Is this site for ONLY for restoration only?

[Guest 1hooligan]

I have been on this site for several years, and have been very lucky to have acquired over 250 antique and classic cars in my life. Put my self thru middle school, high school, and 4 years of collage, buying and selling them. Yes this was the late fifties and sixties. The one thing that I have found out is that all

"FINDS" are not canidates for full restoration, either do to condition, or economics. Stripped bodies, missing all undercarrage, and power train. The scarcity of correct parts is making it near imposible to aquire the necessay to restore back to the original configuration.

Now the point of my rambling. If this hobby is going continue, we must be more open to those in the hobby that are saving metal that most purest would pass by.

I chringe evertime, I read posts from a few of our members, that are hurtful

nasty, and flat out mean to new members, who are just getting into the hobby, Hot Rodder, yep I was. I am proud of what we built. Now that I am in my sixties, what I build is not the same as then.

I GUESS WHAT I WANT TO SAY AND ASK, IF YOU DONT HAVE SOMETHING NICE TO SAY, DONT SAY OR WRITE ANYTHING. MANY OF US ARE OF THE OPINION THAT CONVERTS CAN BE MAKE. IF YOU ARE HAVING A BAD DAY, GO OUT TO THE GARAGE and beat on a only fender or such.

[MCHinson]

You might want to check out the link to the AACA Home page at the top of this page. The short answer is, that....

"The aim of the AACA is the perpetuation of the pioneer days of automobiling by furthering the interest in and preserving of antique automobiles, and the promotion of sportsmanship and of good fellowship among all AACA members."

Essentially, AACA is about preservation and/or restoration of automobiles 25 years old or older, in the condition that they were originally in from the manufacturer.

So, this is not really the place to discuss hot rodding, or modifying cars. That does not mean that we should not try to be polite when we point out this fact to those who might wish to discuss street rods, or customs, or modifieds here on this site. Hopefully, we can all get along, while furthering the mission of AACA, and perhaps assisting folks to find another site on the web where they might find a more receptive audience or people better equipped to answer their questions about modified vehicles.

[Restorer32]

Excellent answer.

[Bhigdog]

BINGO!

[1937hd45]

1hooligan, AACA members on this website for the most part live by the "Welcome to AACA, I'll tell you what is wrong with your car" outlook. Once you understand that, and have an unnatural love for 10-25 years old cars you'll get allong just fine. Owning a Buick also helps. Just my opinion, and I've been a member since 1970.

Edited June 8, 2010 by 1937hd45 (see edit history)

[Guest windjamer]

Matt, please rub shoulders with me at Hershey. I NEED to aquire some of your finess.

[Shop Rat]

Matt pointed out very well what the AACA is about. And these forums are an extention of that mission. And based on that policy we are here to help those in the hobby with the advice they need to repair/restore their vehicles. And many have the kinds of vehicles that you do as well as vehicles that conform to the mission of the AACA as a whole. We just don't break the rules by talking about the ones that don't here.

You are 100% correct that any that come here should be treated with respect. In turn they should treat the policies that govern the AACA and these forums with the same respect by abiding by the rules.

[alsancle]

1hooligan, AACA members on this website for the most part live by the "Welcome to AACA, I'll tell you what is wrong with your car" outlook. Once you understand that, and have an unnatural love for 10-25 years old cars you'll get allong just fine. Owning a Buick also helps. Just my poinion, and I've been a member since 1970.

Thanks for making me spit my coffee all over my keyboard! Personally, I think people are too nice here.

[Guest cben09]

When we stop talking to each other,,,,ALL IS LOST,,,,I can remember when in VMCCA,[i was a "Boston kid] Sam Bailey was critized for spoiling that old,,,was it a Simplex??? by restoring it,,,The concept of a complete restoration was simply NOT acceptable,,,,,and rules/regulations judging///all for not,,,get em running and drive em was the motto This was the crew that DROVE to Detroit in '46 I think,,for the Golden Jubelee,,,I was in grammar school,,,but was a member,,,That alone was a board meeting/discussion,,Sharing ideas and techniques is the key,,, IF a drag racing technique keeps a Pierce Arrow going,,,,for gosh sakes,,,,talk aboit it,,Then I hear about shell bearings in poured rods,,,,poured is still babbitt,,,and poured wont kill the crank when it fails,,Theres books of info here and elsewhere to talk about,,,NO one has scratched the surface of early car stuff,,,,the book has yet to be written,,,I have enough to fill 4-6 books easily,,, i-e check R,Fraser's Maine built autos,,,coupla hundred cars built up here,,,Richard expected to find a douzen at best ,,that was 20 years ago,,,A supreme court judge built a steam wagon in 1859 ,drove it,,Were now considering doing New England,,,I don't have the time left,,We all love the machinery,,,lets talk,,,I guess you guys can tell my subject will not be art decco,,,haha,,Does anyone know where I can find a 1906 SAURIER air starter for a 1906 Panhard,,Was available all models,,not std on any model,,will argue with the judges later,,[joke] Cheers ,Ben //oh yes they are still in business,,!!!,,, Sam Bailey was the first person in this country to restore a car completely,,,I knew you knew that ,,,but the newbies may not,,Whose got it now,,,CB

