wayne sheldon

Old "history" from faulty memories. A lot of books published in the 1940s and into the 1960s said that. But nothing in actual records or era photographs actually support that idea. It IS true that dealers would trade the electric headlamps off the car and install earlier gas headlamps occasionally for customers that weren't yet ready to accept electric headlamps as being safe or reliable. Remember, adults at that time had spent their entire lives around oil and gas lamps, no matter where they lived. And only in some areas were people used to electric lamps by then. While many people were ready to step into the future and embraced the new concept, many others wanted to stick with what was familiar. It was a win/win for the dealer. He charged a few dollars, took in the modern electric lamps, and installed a leftover set of gas lamps along with the carbide generator or Prestolite tank. Then put the new electric headlamps on the shelf, to sell them to a past customer that wanted to upgrade their older T model to the new modern electric headlamps. Ford factory also supplied new headlamps for such upgrades. I spend a lot of time studying era photographs. It amazes me how many model Ts from 1912 through 1914 have either electrified gas lamps, or later replacement electric lamps. There must have been thousands upon thousands of model Ts upgraded to electric headlamps! Compared to that, very few photos show later cars with earlier gas headlamps. I have seen several, maybe a dozen or more over the years. A lot of them were overseas versions, and likely military during the Great War. The military apparently liked the more familiar and reliable gas lamps. But I have also seen typical family type model Ts, 1915 and even into 1917 or '18 with gas lamps. Just not many like that. Another thing that confuses the issue? Is that there are a few factory photos of preproduction prototype model Ts, a few of which had gas headlamps on them. Most people do not recognize the prototype cars as such, and do not realize that the photos were taken earlier in 1914, long before the 1915 style cars were being produced. The horn is a bit different complicated. The 1915 model year was really messed up due to design changes resulting in production delays. The new center-door sedans and folding top couplets began production almost on schedule, about September or October of 1914. Those cars had headlamps and sidelamps that were different than anything else. They also had electric horns! The common open style cars (touring car and runabout) however were delayed for a few months due to manufacturing problems on the new sheet metal for the new style bodies. Approximately 50 (half a hundred!) runabouts were produced in December of 1914! Touring car production didn't begin until January of 1915. Total production of 1915 style open body cars in January 1915 was about two thousand FOR THE MONTH! The Ford factories continued producing 1914 style open cars well into April of 1915 to keep up with purchase orders. While the "closed" car T models had electric horns by October of 1914, open style cars didn't begin getting electric horns until almost June of 1915! And even then, changeover was slow. Many open model Ts continued getting the bulb horn through July, and empirical evidence suggests even some as late as December of 1915. Although, probably most model Ts by the end of July were getting electric horns. The 1915 model year was one of almost continual change for the model T. But 1912 was even worse.

I am curious to hear what you find out. They look almost exactly like the steel bucket pair I had on a 1914 many years ago. Even the ridges on the rim look the same. I wish I could remember what brand they were.

Mark G is probably on it! Specifically, they look like 1913 or 1914 ford headlamps. Double check the main body of the lamp with a magnet. The Ford (and most after-market replacements) had steel main bodies and brass rims and top/chimney. Some after-market replacements did have brass bodies as they were sold to replace lamps for many midsize automobiles, and some people still wanted brass lamps. 1912 and earlier Ford headlamps were mostly all brass. Ford used headlamps from a few manufacturers for 1913 and 1914, and models of lamps changed often through those two years. Minor variations in almost all parts varied considerably. The lamps themselves are fairly common. Finding two that actually match can be tough!

Not the first time I have run into this one. However, I haven't seen that very many times. Usually I walk away shaking my head thinking what a clueless fool they are. Usually, they start out more than a bit high? Then they want even more? Some people just cannot be reasoned with.

The design and manufacturing process uses a lot of numbers! Cast parts may have factory part numbers, inventory part numbers (may be the same or may be different?), and/or numerous other numbers. Other numbers may include pattern numbers, or mold numbers. The mold is used to make the part, the pattern is used to make the mold! Both patterns and molds wear out, so quality control uses numbers to track defective parts back to failing molds or patterns that need to be replaced. Other types of series numbers may identify minor improvements in design or process in the original manufacture, but may have no known meaning today. Most automobile manufacturers used multiple outside suppliers for many parts they needed. Oftentimes those outside suppliers would cast in numbers that had meaning only to themselves. Once the parts were delivered to Nash, nobody paid them any attention. Other than things like engine firing order or actual part numbers, most such cast in numbers have no real meaning today. Showing full photos or identifying the part might help in determining if the number has any real meaning now.

