of that tower hundreds of times! A well built properly guyed tower is fairly stable, and for me comfortable to be near the top. The scariest tower I was ever on was just over 30 feet tall, on a hillside and very unstable, leaning over a good ten feet! Felt like it was going to buckle over every second I was on it, and the way it was leaning on the hillside a lot more than thirty feet down! We didn't climb towers all the time, and only carried the belts when we expected to need them (riding around in a service truck is not good for the belts!). Often, when I would discover that a problem was "up there", and I didn't have the belt with me? I climbed the towers without a belt. (OSHA would have freaked out if they had known at that time!) But I knew how, and I was careful when doing so. I also on a few occasions put my extension ladders in the back of my pickup truck if it was just two feet too short. And a few times had to lean ladders agains the strand between poles if that was where a problem was. My eldest son was really into rock climbing for many years. He climbed "Half Dome" in Yosemite a few times. Kind of a funny thing. I just never could see the fun in rock climbing? After climbing towers literally hundreds of times? It just looked like work to me?

I was thinking Fischer Body Company. They were a general coach builder officially founded in 1908, and built bodies for numerous automakers of the era for several years. In the brass era of model T Fords, they were one of the top five suppliers for Ford's model T, providing common touring car bodies as well as the rare early coupes and I believe town cars. When Ford brought out the famous center-door sedan in 1915, Fischer built many of those for a number of years. Ford, even after moving the majority of body building inhouse by 1920, continued using some Fischer bodies even until after Fischer became part of the General Motors empire. If I recall correctly, the body on my 1924 model T Ford coupe was a Fischer body (according to the builder's date and coding information stamped into the floorboard risers). Clearly, this is not a Ford body of that era. But it could be from almost any larger other automobile from the Detroit area around 1910. Fuller Buggy Company could be a possibility, however, having researched Fuller some years ago, I consider that somewhat unlikely. The "F B Co" stamping in the wood looks very much like the early model T's body stampings I have seen on original known Fischer bodied Ts.

Interesting. The FB listing states that it was found in the Sierra (mountains?), but doesn't say where in the Sierras (a very long mountain range). It looks like it could be old enough to date back to the California Gold Rush. Many a sailor jumped ship to try their luck in the gold fields. Certainly, a lot of them would have taken tools of their former trade with them.

Do they need to be AACA? These are actually HCCA. The modern interloper (Goldbug) is there because the fellow's 1914 Kissel touring car blew out the water pump the day before the tour was to start! And I am kidding calling it an "interloper". The Goldbug is gorgeous! A few weeks later and the 1914 was back on the road. The resolution may actually not be high enough. But these photos are fond memories for me.

If your Chrysler has external contracting band brakes (which I think it does?)? Be prepared for some stopping issues. When the drums and bands get wet, they don't work very well. They may do nothing at all for a bit, then grab unevenly causing handling troubles. Don't fear it, just be prepared, and allow double or even triple normal stopping distances for the car! I highly recommend practicing for a bit under safe conditions, using the hand brake to stop your antique automobile. One should KNOW what to expect from it, and how it will react and handle emergency stops. I believe your Chrysler like the 1925 Studebaker I used to have has the hand brake behind the transmission. I drove that Studebaker in the rain "a few" times, and found the hand brake stayed dry enough to stop the car more reliably in the rain. A bit squirrely, but better stopping than the wet service brake. Another thing about external contracting brakes, is that they get wet, but applying the brake a bit ahead of a planned stop can brush most of the water off, and after a few seconds begin to dry the linings. Again, allow extra distance to do that, and be prepared for uneven braking. Internal expanding shoe brakes can have some stopping issues in the rain, especially if they do not have full backing plates. However, the drums afford some protection from water accumulation, so the effects are less dramatic. The 1925 Studebaker I had was a two-door coach (sedan), so keeping passengers and the car's interior fairly dry was not difficult. My main worry driving antiques in the rain is getting parts of the car wet that could result in damage to the car. Another car I used to have was an open sport roadster, with no top. I only drove it in the rain on a few tours I was really looking forward to going onto. For it, I grabbed up a bunch of old towels, and a large plastic bag. At every stop, I would dry the "interior". When we went inside at stops, I would cover the seat and floor with towels. Then when we went to leave, I would gather up the towels and put them into the plastic bag. It wasn't raining hard that day, so the towels mostly absorbed the rain before it could get into the seat or floors. I have had a few model T speedsters over the years. Most of them were driven in heavy rain a few times! Other than handling and braking issues which I always carefully planned for, I never had a problem with any of them. As far as engine and ignition issues? I never had any significant trouble from any of them. With a hood and the engine's heat, everything usually stayed dry enough. Actually, the only "engine" issue I can recall offhand, was once in my first model T speedster, on the way home from the club's annual "rainy run to the snow" trip! It was raining buckets! And I was having a blast in the open wheel, no windshield, no doors, no top, car! As I often did with a car like that, I would zoom up ahead, then pull over to watch the other cars go by. Wait a couple minutes and then catch up to the line and follow them for awhile. Then repeat with a zoom ahead and stop again. So there I was, doing a good 60mph in the pouring rain in a car that might as well been a motorcycle, and unseen ahead was a slight dip in the road, with the water almost a foot deep! (Nobody ahead of me to see a splash and the water lay nice and flat looking like pavement.) You could say the Bosch magneto the car had got a bit wet, and the car was running on about 2 1/2 cylinders, so I pulled over and parked. I was trying to keep the engine running enough to dry it out more quickly, but looked under the hood and discovered the splash had literally washed the fan belt off its pullies! So I shut the engine off (which was probably a better idea anyway?), and put the fan belt back where it belonged. I restarted the car just as the line caught up to me and we went along our merry way.

