EmTee Posted April 28, 2022 Share Posted April 28, 2022 2 hours ago, BobinVirginia said: I enjoy the tuning comments and information. x2! This is a great discussion (probably warrants its own thread). FYI, my '38 Century has one of those 'Spark-O-Liner' gadgets installed in its distributor. It would backfire (report through the tailpipe) most every time I abruptly lifted off the gas at greater than ~45 mph. I pulled the distributor and disassembled and cleaned everything (including centrifugal advance). I discovered the vacuum advance diaphragm was shot so I bought a reconditioned one from Bob's. I also replaced the primary wire to the points and ground lead (also from Bob's). The car no longer backfires, though I could never really be 100% certain that the distributor R&R fixed it or maybe it was something else (sticky valve?). Currently I have my timing set IAW the book, as it was advanced when I got the car and it labored to start (hot or cold). The car seems to run a little better every time I drive it, so I'm cautiously optimistic that I'm on the right track. That said, the comments from Grimy and Ed above make it clear to me that I still have some work to do... 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konrad Posted April 29, 2022 Share Posted April 29, 2022 (edited) On 4/27/2022 at 8:27 AM, edinmass said: ... With this Buick engine, just the fact of a bent push rod makes me draw certain conclusions but without standing there, they are hard to quantify. We have pulled engines all the way down several times on a Pierce eight because we couldn't figure out why we were down on power. That doesn't go over well with paying customers........fortunately in this case it was my own car. These old cars are WORK, and nothing is easy on them. If someone says they are easy, they don't know what they are talking about. Today time is our most valuable commodity but almost no one wants to put it into making a car run, drive, stop, and shift correctly. 98 percent of the cars I drive have slight to moderate clutch chatter........and a well know restoration shop said to me they all do that. Nope.......I fixed it first try, because I have done similar clutches fifty times and worked through all the issues.........today there are very, very few mechanics that have 5000 hours in a shop spinning wrenches. There is no substitution for time in the garage, and that is causing 80 percent of the problems on early cars. The other 20 percent is "it's just an old car and that's how they are. When I had a chassis dyne, we tuned all the cars on it. While it is gone now, the skill set that was learned there carries over and we seem to do ok now without it. It was a valuable tool in learning how to get cars to run properly. It was brought to my attention that the push rod never bent. (I've removed that ref. in yesterday's 9:07 post. In the March 28th post I did accurately state that we did not bend a push rod) So, we didn't have the classic late opening early closing valve one would expect with a newly bent push rod. The failure mode was that the adjuster was perched on the edge of the push rod bucket. When the coil bound the bucket split allowing the push rod to escape and bind against the rocker and tower. This bind allowed the exhaust valve to stay open with the subsequent flame path through the carbs. 5K hour mechanics are hard to find? That's only 2.5 man years on the job. Edited May 14, 2022 by Konrad (see edit history) 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konrad Posted April 29, 2022 Share Posted April 29, 2022 6 hours ago, EmTee said: x2! This is a great discussion (probably warrants its own thread). FYI, my '38 Century has one of those 'Spark-O-Liner' gadgets installed in its distributor. It would backfire (report through the tailpipe) most every time I abruptly lifted off the gas at greater than ~45 mph. I pulled the distributor and disassembled and cleaned everything (including centrifugal advance). I discovered the vacuum advance diaphragm was shot so I bought a reconditioned one from Bob's. I also replaced the primary wire to the points and ground lead (also from Bob's). The car no longer backfires, though I could never really be 100% certain that the distributor R&R fixed it or maybe it was something else (sticky valve?). Currently I have my timing set IAW the book, as it was advanced when I got the car and it labored to start (hot or cold). The car seems to run a little better every time I drive it, so I'm cautiously optimistic that I'm on the right track. That said, the comments from Grimy and Ed above make it clear to me that I still have some work to do... That was also my concern with the lifter issue early on. But I'm happy to report the lifter and valve are following the cam profile just fine! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil morse Posted April 29, 2022 Author Share Posted April 29, 2022 Coming Attractions 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konrad Posted April 29, 2022 Share Posted April 29, 2022 (edited) I thought this project was on hold pending approval from SWMBO. Love the OEM Y and flex joint. Are you going to do the work? Or are you going to take her to a shop to deal with the inevitable adjustment (hint)? Edited April 29, 2022 by Konrad (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil morse Posted April 29, 2022 Author Share Posted April 29, 2022 Installation will be handled by a shop in @Grimy's neighborhood -- no need for your hint! I figured that cutting off the old rusty (and welded) pipes and installing this new Waldron system was best left to the professionals, and I've been quoted a very reasonable price. Konrad mentions the OEM Y-pipe. When he saw the rigid pipe on my car (with the broken weld and leak in the middle of the "Y"), he immediately commented on what a poor design it was because the weld would inevitably fail due to expansion. All I could do was shrug my shoulders as to why the Buick engineers would have made such a mistake. When I got the new system from Waldron's, I was happy to see that the Y-pipe was set up properly with an expansion joint. It was only then that I looked at the shop manual for the first time and saw that this, of course, was the original design and that someone had installed a bogus substitute on my car at some earlier point in its 81-year-old history. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonMicheletti Posted April 29, 2022 Share Posted April 29, 2022 I'd like to comment on the valve adjustment "accuracy". I have yet to see an older overhead valve engine, with rocker arms, that did not have the impression of the valve stem worn into the tip of the rocker some. As a matter of fact I measured that "impression" on Neils rockers. Some of the impressions were as deep as .003". So in adjusting the valves you are kidding yourselves in talking +/-.001", or so, in adjusting valve clearance. A feeler will bridge the impression in the rocker and give you a false reading. Unless, of course, you have new or rebuilt rockers that have no impression. The Buick manual warns against grinding to remove the impression because you could break thought the case hardening of the surface. If there is good news, the impression will insure that your valves are loose and will not be burned due to a tight adjustment. I knew of guys who just adjusted with a feeler, listened, and tightemed until the probable clicking ceased. I have never done that. A possible alternative would be to use a dial indicator to set clearance. Enging stopped of course. I have never bothered to do that on a Buick. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Konrad Posted April 30, 2022 Share Posted April 30, 2022 (edited) Ah, Metrology. If using the dial indicator make sure it is tangent to the rocker arc. You want to avoid as much cosine error as possible. I always tried to leave a witness mark on the rockers I reworked, or any surface that would not be built back up. This was to show that the minimum of material was removed. If the wear had passed through the case hardening it was done in service, not on my grinder. It is a good idea to talk to your machinist and ask that he try to leave a witness marks. Also ask him to hit the MMC (Most Material Condition). Most machinists try to hit the mean tolerance. These two requests will tell him, he is dealing with a guy that is more than your average customer. Wiseman, Neil. I'm sure I'm just showing my prejudice against exhaust systems.😖 As you might recall the two areas I hate to work on, when working on cars, is under the dash work and exhaust systems. It won't be long before this is a real nice daily driver! Edited April 30, 2022 by Konrad (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmTee Posted April 30, 2022 Share Posted April 30, 2022 21 hours ago, DonMicheletti said: A feeler will bridge the impression in the rocker and give you a false reading. Good point. I will look closely at the rocker/valve interface when I make my next adjustment. I do have another set of narrow feeler gauges that I use for setting breaker points. I may measure any that seem to have noticeable wear with both feeler sets just to get a sense of the difference. As you say, at least the error will be to the 'loose' side, so a little more noise, but no burned valves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonMicheletti Posted April 30, 2022 Share Posted April 30, 2022 None of this is rocket science. Mechanics have ignored the issue of the impression in the rocker arm and adjustment forever and the engines still work OK. These engines do not need to be tuned to the "n"th degree. You just do the best you can within reason. 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil morse Posted May 15, 2022 Author Share Posted May 15, 2022 Exhausting Day Konrad and I took my car over to Hayward yesterday to the shop recommended by George (Grimy). They did a great job of installing the new Waldron system, and only charged me $300! I am very pleased with both Waldron and the shop (Downtown Muffler in Hayward). I would recommend Downtown to anyone seeking help with muffler/exhaust issues. Here's a before/after sequence showing the old and the new Y-pipe. (I have no other photos to share -- it occurred to me later that I should have taken some shots of the exhaust when the car was still up on the lift.) In any event, the car sounds great, runs great, and smells much better! 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil morse Posted May 15, 2022 Author Share Posted May 15, 2022 Friendship Day One of my favorite old car events of the year was held today in Redwood City (after being cancelled for the past two years). This is an informal meet where people are invited to bring all kinds of cars, no judging, just tire kicking and enjoying our hobby. Here are some random pics of what I saw. Notable were the Rambler Marlin ('65?), outstanding '17 Auburn (with 36" wheels), and lovely '31 Chrysler 3-window coupe. 