1928 Pontiac 6-28 sedan

[Matt Harwood]

Oh man, that's heartbreaking. I hate to see things like that.

 

I think having an axle made won't be that big a deal. One of the aftermarket axle companies like Moser or Currie can probably make something that'll fit properly and I bet it won't be crushingly expensive. Find out the dimensions that you need, the diameter, the length, and the splines, and I'm sure they can figure out something that will work.

 

Good luck and I'm sorry this happened.

[m-mman]

From Hollanders 16th edition: Axle shaft. 
Pontiac 26-28 all

Chevrolet 25-29 passenger car & half ton

GMC 27-29 T10, T11 first series 

Looks like 10 spline 30 7/8”

 

24-31 Olds same spline but only 29 7/8”. Pontiac axle fits Olds by shimming back of hub.  

[zdillinger]

6 hours ago, m-mman said:

From Hollanders 16th edition: Axle shaft. 
Pontiac 26-28 all

Chevrolet 25-29 passenger car & half ton

GMC 27-29 T10, T11 first series 

Looks like 10 spline 30 7/8”

 

24-31 Olds same spline but only 29 7/8”. Pontiac axle fits Olds by shimming back of hub.  

I can't thank you enough for providing this information. I think I have found a source for 25-29 Chevrolet axle shafts, which looks like they should work. Expensive, and there's a wait list, but I should never have to do them again!

Edited June 21, 2023 by zdillinger (see edit history)

[chistech]

Your issue is not uncommon with these old cars. I keep a couple spare axles for my own 31 chevy and have a pair of spare axles for my Oldsmobile. If you’re to order those new axles and there’s a long wait, you could always find a good used axle from a chevy and put it in for now so you can use the car while you wait for the new ones. If I had a 29 I’d send it to you but I don’t. There’s got to be someone out there who has one or knows someone who does. 

[zdillinger]

23 minutes ago, chistech said:

Your issue is not uncommon with these old cars. I keep a couple spare axles for my own 31 chevy and have a pair of spare axles for my Oldsmobile. If you’re to order those new axles and there’s a long wait, you could always find a good used axle from a chevy and put it in for now so you can use the car while you wait for the new ones. If I had a 29 I’d send it to you but I don’t. There’s got to be someone out there who has one or knows someone who does. 

Thanks Ted. Now that I know that this isn't just a two-year, Pontiac only part, I'm feeling more optimistic about finding something (not like I was with the pistons). There has to be something out there for me!

[Stude Light]

The failure was more than likely from a poorly processed part. The quality control in that era was nowhere near today’s standards.

 

I read through at least 25 durability test reports that GM ran in the 1920s and 1930s on their products and their competitors and failures of hardened parts almost always were the result of poor processing based on the post failure analysis (improper hardening, depth of hardening, tempering, etc.)

 

The recent failure of front spindle from a 1914 Studebaker had the same cause - improper processing.

 

So, they are not all prone to fail…just the luck of the draw or bad luck in this case.

 

It’s great you have some direction….this forum is full of so much knowledge! 

[zdillinger]

Well, the new axle angle fell through. Apparently the man that made them for the vendor has passed away and they are no longer available. So used will be my only option for now, assuming I can find one. I've had a few leads but nothing has paid off yet. 

[Stude Light]

What about a museum that has a Pontiac or Chevy that will never drive again? You would be surprised how many cars in museums fit that description. Give them a few bucks and swap out parts. You never know....

[chistech]

On 6/23/2023 at 10:57 AM, zdillinger said:

Well, the new axle angle fell through. Apparently the man that made them for the vendor has passed away and they are no longer available. So used will be my only option for now, assuming I can find one. I've had a few leads but nothing has paid off yet. 

Zach, I’ll ask over on the VCCA forums and let you know.

[chistech]

When I went to post on the VCCA I read your post. Chipper is a really good guy and it doesn’t surprise me that he offered to help. Chipper has helped me in the past and I’ve helped him. I posted tat a few of us have been offering you

advice in your restoration. 

[Dave39MD]

I thought Billy Possum/C P Automotive was making the early axles but could not find them on their site, http://www.billypossum.com/Catalog/Catalog.php.

 

Might be worth a phone call. Lot's of other good parts.