That looks an awful lot alike the one I saw at an auction in Las Vegas over twenty years ago! If by chance it is the same car, someone did a nice job cleaning it up and somewhat detailing it. The car at that auction wasn't nearly so nice looking. One of the rare times I actually went to a major auction.

Been there. Done that.

The same sort of badging thing happened with vacuum tubes for radios and televisions back in the 1950s and 1960s. My dad was part owner and chief repairman in a television sales and repair shop in the 1950s. Certain tubes were made better by one company than by others. Good repairmen knew the coding on the tubes themselves to tell who actually manufactured a given tube. GE, Sylvania, a dozen others. The box label didn't necessarily mean who made the tube! The tube inside would even be labeled to match the name on the box, only the source coding numbers would tell who really made it, if you knew what the numbers meant. And some tubes it made a difference. I don't remember the details anymore. But there was one commonly used television circuit tube that he was adamant only one manufacturer to be used. No matter what the box said, he checked the tube itself!

FAN-dang-TASTIC! I love a wonderful ending! Good honest deals are out there. My first thought when seeing this one was that it was in that gray area where the price wasn't that too good to be true that it actually might be real. Right now I cannot buy anything I don't really need. So when I saw this I was glad it was too far away.

Are you familiar with the club specifically for flathead Pontiacs and Oakland automobiles? A very longtime friend of mine is involved with them and I understand they are very helpful with information.

For whatever it is worth? My first glance at the photo, my brain said likely Nash. However, something also said to me it didn't look quite right for a Nash. As I didn't have time to look it up in any of my references, I said nothing. (And that golf bag door was bugging me?) Oakland is an interesting marque, one which has some background causing me to notice them on the rare occasions I see or hear of one. And over the years, I have known a few people that owned one of some year or another. And I have actually ridden in a couple of them. Year models I have had close contact with have included 1912 (a longtime friend has toured with it for years!), 1918 (I considered buying that one), and a few from the early, mid, and late 1920s. They tend to be a car one doesn't often think about. As the discussion here progressed, and photos and opinions were shared, That golf bag door kept bugging me. A lot of cars, coupes and roadsters, during the 1920s had golf bag doors. My first real prewar car when I was still in high school was a 1929 Reo Flying Cloud coupe with a golf bag door. So I tend to notice golf bag doors on cars of the 1920s. Most of them are more or less rectangular in shape, often but not always with slightly rounded corners. Sometimes they have a corner notched out around the rear fender? Often they do not. Still, usually basically squarish in shape. RARELY are they askew as is the subject car. The era picture of the Oakland sport roadster shared by keiser31 above may not have as nice a square view of the side as the OP car, however, it does appear to also have an askew golf bag door. That golf bag door, coupled with the details of the windshield frame, location of the cowl lamps (also a bit unusual), and the not quite clear enough but very close hub caps pretty much conveniences me that the OP car is most likely an Oakland roadster. As for the steel disc wheels. Those are a bit unusual for General Motors. Most General Motors marques did offer steel disc wheels as an option, with Chevrolet selling a lot more cars with steel disc wheels than any other GM brand. Chevrolet and most other GM brands used Jaxon steel disc wheels which most years had their own distinctive look to them. The disc wheels on this Oakland don't have the typical Jaxon Wheel look to them. However (and I don't offhand recall the details of this?), there was a merger between a couple wheel companies including Motor Wheel and Jaxon in the early to mid 1920s. Part of that process resulted in a couple GM brands using different steel disc wheels for awhile. I recall seeing a couple GM brand automobiles including Oldsmobile using this particular distinctive style wheel in the mid 1920s. That is my opinion. Welcome Old Crock to a wonderful discussion forum for antique automobiles!

Automotive history is filled with exceptions to the rule! The general rule is, that in America for the first several decades of the automobile, light "colors" including off-whites, were not common, or popular. Yet, Buick built their "White Streak" series of cars around 1910, which were rather popular for a few years. Whether that popularity was in part due to or entirely in spite of the whiteness of the cars is subject to debate. Numerous low production automobiles over those decades offered a model or two in a near white. Most are rarely if ever seen. Expensive special order custom cars were sometimes ordered in white or very light colors. I have read of a brass era Pierce Arrow, and a couple Rolls Royces. And, YES! Even Henry's infamously "black" model T Ford came from the factory in a very light (almost white!) gray! With a few other special exceptions, in one body style only, for a bit over one year only, the 1909 runabout's standard color was light gray.

Very, very, nice! I do look forward to seeing more progress as well as the "great unveiling"! Be well my friend.

Just a few hours to go, and the high bid is now $11,500. Reserve still not met.

A bit too new for me. But I like it! I question the "rebuilt engine"? It doesn't look like any really rebuilt engine I ever saw. Maybe worked over a little bit? The material I don't think is correct, but the interior looks pretty good anyway. I would actually consider it if I had the money to spend. Almost anywhere you ever went with it, you would be the only one there with anything quite like it!

I am so pleased to see this car coming along this nicely! I remember you making comments about it on the MTFCA forums ten to fifteen years ago. I also like the color choice! I looked at a very original 1927 T four-door sedan many years ago. The mostly intact original paint was that light greenish gray color. I really liked the color on that car.