Anyone Here Buy This 1961 Chevy Biscayne In Florida ?

[Trulyvintage]

Good Luck ….

 

Jim

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[8E45E]

It appears to be a Bel-Air, not a lesser trimmed Biscayne.

 

Craig

[rocketraider]

Let's hope it's not headed the same place as the other two.

 

That Infiniti might be repairable. The SUV? I can't imagine anyone trying to rebuild that.

 

What is it with Chevy guys' obsession with putting Chevy Rally wheels on EVERYTHING? It's not like Chevrolet's 1961 wheelcovers and dogbowls weren't some of the most gorgeous they ever had.

[arcticbuicks]

no...i didnt buy that one.....i only wanted the blue one .....so i would know theres no chance of any bondo

[Pfeil]

35 minutes ago, rocketraider said:

Let's hope it's not headed the same place as the other two.

 

That Infiniti might be repairable. The SUV? I can't imagine anyone trying to rebuild that.

 

What is it with Chevy guys' obsession with putting Chevy Rally wheels on EVERYTHING? It's not like Chevrolet's 1961 wheelcovers and dogbowls weren't some of the most gorgeous they ever had.

Or 

[rocketraider]

We can thank the 1961 Impala SS and the 1961 Starfire for the advent of 1" narrow whitewalls. Those two very special cars took us out of the wide white era and into the 60s.

 

To their credit no one's 1961 wide whites were as outrageously wide as earlier ones but the SS and Starfire pointed the way to 1960s cleaner styling.

 

Jars me to see more than a 1-1/2" whitewall on anything later than 1961... needs to be some black rubber between the wheel and the white rubber!

[arcticbuicks]

interesting how sports cars in 1961 came new with wide whites

Edited February 16 by arcticbuicks (see edit history)

[West Peterson]

14 minutes ago, arcticbuicks said:

interesting how sports cars in 1961 came new with wide whites

 

Only in America. Europeans had better taste.

[zepher]

First thing that jumped out to me was that new cars are built out of such inferior materials that the Chevy totaled two new cars and there isn't even a scratch on its bumper.  

[rocketraider]

4 minutes ago, West Peterson said:

 

Only in America. Europeans had better taste.

 

Didn't XK-120s and XK-140s often have them? Maybe big Healeys?

 

Or did that happen after they were offloaded in America?

[West Peterson]

49 minutes ago, rocketraider said:

 

Didn't XK-120s and XK-140s often have them? Maybe big Healeys?

 

Or did that happen after they were offloaded in America?

European car enthusiasts with any dignity scoffed at the idea of putting on white sidewall tires. Strictly an American "thing."

[auburnseeker]

It's just because the Europeans were too Cheap to spring for the white walls. 

[1912Staver]

Michelin X were the tires of choice in those days. I don't think they made them in white wall. Dunlop Gold Seal might have been made in a WW version, but they were not as good as the Michelin's .

Edited February 16 by 1912Staver (see edit history)

[Frank DuVal]

So, good luck because they chose a hauler whose expertise is in hauling totals?

 

Because it is an open haul, and possible to get a windshield rock chip being the front car? (happened to my own Greenbrier being hauled just 100 miles by a friend)

 

Because the tires are low, and if they loose more air the straps will be loose?

 

It's Love Bug season? (That is late April and again late August)

 

What else?❓

 

 

Glenn, I agree, the stock '61 wheel covers would be sooooo  much nicer. And this is from a guy who has bought two Corvairs with Rally Wheels.  Can't wait to put stock 13" back on the newest one, as soon as weather holds out so I can sandblast and paint the set. A lot of Corvairs got 14" Rallies when 13" tires became unobtainium around 2008.

 

Yes, Bel Air.

[Trulyvintage]

51 minutes ago, Frank DuVal said:

So, good luck because they chose a hauler whose expertise is in hauling totals?

 

Because it is an open haul, and possible to get a windshield rock chip being the front car? (happened to my own Greenbrier being hauled just 100 miles by a friend)

 

Because the tires are low, and if they loose more air the straps will be loose?

 

It's Love Bug season? (That is late April and again late August)

 

What else?❓

 

It takes no “ expertise “ to drive

into Coparts or another auction

yard and wait for a forklift to 

bring out a salvage vehicle

and side or rear load it on 

an open trailer.