 

Dave

[zdillinger]

11 hours ago, chistech said:

When I went to post on the VCCA I read your post. Chipper is a really good guy and it doesn’t surprise me that he offered to help. Chipper has helped me in the past and I’ve helped him. I posted tat a few of us have been offering you

advice in your restoration. 

Thank you! I've sent Chipper an email but I know he's busy on the four cylinder tour. Hopefully he sees the email and we can work it out to have that tour participant from MI or IN bring it back this way.

[chistech]

I have a guy in WI that I'm helping with a 32 olds restoration. He's checking on a chevy axle he might have. I see that the 31 olds axle is 1" shorter. Will one work or does those numbers mean that the pontiac will work in the olds if it's shimmed and not the other way around?

[zdillinger]

17 minutes ago, chistech said:

I have a guy in WI that I'm helping with a 32 olds restoration. He's checking on a chevy axle he might have. I see that the 31 olds axle is 1" shorter. Will one work or does those numbers mean that the pontiac will work in the olds if it's shimmed and not the other way around?

Thanks! Re: Olds axle, I took it to mean you could shim the Pontiac axle to work in an Olds but not the other way around. 

[Axial_Flow]

@zdillinger  I tagged you in a post on FB, there is a guy who claims to have an axle shaft for a 1927 Chevrolet that should fit your car.

[zdillinger]

32 minutes ago, Axial_Flow said:

@zdillinger  I tagged you in a post on FB, there is a guy who claims to have an axle shaft for a 1927 Chevrolet that should fit your car.

Thank you, I'll check it out!

[ericmac]

Zach, as a fellow Model T and non T owner, here is case in point why the Ts and As are so popular.  We just don't have these kinds of problems with them. Conversely,  this is also what makes the non-Fords fun.

[Stude Light]

On 6/29/2023 at 10:13 PM, ericmac said:

Zach, as a fellow Model T and non T owner, here is case in point why the Ts and As are so popular.  We just don't have these kinds of problems with them. Conversely,  this is also what makes the non-Fords fun.

But the crankshafts in the Pontiacs don’t snap in two and break engine blocks like certain four letter brands. Pick your failure mode 😉

Edited July 1, 2023 by Stude Light (see edit history)

[ericmac]

24 minutes ago, Stude Light said:

But the crankshafts in the Pontiacs don’t snap in two and break engine blocks like certain four letter brands. Pick your failure mode 😉

Well...there's that! On the other hand most crank breaks I've heard of have been a product of operator error.  Cracked blocks? Ford error. 

[zdillinger]

The ol' Pontiac lives and moves once again! Thanks to some new friends in the Chevrolet community, I was able to find an axle that works (I also got a couple of spares just in case...). Got it installed and all is well once again. With the new clutch disc, etc., the car drives better than ever.

 

While waiting for the axles I installed a generic chrome headlight switch since the Pontiac OEM switch is broken/seized beyond repair. There was already a hole drilled in the dash that was perfect for the switch. I'll keep looking for a useable OEM switch but, in the mean time, this will do the job. I made no permanent modifications to my new wiring harness, so it can all be put back to stock if/when the part is found.

 

It's the same story with the OEM taillight. The lens is beyond repair and every socket needs to be replaced, so while I hunt for a better one this Model A unit is similar enough to serve. 

 

I installed a Gano filter as well. Currently running Evaporust in there as coolant and, as you can see, it's pretty brown so it's just about time to change it out. Expensive but effective.

 

Finally, I installed a battery cutoff switch on the floor just above the steering column. Out of the way of my feet but still easily reachable. 

 

I still need to finish the headlight and tail light wiring (and figure out how to hook up a stop light switch) and then I will get tags and insurance while finishing up the top and interior. My goal was to have this car ready for the R.E. Olds Museum show which is on July 29.... it should be close assuming I have enough time for a few shakedown cruises before jetting off on a 40 mile round trip in what would otherwise be an unproven car (which isn't my style).

 

Thanks, as always, for following along and to all of you who have offered advice and support. It is much appreciated.

 

 

Edited July 3, 2023 by zdillinger (see edit history)

[Matt Harwood]

Awesome! Glad you were able to find the parts and get things back together. That's amazing!

