Winter storage and Ethanol Fuel

[dmfconsult]

I’ve been lucky that I’ve been able to get non Ethanol 94 octane fuel locally for a long time, so I would fill the tank prior to storage with some Sta-Bil and be fine.  
 

Unfortunately, the non Ethanol fuel is no longer available, so I’m left with having to deal with having ethanol fuels that will be in storage for 6 months or more. These fuels aren’t new so what is everyone doing to ensure the fuel remains relatively fresh and stable?  
 

I guess I could use a higher concentration of Sta-Bil and maybe some other additive.  I also thought about not filling the tank, but there are other potential issues with doing that, including having the inside of the tank rust. What is everyone else doing?

[Grimy]

I've been using Startron, found at marine supply stores like West Marine, and I've found it even better than blue (marine) Sta-bil.  It held up for over 3 years in my gas can for a leaf blower--but I wouldn't trust any product to last that long for an auto engine.  A quart bottle is about $40, BUT the initial dose rate is one ounce per 8 gallons of gasoline.  (A pint bottle, half the amount, was $32.)  Be careful, however:  Startron also makes diesel fuel additives that seem to have the same light blue color, so make sure you select the GASOLINE STABILIZER product.  The literature claims that it is enzyme-based; perhaps one of our chemists can explain that.

[NTX5467]

I have read that Startron is enzyme-based.  I used to use Lucas "Green Stuff" (my name for it) ethanol-shield additive.  It IS green in color and has no "over-treat" issues.  I used to use it in my push lawn mowers.  After 3 months of sitting outside, they 'd usually start on the 2nd pull.  I did manage to over-treat a few times, with nothing other than the white ceramic on the spark plug got a green tint to it.  

 

There is a website (www.pure-gas.com, or similar) that lists alleged ethanol-free fuel sources with available octane levels.  Might help you find a different vendor?

 

NTX5467

[dmfconsult]

I think my main concern is “phase separation” and none of the main additives seem to be able to address it. The reviews on Startron and Sta-Bil seem to be similar so I guess there isn’t a bad choice there between the two.  
 

I have used the pure-gas.com list in the past, but as I’m in Canada, I think most have removed the non-ethanol gas to become compliant with federal legislation.  It’s really a shame for all of us hobbyists. 
 

Maybe the only real solution is just to drive the Electra year round! 😛
 

Edited September 8 by dmfconsult (see edit history)

[EmTee]

7 hours ago, dmfconsult said:

I think my main concern is “phase separation” and none of the main additives seem to be able to address it.

My marine mechanic recommended K-100.  I have used it a couple of times.

 

https://k-100.com/gas/

 

The last few years I have simply filled the tanks with E-0 gasoline with no additives.  So far, no issues following ~ 4 months of winter storage.

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

A little tongue in cheek, maybe,  maybe not.  All alcohols are not the same.   While ETHANOL attracts moisture, METHANOL absorbs moisture [ water ].  Pure methanol is used for fuel in some race cars.     

 

  Perhaps a quart of methanol in the tank when storing.  A little agitation in the spring.  No water AND a souped up fuel.😁

 

  Ben

[60FlatTop]

I have always used regular Mobil gas from the same station on the corner of my street and Main St. Mobil is a Tier 1 fuel. I have never had any of the problems with my cars or lawn equipment that I have heard many others tell. I do store the cars and at least one is in dead storage away from home. In my case it appears to work for me.

 

Things cost a few pennies more at the Mobil pump. I have noticed the problems I hear may be coming from astute price shoppers.

[NTX5467]

("Astute price shoppers" = "cheapskates"?)

[Mark Shaw]

 

 

[dmfconsult]

That does appear to be what I'm looking for, thanks Mark, and it's available at my local Home Depot for about $12/bottle.  I think I'll give it a try.  I have seen how gummed up the carburetors of lawn mowers can get with ethanol fuels which is why I was concerned in the first place.  As long as I had E-0 or non-Ethanol fuel available, I just used that with Sta-Bil and didn't worry about it in either the cars or small engine stuff, but now I have no choice.  I did check the pure-gas website and it looks like there is one Shell station about 30min from me with 100 Octane non-Ethanol fuel, but I'm skeptical.  I'll have to see to believe if it's real, but there is nothing else remotely close.

 

Thanks for all the replies!

Edited September 11 by dmfconsult (see edit history)

[dmfconsult]

On 9/8/2024 at 6:07 AM, 60FlatTop said:

I have always used regular Mobil gas from the same station on the corner of my street and Main St. Mobil is a Tier 1 fuel. I have never had any of the problems with my cars or lawn equipment that I have heard many others tell. I do store the cars and at least one is in dead storage away from home. In my case it appears to work for me.

 

Things cost a few pennies more at the Mobil pump. I have noticed the problems I hear may be coming from astute price shoppers.

Ironically, the Mobil stations we have here are considered to be the bargain gas stations for the "astute price shoppers", not sure if they are even considered top tier.  We have Chevron "Super Premium" 94 Octane which is generally seen as the best of the best by all the high performance car/motorcycle crowd, so that is what I have always used for the old cars despite it's premium cost.  