[novaman]

I don't think anyone here has a problem with the idea of modifications to keep cars running since there are parts out there that you simply can not get anymore. The issues arise when folks come here and want advice on things like chopping the top, stuffing a chevy v8 in a early ford , etc. Again, when they come here for that type of advice, we need to respect them (after all it is thier car) and point them in the direction of the assistance tehy are looking for. After all this project might be a rod but that's not to say thier next project might be a restoration and if we tick them off, that restoration is likely to become a street rod instead.

[Guest windjamer]

37hd, with all due respect, about two years ago I tryed vary hard to convince you to come back into the fold and share the exsisive and ex. knowlage I know you have with us youngsters. If your post is truely your real feelins on our hobby, Im vary sad to say im glad I failed.

[poci1957]

My thought is that I know well that interest is growing in street rodding and interest in preservation and restoration is flat or declining. This is due to many reasons and factors, and there is some overlap of interest in both sides. But there are many other web sites, clubs and forums that cater to modifying cars. The AACA and this forum is the only one I know that remains true to original features, it is why I am here.

I notice 1hooligan mentions the word "purist", which I think has become a code word to denote uptight, numbers-matching restorers that street rodders find annoying. I can appreciate this to some degree, so prefer to just label myself as someone who respects original features. And I think that is the thing here, it is a safe bet few of us regulars are strictly numbers-matching "purists" but we respect original features and that is what we are interested in. I will never be mean or insulting to people, but we must stand up for why we are here. And I think Matt said it all very well. Todd C

[Guest]

1HOOLIGAN,

The answer to your question is yes, but that dosen't mean some of us wander off sometimes. In my case I do have both stock and modified cars (nothing major or to most people would consider stock). I was sort of driven to this club because the three brands I collect have clubs that have taken in big time customs because of membership drives or in one case to completly taken over the mission statement of the club. I would say in that club I mentioned that the local chapter is at least 80% customs or modified. That club was originally started because there were no completly stock clubs out there for that brand. So please understand for some of us AACA was our last stop or hope. Mat and Susan I couldn't agree more with your post.

Don

[1937hd45]

Send me a PM and explain what that was/is all about. :confused:

37hd, with all due respect, about two years ago I tryed vary hard to convince you to come back into the fold and share the exsisive and ex. knowlage I know you have with us youngsters. If your post is truely your real feelins on our hobby, Im vary sad to say im glad I failed.

[Guest 1hooligan]

Sorry You all, I fully understand the goal of this forum, and agree with it. What set me off is the SOMETIME nasty, stupid responses of some of our members to those who just happen to find the site. And yes, some of the questions tend to rub me also the wrong way. However, with the scareity of parts becoming more and more of a major problem for those of us who wish to restore the highest standards. Like it or not they are becoming the major source of most rare parts. How about a generic "thanks for stopping by, however this site is for the restoration ..............you might try.............! And not create another individual who thinks that we are a bunch of .........holes. That is my only point !!!! SORRY TO BRING IT UP

[R W Burgess]

Hooligan, all of us on here try to make new users welcome. Sometimes there are heated discussions that turn off members of the forum.

I don't think anyone on here intentionally makes disparaging remarks on purpose. It's just that it's hard to express one's self without facial expressions.

Wayne

[poci1957]

Actually hooligan, I think you have a very good point that we should be careful to not just turn off a visitor, it sometimes happens. I agree we should be careful to be friendly, but also quick to let them know that this is not the place for street rod issues, and most beginners really may not know there is a line between the two. After all, he just saw a blown 350 powered Terraplane street rod on the "My Classic Car" TV show, so it is an antique classic, right? I can see why people do not know the difference and at least they are here so we can maybe educate. Todd

[Restorer32]

More and more the word "restore" is being used to mean "street rodded" especially in local newspapers and TV news accounts of local shows.

[poci1957]

Yes, that is often annoying to me. I have resigned myself that like much social "dumbing down" this trend will not likely reverse either. And I single out Dennis Gage and the My Classic Car TV show as someone who knows better but has deliberately chosen to carry on this practice.

[Ron Green]

And I single out Dennis Gage and the My Classic Car TV show as someone who knows better but has deliberately chosen to carry on this practice.

Probably not Dennis's choice but the producers along with the advertisers. They need to keep up with the "Chop Cut Rebuild" type shows, after all this is the accepted method of car restoration for many who may not be associated with the hobby, but like cars, and follow their dreams through TV.

