Something completely different: 1913 Peugeot BeBe

[Leif in Calif]

! I remember reading a road test of one of these where they said even after a number of careful attempts, "shifting the transmission produced a sound like  a cow giving birth to a bale of barbed wire". 

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/nby/cto/d/santa-rosa-1913-pugeot-bebe/7588202950.html

email: 10c5d5f4c76038e5b286698776c4d1fa@sale.craigslist.org

I’m the owner' friend of a rust-free unrestored 1913 Peugeot Bebe (It is a Bugatti-designed “Type BP1”). Between my godfather, my daughter, and myself, we have owned it for slightly less than 100 years.

Sadly, we are not in a position to restore the vehicle to its well-deserved former glory, so it is our intention to offer it for sale. Perhaps the best way of describing the present condition and status of the Bebe is to do so via a brief historical summary.

The “Bebe” originally came into my godfather’s repair garage located in downtown San Francisco in 1923 as just an “old car” to be rebuilt. My godfather obtained and rebuilt the engine and a local body shop took the balance of the vehicle for a repaint. The owner was unable, for whatever reason, to pay for the work and left the car in the two shops. After about two years, the body shop contacted my godfather and asked if he wanted to pay the balance due, otherwise they would scrap the body/chassis. So, for approximately $15, my godfather paid off the amount due. But when returned to him, the body shop had lost the top and the two upholstery cushions.
The Bebe was eventually reassembled and rendered mobile again. It remained in my godfather’s garage until 1960 when he gave the Bebe to me, a 16- year-old at the time. I got it running again and eventually returned it to storage. Ultimately, I presented the vehicle to my daughter and we now have it sitting comfortably in storage in Southern California.
The overall “unrestored” condition of the Bebe is superb, with absolutely no rust and only a minor dent in one of the front fenders. Prior to the early 1920’s, the original owner converted the headlights to beautiful brass electric units. Although not original, these lights are, in my opinion, far more attractive on the vehicle than the acetylene lights that were original equipment. To my knowledge, the only other component that is not “original” is the carburetor. That was replaced with a Scheubler during the 1923 rebuild. Although I don’t know the vehicle’s serial number off-hand, I am convinced the “Bebe” is a 1913, since it has a two-speed transmission. To my understanding, only the prototype year of 1912 and the 1913 production year had two-speeds and after that year Peugeot changed to a three-speed transmission.
I have the original windshield. The wheels are original with English motorcycle tires currently installed. Despite having owned the vintage vehicle through three generations, we are simply not in a position to give the Peugeot the proper respect and attention it deserves. Although slightly incomplete in a couple of details, this is a vehicle in absolutely excellent condition, for its remarkable age. To assist in your evaluation of the vehicle I have photos of my Peugeot along with this letter that will support the status of its condition.

The Bebe has been in protected storage for a number of years so although dated, they very accurately depict the details and condition of the vehicle as it is today

What is you thoughts on price, we have heard absurdly low suggestions so far. What is a reasonable range, depending on your inspection and research?

 

email:  

[Hudsy Wudsy]

Wow! What a cutie! Do any of you have an idea as to what the displacement is?

[bryankazmer]

I think 855 cc.

[JACK M]

23 hours ago, Leif in Calif said:

we have heard absurdly low suggestions so far.

Fishing for a better price?

[suchan]

13 hours ago, JACK M said:

Fishing for a better price?

More like looking for respect for their treasured family heirloom. They’d do better to donate it. They’ll never get what they hope it’s worth.

[wayne sheldon]

The Bebe Peugeot is an interesting piece of history. However, they are really little more than a footnote in that long history. Peugeot built some incredible cars in those early years! They placed high in international racing. But the Bebe was not one of those cars. They were an entry level any man's car. Maybe better than some of European competition in that entry level market, but entry level none the less. 

They do have a connection to Ettore Bugatti! They were among a few marques that built small cars under license from Bugatti. His design was well done, the cars reasonably priced, and they drove well. 

As hobby cars today, the Peugeot and Bugatti connections give them some special desirability. However, as a hobby car they are remarkably impractical. Because they are four cylinder engines, the cars do not qualify for most early one or two cylinder tours! They are too small and too slow to be useful for much else club activity wise.

I have seen a couple of them over the years. One is in the National Automobile Museum (William Harrah's collection) in Reno, Nevada. One was in a private collection I got to see years ago.

One great thing about them is that a person could consider keeping one in their living room. I knew a collector years ago that in addition to a building full of Packards (and a couple Pierce Arrows!) had a couple dozen antique motorcycles! He often joked that he had a few that his wife didn't know about hidden in closets in the house!

 

This car I think should be cleaned up and made running and usable while maintaining its remaining originality. The missing seat springs can be made and upholstered in material appropriate for an otherwise original car. But that is my opinion. I think it would look fantastic done that way!

 

I think these are wonderful! Interesting, and cute as a button! I love seeing them, and personally, if I had the wherewithal? I would love to have one! 

I hope they get a good offer! And I hope the car gets someone that gives it the care and preservation it deserves.

[mikewest]

Has ANYONE heard what the price is? Its a dark secret... Ive asked twice and no replys.  its a odd way to sell something. I like the car and it would make a fun project keeping it original.

[old car fan]

I think they are fishing. 

[Lahti35]

13 hours ago, old car fan said:

I think they are fishing. 

110%... Life is too short to deal with sellers like this. These are the ones that are on a mission to extract every penny out of a buyer they can possibly get while holding their cards tight to their chest. I put up with a lot of seller bologna in my younger years because I wanted what they had, these days they can keep it😁 

[Leif in Calif]

19 hours ago, mikewest said:

Has ANYONE heard what the price is? Its a dark secret... Ive asked twice and no replys.  its a odd way to sell something. I like the car and it would make a fun project keeping it original.

Just a quick search showed only one sale in the last 5 years. It was restored and went for $78K in 2018.

Many on the forum know much more than I do, but my guess would be somewhere in the 20s. 

[mikewest]

8 hours ago, Lahti35 said:

110%... Life is too short to deal with sellers like this. These are the ones that are on a mission to extract every penny out of a buyer they can possibly get while holding their cards tight to their chest. I put up with a lot of seller bologna in my younger years because I wanted what they had, these days they can keep it😁 

I agree, There are SO many cars to buy, they are only hurting themselves. Im a impulse buyer, strike while the iron is hot!

[prewarnut]

...speaking of small, early French stuff this one is attractive, has original?  paint and not a bad price (I have no affiliation or interest in it's sale). It is alas only a one cylinder.

https://www.prewarcar.com/on-the-market-an-oily-rag-le-zebre-voiturette

 

Edited February 15, 2023 by prewarnut (see edit history)