[Stude Light]

31 minutes ago, zdillinger said:

My goal was to have this car ready for the R.E. Olds Museum show which is on July 29.... it should be close assuming I have enough time for a few shakedown cruises before jetting off on a 40 mile round trip in what would otherwise be an unproven car (which isn't my style).

Excellent! I was pretty sure you would find another axle with the vast resources of this forum and other social media outlets. I will be looking for you at the show. I'll be one of the volunteers working the show so not sure if I'll bring something or not.

[95Cardinal]

Zach,

I just caught up on all the challenges and progress since last September.

Congratulations on all your achievements; you've come a long way and the car is sounding great!

Joe

[chistech]

Good to hear all went well. Some very good alternative fixes too. Keeping it going down the road while looking for specific items is the way to keep the fun going while keeping the frustration away. It is one of the best things about the restoration forums that some are willing to go above and beyond to help others. You found one of the best guys on the VCCA to help you out. I’m currently helping someone here who just had his starter fail and needs another quickly. It’s all about keeping these cars of ours on the road and if we can help, we will. Happy 4th!

[Mike "Hubbie" Stearns]

5 hours ago, chistech said:

Good to hear all went well. Some very good alternative fixes too. Keeping it going down the road while looking for specific items is the way to keep the fun going while keeping the frustration away. It is one of the best things about the restoration forums that some are willing to go above and beyond to help others. You found one of the best guys on the VCCA to help you out. I’m currently helping someone here who just had his starter fail and needs another quickly. It’s all about keeping these cars of ours on the road and if we can help, we will. Happy 4th!

Well said Ted. Mike

[zdillinger]

Yesterday was a productive day! Headlights are done and working. Tail light is done and working. Stop light and stop light switch are installed and working. This morning, the car is officially insured and I'll be stopping at the DMV shortly to get a plate. So we should be in business for a few legal trial runs.

[zdillinger]

Plate is affixed. I took off for a short ride, made it two miles and ran it out of gas. The car is officially mine now because I have done that on pretty much every old car "first drive". Even wrote a chapter about it in my third book. I blame the ADHD.

 

Wife April to the rescue with the gas can and all is well once again. Car ran strong while it still had gas in it that is...

Edited July 6, 2023 by zdillinger (see edit history)

[Dan Cluley]

I know it's not the right decade, but the "retro" license plate is a nice choice.

[zdillinger]

8 hours ago, Dan Cluley said:

I know it's not the right decade, but the "retro" license plate is a nice choice.

Thanks Dan! I put the retro plate on my oldies even though I detest winter and hate that the plate even says that word. See you at the Olds show in a couple weeks?

[Dan Cluley]

It is on the calendar, so hopefully. 

[chistech]

13 hours ago, zdillinger said:

Plate is affixed. I took off for a short ride, made it two miles and ran it out of gas. The car is officially mine now because I have done that on pretty much every old car "first drive". Even wrote a chapter about it in my third book. I blame the ADHD.

 

Wife April to the rescue with the gas can and all is well once again. Car ran strong while it still had gas in it that is...

Love the BnW photo!

[zdillinger]

I've put about 20 miles on the car, in ever-expanding circles on the country roads around my house. The gearbox is a bit noisy but everything is running strong (knock on wood). Oil pressure shows middle of the gauge (about 15) when hot. No boil overs thus far. Brakes grab strong and stop the car pretty darn well. Overall, I am cautiously optimistic.

Edited July 12, 2023 by zdillinger (see edit history)

[EmTee]

That's great to hear -- keep it up! 

[Stude Light]

Hey Zack,

Did I miss you at the Car Capital Auto Show? I can’t believe I wouldn’t have spotted your car.

Scott

[zdillinger]

On 7/30/2023 at 8:26 AM, Stude Light said:

Hey Zack,

Did I miss you at the Car Capital Auto Show? I can’t believe I wouldn’t have spotted your car.

Scott

No, you didn't miss me. Some family stuff came up and I wasn't able to be there. That's the first Museum show I've missed in a long time and I was pretty bummed but nothing I could do about it.

[Stude Light]

7 hours ago, zdillinger said:

No, you didn't miss me. Some family stuff came up and I wasn't able to be there. That's the first Museum show I've missed in a long time and I was pretty bummed but nothing I could do about it.