That style Oakes tire lock was from the early/mid 1920s into the very early 1930s. I think they were pretty much gone by 1932, but don't know for sure about that. They came in a few lock sizes, and a whole bunch of iron casting versions for a wide variety of cars. A lot of automobile manufacturers offered Oakes spare tire locks as factory options. My 1925 Studebaker many years ago had a factory installed version, very different from that. My Studebaker's was built into the spare tire carrier from the factory. Yours is I am fairly sure an after-market version to lock the straight side tire "split rim" onto the spare tire carrier. That style will not fit all such cars, only ones with a thing tire carrier "band" that can be captured by the lock. It also may only fit certain rim sizes? It would for instance fit my 1927 Paige 6-45 sedan! However, I already have a different style Oakes lock that fits my car. Did I miss it? I didn't see a price? They are nice items! Some people with proper vintage cars really like these for their cars. I am not sure what one like this should sell for these days.

I have seen Whippet rims 19 inch size, I think there were other sizes as well. Whippet rims I have seen were very similar to the 1926/'27 Ford model T split rims. They are fairly lightweight rims, easily tweaked wrong ways, and not too difficult to straighten as long as they are not rusted too much. What I do for the Ford rims, is get a nice large enough piece of cardboard. Use a made-up compass to draw nearly perfect circles to match the inside and outside of the rim. That makes it easy to see exactly where the rim is wowed out, or otherwise has too much or too little curve. Go slow and be careful bending the rim. Use bits of wood to cushion the rim over whatever you are using to bend the rim. You want gentle adjustments. I use my car trailer as a bending anvil. Between the tiedown ratchets (heavy duty ones), ramps, and tongue, I can almost always find something that will allow me to get the tweak I need. Rims can also get twists in them. Simple twists can usually be easily seen by laying the rim flat on smooth flat concrete. Be creative clamping or locking the rim in places that allow you to bend or twist as needed. Well clamped, a big wrench (even a big Stillson wrench!) can be used to twist it back to straight round! Again, go slow, and keep checking the rim against your circles. When done, the ends of the split should line up nearly perfect without any pressure holding them in place. Model T, and I imagine Whippet, rims are easy to do. Larger cars? not so much. I recently straightened a rim for my 1927 Paige 6-45 sedan. For it, I made a sheet steel template to gauge the roundness. It was more precise than cardboard. That rim, I had to use the torch and shrink stretched metal to get back to round. The silly part about it was, that it really didn't look bad. It just would NOT seat properly and go onto the wheel. The car doesn't run, all I needed was to replace an ancient tire with a newer one to roll it round the garage. After fighting the silly thing for a few hours, trying to coax it onto the wheel, I finally gave in and straightened it. It took me less than an hour to make the template and get everything set up. And then it took me about thirty minutes (including heat to shrink a stretched section!) to do the straightening. After which it all went together perfectly, just like it was supposed to. The Paige rim was not the worst one I have done. Some years back, I straightened one for my friend's 1925 Lincoln! That one was tough! But it still only took about an hour to do.

Me, chuckling. If there is? I haven't found it yet. Just car level (or holding VT level if not mounted), eyeing for center very carefully, I can usually get it within five tries. Of course, there was once, after about twenty or thirty tries, I walked away from it for about an hour. Being very careful, I can usually by lowering it slowly, tell if it is a hit or a miss just as the long pin hits outside the hole. Sometimes, just a bit of a jiggle, can then shake it into the hole. I love driving cars with vacuum tanks! Just part of the fun.

Beautiful Packard Twin Six! Yes, that is a car I could go crazy over! Almost twenty years ago, I went on a Nickel Age Touring Club tour with my then 1915/'16 Studebaker touring car. An old friend was there, one of the last club tours he went on. He sadly went in a modern car due to his rapidly failing health. His daughter's boyfriend drove his just completed Packard Twin Six roadster on the tour. It was a 1917 if I recall correctly. An extremely impressive automobile!

But I want to know what car Tph479 took to Pebble Beach! Two wheel brakes, rumble seat? Gotta be something I would go crazy about! Wonderful writeup by the way!