9 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgreen Posted May 19, 2022 Share Posted May 19, 2022 Oh, and a nice looking 41 Buick! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil morse Posted July 26, 2022 Author Share Posted July 26, 2022 New PCV pipe Not much going on here, but I did take care of getting a proper PCV pipe on my car instead of the piece of rubber hose that a previous owner had substituted. This is what I had when I got the car: It bothered me for two reasons: (1) it didn't look right, and (2) the hose tended to get compressed (and fouled with sludge) to the point that it really wasn't doing its job. Thanks to a great suggestion from @Matt Harwood, and help from Don Micheletti, we fabricated a pipe from a conduit elbow. Don made ferrules and soldered them onto the pipe to keep it in place. Some paint and the grommets I got from Bob's, and this is how it looks. Not a huge deal, but a definite improvement. 9 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmTee Posted July 26, 2022 Share Posted July 26, 2022 Looks great! Did you have to bend the conduit or did you start with a stock 90* elbow? Is it 1/2" conduit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil morse Posted July 26, 2022 Author Share Posted July 26, 2022 (edited) 3 hours ago, EmTee said: Looks great! Did you have to bend the conduit or did you start with a stock 90* elbow? Is it 1/2" conduit? Thank you. We used a standard 3/4" 90 degree elbow. The OD of the 3/4" is a bit too big for the grommets, but it just squeezes in. The 1/2" is too small. Edited July 26, 2022 by neil morse (see edit history) 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonMicheletti Posted July 26, 2022 Share Posted July 26, 2022 Neils elbow was rigid conduit. I cut the threads off before we started and established the correct length. The other elbow, that was too small, was thin wall conduit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
valk Posted July 26, 2022 Share Posted July 26, 2022 Nice improvement Neil. It’s the details that count. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NailheadBob Posted July 26, 2022 Share Posted July 26, 2022 Great suggestion from Matt Harwood. Neil and Don, job well done, looks very nice, thanks for sharing to us forum members. Bob 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmTee Posted July 27, 2022 Share Posted July 27, 2022 With all of the work done on Neil's car, I think Don should consider taking a couple of weeks for vacation. I hear Central New York is very nice this time of year... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonMicheletti Posted July 27, 2022 Share Posted July 27, 2022 EmTee, Doing this stuff is a vacation for me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmTee Posted July 28, 2022 Share Posted July 28, 2022 9 hours ago, DonMicheletti said: Doing this stuff is a vacation for me. Say no more. My 'friend' has several 'vacation' activity suggestions that would provide an enjoyable and relaxing vacation experience for you... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted August 24, 2022 Share Posted August 24, 2022 Is this your car, Neil? These photos were swiped from Facebook. https://www.facebook.com/groups/1759877887671226/?hoisted_section_header_type=recently_seen&multi_permalinks=3346502082342124 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil morse Posted August 24, 2022 Author Share Posted August 24, 2022 1 hour ago, Matt Harwood said: Is this your car, Neil? These photos were swiped from Facebook. Wow, you've got a good eye, Matt! Yes, someone snagged those shots of my car at a "Cars and Coffee" event out at Ocean Beach on Sunday. Thanks for posting them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NailheadBob Posted August 24, 2022 Share Posted August 24, 2022 (edited) 18 hours ago, neil morse said: Wow, you've got a good eye, Matt! Yes, someone snagged those shots of my car at a "Cars and Coffee" event out at Ocean Beach on Sunday. Thanks for posting them. Neil, you have a great looking car, I am a big fan of all of your posting of your car, and especially interested in your transmission repair with "Super Don Micheletti" great job. Good friend of mine in our local BCA club in Chicagoland has an all original 1941 Super, dark green and gorgeous car, this photo of his car spot U1, from the BCA National in Lisle, IL. June 2022. Bob EDIT: I found new tail lamp lenses for him. Edited August 25, 2022 by NailheadBob Add photo (see edit history) 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil morse Posted August 24, 2022 Author Share Posted August 24, 2022 Thank you, Bob! That's a great new moniker for Don! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonMicheletti Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 You guys are going to give me a big head! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmTee Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 Time for a new hat! 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD1956 Posted August 25, 2022 Share Posted August 25, 2022 Super Don! I like it! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil morse Posted September 17, 2022 Author Share Posted September 17, 2022 Neighborhood Visit I had a chance today to visit with my neighbor Thom ( @Shootey ) and get a look at his "new-to-him" '41 Special woody. What a lovely car! It's not roadworthy right now because Thom is replacing a broken window in the left rear door, but I'm looking forward to the day when we can have a proper photo session with our two cars together. I think we will spin some heads when we drive down 24th Street -- our little neighborhood's main street. Here's a preview of what Thom's car looks like. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmTee Posted September 18, 2022 Share Posted September 18, 2022 Wow - that's a nice looking Woody! 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil morse Posted October 9, 2022 Author Share Posted October 9, 2022 Upscale Cars and Coffee I attended a great gathering yesterday. It was organized by the local CCCA chapter so the "heavy hitting" true classics dominated, but the invitation was extended to all AACA members as well, so I was able to attend with my Super. There were multiple Pierces and Packards, with some Cadillacs and a beautiful Rolls thrown in. ( @Grimy was in attendance, but did not bring a car, despite the prevalence of Pierces.) Here are some pics. '24 Pierce '26 Rolls Stunning Le Baron-bodied '33 Pierce convertible sedan -- this car had just won Best in Show two weeks ago at the Ironstone Concours. '38 Cadillac V-16 convertible sedan Packard dual cowl phaeton (not sure what year) 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil morse Posted October 9, 2022 Author Share Posted October 9, 2022 More photos from the event. '41 Cadillac convertible '40 Lincoln Zephyr convertible Zephyr dash Rolls wheel Rolls rear compartment (you gotta love this!) '33 Pierce V-12 The lone Buick in attendance -- striving to look her best! 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
usnavystgc Posted October 11, 2022 Share Posted October 11, 2022 Your Buick looks awesome. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil morse Posted October 11, 2022 Author Share Posted October 11, 2022 55 minutes ago, usnavystgc said: Your Buick looks awesome. Thanks, Phil. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil morse Posted March 29, 2023 Author Share Posted March 29, 2023 (edited) Plaid Tour 2023 Last Sunday was the 20th annual Plaid Tour in honor of Marshall Mathews, a fund raising event for ALS research. We have had so many severe rain and wind storms that several roads were blocked and attendance was down. Here are a few pics (I was there with my Super, but I totally forgot to take a pic of my own car). There were only a few pre-war cars, but the highlight for me was the beautiful unrestored Caddy V-16 limousine. Edited March 29, 2023 by neil morse (see edit history) 12 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil morse Posted May 27, 2023 Author Share Posted May 27, 2023 Friendship Day 2023 An indication of how quiet this thread has been -- it was already time for Friendship Day again and I've hardly posted anything since the last one! This year's meet was great as usual -- really my favorite old car event of the year because it's so friendly and informal and there's always something new and interesting to see. Here are some pics of the event (and I've saved the most unusual car for the end). My Super (which has mercifully needed very little work in the past year) A very interesting car, built in Detroit for the European export market. The owner found it in France. It's called a "Chrysler Junior," but is basically a '36 Plymouth. It has French Marchal headlights, which were required in France. Dash of the "Chrysler Junior" Very nice '48 Chrysler Town & Country convertible. This was a fresh restoration and was exquisitely done. '51 Hudson Commodore 8 sedan '53 Cadillac Coupe de Ville '60 Studebaker Lark convertible '58 Edsel Citation convertible 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neil morse Posted May 27, 2023 Author Share Posted May 27, 2023 Now for the most obscure attendee at Friendship Day 2023 -- I will post the pics first before I identify it in case anyone wants to try to guess what it is. (I had never heard of this car before.) Ok, give up? It's a 1953 IFA F9 -- "a compact saloon manufactured under the auspices of the Russian and East German states between 1949 or 1950 and 1956" that was "built at Zwickau at the plant previously owned by Auto Union," according to Wikipedia. When I first saw it from a distance, I immediately thought "DKW," which is not surprising because apparently "the body closely followed the design of the DKW F9, a prototype with which Auto Union would have replaced the F8 on the Zwickau production lines earlier, had the war not intervened." It's powered by a three-cylinder, two-stroke 910cc water-cooled engine. Note that the radiator is behind the engine so that the air can be conveniently pre-heated on its way to the radiator! Also note in the first engine compartment photo that the fuel tank is right in front of the driver, and in order to fill the tank you had to employ a convenient zig-zag shaped funnel which presumably was stored in the trunk. I really wanted to talk to the owner of this car and see it run, but despite circling back to this car several times during the meet, I missed him. And the next time I looked, it was gone. Maybe next year. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Bruce aka First Born Posted May 27, 2023 Share Posted May 27, 2023 I never tire of looking at that Super. Thanks for the pictures, sir. Ben 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmTee Posted May 28, 2023 Share Posted May 28, 2023 Thanks for the pictures, Neil! Funny that I also thought "DKW" when I saw that last one... Your Buick looks 'Super', as usual! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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