 

The middle and end vehicle

vehicles on that trailer are 

required to have any loose

parts secured in place before

using public roads.

 

I get contacted by folks every

day telling me what

“ the going rate “ is for

vehicle transport.

 

To transport the Chevy in

manner shown is disrespectful 

to the vehicle at the very least.

 

I see this every day on the road.

 

Jim

[arcticbuicks]

maybe its his own car ?....could possibly be a flood damaged car also......or maybe a customer that chose that open hauling by his choice

[auburnseeker]

Had a guy ship a 68 Big Block really nice corvette I sold him,  the same way.   There was literally an inch or less between the v in the front bumper and the back of the wrecked SUV in front of it, when he strapped it down.  The frame also got hung up trying to load it as the ramps were really steep as it was actually a semi trailer.   Surprisingly it made it unscathed.

[Fargoguy]

1 hour ago, Frank DuVal said:

So, good luck because they chose a hauler whose expertise is in hauling totals?

 

Because it is an open haul, and possible to get a windshield rock chip being the front car? (happened to my own Greenbrier being hauled just 100 miles by a friend)

 

Because the tires are low, and if they loose more air the straps will be loose?

 

It's Love Bug season? (That is late April and again late August)

 

What else?❓

 

 

Glenn, I agree, the stock '61 wheel covers would be sooooo  much nicer. And this is from a guy who has bought two Corvairs with Rally Wheels.  Can't wait to put stock 13" back on the newest one, as soon as weather holds out so I can sandblast and paint the set. A lot of Corvairs got 14" Rallies when 13" tires became unobtainium around 2008.

 

Yes, Bel Air.

I believe he said Good Luck because:

1. He believes that the vehicle is being hauled in a substandard way that he doesn't agree with

2. He believes that he would have been a better choice no matter what price

3. He uses what he sees as the failures or shortcomings of others to reinforce his own superior value and quality. ( This can be backed up by his use of pictures of a 20's car hauled through an Ice storm on an open trailer in his ads to show the "wrong" way to do things as opposed to the way he does them). 

 

[John348]

6 hours ago, rocketraider said:

We can thank the 1961 Impala SS and the 1961 Starfire for the advent of 1" narrow whitewalls. Those two very special cars took us out of the wide white era and into the 60s.

 

To their credit no one's 1961 wide whites were as outrageously wide as earlier ones but the SS and Starfire pointed the way to 1960s cleaner styling.

 

Jars me to see more than a 1-1/2" whitewall on anything later than 1961... needs to be some black rubber between the wheel and the white rubber!

 

Actually the Corvair Monza was the first with narrow whitewalls, the only reason I know this is I got stumped by a Corvair guy while I was saying the same thing at a seminar on 61-64 Chevy's.

Edited February 16 by John348 (see edit history)

[rocketraider]

Once again I've learned something from the Forums. I'd never heard that about the Monza, but stands to reason with all the early 60s innovation and cleaner styling that was going on at GM at that time.

 

But the Corvair people insist they had the first production turbocharger too!😏😄  

 

Mmph. All the emojis on this phone and not nare baitworm! I know you're out there listening Frank...

 

 

[Shootey]

7 hours ago, rocketraider said:

Didn't XK-120s and XK-140s often have them? Maybe big Healeys?

Some Porsche 356’s had whitewalls but maybe just for USA. 

[8E45E]

41 minutes ago, Shootey said:

Some Porsche 356’s had whitewalls but maybe just for USA. 

Rolls-Royce also offered whitewall tires on Silver Clouds.

 

 

Edited February 17 by 8E45E (see edit history)

[Pfeil]

9 hours ago, rocketraider said:

We can thank the 1961 Impala SS and the 1961 Starfire for the advent of 1" narrow whitewalls. Those two very special cars took us out of the wide white era and into the 60s.

 

To their credit no one's 1961 wide whites were as outrageously wide as earlier ones but the SS and Starfire pointed the way to 1960s cleaner styling.

 

Jars me to see more than a 1-1/2" whitewall on anything later than 1961... needs to be some black rubber between the wheel and the white rubber!

58-59-60 Pontiac were the first Pontiac's to reduce from what I would call the wide whites of my dad's 50 Pontiac.