Like so many things in the universe. There is how the universe usually works? Common realities? Followed by "sometimes it can go another way!" And then there is Hollywood. It is always a matter of perspective and perception. The fact is, that liquid gasoline rarely ever flashes or explodes. However, given the right circumstances? It can. Vaporized gasoline is much more dangerous than liquid. But even that generally needs a flame or well placed spark to ignite. my work for many years had me working around hot running equipment needing fuel. Probably more than fifty, maybe more than a hundred times, I have seen gasoline spilled onto very hot exhaust manifolds. The gasoline landing on the manifold vaporizes almost instantly! Other fuel landing on cooler pieces takes awhile to evaporate. Even with running engines, in the hot sun, knowing the distributor or magneto is flashing sparks inside its little housing? I have never seen spilled gasoline ignite. My dad did manage to create an interesting flash once however. He knew plenty. One of the rare times his garage wasn't packed to the rafters, and he was cleaning it. There was a nasty oil spill on the floor, he had wiped up most of it. He wanted to use some gasoline to clean up the last of the stain. He knew the potential, and he also knew chemistry well enough to keep it within safe limits. Sure enough, the small amount of gasoline created enough airborne vapor and the hot water heater picked that moment to fire up! He had the doors open, front and rear, and the amount of gasoline in the building was so small that he said it made an interesting swirling flash around the inside of the garage! No damage to anything. He didn't even singe his eyebrows. But he loved to tell the story for years, always with cautionary comments about how just a tiny bit more gasoline could have been a disaster. I often wish I had been there to see it. I have seen so many things that could have become a disaster, but didn't. The fact is, that gasoline is not that explosive, unless under very certain circumstances which almost never happen accidentally. Hollywood loves to make it happen for their movies and tv shows. But it doesn't happen often in the real world. Knowing that, it could be easy to become careless. But that is something we must NOT do! Every now and then, enough gasoline, enough of it vaporized and exposed, and some silly spark, or flame in the wrong place? And it is that two seconds again! I could tell a dozen more tales. Like the young man that worked for my dad for a year or two when I was still in high school. He was somewhat messed up after a long tour in Vietnam. Liked to play with fire. But for now, I know Jay will be hurting for awhile. I am very grateful he was not hurt any worse than he was. Be careful out there guys! It may not happen easily, it may not happen often. But it can and sometimes DOES HAPPEN! Yes, I still use gasoline as a cleaner. But I only use small controllable amounts, in well ventilated areas (and have a couple fire extinguishers handy!).

I am really enjoying reading this thread, and the comments from people "in the know". I also appreciate the questions asked by people that aren't all that personally involved. Good stuff! I think I would have liked to have done a bit more showing of my cars. But I never had any cars that were truly show-worthy. I was invited to show a car a few times at lesser venues. Usually in cases when the venue wanted a certain marque or class of which a car I had at the time was good enough to fill a space. I enjoyed the experience, although I always declined to have my car judged (why waste their time?) I do think I would have enjoyed showing cars more often. Although I don't think I would have ever made it to Pebble that way. I was never one that wanted trophies or ribbons.

Such a wonderful thing!

THANK YOU for the update! I keep looking in here to see if someone can let us crazies know how Jay is doing. I don't any longer have news or social media that I trust except for a couple antique automobile forums! Whether celebrities or hurricane damage, I find the reporting on these sites more reliable with less blowing things way out of proportion than on most media sites. (Antique automobile people tend to be more sensible than most people!) I, like a lot of people in the hobby, have met Jay Leno. He is one of many truly interesting people I have met through this hobby. Although I am not silly enough to think he is a personal friend (Hey, I only actually met him once!), we chatted antique automobiles for some time. I found him to be friendly, intelligent, and interesting. As such, he is a person I care about. I check this thread often, make comments or add related stories in part to keep it in sight near the top of the list, in hopes that others with better contact than I have might report in here. Hey out there Jay! Get well quick!

It IS a BiFlex bumper, I have had several of them over the years. They were very common, offered as factory options on dozens of marques, as well as popular after-market accessory for anything from a model T on up! They came in lighter weight versions (which are actually not very common!) for smaller cars. And most of them were about the size and weight of yours, but in varying widths to fit or style for different larger cars. The cast clamps that hold the two sides together came in several styles, some fairly plain, others with diagonal ribs or even the BiFlex name cast in. The variation may have been a year/style thing or not, I don't know. I think I still have most of one badly damaged one in my junk pile. It had collision bends when I bought it for very cheap a very long time ago. It turned out to be a fortuitous purchase a few years later when the plating shop lost the clamps for a very good friend's bumper he was restoring. I gladly donated my bumper's clamps to his car. I could still straighten and make replacement clamps for my bumper if I had a car that could use it.

Don't let the borer beetles get into anything else! If they are still alive? As much as I rarely ever destroy anything antique, I would probably burn those wheels. And you wouldn't believe the amount of time and effort I have put into restoring original wood spoke wheels!

A major part of my wife's family heritage was in a small out of the way lumber town 90 to over 120 years ago! We found a rare original photograph of the town about forty years ago in an antique shop. The photo was in terrible condition, folded, torn, with small pieces missing. I had a large format negative made of the photo, had it blown way up in size, then by hand and ink drew in all the missing pieces! We then had copies made for family members. My first hand experience with "photoshop" before computers. Most people today just don't realize about such things!