Family comes first! See you at OCF or maybe the Orphan Car Show?

Edited August 1, 2023 by Stude Light (see edit history)

[zdillinger]

I've been enjoying the car more and more, including an inaugural trip to the gas station. It is behaving quite nicely, so I figured I'd jump to some more of the "nice to have done" projects. To that end, I've started installing the top.

 

I first put tar paper down over the wood bows to prevent the chicken wire from squeaking. The wire was then stretched taut and stapled into the framing.

 

After that, I put a layer of 1/4" closed cell upholstery foam from Sail Rite. The only tricky part here was getting the front corners to lay down so that the cover vinyl would be nice and smooth. A little judicious trimming with an utility knife and mission accomplished.

 

Next goes the vinyl. The typical "cobra" grain top material is only available in 64 1/2" width, as far as I can tell, and that wouldn't leave me with much margin for error. Instead I chose a more subdued grain vinyl, also from Sail Rite, that was available in 77" width. It will leave me with more waste but it's worth it for my peace of mind. The install, so far, is going well.

 

I'll report back with more photos when the top is done, sealed, and the trim has been installed. I will be reusing the original gutters but will have to make something go on the front and possibly the rear (I may be able to save the original aluminum trim but I'm not sure yet). 

[chistech]

Zach, not sure if you’re using them but they make SS staples. I use them exclusively on all my roof work. Steel staples are not as robust as the tacks originally used and will rust out fairly quickly. There is an aluminum molding made for roofs and it’s available from Bobs Automobilia or bobs Buick. Here’s a thread on a 30 chevy I did that shows may techniques and those aluminum moldings. Maybe it will help.

 

 

[zdillinger]

15 hours ago, chistech said:

Zach, not sure if you’re using them but they make SS staples. I use them exclusively on all my roof work. Steel staples are not as robust as the tacks originally used and will rust out fairly quickly. There is an aluminum molding made for roofs and it’s available from Bobs Automobilia or bobs Buick. Here’s a thread on a 30 chevy I did that shows may techniques and those aluminum moldings. Maybe it will help.

 

 

I did use stainless steel staples on the chicken wire and the foam. For the top I used galvanized tacks, driven about halfway in so that I can easily rework any wrinkles, etc. Thanks for the tip on the aluminum roof moldings!

[28pontiac]

Zach,

 

Nice story thus far, and it is great that you have been able to do so much.  That is alot of woodwork to do, more than I could ever accomplish.  A while back you were thinking on a color for a future paint job.  While you could paint it any color, if you are interested in making it look reasonably original, I have some info for you.

 

I have copies of the original paperwork provided to the government for vehicle certification concerning the 1928 Pontiac's.  Called the AMA Specification sheets, these cover all the technical features of a car, but also the initial production models and colors.  With that in mind, below is the outlined 1928 4 door blue colors (not the Landau which offered 2 other colors).  The date on these is Dec of 1927.  The paint codes shown are factory numbers, and I do not have any cross reference to modern colors.

 

Main Body- Paquot Blue #2441205.   This is a dark blue, a bit brighter than the Model A dark blue. 

Upper Body above beltline-  Cayuge Blue #2441477.  Dark black/blue (almost black).  Most people just use black to match top.

Window Reveals (around window)-  Samoset Blue #2443147.  A light blue, slightly darker than sky blue.

Fenders, Headlight bar, and raised body side moldings around car-  BLACK.

Bodyside Molding pinstriping-  Tacoma Cream  (yellowish cream).

Dash-  Black main front area (called Monogram Panel) with Paquot Blue outer (top, edges,lower). I polish the screws for a great look.

Wheels- Dark blue with Tacoma Cream center accents.  Natural wood without paint and with black spoke accents were a no cost option.

Interior- Grey cloth.

 

Hope this helps a little.

 

Bill

 

Also, if you look on EBAY under 1928 Pontiac collectibles, you will usually find the large Saturday Evening Post full color adds from 1928.  There are a couple with the 4-door (which is blue).  Pontiac offered one color on each on Coupe, Sedan, Roadster and Touring.  Two options on Landau.  Great artwork in these adds.

Edited February 10 by 28pontiac (see edit history)