Judging Guidlines

[John Lau]

My boss just purchased a 1955 Buick Super.  It underwent a frame-off restoration in July, 1999.  It was a 392-point car back then.  The car has been driven 120 miles in the last 19 years.  It looks as though the resto was done last week.  A beautiful car!  One of the only things that need to be upgraded is the windshield washer top.  It has some rust, and the sliding teardrop-shaped piece on the top has rusted off.  I found one at Fusick and I also purchased the correct decal as well.  My boss is concerned that since it is not actually original to the car, we would be gigged for that.  I'm pretty sure that if it is a factory-correct repro, we won't be penalized.  What experiences have you guys had in this area?

Thanks, John

[Bhigdog]

Put it on and fugetaboutit. Fusick's repro parts are among the best. You're good to go..................Bob

[MrEarl]

6 hours ago, John Lau said:

I'm pretty sure that if it is a factory-correct repro, we won't be penalized

 

If it looks and functions as original then should be no problem. not familiar with that particular part from Fusicks, if you could post a picture of it then we could advise as to whether it is "factory correct repro" enough to pass the 400 point judging. It would be interesting to know whatt were the items that lost the 8 points back in '99?

[JohnD1956]

If you can tell it matches what was originally in there, then there would be no loss in the 400 point class. It is different in the Archival class.  There you would lose points if it wasn't the original part provided with the car.

 

Since you say the car was restored at some point , chances are it should never be put in the Archival class anyways 

[superbuick]

And judging can differ after several years with different judges. Now I am interested in seeing the car- any pictures to post for us?

 Steve

[NTX5467]

One observed issue with "restorations" is that in so doing, many people desire to "make them better" than the factory ever could or did.  As I recall, unless something's changed, "over-restoration" is not rewarded on the BCA 400 Point System.  Other club/group's judging MIGHT reward such, though.  In some shows, a factory-correct vehicle will look poorly next to an over-restored vehicle with too much shiny paint, wrong paint type, and "show chrome" . . . the latter tends to be what many spectators desire to see and perceive is "stock".  I believe there's a judging manual in this website, somewhere?

 

NTX5467

[Jack Welch]

22 hours ago, John Lau said:

My boss just purchased a 1955 Buick Super.  It underwent a frame-off restoration in July, 1999.  It was a 392-point car back then.  The car has been driven 120 miles in the last 19 years.  It looks as though the resto was done last week.  A beautiful car!  One of the only things that need to be upgraded is the windshield washer top.  It has some rust, and the sliding teardrop-shaped piece on the top has rusted off.  I found one at Fusick and I also purchased the correct decal as well.  My boss is concerned that since it is not actually original to the car, we would be gigged for that.  I'm pretty sure that if it is a factory-correct repro, we won't be penalized.  What experiences have you guys had in this area?

Thanks, John

The standard used in judging by the BCA 400 point system is that the car should look as it did "when it left the factory" As the supply of NOS parts has dried up, most of us have to resort to repro parts. If they look correct, you will not be penalized (lose points). Many cars lose point for easily fixed items such as the wrong caps on tire / tube and wrong bolts, non Delco battery , voltage regulator . Those are things to look for before showing a restored car. 

[John Lau]

20 hours ago, MrEarl said:

 

If it looks and functions as original then should be no problem. not familiar with that particular part from Fusicks, if you could post a picture of it then we could advise as to whether it is "factory correct repro" enough to pass the 400 point judging. It would be interesting to know whatt were the items that lost the 8 points back in '99?

 

We were told that the center caps on the wheels are for the Roadmaster, and they are beautifully colored.   The stock center caps are plainer and boring.  We have those, but they need to be restored.  The fuel line was spliced.  Wrong sills and materials. Jack finish was not in perfect condition. 

Edited July 25, 2018 by John Lau (see edit history)

[John Lau]

19 hours ago, superbuick said:

And judging can differ after several years with different judges. Now I am interested in seeing the car- any pictures to post for us?

 Steve

 

The car looks great, but after 19 years of sitting, the seals have gotten hard and it leaks PS fluid, brake fluid and transmission fluid.  Not hard to remedy.  I got a few picts with the car up on the rack.  The lighting is not great, but you can see that it is in pretty good shape.

 

Thanks for the feedback!

Edited July 25, 2018 by John Lau (see edit history)

[JohnD1956]

Sweet!  Love the color.

[old-tank]

I remember that car when it was judged and it has aged well.  While those wheel covers from an earlier model look nice, there will always be a deduction.  If you enter again, I have a set of restored 55 wheel covers that you can borrow.

[BUICK RACER]

Cool car, hubcap  centers and door sills check out http://www.bellbuickparts.com/ as Ann has both for the '55

[MrEarl]

10 hours ago, John Lau said:

We were told that the center caps on the wheels are for the Roadmaster, and they are beautifully colored.   The stock center caps are plainer and boring.  We have those, but they need to be restored.

 

The wheel covers on the car in the pictures are 1953 Special wire covers. Do you have correct '55 covers?

Beautiful car by the way!! I love Titian Red

[1953mack]

21 hours ago, Jack Welch said:

The standard used in judging by the BCA 400 point system is that the car should look as it did "when it left the factory" As the supply of NOS parts has dried up, most of us have to resort to repro parts. If they look correct, you will not be penalized (lose points). Many cars lose point for easily fixed items such as the wrong caps on tire / tube and wrong bolts, non Delco battery , voltage regulator . Those are things to look for before showing a restored car. 