Thank you for that Walt! I love it. Looks like an English Austin (is that a 7 series?). And since Mr. Punch was English? As much as I would enjoy seeing ALL of it? Don't spend much of your time posting pieces of it. I know how your time is. And I do appreciate so many of the postings you make time for here, as I am sure many other people here do also. Thank you.

And I would have guessed it was an Edsel! Guess that shows how much I know about postwar cars. I will admit to liking a fair number of postwar cars. Just not enough to buy one at anywhere near their market value.

For people not familiar with these incredible engines, and their very important place in history, a recent thread with some discussion about them. https://forums.aaca.org/topic/384817-otto-horz-stroke-1-cyl-gas-engine-can-some-give-me-some-history-on-this-one/#comment-2426734 It must be an honor to work on one.

Many many years ago (nearly 50!), at a club meeting, another conversation drifted off into territories related to this. A well respected club member, professional mechanic, expert repairman, one of the most safety conscious people I have ever known, admitted to a car being destroyed by fire. He told how he had been working on it, with the carburetor removed, and a bizarre set of circumstances while rotating the engine ignited fuel at the open end of the fuel line, which in turn blew some into the intake manifold, and caused the engine to fully run, which then pumped gasoline out the fuel line end in large volumes which became a blow torch as the engine continued to run at high rpm with no carburetor and the ignition turned OFF! He did manage to get the fire put out after emptying a couple fire extinguishers. The car was totally destroyed, he had some burns, but he saved this shop! About two seconds from everything is fine to all He!! is breaking loose! Be careful out there!

Dreyer's Ice Cream was founded in Oakland California in the 1920s. Breyer's Ice Cream was founded somewhere back East a couple years before Dreyer's. It took a few decades, but both companies grew and expanded until their territories crossed into each other. Dreyer's chose to market their product East of the Mississippi under the alternate name of "Edy's". They did this to avoid confusion due to the similar names. Breyer's wasn't so nice, and stuck with their original name as they expanded to areas Dreyer's had been in for nearly half a century by then. The ice cream truck is a 1919 Model T Ford chassis with original wooden after-market body, originally built in Oakland California. It was thoroughly restored in the 1960s to a very high degree of quality. So much so, that it won more than fifty first place and Best of Show awards at over a twenty year period. And they weren't all small shows! Not at all! That truck won Best of Show at one of William Harrah's Reno car shows! Before Pebble Beach became what it is today, Harrah's Reno show was one of the West of the Mississippi top car shows, with some of the highest judging standards in the world in those decades. For ANY model T, and a truck? To win Best of Show at THAT show was shocking to many people. After it had won many awards, the truck was used by Dreyer's for promotional appearances all over the country. It was lovingly maintained for many years by the fellow that had restored it. And by the way, he is a long time one of my best friends. I have ridden in the truck many times, and even drove it in a parade for him once when he was unable to attend the parade himself. The black canvas side curtains are changed to display the two different names depending on where the truck was being shown. One more bit of ice cream trivia. It was Dreyer himself that is claimed to be the inventor of Rocky Road ice cream.

Nice!

I have seen several vintage automobiles done this way, including a few model A Fords, a Pierce Arrow, a Studebaker. Most were being turned into crude delivery vans. A couple were for handicap access (there was a Pierce Arrow shared a few years ago that was done for that purpose!). I think I saw pictures of a Packard done for that reason also? It wouldn't be too difficult to take this sedan back to its original form, provided the all steel body is basically decent. Those bodies survived in large numbers, a lot of them rotted out on the bottom if left out too long in harsh environments. I would suspect a back section could still be had fairly reasonably and grafted into place, complete with proper rear window. Pictures in the ad are lousy, and I didn't notice a price? But the car looks fairly solid, and with almost no wood in the body they are usually fairly easy to restore. The sort of thing a good DIYer should be able to handle. Club support is good, and most parts are available.

Studebaker's marketing was changing model designations a lot during those years. But I think that is what amounts to the "standard" or "light six" model, or the small Studebaker for its year. The last of the four cylinder Studebakers was about a year to two years earlier. I would recommend checking the serial number and data plates on the car to verify year and model. It looks very much like the 1923 I went and looked at for sale about six months ago. This car appears to not have the cute little cowl lamps that the 1923 had, otherwise it is almost identical in style and appearance. It is possible that this car could be early enough to not have those cowl lamps? Not as impressive as the larger models, but these Studebakers are good cars and usually quite reliable on tours (once reasonably sorted).