60s GM Fan Posted December 11, 2021 Share Posted December 11, 2021 (edited) Okay for those of us who have never operated one of these before how does the late 60s 8 track players work? Just push a tape in and it plays? How do you stop it? Does the radio have to be on or is it a separate unit? Edited December 11, 2021 by 60s Buick Fan (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTX5467 Posted December 11, 2021 Share Posted December 11, 2021 Radio on, insert tape, radio is silenced, tape plays. Volume, tone, and balance work with the tape as they do with the radio itself. The 8-track tape is an endless loop, keeps playing unit the tape cartridge is removed from the player. Radio resumes. Sometimes, the lube on the tape will degrade and the tape binds up and gets pulled out of the cartridge and somewhat wrapped around the spindle in the player. Which generated the 8-track cartridges laying in the road with most of the tape pulled out of the cartridge. Seems like tape speed for the 8-tracks was 3.75 inches/second. This gave them pretty decent sound quality and a higher top-end frequency response. Add in the fact that most Stereo records and tapes had a bit exaggerated Stereo separation designed-in and it made things sound close to what you might hear with a home unit, back then. Enjoy! NTX5467 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketraider Posted December 11, 2021 Share Posted December 11, 2021 49 minutes ago, NTX5467 said: Sometimes, the lube on the tape will degrade and the tape binds up and gets pulled out of the cartridge and somewhat wrapped around the spindle in the player. Which generated the 8-track cartridges laying in the road with most of the tape pulled out of the cartridge. Enjoy! NTX5467 😄😆🤣 Guilty as charged! These units need to be cleaned and demagnetized every so often too. There used to be 8-track cleaning cartridges for this. Since doubtful there are any of those around, a long Q-tip wetted with plain old rubbing alcohol will clean the graphite tape lube off the tape head and tape drive spindle. That will restore what high frequencies 8-tracks had, and reduce "warbling" caused by the tape slipping on the drive spindle. Hold the tape door open and you can access these parts. If the Q-tip turns brown, it's removing graphite flakes and whatever else has accumulated. If the sound is very muffled and cleaning the head doesn't help, time to demagnetize. I haven't seen a tape head demagnetizer in over 25 years either. You will learn the matchbook trick too. If the tape slips or otherwise acts funny, wedge a matchbook under either the top or bottom of the tape cartridge and it just might correct it. AXS-TV is showing "Top Ten Songs of 1975". Timely topic! KISS "Rock and Roll All Night" and Foghat "Slow Ride" were often blasting out of my 8-track player! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GARY F Posted December 11, 2021 Share Posted December 11, 2021 I used to play tapes in my 72 Electra when I had it. I wish I still did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60s GM Fan Posted December 12, 2021 Author Share Posted December 12, 2021 Good just bought David Bowie and AC/DC for a test run! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M1842 Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 There is usually and eject button. If you just pull the tape you risk pulling the tape out of the cartridge. There were also demagnitizing probes for use with reel to reel tape players that will work in an 8 track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTX5467 Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 In about 1980, they ordered me a loaded Silverado 5.7L DIesel at work. Had the factory AM/FM/8-Track stereo. I found a bunck of old tapes at a local Half-Price Books for about $1.00 each in a Grab Bag Box. Found several of the "Cruising 196_" tapes! Still have them somewhere. Neat stuff in an age of cassettes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
37_Roadmaster_C Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 A quick warning from someone who worked on many commercial equivalent of the 8 track players in broadcast... Either find an old time repair shop or gently open the player up. What you need to do is clean and lube the pinch roller assembly. This is the rubber roller that is pulled up to pinch the tape to the capstan to play. This is not a difficult process. The roller needs to be removed. Gently lift it up and there will be a "C" clip on the shaft holding the roller. Remove it and the roller slips off. Now clean the roller, inside and out, the shaft , the heads and tape guides with alcohol and a Qtip and clean Cotton cloth. It is best to use the purest alcohol you can find. 99% is available on the shelf of any drug store in the US. While it is apart you might as well try to find a new pinch roller. They are rubber and get hard and cause problems... think tape on the road problems. As for lube, the best commonly available is 3 in 1 oil or better yet would be sewing machine oil. Use VERY little on all moving points. Remember, VERY LITTLE. You do not want it getting on the tapes or slinging around. Next is demagnetizing the heads. Google it and you will find methods... Good luck and happy Rocking Out!!! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTX5467 Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 As with cars, the BELT is another key part, too! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketraider Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 8-track pinch rollers are in the tape cartridge itself, unlike reel-to-reel and cassette where it's on the tape machine. Still good to clean them. Some had rubber pinch rollers, others hard plastic. Diagram shows the endless loop tape path. Drive spindle and pinch roller pulled the tape from the center of the hub, across the playback head and then wound it to the outer edge of the hub. The graphite was needed to ensure the tape would pull from the hub smoothly. There was a metal foil splice strip that triggered a solenoid that moved the player's tape head so it would pick up the next program. The foam pad behind the tape kept it in contact with the tape head. Looking at it, it's amazing it worked as well as it did. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfloro Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 (edited) Although not widely adopted, a 4 track tape cartridge system did exist for mobile use prior to the 8 track system. It was called "Stereo-Pak". With 4 track, the "endless loop" cartridge did not contain it's own "pinch roller". The roller was part of the player (or recorder). It swung up from the machine's chassis through a hole in the bottom of the cartridge. The roller then pushed the tape against the capstan. A friend had a recorder/player in the later '60s and I got to see it in operation. This article explained it nicely: https://www.hagerty.com/media/automotive-history/obsolete-car-audio-part-3/ Paul Edited December 12, 2021 by pfloro (see edit history) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketraider Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 Paul, was that the Muntz or Learjet design? I know both were involved in "mobile music" for lack of a better description. *edit* shoulda read the Hagerty link first ☺️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
37_Roadmaster_C Posted December 13, 2021 Share Posted December 13, 2021 (edited) 11 hours ago, rocketraider said: 8-track pinch rollers are in the tape cartridge itself, unlike reel-to-reel and cassette where it's on the tape machine. Still good to clean them. Oops, I stand corrected. I never paid any attention to 8 track players. The "Cart decks" I am familiar with had the pinch rollers on a moving arm that swung the roller into position when the cart played. I knew they were similar but I digress... In any case, anything rubber most likely needs replaced. Clean and lube the mechanical parts, just be light on the lube. Just a note. After reading Pauls post about 4 track systems, I thought I would just add a detail about the broadcast cart systems. They were actually 3 track. The top two tracks were left and right audio channels. The third track was the "Cue" track. The cue track was used to "control" various functions within the studio. The reason it is called a "Cue" track is that its primary purpose was to stop the player when the tape reached the beginning of the recorded audio or to "Cue the tape" for the next play. Edited December 13, 2021 by 37_Roadmaster_C add information (see edit history) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank DuVal Posted December 13, 2021 Share Posted December 13, 2021 8 hours ago, rocketraider said: was that the Muntz or Learjet design? Here's some facts. Lear (Bill Lear) actually invented stuff. Muntz (Earl Madman Muntz) found the cheapest way to build it!🤣 I remember "Learjet 4 track" display at the Delco radio rep/repair shop in Richmond. A friend bought a Learradio at an antique radio swap fest. Yep, Bill Lear built AM radios before airplanes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60s GM Fan Posted December 13, 2021 Author Share Posted December 13, 2021 My unit is fully restored and I've inspected the interior components. I'll be receiving my 8 Track tapes here in the next few days and I'll post a video once I test it out. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfloro Posted December 13, 2021 Share Posted December 13, 2021 (edited) 15 hours ago, 37_Roadmaster_C said: They were actually 3 track. The top two tracks were left and right audio channels. The third track was the "Cue" track. The cue track was used to "control" various functions within the studio. The reason it is called a "Cue" track is that its primary purpose was to stop the player when the tape reached the beginning of the recorded audio or to "Cue the tape" for the next play. Thanks for educating me about the "cue" track. I suspected that there must have been a way to 'cue up" the cart's audio material. Every second is important regardless of what you're broadcasting...! Paul Edited December 13, 2021 by pfloro (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jolly_John Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 (edited) Ah, Robin and Paul, you're bringing back many fond memories of my days in Top 40 radio in the 1960's. Don't forget the splice in the tape that created the endless loop. I recall recording commercial "spots' in the station production room direct to tape carts. I'd do a playback check of my work, and be very disappointed part way through the 30 second commercial. You could sometimes hear a blip or a warble in the voice and music, as the splicing tape area passed over the playback head. Those of us DJ's who were perfectionists would have to re-record the commercial. It didn't take long to learn to manually advance the tape just past the splice, and then begin recording. That way, the splice would wind up in the approximately 10 seconds of blank tape contained on these 40 second broadcast cartridges. A little later, someone got smart and invented a little tabletop machine that would automatically find the splice in the cart, and stop once it ran past the sensor. Sure saved a lot of time. Edited December 15, 2021 by Jolly_John (see edit history) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTX5467 Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 Might the tape splice be on the section that tells the unit to change tracks? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketraider Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