 

I don't agree with how you worded your first sentence. Am I being picky? Not according to a bleep that was published in the BUGLE, maybe in the early-1990s, that addressed exactly what you just printed. I'll try to find that BUGLE one of these days. 

 

Without an original invoice or a copy of it (window stickers were not used back in the 1950s, the topic of this Thread) it's difficult to prove exactly how the Buick looked when it rolled-off the assembly line. Who's to say that the original invoice was inclusive? Briefly recapping what the BUGLE bleep said from memory along with using some of your own words, it would be more correct to say that the standard used in judging by the BCA 400 point system is how the Buick could have looked when it left the factory and/or the Dealer's Showroom or anytime after, properly equipped with Buick-authorized options and accessories that were never installed either in the factory or by the Dealer. All Buicks didn't roll off the assembly lines with whitewall tires, radios, and Kleenex holders. There were usually numerous Buick-authorized factory options to pick from (automatic vs. manual transmissions; different engine displacements; different rear-end ratios, etc.) along with maybe a dozen or more Buick-authorized Dealer accessories available (vanity mirror, compass, seat cushions, removable floor mats, etc.). You get the picture.

 

As long as we're talking judging, a recent BUGLE briefly noted that a new Judging Handbook was available at the Brookfield, WI BCA Nationals. I've read your posts in regard to the Denver Nationals judging and maybe you could give everyone an update. Would you be willing to share some info on (1) the major changes or corrections that were made to the former 2005 Judging Handbook; (2) how and where can members obtain a copy of the new Judging Handbook; and (3) any items that were not addressed? Articles in the BUGLE from Chief Judges are rare nowadays.

 

Thanks for taking the time to respond.

 

Al Malachowski

BCA #8965

"500 Miles West of Flint"

 

 

 

 

 

[John Lau]

18 hours ago, JohnD1956 said:

Sweet!  Love the color.

 

John, the color is Tahitian Red.  We love it as well.  A different look for our collection.

[John Lau]

17 hours ago, old-tank said:

I remember that car when it was judged and it has aged well.  While those wheel covers from an earlier model look nice, there will always be a deduction.  If you enter again, I have a set of restored 55 wheel covers that you can borrow.

 Old-tank,

The car was originally from Ohio, and it was restored and entered into shows there in 1999.  Is that where you saw it, or was it from somewhere else?  And yes, it has aged wonderfully.  I made a mistake in my original post regarding the mileage.  Since the restoration in July of 1999, only 12 miles have been put on the car.

[John Lau]

12 hours ago, MrEarl said:

 

The wheel covers on the car in the pictures are 1953 Special wire covers. Do you have correct '55 covers?

Beautiful car by the way!! I love Titian Red

Mr Earl,

Yes, we have the original center caps, but they need to be restored.  Also, they are pretty plain. The ones on the car now are really nice.  I don't know if we will enter the car in any shows.  I may have the originals restored just in case.

 

John

[old-tank]

27 minutes ago, John Lau said:

 Old-tank,

The car was originally from Ohio, and it was restored and entered into shows there in 1999.  Is that where you saw it, or was it from somewhere else?  And yes, it has aged wonderfully.  I made a mistake in my original post regarding the mileage.  Since the restoration in July of 1999, only 12 miles have been put on the car.

Yes, it was 1999 in Columbus.  Drive it a few hundred miles and your leaks will resolve.

[Jack Welch]

 

I don't agree with how you worded your first sentence. Am I being picky? Not according to a bleep that was published in the BUGLE, maybe in the early-1990s, that addressed exactly what you just printed. I'll try to find that BUGLE one of these days.

 

Al: I do think you are being picky. The intent in judging is not to try and replicate the car exactly as that particular car rolled off the line, but it is meant to be totally correct for a 19--XYZ . WE have never looked at trim and and color codes on data plates while judging. The original build sheets are not available for early cars, so there is no need to hold the owner to that level of correctness for their car. It matters not to a judge, what options a car has as long as they are correct. Cadillacs ,for instance, are different. he build sheet on my '41 Caddy tells what options it had as well as options , etc. 

All that said , there are a few changes in the judges manual, such as deductions for the black replacement engines on prewar cars. The new judges manual are hard bound binders with replacement pages. We do not have a lot of them, and it is still a document in flux. At Denver we gave them out to the team captains, and asked for them back at the end of judging. Chief Judge John Steed may have some extras. You could contact him and request one.

[MCHinson]

Jack,

 

Are there plans to post the updated judging manual on the BCA Website? The old one is still up on the website.

[Jack Welch]

11 hours ago, MCHinson said:

Jack,

 

Are there plans to post the updated judging manual on the BCA Website? The old one is still up on the website.

Matt; Let me get with John Steed on that.. If it is in electronic form, it will be easy to do, if not it will take a bit more effort to digitize it and post it. I will get back to you on that.

[John Lau]

On 7/25/2018 at 10:21 PM, MrEarl said:

 

The wheel covers on the car in the pictures are 1953 Special wire covers. Do you have correct '55 covers?

Beautiful car by the way!! I love Titian Red

We have the correct covers, but they have to be restored.

[Bhigdog]

On ‎7‎/‎26‎/‎2018 at 10:56 AM, John Lau said:

 

John, the color is Tahitian Red.  We love it as well.  A different look for our collection.

 

The color is actually Titian Red. Named for the Italian painter, Titian,  who often used that color for the hair of the women he painted. They often being zaftig nudes. So your car's color was named after plump, naked, red headed women.  I can think of worse..............Bob

Edited September 20, 2018 by Bhigdog (see edit history)