Dennis featured my Pontiac at Amelia Island in 2001 and was far from being in love with hotrods. At least that was the impression I got.

[poci1957]

I would certainly like to give him the benefit of the doubt, as I know he knows better and the show was initially restoration focused. I met him briefly at a McPherson College function in 2001 and complemented him on it, but since then on SPEED the show has given street rods more than equal time. And don't even mention "Car Crazy" to me on that subject.

You are probably correct about the producers and advertisers--the dumbing down will likely continue.

PS--I do not remember your Pontiac, what kind is it? A 1955? Have you since left POCI?

[Ron Green]

Yes it is a 55 (3 POCI gold awards) and I left POCI about six years ago for reasons I will keep to myself. Speaking of hotrods.

I took the Amphicar out for the 1st swim of the season last weekend checking it out for leaks as we have a tour next week. As ususal it was surrounded by many car experts at the boat launch prior to me going in the river. Most were commenting on what they would modify if they owned it and a few went as far as suggesting that I should remove the Triumph 4 cylinder and replace it with a SBC 350. They see it done all the time on TV. I told them that if it could somehow be wedged in and mated to the land / water transmission (which wouldn't hold up under a SBC), why would I want to devalue the vehicle? Which none of them understood what I was trying to convey.

In my opinion there appears to be more of them then there are of us...................who like them factory stock. Sure we change colors and do a few safety modifications on occasion however that is an easy fix down the road.

[poci1957]

I just bought an Alfa Romeo Spider and a local car friend suggested dropping a V8 in it, as if that was the only logical thing to do and he could not imagine any other outcome.

I am convinced it is largely peer pressure and the media exposure. How boring and uninspired to reduce the possibilities of old car ownership to just take any car and drop in a 350?

I have been in POCI for 23 years and am considering my loyalty, I would be interested in your opinion if you want to PM me on your experience. Thanks, Todd C

[Guest DriveAG]

The expectation of the pent-up blast of foulness awaiting anyone who posts on this site discourages many from participating (including myself) even if it is to discuss the merits of iron vs aluminum pistons on 100 year old cars. No topic is proof against the rancid criticism that pervades this forum. It is the most un-welcoming site that I occasion and my posts are few and far between for that reason.

If someone who only deals in antiques and restoration in the traditional (and AACA recognized) manner gets blasted, imagine how others who press the boundaries of restoration and antiques must feel.

Upon reflection, this post is a perfect example.....

[alsancle]

The expectation of the pent-up blast of foulness awaiting anyone who posts on this site discourages many from participating (including myself) even if it is to discuss the merits of iron vs aluminum pistons on 100 year old cars. No topic is proof against the rancid criticism that pervades this forum. It is the most un-welcoming site that I occasion and my posts are few and far between for that reason.

If someone who only deals in antiques and restoration in the traditional (and AACA recognized) manner gets blasted, imagine how others who press the boundaries of restoration and antiques must feel.

Upon reflection, this post is a perfect example.....

Wow, I'm honestly missing this blasting that is going on. This site is the politest of the 4 or 5 I follow regularly. Like I said before, I think people are too patient around here.

[R W Burgess]

Like any hobby or passion, you get out of it what you put into it.

Wayne

[Ron Green]

I don't see the blasting either just trading a few true experiences.

On another note: recently I was accused of being somewhat negative because I reported in our clubs newsletter about a bad experience with the water police at one of our swim ins. According to the complainer I should only state positive thoughts and outcomes. I wonder what he thinks or says about the weatherman when he predicts rain?

[Earl B.]

Please excuse my ignorance, but what does POCI stand for? thanks, B

[Ron Green]

Pontiac Oakland Club International

[Guest]

Probably not Dennis's choice but the producers along with the advertisers. They need to keep up with the "Chop Cut Rebuild" type shows, after all this is the accepted method of car restoration for many who may not be associated with the hobby, but like cars, and follow their dreams through TV.

Dennis featured my Pontiac at Amelia Island in 2001 and was far from being in love with hotrods. At least that was the impression I got.

Would that be episode 11 with a 69 Judge RA V ??

Don

[MCHinson]

DriveAG,

That sounds overly critical to me. In my experience, people are people. People sometimes go overboard. People are sometimes difficult to get along with. I have seen some things posted here that I would prefer were not posted. Sometimes the moderators have deleted comments that I thought needed to be deleted and sometimes they have deleted some that I thought should have been allowed. The world is not a perfect place, and neither is this forum.

I attempted to view your previous posts to search for clues to your previous experience here and could not find them. I am guessing that you have had some posts deleted. I have occasionally had a few posts deleted by the moderators. Most of us who are active here probably have. I have also met a lot of great friends here, from all over the country. The discussion forum has added to my AACA experience over the past few years.