[Machine Gun]

The nearest non-ethanol fuel available to me is about a 90 minute round trip from my home. I've always put Sta-Bil in a topped-off fuel tank for winter storage. Never had a problem with any of my cars or lawn equipment. Regardless, I saw Chickanic's video on Ethanol Shield just before I went out to buy a new bottle of Sta-Bil. I'm going to switch.

[avgwarhawk]

I have left ethanol gas sit for 5-6 months.  Never an issue when starting my lawnmower for the season.  Ethanol gas sits in the tank of my Buicks over the winter. Never a problem burning through the gas in springtime. I have not experienced any issues with ethanol that has sat for a while.  Knock on wood I guess. 

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

Agree!!!

 

  Ben

[Barney Eaton]

A few years back there was a tech session at the Buick national meet put on by the 36-37 group.   This subject came up and there was an overwhelming recommendation for 

Marvel Mystery oil.   40+ people in attendance and they recommended it over Sta-Bil and also used it in engines, transmissions, etc.      I was so impressed I purchased a gallon 

and use it in the gas of all my cars every few months.

On long term storage and modern gas....... I would consider disconnecting the fuel line and run the engine until the carb is empty,  extra work but you are only doing it every 6 months

 

[JohnD1956]

On 9/15/2024 at 11:26 AM, avgwarhawk said:

Never an issue when starting my lawnmower for the season.

A long time ago, probably a decade or more, an aluminum appearing lawnmower carb bowl rotted thru, which I suspect was the result of ethanol fuel use in it's first 5 years. Since then I have only used non ethanol in it and have not had any indication of a similar problem. 

I am sure fuel formulation has changed since those days but I have no proof of that. But since non ethanol fuel is still readily available in my area I went strictly non ethanol in all my vehicles. 

Last year I used ethanol fuel in the 56 untill late in the season and then refueled with non ethanol for the winter. This year I have been using ethanol in the Buicks all the time. But with a month or two to go I am again filling with non ethanol.  But I am still using a can of non ethanol I bought last fall for the lawnmower. If I don't over prime and flood it, the engine will start on the first pull. And there is no water in the bottom of the non ethanol gas cans. 

Obviously everyone has the best alternative that works for them. I believe the key factor is to keep the tanks full during storage or non use periods, and if possible to run them on occasion. 

 

[avgwarhawk]

48 minutes ago, JohnD1956 said:

 

  I believe the key factor is to keep the tanks full during storage or non use periods, and if possible to run them on occasion. 

 

This is what I do.  It has served me well with my Buicks for 14 years.   

[EmTee]

9 hours ago, JohnD1956 said:

A long time ago, probably a decade or more, an aluminum appearing lawnmower carb bowl rotted thru, which I suspect was the result of ethanol fuel use in it's first 5 years.

That might have been gas with Methyl Tertiary Butyl Ether (MTBE).

[dmfconsult]

As I understand it, ethanol replaced MTBE in gas and the unintended consequence was phase separation.  Non-Ethanol fuels will still have MTBE but they are being phased out.  

 

For the past 22 years, I've followed the same route as most.  Every winter, add some Sta-Bil (and/or Marvel Mystery Oil) and fill the tank to prevent rust, and change the oil and filter before storage.  I typically have not run the car in winter unless I can drive it and really warm it up.  There is a lot of moisture up here in the winter, so running it just in the garage does not necessarily do the job.  I may keep it insured  for the road all year long this year so I have the option of taking it for a drive on nice days, which I used to do as well.   Years ago, I also saw a video from "skinned knuckles" magazine about pouring Marvel Mystery Oil down the carburetor to lubricate the top end of the engine, and basically pouring it until the engine stalls.  I did try that once or twice, but I don't do it every year as it gets a really smoky for about 20min during spring start up until the MMO burns off.  I guess it really does coat things as planned!

 

I had been thinking about this awhile as I don't think I have non-ethanol as an option, but something occurred this summer with my daily driver that got me really concerned.  My DD takes premium fuel as well and I had to add a bit of fuel in a small town.  The car ran well for the rest of the day, but the next morning, the car would start but run poorly like 3 of the 6 cylinders were dead and then shut down.  It did this a couple of times, so (after I checked the fluids) I just put my foot into it and revved the engine on start up.  It choked for a bit then smoothed out and idled normally.  I spoke to some local boaters, who are the primary users of premium fuel in this area, and they said that water in the fuel was quite common there as the premium gas sat in the tanks at the gas station longer than regular, which was likely my problem.  At any rate, this isn't something I want to experience in March when the car comes out of winter storage.   I'm not so worried about the lawn mowers as I already run a bit of MMO with the fuel in those and I typically run them out of gas every fall anyway.  

 

I've purchased a bottle of that Ethanol Shield and we'll see what happens.  I may also try the MMO trick again this year to coat the inside of the carb.  I'm definitely going to have a full tank of gas, but I'll work a bit harder and try and burn it faster (which isn't difficult to do in a Big Block Buick!).  

Edited Tuesday at 11:44 PM by dmfconsult (see edit history)