37_Roadmaster_C Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 @Jolly_John, Do you remember the "Cartosaurus"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60s GM Fan Posted December 15, 2021 Author Share Posted December 15, 2021 First 8 track tape arrives today....AC/DC. For those about to rock...we salute you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 (edited) Before you do ANYTHING take the cover off of the player and look at the belt. They turn to goo that is almost impossible to remove. I don't even know how to remove it. If that happened, you definitely don't want to fire up the motor and spread that around. Just take the covers off and look. On all 8 tracks, the belt is out front and obvious. It will be looped around the motor and a big flywheel. To your original question, if the player is combined with a radio, you might need the power on. I don't remember. Otherwise just shove the tape in there. There is no switch. If there is an eject button use it, but there probably isn't. Just pull the tape out until it is past the click to stop. Edited December 15, 2021 by Bloo (see edit history) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketraider Posted December 15, 2021 Share Posted December 15, 2021 8 hours ago, 60s Buick Fan said: First 8 track tape arrives today....AC/DC. For those about to rock...we salute you! Guess this could be analogous to resurrecting our old cars... AC⚡DC actually didn't sound bad thru a Craig Powerplay FM-8 track and speakers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60s GM Fan Posted December 16, 2021 Author Share Posted December 16, 2021 Welp no dice. Plug the tape in. Nothing. Hit the program button...fuse blows. Any ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTX5467 Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 Be gentle with those old, dried-out paper, speakers . . . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60s GM Fan Posted December 16, 2021 Author Share Posted December 16, 2021 I dont even get a pilot light on. Everything electronic is either new or in excellent shape. I've removed the glove box and everything as far as I can tell is plugged in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60s GM Fan Posted December 16, 2021 Author Share Posted December 16, 2021 Okay went outside to mess with my setup. Everything looks factory and unmodified. You turn the radio on and it lights up. Pop in the tape...radio turns off but 8 track fails to do anything. Pull tape out radio light comes back on. I'm slumped here fellas.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jolly_John Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 (edited) Not intending to be a smart a--, Tim. But, have you tried more than one tape? Sometimes used 8-track tapes have issues, and won't advance. Also, when you're in radio mode, are you getting audio (sound from stations)? Good luck! John Edited December 16, 2021 by Jolly_John (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60s GM Fan Posted December 16, 2021 Author Share Posted December 16, 2021 Well I have other tapes in route so I'll give those a try. I don't have a working antenna (not even plugged into the jack lead in the trunk) so I don't get sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmTee Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 Try this one! 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfloro Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 (edited) 15 hours ago, 60s Buick Fan said: You turn the radio on and it lights up. Pop in the tape...radio turns off but 8 track fails to do anything. Pull tape out radio light comes back on. I'm slumped here fellas.... The best way to troubleshoot this unit is to remove it from the dash, get it on your work bench, and open it up. Rig up a 12V DC source to power it. NOTE: You don't need to have the speakers connected but be sure to have the volume control set to minimum. Some amplifier circuits need a load (speakers) to be present to prevent the output transistors from "blowing up" when sound is being amplified. Regarding the unit not functioning when you insert a tape: there is most likely a DPDT (Double Pole / Double Throw) microswitch which operates when the tape is seated. It turns off the radio tuner but keeps the amplifier on, starts the drive motor, and powers the track change circuit for the tape deck. I would locate this switch and operate it manually without a tape inserted. If pressing the track change button is blowing the fuse, there is probably a dead short in the wiring to the solenoid circuit which advances the play head to the next track position. I doubt the solenoid has shorted internally... I worked on a few of these units decades ago. They are not very complicated mechanically or electrically... Please keep up posted. Paul Edited December 16, 2021 by pfloro (see edit history) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketraider Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 5 hours ago, EmTee said: Try this one! Wore out two of them! Well, track 4 anyway... This one was great too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60s GM Fan Posted December 17, 2021 Author Share Posted December 17, 2021 New tape did nothing. Hitting the switch inside the unit does nothing. Radio still lights up but there's nothing else that happens. Any clues? Both units shot? They look practically new... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jolly_John Posted December 17, 2021 Share Posted December 17, 2021 (edited) Tim, can you tell if the tape is moving in "play" mode, after you insert it into the player? You'll have to listen for the mechanical movement of the tape moving, since you aren't getting any sound through the amplifier circuit. If you're not hearing any physical movement of the tape, you'll need to dig into the player, as previously suggested. However, if the tape is actually moving, I'd then go to the radio itself. As Paul has noted, the tape player utilizes the audio amplifier circuits of the radio. So, you'll want to make sure the radio itself is fully functional. That means you'll need to find an antenna to plug into the radio. Maybe you've got an old car buddy who will lend you a used one, if you don't have one laying around. Unlike some of the old home console and tabletop radios, a car radio won't give you squat for sound (station reception) without an antenna plugged in. This is pretty basic stuff, Tim, and you can do these tests without any knowledge of electronics. Give it a shot! John Edited December 17, 2021 by Jolly_John (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
37_Roadmaster_C Posted December 17, 2021 Share Posted December 17, 2021 The first thing to do now is confirm that the radio is working. What Jolly_John said is also a very valid thing to confirm the tape is actually moving. In any case the whole system needs to work properly or you have a band aid box at best. Hook up an antenna. The antenna for an AM/FM radio can be a simple piece of wire a few feet long attached to the cable in the trunk. Even without an antenna if you turn the volume up you should hear some noise from the speakers. If there is no sound/noise there is a problem with either the radio or the speaker or the wiring. This would be your first thing to fix. I am assuming this radio is for your 67 Wildcat. If it is there is a little troubleshooting information in the chassis service manual. A copy is available online at Team Buick. The only really useful thing mentioned is to listen for a "Thump" from the speakers when the radio is turned on. If no thump suspect the fuse first then the speakers and wiring. You mentioned a light working so the fuse is fine. move forward one step at a time. Basics first and ASSUME NOTHING!!! Good Luck!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTX5467 Posted December 18, 2021 Share Posted December 18, 2021 (edited) The radio is "on", to listen to AM, etc., as normal. Inserting the tape changes the "source" to the tape unit, so the tape unit turns on and starts to play the inserted tape. Removing the take (either by just pulling it out or using the "Eject" push button to do so) turns the tape unit "off" and changes the "source" back to the radio. DO clean the tape drive spindle with rubbing alcohol and also the rubber wheel in the tape cartridge, to remove any accumulated/latent oils from them. A good "traction" between those two items is important. That whole operation is pretty simple to troubleshoot and make work, by observation. Probably might be some YouTube videos on servicing those 8-track units? Or even some "factory information" at www.wildaboutcarsonline;com? Enjoy! NTX5467 Edited December 18, 2021 by NTX5467 (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60s GM Fan Posted December 20, 2021 Author Share Posted December 20, 2021 Well I purchased the user manual for the unit on ebay but it wasn't much help. The unit is dead and I think the power module inside the unit is dead. I'm going to refurbish it and then switch out my AM radio for a AM/FM that I just purchased on ebay as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD1956 Posted December 20, 2021 Share Posted December 20, 2021 6 minutes ago, 60s Buick Fan said: Well I purchased the user manual for the unit on ebay but it wasn't much help. The unit is dead and I think the power module inside the unit is dead. I'm going to refurbish it and then switch out my AM radio for a AM/FM that I just purchased on ebay as well. Try several tapes if you already haven't. My recollection is with use the may get tighter on their spindel and eventually cease to turn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocketraider Posted December 20, 2021 Share Posted December 20, 2021 On 12/13/2021 at 10:34 AM, 60s Buick Fan said: My unit is fully restored and I've inspected the interior components. I'll be receiving my 8 Track tapes here in the next few days and I'll post a video once I test it out. 7 minutes ago, 60s Buick Fan said: Well I purchased the user manual for the unit on ebay but it wasn't much help. The unit is dead and I think the power module inside the unit is dead. I'm going to refurbish it and then switch out my AM radio for a AM/FM that I just purchased on ebay as well. Thought this thing was ready to go? Did it come with the Wildcat or did you purchase it for the car? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60s GM Fan Posted December 20, 2021 Author Share Posted December 20, 2021 Its very clean so I'm surprised that the unit doesn't even power up. Its a factory accessory that came with the car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now