1961 Chevrolet

 

1961 Pontiac 

[Pfeil]

1957 Cadillac Eldorado Brougham 

 

[John348]

20 hours ago, Pfeil said:

58-59-60 Pontiac were the first Pontiac's to reduce from what I would call the wide whites of my dad's 50 Pontiac.

1961 Chevrolet

 

1961 Pontiac 

They did reduce them, but they were still 1 3/8" from 1 3/4" from 1957, but they were not yet 1" I forgot about the Cadillac Brougham. 

[Frank DuVal]

OK, Glenn.... I shall quote Big Wave Dave, a Corvair historian:

 

Obviously someone put this bit of misinformation out years ago until people over time just take it for granted it is true. I'm here to tell you it is not true!!!
I'll have more details in the update, here are the basic facts.

Both Chevrolet and Oldsmobile were working on Turbocharging programs in late 1961.There was a definite rivalry among divisions within GM.
Chevrolet was always very secretive regarding their programs, and did not leak anything about the Corvair Turbocharging program.
On the other hand Oldsmobile was not nearly as secretive and released some preliminary details of their turbocharging program in late 1961. This is the main reason many think Olds was first.

Now both programs were not anywhere near completion in 1961 and both Oldsmobile and Chevrolet produced Turbocharged "Pilot" show cars for the large and prestigious February 1962 Chicago Auto Show. The Oldsmobile Jetfire at the show was a hardtop, and the Corvair Spyder was a convertible.
After the show ended Chevrolet immediately began production of both the new Convertible and Spyder Turbocharging option in early March 1962. Official announcement for both the Convertible and Spyder options was on March 27th 1962 which was several weeks after production began. The Convertible and Spyder option was then available to order in April 1962. Early production was primarily to supply showroom display cars to the thousands of Chevrolet dealers nationwide. These cars were to be displayed for several months before they could be sold.

Oldsmobile started production several weeks after the Corvair Spyder but also could be ordered by April 1962.

So it was practically a dead heat. Both developed around the same time. Both shown at the same time at the same Chicago show, and both available to order from the public in April 1962, but Chevrolet beat the Oldsmobile to production by several weeks so the Corvair Spyder is actually the first American Production car to have a turbocharger.

PS: This information is sourced from GM documents and period automotive articles from March and April 1962 and information from the 1962 Chicago Auto Show among others sources.

Bigwave Dave Trull, Sierra Vista Arizona

 

 

My second gripe is about the know it all pundits who lump the Corvair Spyder with the Oldsmobile Jetfire as a failure that set back Automotive Turbocharging decades.

I do agree that the Jetfire Turbocharging system was a failure. It was too complicated and was too dependent on the owner properly maintaining the water alcohol turbo rocket fuel. Only 9607 were produced over two years and Factory Oldsmobile technicians estimate 80% were returned and had the Turbo removed and replaced with a carburetor.

The Corvair on the other hand, produced 9468 Turbos the first year, nearly equaling Oldsmobiles total output and over 50698 turbos in a 5 year span, which is an enormous amount. Corvair Turbos also were not replaced by the factory for carburetors and a great many Turbocharger equipped Corvairs have survived till this day.

How dare you call the Corvair Turbocharger a failure and lump it in with the short lived Jetfire. It was a amazing piece of engineering for its day, warts and all!!

 

So over 50,000 turbocharged Corvairs produced vs less than 10,000 Oldsmobiles. I'll just leave it at that.👍😁

Edited February 18 by Frank DuVal (see edit history)

[rocketraider]

Corvairs weren't trying to squeeze 5 pounds of boost onto a 10.25:1 CR engine either.

 

Oldsmobile had a bit of a fetish about their "Ultra High Compression" thing and having to use methanol injection to control detonation was right up their gadget-obsessed alley. Dropping the CR to a turbo-friendly number could have eliminated all that banjowork and saved the little huffer Oldsmobile's reputation. When a properly tuned engine detonated on Sunoco 260 or Phillips 66 Flite-Fuel, the squeeze was too high.

 

Whichever was first to market, if either had had reliable electronic fuel injection turbocharged engines would have come into their own long before they did. I maintain GM was never again as adventurous and innovative as they were with the early 60s Y and Z cars until federal regulations forced their hand in the 70s. Even then the innovation wasn't for performance, handling or efficiency, but to meet emissions and crash standards.

 

Now back to the BelAir. Did anyone here on the Forums buy it?