Are you an AACA Member? If not, you should join and have a voice in the organization. If you are not happy with anything about AACA, members have the chance to ask questions of the Directors at Membership Roundtable discussions at all of the meets. You can also check out the Contact Us page from the main page and find contact information to voice any concerns.

There are other Antique Automobile sites that I have not enjoyed as much as I enjoy this one. I don't spend time on sites that I don't enjoy. If you don't enjoy it, maybe you should look closely at what you put into it. I think that Wayne hit the nail on the head.... You get what you put into it. Best of luck to you in any case.

[Shop Rat]

The expectation of the pent-up blast of foulness awaiting anyone who posts on this site discourages many from participating (including myself) even if it is to discuss the merits of iron vs aluminum pistons on 100 year old cars. No topic is proof against the rancid criticism that pervades this forum. It is the most un-welcoming site that I occasion and my posts are few and far between for that reason.

If someone who only deals in antiques and restoration in the traditional (and AACA recognized) manner gets blasted, imagine how others who press the boundaries of restoration and antiques must feel.

Upon reflection, this post is a perfect example.....

If you read a post and you feel that someone is "blasting" someone else you can report it by clicking on the small red flag that appears in the gray area below where their name is at the bottom of the post it is in. The moderator(s) will look at it and decide if it should stay or go. It is right in the rules that folks here are not permitted to attack each other.

Also, look at the number of posts that they have made under that person's name. If it is a low number then there might be a question about whether or not they actually have read the rules. Or if they happen to be what is referred to as a "troll".

[Guest billybird]

Shop Rat: interesting post ; I did not realize the significance of the red flag. Can you expound on the other symbols; the circle to the left of the red flag, sometimes this circle will be colored in??? How about the little man running above the circle?

[Earl B.]

Thank you Ron

[Guest bofusmosby]

I am new to this hobby, but this is not the only car forum I belong to. One of the other ones deals with "chop, lower, and more power". This is not for me. I have nothing bad to say to these people, its just not my cup of tea. Therefore, I don't visit those sites too much. As far as being welcomed here, I have never felt so welcomed in my life! Most of my posts are in the form of questions, but as I learn the ropes of the old cars, I will gladly help others if I can by giving answers.

It has already been said here, the more you put in, the more you get out. I am just overwhelmed by the help that I have recieved here. THANK YOU!

[Guest]

I ju

I have been in POCI for 23 years and am considering my loyalty, I would be interested in your opinion if you want to PM me on your experience. Thanks, Todd C

I would be interested in your opinion as well so if you could PM me as well. Todd and I had just finished with a heated argument on POCI's forum.

Don

[stealthbob]

From the start I have endured all the comments from my social circle on what I am to do with my new project. From disc brakes, alternator swaps all the way to using a crate 350....I have heard it all. Not one asked if I was going to preserve the original makeup???

All the while however, I have been "mentored" from the likes of MrEarl and the gang at 54Buick.com.

I have to say I may have been swayed to the "Resto-Rod" route if it was not for people like I find here and my home site.

Thanks to all of you for helping me understand the value of historical preservation.

Edited June 9, 2010 by stealthbob (see edit history)

[Shop Rat]

Shop Rat: interesting post ; I did not realize the significance of the red flag. Can you expound on the other symbols; the circle to the left of the red flag, sometimes this circle will be colored in??? How about the little man running above the circle?

The circle/dot turns from dark blue to green when you are on-line.

The little man running is the symbol for: Send a message via AIM to (whomevers name it is under)

Edited June 9, 2010 by Shop Rat (see edit history)

[Ron Green]

Would that be episode 11 with a 69 Judge RA V ??

Don

Season 6 episode 1 (2002) 1955 Pontiac. It has been a long time since I watched the tape but they did 4 vehicles. I know one was a Woodie, another was a one off prototype and I can't remember the other. If you listen close enough you can here Elmer Fudd (me) proclaiming that my car is a custom Continental instead of a custom Catalina.

Edited June 9, 2010 by Ron Green (see edit history)

[Bhigdog]

The expectation of the pent-up blast of foulness awaiting anyone who posts on this site discourages many from participating (including myself) even if it is to discuss the merits of iron vs aluminum pistons on 100 year old cars. No topic is proof against the rancid criticism that pervades this forum. It is the most un-welcoming site that I occasion and my posts are few and far between for that reason.

If someone who only deals in antiques and restoration in the traditional (and AACA recognized) manner gets blasted, imagine how others who press the boundaries of restoration and antiques must feel.

Upon reflection, this post is a perfect example.....

I'm not nearly as eloquent, nor as courteous and thoughtfull as Matthew, so I'll just say it in my own words. ..............

I don't know what site you're refering to in the above quote, but if it's this one you need to either start or go off your meds...........Bob